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Conspiracy Theories (“Alternative Research”)

I have to agree that pointing to a poster is not good proof.

Asking others to do the research is a cop out. If you are trying to assert a thing maybe you should do research into the facts that are presented in that poster. Present them here to backup your argument and you may find others more willing to accept what you say. I suspect if you look into the information on that poster you will find it hard to backup the claims it makes. Now i say this as I have tried.

It is also just as hard to disprove, as I believe Snopes may be compromised and it rarely presents great supporting evidence. WikiLeaks is slightly better, but it could all be misinformation coming from these powerful people. Who knows... I, personally, revert to Occam's razor in such situations...
 
I have already researched it far more than probably should have.

I have not found what I consider compelling proof. You are the one making the claim, you should provide the proof.

And of course I am dismissing what you've provided, cause what you've provided is proof of nothing.

A video with no context, where 90% of what it "proves" is a matter of interpretation. And where you can't even establish that the video is related to the subject we are discussing.

And infographics that show photos that could have come from anywhere. That's not evidence of anything.

I can put up a picture of "kill room" from a movie, and say it's your basement. And that's exactly as good as the evidence you've provided.

Just because you put up a photo and say "this is a picture of x" doesn't mean it really is a picture of x. And it's not my job to prove that it is. You're the one making the argument. This is why real evidence needs foundation.
 
Everything on that poster is true. I'm not presenting shit anymore just so people can write it off. The truth is out there. If you don't believe what's on the poster, you can look up the information yourself is my point.

I've already done research into what's on the poster, that's how I know it's true. You're the one who needs to do research instead of just denying everything.
 
If you've done the research already, why don't you already have the foundation ready to present? I can't provide proof that there's nothing to be found... Because you can't prove a negative.

Why should anyone believe you without foundation to establish that your evidence is genuine?

And saying "oh research it yourself" is bullshit, because many of us have and not found anything compelling. Thats why we don't believe it.

There's always a chance you have somehow found better evidence though, which is why I'm giving you the opportunity to provide said foundation. But you don't.

So no, I won't be believing it. It's foolish to assume something written on the internet is true just because it purports itself to be.

How many times has social media gotten into a frenzy because of a photo of say "antifa attacks elderly man" or whatever, and it turns out the photo is in fact of something totally unrelated.

Just because someone says a photo is of x doesn't make it true.
 
You can easily research what's on the poster and see that it's true. I have given plenty of evidence on this site in other threads too and I get the same denial, same song and dance. Common sense would tell you if you don't believe what's on the poster, to look it up yourself. But no, it's easier to deny deny deny. Boring.
 
This is what I call a scattershot argument. Basically where you argue a million different things at once so that it's impossible to actually establish anything on any particular point.

We aren't talking about other threads, or other arguments. Right now all I asked for is for you to establish that the video you put up is what you say it is. And you haven't even done that much.

I have already researched pizza gate, along with many other conspiracies at length. I have not found compelling evidence.

It's your argument. I haven't asked you to prove every element of it all at once. I've asked for foundation for one piece of evidence and you've repeatedly ignored it.

You can't argue the entire subject at once. Every element of the argument has to be broken down and evaluated one at a time.

I haven't written anything off. I've looked at what you've provided, and asked simply that you establish that it actually is what you claim. You fail to do so then claim that that's me writing it off. It's bullshit.

It's outrageous that you claim others are sheep believing whatever those in power tell them without question. Yet that is exactly what you seem to do and expect of others when it comes to your own point of view.
 
I won't. But I suggest you either follow your intuition that it's pointless to bring this stuff up, or accept that if you do there's a high probability that I will continue posting about this hypocritical attitude.

Because I don't intend to just stay quiet and let conspiracy theorists repeatedly bring up this shit over and over all the time without challenge.

It's kinda ironic because all I've ever wanted of conspiracy theorists I've known was to just stop talking about it to me. To not force me to either tell them I think they're being manipulated, or lie to them and pretend I believe it. But noooo, conspiracy theorists in my life always have to spread their bs to everyone around them.

So I'm not exactly pleased that you keep telling me to stop posting. Now obviously I recognize that you are your own person, and not some proxy for every conspiracy theorist I've known. But try to understand that I get frustrated too. And every conspiracy theorist I've known just can't seem to help constantly bring it up. So I'm not very amenable to requests that I just stop speaking my view, because no one's ever granted my request for the same.

I may have to be diplomatic and sugarcoat my feelings to keep the peace with people I know in real life who just can't leave it alone. But I don't have to and don't intend to here.
 
You actually don't have to say anything at all to "conspiracy theorists". I didn't bring it up directly to you anyway. You inserted yourself and your only purpose is to discredit everything. I was actually talking about this in another thread and a mod transferred it to this thread. If people happen to bring up conspiracy theories in this thread on their own, so what? That's what it's here for.

You act like people keep bringing it up to you and bothering you. No one was talking to you. You act like you know people are being manipulated you are dead wrong. It's not your place to talk down to people and tell them they're wrong. If you don't believe in it, you could simply leave people alone.

I've learned it's pointless to bring anything up in this thread. Like I said, it was transferred to this thread last night. I didn't originally put it here because I know better.
 
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Didn't some guy try and jackhammer through the floor of that pizza place? There was no basement iirc.

Another guy set the place on fire, which doesn't make a ton of sense if you are doing it bc you think there are innocent children locked in a basement....
 
CoastTwoCoast said:
You actually don't have to say anything at all to "conspiracy theorists". I didn't bring it up directly to you anyway. You inserted yourself and your only purpose is to discredit everything. I was actually talking about this in another thread and a mod transferred it to this thread. If people happen to bring up conspiracy theories in this thread on their own, so what? That's what it's here for.

You act like people keep bringing it up to you and bothering you. No one was talking to you. You act like you know people are being manipulated you are dead wrong. It's not your place to talk down to people and tell them they're wrong. If you don't believe in it, you could simply leave people alone.

I've learned it's pointless to bring anything up in this thread. Like I said, it was transferred to this thread last night. I didn't originally put it here because I know better.
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This thread is for discussing conspiracy theories. Me making an argument against the evidence for them is totally on topic.

Especially when conspiracy theorists are constantly bringing them up in otherwise unrelated threads.

So how can I leave them alone when they constantly bring them up to everyone around them? Anyone who's been around conspiracy theorists probably knows that it's like a life obsession. And they bring it up in everything even remotely political.

I am totally on topic here and well within my rights. So don't expect me to stop. If you don't like it, go above me to an admin.

Cause for all this talk about it "not being my place". It absolutely isn't your place to tell me not to post here.

If you think I'm in the wrong with what I'm posting, take it to the other ceps mods, or an admin, or love bandit. If they agree with you, then I'll stop.

DopeM said:
Didn't some guy try and jackhammer through the floor of that pizza place? There was no basement iirc.

Another guy set the place on fire, which doesn't make a ton of sense if you are doing it bc you think there are innocent children locked in a basement....
Click to expand...

Yeah and another one took a gun and tried to free the sex slaves. Only to not find any.

Hilariously I've seen conspiracy theorists then argue that those people are themselves in on it and are attempts to discredit them...

Figures.
 
DopeM said:
I mean, you come off as relatively intelligent. You find lines to draw on almost every subject. You have no problem saying, "I don't know".

I guess this is your way of saying you don't know what lengths human error can go to. But surely you have a point at which you think it is implausible. Maybe I am assuming here though
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I missed your post first time around so I'll answer it now. There might well be hypothetical instances where human error is so implausible that deliberate malice becomes the more likely answer. I'm just not convinced that's the case with epstein.

It's just that I've seen so many amazing displays of incompetence, especially in public institutions.

And even at the best of times I can find it quite plausible that someone who's job it is to keep a pedophile child abuser who'll likely face reduced punishment for their crime from committing suicide, might find that their heart isn't in it.

If my job were keeping epstein from killing himself, I can't say I'd be as committed to it as for most other people.

So let's say that's plausible. And then there's the cameras. Again it's hardly uncommon for these kinds of institutions to have comically under maintained equipment.

Now sure, we are adding all these things together... But if epstein was indeed suicidal, and it's quite likely he was. It's not all that unlikely to me that he might have found some way to do it.

It still stinks of something more sinister. But I don't find it totally implausible that he may have actually just killer himself.

Which is why I sit on the fence. Because I could believe either possibility, and I just don't feel like I have enough evidence to comfortably endorse one possibility over the other.

I don't like taking solid opinions when I don't feel comfortable that I'm right. And I don't feel so certain that suicide isn't possible as to rule it out.

So best I can say is that I think someone should be prosecuted for this. Murder or suicide, it was someone's job to keep him alive, and they failed. And they shouldn't have.

Someone was responsible for ensuring he couldn't kill himself, they failed to do so. Someone was responsible for ensuring noone murdered him, they failed to do so.

So either way, I feel like I'm on the side of a comprehensive investigation, and prosecuting whomevers failure resulted in a witness dying.

That's the side I'm on here. The side of finding out how it happened. Whatever that answer might turn out to be. Because this wasn't an accident. Best case scenario it's criminal negligence in handling a suicidal inmate.
 
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Okay. I’m done with modding recent posts.
I tried to save the flavor of debate without acrimony, so I edited a few and deleted some. (Unfortunately I had to delete a few posts that were just fine because they didn’t make sense anymore. So not all deleted posts were problematic. Sorry.)
I’d like for this thread to be “loose”, but unfortunately passions got out of hand. Hopefully, the remaining posts make sense and keep the tang of the discussion.
 
Thank you. Unfortunately, my posts from Royal Family were transferred here and I try to avoid this thread like the plague because I know exactly what will happen.
I apologize to @JessFR for things getting so heated between this thread and the other one.
 
@JessFR
You said this in response to myvsayikng humans do terrible shit not lizard ppl (paraphrased)
"
Actually there's probably nothing to address. I've looked into it before and discovered that the part nobody tells you when they mention epidemics of missing children is...

They almost all show up again.

They just take the statistics of the number of kids who go missing every year, and assume 100% were abducted by Satanists. Including the ones where a worried mother didn't realize their separated husband's phone simply went flat and hasn't in fact abducted them.

Lies, damn lies and statistics."

If even 1 child is abducted for nefarious purposes it is too many. I wasn't necessarily saying that they were being abducted for satanic cult rreasons. But if even one kid is taken and abused it is an evil act. And there are certainly records of children being abducted. On top of that, any abuse of children, by parents, teachers, "friends", or "loved ones" is despicable, statistically significant, and evil.
 
DopeM said:
@JessFR
You said this in response to myvsayikng humans do terrible shit not lizard ppl (paraphrased)
"
Actually there's probably nothing to address. I've looked into it before and discovered that the part nobody tells you when they mention epidemics of missing children is...

They almost all show up again.

They just take the statistics of the number of kids who go missing every year, and assume 100% were abducted by Satanists. Including the ones where a worried mother didn't realize their separated husband's phone simply went flat and hasn't in fact abducted them.

Lies, damn lies and statistics."

If even 1 child is abducted for nefarious purposes it is too many. I wasn't necessarily saying that they were being abducted for satanic cult rreasons. But if even one kid is taken and abused it is an evil act. And there are certainly records of children being abducted. On top of that, any abuse of children, by parents, teachers, "friends", or "loved ones" is despicable, statistically significant, and evil.
Click to expand...

Sure, but as I said in the other thread.. We have finite resources. We can afford to dedicate limitless resources on every single evil that exists.

It's bad enough that we already seem to frequently allocate resources depending on if the missing child is a pretty middle class white girl or not.
 
Oh yes, this brings us to sex trafficking

Are you saying this is not a thing?

Or was there some level of facetiousness* in your quoted post?
 
JessFR said:
CoastTwoCoast, do you seriously not see the problem here?

You gave me a video of some guy yelling about something with the sounds of children in the background.

That is the evidence we have here. A video of someone yelling about something, with children in the background.

Everything else is your interpretation, which requires its own evidence.

What evidence do I have that it's podesta in the video beyond the sound of his voice? Cause on its own that's not good evidence.

What evidence do I have that he's hitting anyone? Cause I didn't see it in the video.

What evidence do I have that this video is even real?

I could just as easily put up the same video and argue that it's YOU torturing a child. And I'd have just as much evidence as you've provided.

I'm really trying to give you the benefit of the doubt, as I always try to for conspiracy theorists. I try to keep an open mind. But repeatedly I run into a wall where the actual evidence is very small, and the theory is 90% unsupported interpretation.

And when I ask for evidence validating the interpretations, I'm told that I'm in denial.

I'm asking questions. Isnt that what conspiracy theorists are supposed to support? I'm asking for evidence.

What evidence is there that this video actually shows what you say it does?

Where did it come from? Who made it? Who put it online? What is the evidence establishing who's in it? These are all questions that need answers to make the claim that it's evidence of Podesta beating a child.

But it seems all you have is the video with no evidence of anything else.

Am I wrong to want evidence?

Even taking the whole thing at face value though its only evidence against podesta directly, not anyone else.
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It would be more convincing to see someone speaking in tongues that you know well, in person.

Convincing strangers that it happened via a video if you were taking the video of a loved one or known person possessed would be a different story.


I guess it's how things usually work and the difference between commonly accepted facts vs conspiracy facts, convince reputable people that many would take at face value and the theory becomes just widely known set in stone versions of events.

Still, there's always people who doubt anything.

Interesting stuff to be seen and read in many places.
 
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