Cold injection

[narutokun]

I think everyone agrees that shooting at the same temperature of your body is the best. I've yet to know someone who does a 'cold shot'. I don't see any particular benefits coming from that, quite the opposite really.

 

[hfrs]

Best to keep it between room temp (as long as it's a reasonably tempered room) and body temp for a few reasons. I'll add more later when i have some time - part is due to the physiologic response and part is due to the solubility of cuts or inactives in pharmaceuticals.

In cases of severe hypothermia, warm saline and other iv solutions are used, but never "hot". You can seriously interfere with the heart and blood clotting. This is more true the larger the volume is. 10 ml is pretty large for an iv injection.

 

['medicine cabinet']

i never cook my dope, even if its scramble. my reason: since heroin is highly soluble in water, by just addint water and filtering, i get the heroin and other water soluble cuts. sometimes there are cuts left over in the spoon . but when u cook it all up, you get all those other insoluble cuts in the shot.

 

[fastandbulbous]

If you don't use a micron filter, then making up solutions of heroin etc without heat means that any bacteria present in the drug are going straight into your bloodstream. A couple of years ago, several people in the NE of England died from injecting heroin that was contaminated with Clostridium perfringens because they used the cold preparation method without a micron filter...

It's a myth that heatin' will destroy all of the bacteria.

It's not, heating to boiling point will kill all bacteria and most viruses present (only bacterial spores & viruses like hepatitis B will survive boiling). When you consider how much of the drugs used by injection enter countries in people's intestinal tracts and have to be separated from shit (by people who don't follow full aseptic technique before handling the drugs), the chances of heroin etc being contaminated by things like E. coli or Staph aureus are not insignificant and putting those live bacteria into your bloodstream is a very quick way to get endocarditis, septicaemia and a whole range of very nasty diseases, some of which are fatal

 

[wesmdow]

If what you're shootin' dissolves easily(coke, heroin hcl), you don't need heat. It's a myth that heatin' will destroy all of the bacteria.

it does somethin to my dope-- seperates it somehow.

 

[wesmdow]

I'm just curious about something (it's is still on topic):
-is it dangerous to shoot really hot solution?
-is it dangerous to shoot freezing cold solution? (I remember someone in a thread here on BL said he was putting his loaded syringe in the fridge for a while, and then shoot it, he would call it a "cold shot")

i REALLY love doing this--the cold feeling of the water/h running thru my veins adds SO much to the rush...........

 

[phr]

E. coli [/I]or Staph aureus are not insignificant and putting those live bacteria into your bloodstream is a very quick way to get endocarditis, septicaemia and a whole range of very nasty diseases, some of which are fatal

I was under the impression that typical heroin cooking does not apply enough heat for a long enough time to kill off all of the bacteria/viruses. Most users never bring it to a boil anyway, they stop as soon as bubbles form, so the active ingredient doesn't degrade.

 

[fastandbulbous]

As soon as bubbles form, it's at boiling as the bubbles are gaseous water vapour forming on the spoon where it's in contact with the flame. That's enough to kill bacteria.

If you consider that heating to 70'C for 5 seconds kills most bacteria in milk (pasteurization), taking it the extra 30 degrees to 100'C kills off the rest. The only bacteria to survive a couple of seconds at 100'C are the thermophilic ones found in hot water pools arounf geysers & they're not pathogenic

 

[phr]

Interesting. I guess a bunch of other people that posted about it are wrong as well.


Duration doesn't matter? I mean, most people stop as soon as they see a few bubbles.

 

[hfrs]

The way I always learned it was that killing % was dependent on time, temp and pressure - you have to have a minimum on all three depending on what you need to kill. I don't know tons about pasteurization, but I thought that was done under some pressure, which would allow for a lower temp??? I know that is the whole point of pressurizing an autoclave, and even at elevated P and T, there are time minimums.

I supposed a lot depends on how dirty the spoon and environment is though, that would obviously contribute - in a dirty place with a spoon someone just licked, obviously you'll need more than a few seconds if you want to guarantee everything is killed!

 

[smackem]

10ml is a bit much. Are you using saline or just water? Just water can throw off your electrolytes.

 

[fastandbulbous]

The way I always learned it was that killing % was dependent on time, temp and pressure - you have to have a minimum on all three depending on what you need to kill. I don't know tons about pasteurization, but I thought that was done under some pressure, which would allow for a lower temp??? I know that is the whole point of pressurizing an autoclave, and even at elevated P and T, there are time minimums.

I supposed a lot depends on how dirty the spoon and environment is though, that would obviously contribute - in a dirty place with a spoon someone just licked, obviously you'll need more than a few seconds if you want to guarantee everything is killed!

Bringing to 100'C, even for a second will kill any opportune pathogens that are normal body flora like Staph aureus. It also kills most other pathogens of the sort that could be introduced via soil contamination like C. tetanii & C. perfringens, so all in all, it's something well worth doing. Hospital autoclaving is purely to do with killing viruses like hepatitis B virus that resist water at 100'C for quite some time (Hep B sterilization proceedure is 30mins at 130'C in an autoclave) - the only bacterial form that survives the secobd or two of boiling are spores, but these are a dormant form and are severely weakened by the heat treatment such that the immune system will mop up any (and anyway, only two species, Bacillus & Clostridium, produce spores although those two do cover anthrax, gas gangerene, tetanus & a host of other nasties!)

Would you be willing to chance your arm (possibly quite literally) for the sake of a 20 sec proceedure?

 

[phr]

^
No, the risk isn't worth the minimal product degradation and time spent.


I've always cooked my dope, but I considered it just part of the ritual. I've run into a lot of people that don't cook. IME, the younger users don't cook, but the oldheads always do.

 

[fastandbulbous]

& that's how they got to be old! :D

 

[aardvarb]

i agree. Heat should only be applied in norder to facilitate dissolution. The dope i get, although good and cheap, often REQUIRES heat in order to dissolve, i.e. stirring is not enough and the dope will simply float at the top of the solution.
But when heat is not necessary, it should not be used, as you may evaporate a significant ammount of your product.

yup, that's true....however, most people are under the impression that applying a little bit of heat via cigarette lighter will somehow render their drugs microbe, etc-free. that being said, i do tend to heat my heroin (though i have had the rare occasion when i'm without a source of heat for whatever reason, and when that happens i can usually just stir the stuff real good and kinda swirl it around until it all dissolves...unfortunately, that doesn't always work; some dope (the crappier stuff which, despite just about everyone on this board's claim that they get the bestest shit in the whole freakin universe every single damn time they cop, everybody gets now and then and sometimes way more frequently than that). i do not heat coke - - i've never seen a point as every time i've prepared a shot of cocaine, the drug has just dissolved by itself without any stirring or anything in just a few seconds. 'course, i don't do a lot of coke (and when i do, it's generally w/ heroin in speedball form), so i would hardly describe myself as an expert on that particular substance (though to be honest, i did a pretty big IV shot of coke about 20 min ago and....well, you get it. i'll try and stop now.

 

[hfrs]

Bringing to 100'C, even for a second will kill any opportune pathogens that are normal .....................

I guess doing most of my work with bsl 3/4 viruses, I don't differentiate between bacteria and viruses when determining if something is sterile. To me (and for anything I use - drug-wise) it just doesn't make sense to get rid of bacteria and ignore the possibility of viral contamination.

I realize you're not saying to ignore viruses and just cook out the bacteria - I just don't think decontamination is worthwhile unless you're getting everything. Although, what each person is able to do with what is available to them varies and everyone should decon to the best of their ability (if it's going in a vein etc.)

 

[eon_blue]

I've never heated any of my shots (well, I've tried but it seems to form clumps and make it harder to filter) so I just IV at room temp. Never had any problems arise from it...

 

[sixpartseven]

yup, that's true....however, most people are under the impression that applying a little bit of heat via cigarette lighter will somehow render their drugs microbe, etc-free. that being said, i do tend to heat my heroin (though i have had the rare occasion when i'm without a source of heat for whatever reason, and when that happens i can usually just stir the stuff real good and kinda swirl it around until it all dissolves...unfortunately, that doesn't always work; some dope (the crappier stuff which, despite just about everyone on this board's claim that they get the bestest shit in the whole freakin universe every single damn time they cop, everybody gets now and then and sometimes way more frequently than that). i do not heat coke - - i've never seen a point as every time i've prepared a shot of cocaine, the drug has just dissolved by itself without any stirring or anything in just a few seconds. 'course, i don't do a lot of coke (and when i do, it's generally w/ heroin in speedball form), so i would hardly describe myself as an expert on that particular substance (though to be honest, i did a pretty big IV shot of coke about 20 min ago and....well, you get it. i'll try and stop now.

Did you not read anything fastandbulbous wrote? He proved you wrong before you even made this post.

 

[GlassAss420]

I've always cooked dope, I heard this girl say that she used hot water from a tap when she didn't have a lighter handy but I can't imagine the shit dissoloving that well without the heat, it pretty much just sits there except for a bit dissolving, and dosen't the heat bring the heroin oils, oe the sctive shit out and to the surface? I've seen the sheen on the surface and it seems like theres more in stronger shit..

 

[Slay]

maybe off topic but i wonder IVing cold things can cause vasoconstriction or not?