Can love conquer all?

[Aeon Psyche]

YOU THINK souls are at stake.

You have no way to know for sure, and no one does.

I'm sorry, I didn't want to get into a debate with you cause I respect your beliefs and your right to have them, but the one thing i can't accept is people trying to push their beliefs, ANY BELIEFS AT ALL, on others.

Its like drugs; I believe all drugs should be legal because everyone should have the right to choose what they put in their own bodies, but no one else should be able to force anyone else to take a drug, and that is a horrible thing to do.

No matter how much anyone believes that what they think is right, it is in my opinion morally wrong to preach to others that they have to think the same way otherwise something horrible is going to happen to them.

To be honest, I bet Jesus Christ himself would say the same thing, and I bet if Jesus were alive today he'd say that about 95 percent of his followers have the majority of his beliefs all wrong.

A belief is merely a belief but comprehension and understanding are a higher level that should be concerned. As it says, "believing is not enough, you need to know".

Jesus is alive today^^ And his opinion clearly states that he wishes for no religion, whatsoever to exist. Religions are beliefs, the truth however is something that should be understood.

 

[EphemeralOutlet141]

See that right there is what fucks me up the wall. You think you can get around the whole belief argument by saying it's "the truth". Lol, no. It's you BELIEVING something to be true. I find it the most condescending rebuttal in the history of this argument. You don't have any more proof than the rest of us.

 

[CoastTwoCoast]

I really like you as a person, but in all honesty I am offended by this statement. You are essentially telling us that any other form of love besides your own is false and worthy of punishment. What you call "devil worship" is essentially just humanism, and I'd rather believe in myself as a human than a deity high above me that would punish me for not loving it. That is not love, it is psychopathy and genocide. I only reference "demons" in my belief system as concepts and traits that I wish to embody.

I don't see why you cannot afford the benefit of the doubt to other's form of love the way we're doing for you. As Daniel Sloss said, "just because we believe different things happen to us after we die, doesn't mean that we can't be kind to each other while we live".

Trust me. I'm doing you and others here a kindness by telling you the TRUTH. Some people want to write that link about the truth of satanic cults off because it comes from a site of a believer in Jesus. It doesn't matter, it's still the truth! Hopefully you won't find out it's the truth when it's too late. People here defend LaVey when he was obviously sacrificing humans and worshipping the devil just like Crowley. It offends my very spirit, but I see right through the deception and know people are blinded. People better wake up and get a clue. This isn't a game. Jesus and the devil are real. The Satanist leaders know that, but ease people in with lies. There are some who know the truth and choose to rebel anyway. Good luck to them in the afterlife because there is one whether people believe it or not.

2 Corinthians 4:4

Satan, who is the god of this world, has blinded the minds of those who don’t believe. They are unable to see the glorious light of the Good News. They don’t understand this message about the glory of Christ, who is the exact likeness of God.

 

[EphemeralOutlet141]

Ah of course just more of the same martyr complex, should've known.

I'm out this thread.

 

[Mycophile]

A belief is merely a belief but comprehension and understanding are a higher level that should be concerned. As it says, "believing is not enough, you need to know".

Jesus is alive today^^ And his opinion clearly states that he wishes for no religion, whatsoever to exist. Religions are beliefs, the truth however is something that should be understood.

How on earth do you know that ''Jesus is alive today'', and do you mean that he's alive like a normal human being who has a heart and lungs and can get sick and go to the hospital like the rest of us?

And how is that you can be so sure that you know what his opinion is, and if Jesus really is alive, then why has that info not been published on the cover of the New York Times and every major paper in the world, considering that that is some pretty big news?

I am sorry man, but you have magical thinking and unreasonable beliefs.

You are free to have them, but I equate what you believe to saying that I have wings and can take off right now in my living room and fly, that i can move objects with my mind, and that I have a unicorn in my backyard that i can talk to and who helps me predict the future.

I think the bottom line is not whether or not what you believe is true, BUT NOT TELLING OTHER PEOPLE TO BELIEVE IT, BECAUSE THAT IS IMMORAL.

You are free to believe what you want, and yes indeed you do also have freedom of speech, but most people don't like being told what to believe.

There is what is legal, which is saying whatever you want, and then there is WHAT IS MORAL, and in my own personal moral code, telling others you know the truth to the deepest, darkest mystical answers and that THEY HAVE TO BELIEVE YOU and listen to you or they will burn in hell is wrong.

Believe what you want, but realize that it's going to piss a lot of people off if you preach to them, and you may even lose some friends over it.

 

[Mycophile]

Ah of course just more of the same martyr complex, should've known.

I'm out this thread.

Yeah man it really is upsetting isn't it?

I very rarely get into discussions like this, and when they happen they are always online.

The last time anyone really preached to me like this IN PERSON was many years ago, and we knew eachother through a common sport we practiced, but when he tried to preach to me I'd just stop talking and try to ignore him, which was not always easy, cause if I actually engaged in the conversation it would never end, and eventually we would probably have no longer been friends, which i did not want because otherwise i liked him and wanted to remain friends.

These people simply don't realize how immoral and wrong it is to go around telling people what to believe.

It really isn't cool, and i respect everyone's right to believe whatever, but when you push it on others is when it's a problem.

I don't understand why silently believing what they believe and reading their books by themselves and meditating and praying or whatever is not good enough for them and they have to go out and try to ''spread the word.''

It makes me question if maybe they are not actually strong enough in their beliefs that they feel the need to do so, but whatever.

 

[Mycophile]

Trust me. I'm doing you and others here a kindness by telling you the TRUTH. Some people want to write that link about the truth of satanic cults off because it comes from a site of a believer in Jesus. It doesn't matter, it's still the truth! Hopefully you won't find out it's the truth when it's too late. People here defend LaVey when he was obviously sacrificing humans and worshipping the devil just like Crowley. It offends my very spirit, but I see right through the deception and know people are blinded. People better wake up and get a clue. This isn't a game. Jesus and the devil are real. The Satanist leaders know that, but ease people in with lies. There are some who know the truth and choose to rebel anyway. Good luck to them in the afterlife because there is one whether people believe it or not.

2 Corinthians 4:4

Satan, who is the god of this world, has blinded the minds of those who don’t believe. They are unable to see the glorious light of the Good News. They don’t understand this message about the glory of Christ, who is the exact likeness of God.

Coast2Coast, whether or not you BELIEVE it is the truth, which I fully respect, does not make it MORALLY RIGHT for you to preach to others about it, and if we do not believe it is a ''kindness'' that it is NOT a ''kindness''.

I don't believe it's a ''kindness'', it offends me, and I wish you would stop.

And the fact that my guess is that you have probably never read much about any other major religion or philosophy or considered whether or not those might have any merit also is a different factor, but frankly i can't imagine choosing a belief system without at least reviewing others first...

If you want to tell me something, and I don't want to listen to it, no matter what it might be about, i mean, it could be about a recipe for pizza for all i care lol, DO I NOT HAVE THE RIGHT NOT TO LISETN TO YOU?

Do I HAVE to sit there and listen to what you want to tell me, even if it offends me and upsets me?

If we are in a room and you start talking about this and i dont' want to hear it, do i not have the right to put on my headphones or walk out of the room?

The bottom line to me isn't what you believe or don't believe or what is true or not, but that it is not morally right to preach to people and tell them to change their opinions, or to try to force people to listen to what you have to say ABOUT ANYTHING.

Talking is a 2-way street, involving a speaker and a listener, and if the listener does not want to listen, then it is time for the speaker to stop speaking.

And by the way, quoting the bible means nothing to us, because while I DO think the bible is a great book that DOES have a lot of wisdom in it, so do many other holy books, and I believe it was written by fallible men and is not the word of God, so it will not convince me of anything.

The way i see it, you could be reading from a book of Greek Myths or from The Koran.

If you go around preaching to people you meet, which for your sake and theirs i'd HOPE you don't do IN PUBLIC, you are going to piss a lot of people off and start a lot of arguments.

I generally try to stay out of both religious and political discussions for this very reason, and i am almost always about to do so in person, but online i sometimes fall into the trap lol...

 

[Mycophile]

See that right there is what fucks me up the wall. You think you can get around the whole belief argument by saying it's "the truth". Lol, no. It's you BELIEVING something to be true. I find it the most condescending rebuttal in the history of this argument. You don't have any more proof than the rest of us.

Yeah, i mean, i just can't.

And i'm not gonna brag, but i'm well educated...so actually, this does sound like bragging, but I'm no smarter than anyone else, i have just had the opportunity to, and interest necessary, to read about a lot of stuff and think a lot about what i might or might not believe, and still i don't have most of my beliefs figured out and remain agnostic.

I majored in philosophy at a good college and have an M.A. in English.

In college i had the credits to choose between majoring in philosophy, english, psychology or religion.

I took classes in; Religion of Islam, Jewish Mysticism, Eastern Religions including buddhism, taoism, confucism and shintoism, abnormal psychology, general psychology, sufism, pragmatism, empiricism, Kant, and many others i've forgotten.

I haven't read MOST of the bible, but some day i'd like to make it through the whole thing cause i like to be educated and it's an important book, but i have read several parts of both the Hebrew bible and the new testament including Genesis, Exodus, Judges, Revaltions, bits and pieces of the gospels and other parts, i've read parts of The Koran, all of Dante's Inferno, John Milton's Paradise Lost, all of the Tao De Ching, all of Anton Lavey's books, all of a huge book about the Golden Dawn, Anton Lavey's biography, Aleister Crowley's biography, Eckhart Tolle's ''The Power of Now'', books on withcraft, voodoo, alchemy, Norse, Egyptian and Greek mythology and parts of the very fascinating Kalevala, which is the Finnish book of mythology, and more.

On my next list of religious books to read is Homer's Illiad and Oddesey and Ovid's Metamorphosis.

All these systems of belief are FASCINATING, and it is interesting to notice the differences and similarities therein.

And then you have people believing that any one of these has all the answers, and i don't get it.

I have also had Turkish people try to convert me to Islam while i was SUPER high on coke, weed and drunk in college and that's a funny memory lol.


I mean, my way of thinking is that with all the systems of belief out there that you'd be most likely to find the truth by examining all of them with a grain of salt and considering what parts of some might be worthwhile and discarding the rest, but that's just me.

 

[Aeon Psyche]

How on earth do you know that ''Jesus is alive today'', and do you mean that he's alive like a normal human being who has a heart and lungs and can get sick and go to the hospital like the rest of us?

And how is that you can be so sure that you know what his opinion is, and if Jesus really is alive, then why has that info not been published on the cover of the New York Times and every major paper in the world, considering that that is some pretty big news?

I am sorry man, but you have magical thinking and unreasonable beliefs.

You are free to have them, but I equate what you believe to saying that I have wings and can take off right now in my living room and fly, that i can move objects with my mind, and that I have a unicorn in my backyard that i can talk to and who helps me predict the future.

I think the bottom line is not whether or not what you believe is true, BUT NOT TELLING OTHER PEOPLE TO BELIEVE IT, BECAUSE THAT IS IMMORAL.

You are free to believe what you want, and yes indeed you do also have freedom of speech, but most people don't like being told what to believe.

There is what is legal, which is saying whatever you want, and then there is WHAT IS MORAL, and in my own personal moral code, telling others you know the truth to the deepest, darkest mystical answers and that THEY HAVE TO BELIEVE YOU and listen to you or they will burn in hell is wrong.

Believe what you want, but realize that it's going to piss a lot of people off if you preach to them, and you may even lose some friends over it.

Because nobody ever really dies. They reincarnate through various lifes and eventually move on to be purely spirit. That's why nobody ever saw god, she/he is purely spirit and there are only electrons visible within one's soul. I do not believe in magic and you fail to understand the difference between understanding and believing. I have no doubt about what I have explained. To sprout wings and or use telekinesis, you would need to develop your soul quite a bit more but it is defintiely possible, eventually. Don't expect such in one life. I have no info about unicorns but I assume they would be made-up. And there is no such thing as hell. And I can say that with 100% certainty because it is non-sensical. I'm not preachy, I am not even religious. I understand the book of thiaoouba prophecy since I was 16 and a few years later, god even asked me to enlighten the people.

 

[Wormwood44]

It seems that most of us appear to believe in Something / Some type of belief system that helps us guide our lives. A lot of us (me included) knows what addiction is, and how it destroys every aspect of our lives. For those of us who have had addiction, most of us were pulled / rescued from death by the LOVE of people who continued to believe in us, and didn't see as we were, but who we could be.

So back to the thread topic: I have seen many, many people in addiction overcome overwhelming conditions to end up thriving in life. These people (including myself) claim to have a spiritual connection to a God that loves them.

Yes, I hate it when someone throws religion down my throat. I personally don't preach my faith to others. I try to let my actions in love be my walking sermon (I fail a lot). Then, if someone asks me about my faith, I am glad to talk about it. So I believe and have seen that Love Does Conquer many things!

 

[Mycophile]

Because nobody ever really dies. They reincarnate through various lifes and eventually move on to be purely spirit. That's why nobody ever saw god, she/he is purely spirit and there are only electrons visible within one's soul. I do not believe in magic and you fail to understand the difference between understanding and believing. I have no doubt about what I have explained. To sprout wings and or use telekinesis, you would need to develop your soul quite a bit more but it is defintiely possible, eventually. Don't expect such in one life. I have no info about unicorns but I assume they would be made-up. And there is no such thing as hell. And I can say that with 100% certainty because it is non-sensical. I'm not preachy, I am not even religious. I understand the book of thiaoouba prophecy since I was 16 and a few years later, god even asked me to enlighten the people.

Umm, ok man, but the truth is you don't know that any of that is true.

If you believe it, that's great though.

I don't think we should probably respond anymore to eachother cause you seem pretty set in your beliefs and I don't really agree with them.

Peace.

 

[Xorkoth]

I've tried and failed in this debate, and I decided to stop trying a while ago. It's hard not to take offense, but I try to remember that it's coming from good intentions. As you have pointed out, you can't force your views on someone else. You can try, but it doesn't work. As such we should all try to analyze whether we are being invited to criticize the beliefs of others, or whether we are doing it for our own benefit.

 

[CoastTwoCoast]

I've tried and failed in this debate, and I decided to stop trying a while ago. It's hard not to take offense, but I try to remember that it's coming from good intentions. As you have pointed out, you can't force your views on someone else. You can try, but it doesn't work. As such we should all try to analyze whether we are being invited to criticize the beliefs of others, or whether we are doing it for our own benefit.

I wouldn't guide you or anyone else wrong. After years and years of research and connecting the dots.
It all leads to Jesus Christ is the way.

 

[What 23]

What is love?

 

[draculic acid69]

I really like you as a person, but in all honesty I am offended by this statement. You are essentially telling us that any other form of love besides your own is false and worthy of punishment. What you call "devil worship" is essentially just humanism, and I'd rather believe in myself as a human than a deity high above me that would punish me for not loving it. That is not love, it is psychopathy and genocide. I only reference "demons" in my belief system as concepts and traits that I wish to embody.

I don't see why you cannot afford the benefit of the doubt to other's form of love the way we're doing for you. As Daniel Sloss said, "just because we believe different things happen to us after we die, doesn't mean that we can't be kind to each other while we live".

she like radical Muslims who behead the non believers and infidels has no tolerance to accept anything other than her 'truths'.

 

[Yourbaker]

What is love?

This is dependant on the language and frame of reference of every person.

Love is an emotion, like all emotions it is caused by a conflict of the frontal lobe and the hind brain. You want one outcome so badly you give up reason and enter into an illogical fantasy that allows you to surrender any personal need or want, in favour of another, the object of your love.

As the recipient of another's love it is difficult, but not impossible, to respond out of kind (not return the love). If we all practiced it though there would actually be nothing to conquer.

 

[Xorkoth]

Are you suggesting we should give up love? Not sure if I'm reading that right. I actually disagree with your definition of love. I think people can mistake toxic codependency for love quite easily and often. What you suggest isn't real love, but more like an obsessive dependency. I don't think the idea of sacrificing yourself to protect one you love is a bad thing, but in any relationship, sacrificing your own needs to appease another is very toxic and I agree we should give up on that kind of love. In fact when one person requires that of another, they do not truly love that person, and the person sacrificing themselves is being abused. Real love involves mutual respect in all ways, including the needs and desires of the other person. Real love is selfless and additive, not subtractive. This isn't just for romantic love for also the love of friendship and the love of family (which often coexist). Real love makes both people stronger. I put forth that if we all practiced real love, the world would be a far better place. Love is the best part of the human experience, when it is healthy love.

 

[Yourbaker]

Yeah my bad, I really worded that poorly. Should almost delete it and try again.

I'm referring to the love of a parent specifically. Love is used to mean far too many things in English. Oddly you related that to toxic co-dependancy. I suppose some parental love is toxic to the recipients at time but my bad for not making a specific reference.

When we are loved in honesty and not for something but just because we are, it's difficult but not impossible to reject that love. If it is returned and not rejected, there is nothing to conquer. Being able to be loved and pass that love on IMHO is to the spirit of humanity what breath is to the physical.

However, love is an emotional state where we reject logic and willingly give up self for the better of the one we love. Love to me isn't specific to co-dependancy like a parents love could be said to be co-dependant but you really have to stretch definitions tpo do it.

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

No. Love cannot conquer all. If you believe it can, then you are seriously deluded...

 

[F.U.B.A.R.]

I have absolutely no recollection of sending the above post.

Fuckin vodka...