Benzos Can I use citric acid to lower pH for Midazolam?

[Captain.Heroin]

If I can, how much would it take?

 

[limonov]

I've banged a lot of midazolam- both from vials (1mg/ml or 5mg/ml) and from wheel filtering pill...yes, bad, I know...Midazolam is almost the only thing that I prefer to inject, but on the whole I don't really want to touch midazolam again...it's too fucking strong.

I've never adjusted the ph of the water- though using citric would be fine, you won't need to use that much, but you'll need ph strips if you actually want to confirm the ph- and I've never had a problem getting it into solution. I'm probably losing some, but not enough to be noticeable- one filtered 15mg Hypnovel felt the same as 3 5mg vials.

As long as you're not trying to make ultra-concentrated solutions you shouldn't run into any problems...it's actually quite important that you don't go above about 7.5mg/ml, in the documentation that comes with Hypnovel vials it has a big bit about how midazolam must be injected slowly and the patients breathing must be heavily monitored. This is because IV Midazolam fairly regularly spontaneously stops people breathing- and this is in a clinical setting! I don't think it has anything to do with tolerance either, I think it's sorta like your body almost going into shock due to that much sedation that quickly and you just stop breathing.

Stay safe mang- shooting midazolam is fucking serious business, particularly with you on bupe. Also, it has a habit of causing instant blackouts, EXTREME disinhibition, a complete loss of motor control and possibly most dangerously compulsive redosing- I thought I had taken 10 vials (50mg) over an evening (plugging, not IV)...it was only when I looked in my stash box the next day that I realized that I had actually plugged 30 vials (150mg). The strange, stupefying pseudo-rush and incredible euphoria is pretty neat...but retardation, amnesia and complete lack of inhibitions (and believe it or not everyone NEEDS inhibitions!) are all pretty fucking dire.

I've engaged in a lot of 'risky behaviour' in my drug taking...uhh...career but midazolam is the only one that had be completely beat- not to mention very nearly killing me at least half a dozen times. It also caused my tolerance to skyrocket- as with opiates, IV benzos seem to produce worse withdrawal/rebound insomnia/anxiey than orally- particularly to the hypnotic effects of other benzos. Eventually the midazolam started losing its hypnotic effects too.

These days I actually have a couple of vials of flumezil....just in case

Please be careful, the forum just wouldn't be the same if you weren't around mang.

(That was one long ass, tangential stoned ramble)

 

[Tryptamite]

Citric acid and ph strips. I never got much effect from just dissolving tablets in neutral water. I'm pretty sure the quantity of midazolam in the solution only becomes worth shooting at 4-5 ph.

I used to wash 2 blue 15mg dormicum with 2ml water at ph 3.5-4. Never felt it was too much. Either I was doing it wrong or I have a tolerance to benzos.

 

[alt 14]

Dude iv midazlam fucks you uppppp.. I got it when my wisdom teeth got pulled out and I remember coming to(also got fentanyl in the iv which idk how long it lasts) and going to get the smoothie with the free coupon we got from the surgery. I walked in and like hit what I wanted on the sign hanging over the counter where you order because.. Well I really don't know why. And on the way home I asked to go to the park to walk around because I've never been that wrecked in my life. Looking back its prob good dad said no because I could barely walk.

Sooo yeah, hang on to your hat. It's quite a ride.

 

[sekio]

Use 1 molar eq of citric acid per mole of midazolam.

192g/mol citric acid anhydr. per
325g/mol midazolam

= 0.59 mg citric acid per 1mg midazolam freebase
to form 1.59mg midazolam citrate.


Midazolam is "water soluble at pH 4", apparently. But 1 molar eq is all you should need. Maybe a little more.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I've banged a lot of midazolam- both from vials (1mg/ml or 5mg/ml) and from wheel filtering pill...yes, bad, I know...Midazolam is almost the only thing that I prefer to inject, but on the whole I don't really want to touch midazolam again...it's too fucking strong.

I've never adjusted the ph of the water- though using citric would be fine, you won't need to use that much, but you'll need ph strips if you actually want to confirm the ph- and I've never had a problem getting it into solution. I'm probably losing some, but not enough to be noticeable- one filtered 15mg Hypnovel felt the same as 3 5mg vials.

As long as you're not trying to make ultra-concentrated solutions you shouldn't run into any problems...it's actually quite important that you don't go above about 7.5mg/ml, in the documentation that comes with Hypnovel vials it has a big bit about how midazolam must be injected slowly and the patients breathing must be heavily monitored. This is because IV Midazolam fairly regularly spontaneously stops people breathing- and this is in a clinical setting! I don't think it has anything to do with tolerance either, I think it's sorta like your body almost going into shock due to that much sedation that quickly and you just stop breathing.

Stay safe mang- shooting midazolam is fucking serious business, particularly with you on bupe. Also, it has a habit of causing instant blackouts, EXTREME disinhibition, a complete loss of motor control and possibly most dangerously compulsive redosing- I thought I had taken 10 vials (50mg) over an evening (plugging, not IV)...it was only when I looked in my stash box the next day that I realized that I had actually plugged 30 vials (150mg). The strange, stupefying pseudo-rush and incredible euphoria is pretty neat...but retardation, amnesia and complete lack of inhibitions (and believe it or not everyone NEEDS inhibitions!) are all pretty fucking dire.

I've engaged in a lot of 'risky behaviour' in my drug taking...uhh...career but midazolam is the only one that had be completely beat- not to mention very nearly killing me at least half a dozen times. It also caused my tolerance to skyrocket- as with opiates, IV benzos seem to produce worse withdrawal/rebound insomnia/anxiey than orally- particularly to the hypnotic effects of other benzos. Eventually the midazolam started losing its hypnotic effects too.

These days I actually have a couple of vials of flumezil....just in case

Please be careful, the forum just wouldn't be the same if you weren't around mang.

(That was one long ass, tangential stoned ramble)

Thanks. That was a lot of quality advice. Much and thanks for sharing your experience.

= 0.59 mg citric acid per 1mg midazolam freebase
to form 1.59mg midazolam citrate.


Midazolam is "water soluble at pH 4", apparently. But 1 molar eq is all you should need. Maybe a little more.

I love you

I've been holding onto these 15mg and 7.5mg midazolam tablets for a while. I don't have many and I don't intend on using but half a 7.5mg tablet per session, so this is going to be the bomb.

I have no intention on making a huge vial of this; I'll just be making a few milligrams of solution per session.

I have had a massive IV midazolam dosage in the OR along with a massive IV fentanyl dosage simultaneously on top of a nerve block (which seems to reinforce the reality that the pain meds I received before and after were almost nothing compared to teh level of pain I was actually in....) so I am prepared for this kind of experience, I know what to expect, etc. I won't be abusive with the drug. I only intend to use it to help end stimulant/psychedelic "nights" and to get sleep from severe insomnia (when I'm not spun/tripping).

I also used to get relief from 0.5mg alprazoalm PRIOR to the surgery in the OR which required much midazolam and fentanyl IV; now I need 1mg of alprazoalm to get anxiety/panic relief, if not more.

I'll also use pH papers but I wouldn't know where to get them (except MAYBE I DO!!!)

sekio baby I need your help

I'm very nauseous, have vomited 4-5 times in less than 10 minutes (I think I drank some milk that already went bad without thinking twice about picking up the glass and chugging away 8(), am rather anxious, I want to be able to do the same thing with alprazolam but for plugging (I used to IV alprazolam watered down to a low degree, I want to get it in a small volume if I were to do it that way).

So that also leads me to the question of, would a 4 pH solution be comfortable to plug?

I already know the math for the midazolam tabs but those are special and I can't hold still to prepare something micron filtered as I'm vomiting and shaking and stuff.

Thanks again
Captain

 

[Ksa]

Use 1 molar eq of citric acid per mole of midazolam.

192g/mol citric acid anhydr. per
325g/mol midazolam

= 0.59 mg citric acid per 1mg midazolam freebase
to form 1.59mg midazolam citrate.


Midazolam is "water soluble at pH 4", apparently. But 1 molar eq is all you should need. Maybe a little more.

pro

 

[Captain.Heroin]

pro

Thanks for the helpful post man.

Sorry to be a bit cunt-ish, I'm just not feeling well in a long-lasting series of panic attack after panic attack, with only brief intermissions of dissociation, derealization, or just merely accepting what's going on. I'm even trying to feel better and have already had 1mg of xanax plugged from impromptuitively using too much citric (2ml water + 1ml = .11g citric acid)

I assumed the molecular weight of alprazolam should weigh the same if not less than midazolam due to incredibly similar structure if not slightly smaller structure size.

So anyways I feel the releif (I'm not feeling zero panic attacks, I'm still feeling them just as often and stuff, but it's a lot easier to endure them instead of feeling it 100% more than I should due to the circumstances).

I believe there's something that I'm doing to reduce my ability to employ derealization and dissociation as coping mechanisms, and it's kind of scaring me how many panic attacks I've undoubtedly avoided successfully due to the semi-unhealthy coping mechanisms of derealization and dissociation (I probably employ the latter more than the former).

I think I'll be fine if I stick to just some hash oil/wax, my bupe, and the 1mg of xanax I've already had, maybe another milligram later today if needed. I just know that I will have to do more in depth research into why I am doing this to myself (is it merely to test how I am without these coping mechanisms? Is it merely to try what life would be like without these coping mechanisms? is this self-medication for insomnia, as well as selective mutism/PTSD, as well as lastly but not least, ADHD being amplified to an extreme degree due to buprenorphine tapering withdrawal symptoms - I went from 320mcg IV dosages to 107 mcg IV dosages instantaneously; took about 2-3 weeks to adjust to it, and so I then dropped to 80 mcg IV and am still adjusting to only 80mcg 3-4x per day maximum, where that would probably be a minimum number of shots I was doing with a maximum of twice that with 320mcg per dosage).

There could be other reasons, like tempting fate due to past mental problems and scary lapses where I cease using derealization as a coping mechanism and actually start to believe it, or it could be part of my desire to seek no change in life (I said something cryptically here no one's going to get so stop reading when I started saying ", or it could be...)

everything behind this last line was most likely the case so I need to weigh the possibilities and try to do some psychoanalysis of myself (for once 8(...) to try to find out what factor(s) are at play here so I can work my way forwards through this instead of having to be a mental zombie most of the time to distance my body from my mind/soul/true feelings/thoughts.

But yeah your post didn't help at all and I'm suffering so much so it's hard for me not to be a dick. Would you be albe to tell me if the molecualr weight was simliar to alprazolam at least? I tried googling for a result and it's kind of hrad to sit here and google when going through such severe panic attacks that I'm literally dry heaving and vomitting from the panic, and the best way to feel better includes keeping my eyes closed and/or physically doing something to distract my mind (like speedwalking and jogging a long distance to go buy and carry groceries just to have the tactile sensation to focus on instead of the thougths/flashbacks/tics/defenseless mind in essence). Doing something to reduce my ability to rely on my 2 main coping mechanisms while tapering quiclky with buprenorphine is getting really hard for me to do. It's a bit fucked up how it's effecting me and one day I will try to describe what this is like that I'm going through but likely in The Dark Side.

By the way this last 6 weeks have been the hapiest days of my entire life, I haven't used heroin the entire time ( I'm tapering on bupe and feel great for having done it), and I realzed I can go through debilitating panic attacks knowing that I'll eventually come out of this sooner or later, and I'll be able to go back to my amazing life with a huge smile on my face. If I didn't have the amazing life I do, I don't know if I could go through this as smoothly as I have been for the last 6 months (Other than today and yesterday I've only probably had 2-3 panic attacks for the last 6 weeks, only 1 of which was "severe" and I've had a few severe ones over these last few days).

Much to the BL community and especially extra to anyone who can tell me anything about the molecular weight of alprazolam or how much citric it would require to dissolve. I'm sure I used way much (but I did add in 2 extra mL of water to help the pill matter dissolve and it didn't burn my ass whatsoever, seemed like not acidic enough to burn, but still seemed like a generous amount for 1mg alprazolam).

Even if you have nothing extra to add, please at least throw some kind words my way. Even if you have nothing to say but "best of luck dude", it'll not probably have much effect on me but iwll earn you positive karma for your own life and everyone deserves an amazing life like me. I don't let PTSD lead me to thinking that I can't have an amazing life, because I have one now, I just have bad days like anyone else with PTSD or selective mutism or depression/anxiety disorders have, but I know there are great ones ahead for all of us who are good at heart.

 

[sekio]

Derealization/depersonalization are often exacerbated by cannabis concentrate use. If you have panic disorder to the point where you are physically ill... you should try to figure out why your body is acting up.

By the way, molecular weights are found in the last section of the sidebar on a wikipedia page ("Chemical Data") - alprazolam is 308 Da. For most benzos the ratio is going to be about the same. Roughly 0.6mg citric acid to 1mg benzo. However not all benzos will form a salt readily.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

So that also leads me to the question of, would a 4 pH solution be comfortable to plug?

FWIW I've plugged vinegar & cocaine before with no ill effect.



Though vinegar doesn't have a pH; it has 5% acidity .

 

[Ksa]

Thanks for the helpful post man.

Having the calculation verified by another professional is a very useful post indeed as it further confirms its genuinity. You can imagine I got other shit to do then to calculate molar ratios to make sure it's correct.

Regarding the panic attacks...why you still fear death man? After so much time of drug use? Even if you die, what's the big deal...don't you wana visit other places, you wana be stuck on Earth forever? You make too much of a deal out of it. Many people turn to religion to adress this fear. The fear of ceasing to exist. Sooner or later you will need to adress this issue or the panic attacks will continue and possibly worsten.

If you could never exist again in the future or in a parallel Universe, how come you're able to exist now? The way I regard death is as a gamble: You can end up in a better place or in a worst place, and even if you end up nowhere, you have no proof that it's worst then this life...first thing I remember when I was born is the pain...maybe we all got used to it and we don't even notice it anymore. Don't worry about death. It's the least of your worries.

 

[alt 14]

FWIW I've plugged vinegar & cocaine before with no ill effect.



Though vinegar doesn't have a pH; it has 5% acidity .

Dude vinegar is dilute acetic acid. It has a ph. I think it's like 1 or 2.

 

[Bob Loblaw]

 

[alt 14]

Troll fail. Bob, you fail as troll. So bad.

 

[twotoomany]

Hey Cap'n!

Hope all is well, man. Those bad anxiety days SUCK. You'll get by though. Hope it passes quickly for ya man.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Thanks

The Midazolam I prepped was bangalicious.

 

[DeLee]

Funny coincidence the plan is to have 150-225mg of midazolam (20-30 7,5mg tabs) soon.
This is in the top 3 benzos for me, its amazing IVed. Will read through the thread with sober eyes tomorow.

 

[tricomb]

I regularly plug solutions (meth&morphine, meth&oxy, meth&heroin, which I've tested and most come out around pH 4-5 (but recently have been buffering them with sodium bicarb to the much more rectal-friendly pH of 8-8.5) and I have been injecting a lot lately but I would not want to IV highly acidic/concentrated solutions, my days of IV benzos are long over. If I had midazolam, unless it were the IV-vials I would just sublingual the tablets. I'd IV the IV-solution, but not as a stimulant-comedown helper, because I know it wouldn't really work jack shit against the stimulants I would be taking, these days I just take antipsychotics when I'm done playing with uppers. I don't endorse or recommend this.

@CH, I always used citric to IV dormicum/midazolam tablets that I'd get over the border or online, using simply pH strips and adding pinches at a time until I got to pH 3.5-4, and damn IVing that really could burn, but usually I would be losing consciousness before I noticed "oh that kind of burned" and would focus all of my energy on making sure I got the needle out after administering the shot fully, because way too many times when I was shooting midazolam, (in combo often with other stuff it should not be combined with so I won't say what as it's not relevant) I'd wake up with the needle still stuck in me, and with less than half of my shot administered.... which sadly I would often then proceed to inject and be KO'd again.

I'm very lucky to be alive and lived throughout the worst of my days with depression, suicide, etc.