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Boycott Singapore - Van's unfair sentance

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Legalising heroin would be the only successful opinion.

Should addicts of legal drugs be treated differently to addicts of illegal ones? Imagine if tommorow it cost $70 to buy a pack of cigarettes. How many calm faces would you see in the morning on the train?

Would there be a large blackmarket for heroin and would all the crimes associated with heroin trafficing (like this one) decrease if heroin was legalised?

Switzerland and the UK have trials going right now where heroin addictions recieve their drug free through the UK pharmacy system. They are able to keep jobs and look after their families because seeing as the drug is free, they are'nt spending their whole salary to fuel their habit.

Nearly all deaths related to heroin are a result of the laws against it which promote backyard production with variable dosages.

Its clear that the drug laws cause the drug problems.. how much more evidence do people need? But oh, i forgot.. we all must stick to our nice legal (taxable drugs like alcohol, nicotine and caffine which rake in billions for corperations. Who cares about health now eh?
 
It depends what your definition of legalisation is.

You say "we should see drug law as a unified enemy which creates the dealers and peddlers in the first place". By that statement, it sounds like you'd prefer it if drug laws were removed entirely.

The trials you're using as a justification for the abolition for drug laws are prescription only. Further, it isn't a system whereby a heroin user can get his free dose then continue on working a 9-5 job and live a normal life. They're intended to get the user off drugs entirely so they can then integrate back into society.
 
^^^
re: your second last post...

slightly off topic but what's wrong with legalising heroin? are you one of those people inclined to believe that everybody is going to run out and try smack if it were to be legalised? that same argument is used to justify opposition to the legalisation of marijuana ( a drug 1 in 3 admit to using at one time or another) and is completely devoid of factual evidence. evidence actually suggests the opposite to be true, taking into account that in the netherlands marijauna use has remained stable since it was legalised in the 70's.

the majority of heroin deaths occur from overdosing, a consequence of unregulated manufacture. imagine how many people would be dropping dead daily if aspirin was made illegal and it's manufacture left to criminals?

as stated earlier in this thread and in countless other threads over the years, prohibition causes more problems than the drug itself, for both the user and society. if a junkie mum can get her fix legally at a reasonable cost, she's not going to have to prostitute herself to raise drug funds. she would interact socially more often, coming into contact with people who can help her kick her habit if she wants to, and she can be a better mother to her child/children seeing she could afford to school/house/feed/clothe them. she would be a much more stable person, not associating with undesirables, she could even hold down a job, something high income workers with habits do quite easily.

cigarettes are legal, and through honest information on the dangers of smoking there has been a huge decline in the number of smokers over the years. they didn't have to be banned to achieve such an effect. why should heroin or other drugs for that matter be any different?
 
^ i completely agree with your post, but have to posit the question, would people want cigarettes made legal if they were currently illegal, and we had the benefits of knowing the dangers of them before deciding whether to legalise them?
 
^^Ofcourse they should be legal. All substances should. We are adults. I dont much agree with many of Timothy Leary's speeches but he once said that it should be a basic human right to control what goes on inside the mind and body, without hinderance, because this is you're territory, you're nation, you're country. As long as you arnt harming others. Many things are dangerous for us; Mcdonalds, lard, driving and crossing the road, however we take these risks all through the game of life. If people are educated with truth and wisdom regarding ALL substances, that is the greatest gift of all.

The authorities seem to always miss this but where there is demand there will always be SUPPLY. Its a basic law of economics is it not? Making things illegal only creates a black market economy controlled by thugs and crooks, therefore our children must come into contact with street life and the crimial system to get a hit of heroin or a gram of skunk. It just shouldnt be that way PERIOD.

We tend to live in an environment which sees drug use as something without a history. When I was taught drug education at school for example, I was taught half truths. I was taught that LSD is bad, full stop, but failed to be educated on the fact that LSD was used as a medicine to help sick people before the government implemented its reactionary laws and misguided thinking on it back in the 60s as a result of a few (already mentally) ill people dying. Thousands of people die every year from alcohol and tobacco but do we see any similar moves from the government? Surely this hypocracy is enough for people to realise drug laws are completely inconsistant and corrupt.

People are always going to get high, or low... Imposing restictions on it is only going to cause more death and injury

Will more people use heroin if it is made legal? Wow, i think not.. I certainly wouldnt. Many people who research heroin addiction have found that opiates in general appeal to people who have deep seeded emotional issues relating to lonely disjointed childhoods. Instead of marginalising and critisising heroin addicts we should learn something from them.

Anyway...
 
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Mary Poppins said:
Also - it really jars me when people in this thread who have obviously contributed in some way to the drug market, condemn drug traffickers in that way. Sure - it's heroin, and I understand there's a large stigma attached to this drug and not everyone's contact with it has been pleasant, but seriously, I do not understand how any of you can jump onto the moral highground with this one ---- if you have even consumed drugs, you are perpetuating the unregulated, and yes in some aspects extremely negative, violent and damaging cycle of the drug market - whether within Australia or overseas.

(pre-emptive: yes, i know consuming drugs is not as 'bad' as trafficking them, but you can't argue you're still helping that economy along)
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I've contributed to the drug trade, sure, I was also a pretty busy dealer for a few years too, but then I got busted, I went to court, I almost went to jail, I'm still paying off a huge fine, I can't travel overseas, it ended my previous career (not the dealing ;) )I can't get certain jobs (even though I'm far more qualified than some of the fuckwits I go up against) I still get hassled by the cops on a regular basis so I have to keep my affairs squeaky clean.

However I don't hold any grudges against the justice/law system, because I knew well what I was doing before I started doing it, I don't by any means think that these laws are fair and just and nobody lobbied or campaigned to get me off the hook, however, I'm never going to have the power to change it, and props to the judge who sentenced me, he went pretty hard on me for the amount I was caught with, safe to say I'll never deal again.

Anyway the point of this thread was not whether we thought drug laws are fair or not, but to boycott a country because they uhold their laws, how ludicrous does this sound??

Think about how it makes australia look when we cry and moan about a country that's not afraid to carry out its laws, it makes us look like hypocrats who will drop all morals and values because because we let our naive and impressionable emotions get in the way of the real issue, which is, for anyone who's forgotten that someone broke the law and got caught.
 
I dont care if the guy did break the law...hes only 25 a kid, whole life to live..gonna pay for a mistake he made with his life, just brutal...he should off recieved clemency and thrown in jail....but executing him serves no purpose
 
silvia saint said:
didn't realise natural selection and genocide were the same thing :p
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Where did he mention genocide? His comments were indescriminate of race - unless of course you are implying that his reference to 'stupidity' was a slur to a particular race, in which case, you're a bigot :|
 
OK, lets wade in. I am an Aussie living in Singapore. While we do have drugs here, we have nothing like the problems that Australians face and challenges that every parent faces with their children at school. Is killing this man going to solve Australia's problem? Probably will do nothing at all - BUT - he broke the law in Singapore and knew he was doing it, so he pays the penalty. Just because he is Australian it doesn't mean he is immune from presecution - read the inside page of your passport to find out how that works. He is being executed here after due process of law for breaching Singapore law - just as you would expect a Singaporean to face the full force of Australian law should they break it there. If you don't like that - don't come here - especially carrying drugs.
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taken from theage.com.au story.

Sure I have consumed drugs, obviously giving money to drug traffickers. But if you can't read the signs, look at the news, read your PASSPORT, READ YOUR PLANE TICKET or simply just use your brain and know the risks of carrying drugs in Asia anywhere, then you really are just an idiot.

yes, this vietnamese guy is young and he did have a full life ahead of him - however, he travelled to a country known for its strict drug laws and knowingly broke their laws. he knowingly broke the law, for full purpose of making money. unlucky, he got caught.

if you want to do the crime, be prepared to do the time. I can go and buy ecstasy from someone here, if I get caught, I'm prepared to do the punishment that applies to the laws associated with it. I'm not stupid enough to ignore all warnings and carry a large quantity of class A drugs through countries that punish drug traffickers with death, but this young boy did so and obviously didn't care until it was too late.
 
KemicalBurn said:
Where did he mention genocide? His comments were indescriminate of race - unless of course you are implying that his reference to 'stupidity' was a slur to a particular race, in which case, you're a bigot :|
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from your link...

Much debate about genocide revolves around the proper definition of the word genocide.

Here is what Lemkin said about the definition of genocide in its original adoption for international law at the Geneva Conventions:

Generally speaking, genocide does not necessarily mean the immediate destruction of a nation, except when accomplished by mass killings of all members of a nation. It is intended rather to signify a coordinated plan of different actions aiming at the destruction of essential foundations of the life of national groups, with the aim of annihilating the groups themselves. The objectives of such a plan would be the disintegration of the political and social institutions, of culture, language, national feelings, religion, and the economic existence of national groups, and the destruction of the personal security, liberty, health, dignity, and even the lives of the individuals belonging to such groups. - Raphael Lemkin, *Axis Rule in Occupied Europe (http://www.preventgenocide.org/lemkin/AxisRule1944-1.htm) (Wash., D.C.: Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, 1944), p. 79.
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seriously, is kb like this in person? anyone? :X
 
lots of rhetoric, little substance.

you seem to have read the link (very good btw *golf claps*), yet you havent quite fully understood it, more-over, you dont quite seem to get the fact that the word "stupid" is an extremely subjective word, and it doesnt apply to a "class of persons" (which is vital for it to validate your arguments) because of its subtle meaning that leads everyone to their own interpretation of it.

You can run about saying "nazi this" and "fascist that", but at the end of the day, i still understand the meaning of the words i use and apply them correctly to my arguments.

take care,

your friendly neighbourhood KemicalBurner

ps: and, No, im even more standoffish in person :)
 
apologies kb, if i wasn't so depressed from the world being full of people like yourself i could focus on extending my vocabulary.
 
the same can be said for you, the measuring your dick thread is a few threads down ;). i'll give you one thing, you're really giving me the inspiration i so desperately need to leave my house on a more regular basis.
 
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