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Boycott Singapore - Van's unfair sentance

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keystroke: Do you purposely miss the point to piss people off or are you really that retarded?

I think the reason more people are speaking out about this particular execution is because;

a) it involves an australian
b) he's being killed for drug smuggling; something that most people on this board indirectly support simply by injesting illegal substances

It is ridiculous to suggest we would be able to create threads for every. single. person who dies but that's so not the fucking point.

xcidium: I don't agree. Some countries have laws that are inhumane and public pressure has been able to sway how that country is run. Apartheid in South Africa for example.
 
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and don't we have a right to protest against this because of the very fact that we are fellow human beings? what difference does some arbitrary line that divides australia from singapore have to do with it? we're all human beings, and i fail to see how a state border somehow permits another state to commit a horrible injustice against another human being?

keystroke: you are really struggling man. there are plenty of people in this thread whom i disagree with, but at least they seem to be making realistic arguments. you just keep missing the fucking point.

kemicalburn: yes, in my books that does make you a bad person. of course that doesn't mean anything in the scheme of things, but like i said to mazdan, when 'next' is all we can say in relation to a human life, then the world is heading in a pretty sad direction. furthermore, i think anyone who does think like that loses any possible right to sympathy regarding their life or that of anyone close to them. kb, i realise you said you'd bring your own noose, but what about your family?

we're talking ethical dilemmas here, so you have to also realise that just because you support, effectively, the death penalty in this particular case, there are potentially other scenarios where people would support it and you might not. if such a situation were to arise would you not campaign for support, for clemency, even for sympathy on behalf of your friends or family? because your argument supposes that you wouldn't: if a law is a law then that's the final say and nobody's actual ethics should ever come into it.

isn't that a terrible way to look at the world?
 
up all night said:
keystroke: Do you purposely miss the point to piss people off or are you really that retarded?

I think the reason more people are speaking out about this particular execution is because;

a) it involves an australian
b) he's being killed for drug smuggling; something that most people on this board indirectly support simply by injesting illegal substances

It is ridiculous to suggest we would be able to create threads for every. single. person who dies but that's so not the fucking point.

xcidium: I don't agree. Some countries have laws that are unhumane and public pressure has been able to sway how that country is run. Apartheid in South Africa for example.
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Great post :)
 
missing the point?

actually, I see the point. the point is he knowingly broke Singapore's harsh laws and now has to pay the price with his life. too fucking bad.

what's not to see with that? I don't fucking care that it's inhumane to execute one person because he's an Australian whilst 3000 others go by and not one single person here crying has protested against it openly in the forum.
 
If a member of my family were to smuggle drugs, and they got caught - then its their hard luck.

But once again, i sincerely doubt any member of my family would be stupid enough to smuggle drugs.

Saying "next" means the world is heading in a bad direction? ive already stated that were his stupidity be allowed into the gene pool - then that may take the human race to an even sadder future.

I think judging another nation and telling them which of their laws and punishments are just and which ones arent makes you a bad person.
 
KemicalBurn said:
I think judging another nation and telling them which of their laws and punishments are just and which ones arent makes you a bad person.
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Yeah. All those damn human rights activists. They're such bad people. Lets hope they don't breed.
 
I think judging another nation and telling them which of their laws and punishments are just and which ones arent makes you a bad person.
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LOL. So you are saying the blacks should have respected white man's law in the USA? Are you saying the white Australia policy shouldnt have been faught? Its about progression. To progress you have to object and fight. You have lost all credibility in my books (not that you really care anyway). Go pray to your science. :)
 
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^ (KemicalBurn) I think it makes you an informed and intelligent person.

The world is full of stupid people (and laws) and I'll gladly point fingers.
 
The following Australians are facing the death penalty overseas either because they have been convicted of, or charged with, offences that attract a death sentence:

* Tuong Van Nguyen - TO BE EXECUTED 2 DECEMBER 2005
o take action today: Amnesty International Australia have launched an Urgent Action to save Mr Nguyen. See AIA's website for more details.
* Nguyen Van Chinh - CONVICTED & sentenced to death
* Mai Cong Thanh - CONVICTED & sentenced to death
* Tran Thi Hong Loan - charged & faces death sentence
* Schapelle Corby - convicted, sentenced to prison, but appeal could result in death sentence
* Bali 9 - all have been charged with offences that attract the death penalty
o Andrew Chan, 21 (Sydney)
o Si Yi Chen, 20 (Sydney)
o Michael William Czugaj, 19 (Brisbane)
o Renae Lawrence, 27 (Newcastle)
o Tach Duc Thanh Nguyen, 27 (Brisbane)
o Matthew James Norman, 18 (Sydney)
o Scott Anthony Rush, 19 (Brisbane)
o Martin Eric Stephens, 29 (Wollongong)
o Myuran Sukumaran, 24 (Sydney)
* Tallaal Adrey - charged & faces death sentence
 
keystroke said:
I don't fucking care that it's inhumane to execute one person because he's an Australian whilst 3000 others go by and not one single person here crying has protested against it openly in the forum.
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I hate the death penalty everywhere and everywhy it is practiced. Im sure im speaking for the majority of bluelighters who feel the same way. Happy now?
 
keystroke: And you know what the most important part of your post is? The fact that Nguyen is to be executed this Friday and therefore he needs the most public support at this point in time.

Just because today we're arguing against the execution of one particular person does not preclude us from being against the death of anyone else; particularly for drug charges.
 
KemicalBurn said:
If a member of my family were to smuggle drugs, and they got caught - then its their hard luck.

But once again, i sincerely doubt any member of my family would be stupid enough to smuggle drugs.
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my point was that because this is a subjective ethical issue, to truly understand the consequence of your own argument you need to imagine a situation wherein your friend or family member has been convicted of a crime that you *don't* think deserves the death penalty, yet they will be hanged anyway. your own argument clearly implies that they would not deserve any sympathy or right not to be hanged if the laws stated so. do you still feel comfortable with your position?


KemicalBurn said:
Saying "next" means the world is heading in a bad direction? ive already stated that were his stupidity be allowed into the gene pool - then that may take the human race to an even sadder future.
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ah good ol' eugenics, as championed by wonderful hitler and those lovely murderous folk in control of the communist party of china. as they all proved, that's a fantastic way to run the world! who cares about the less fortunate or less brainy amongst us, instead let's make sure *everyone* is privileged by just making all those annoying dumb folk extinct. (and hey, while we're at it i guess we should probably exterminate the jews and the blacks and well maybe us anglos too? i mean all the asians are much smarter than us, so surely the world would be a much better place without us? and we don't want our stupidity in the gene pool do we?) no wait, i better drop a 'natural selection' reference in here, otherwise people might think i actually endorse these people's deaths! 8o
 
up all night said:
Yeah. All those damn human rights activists. They're such bad people. Lets hope they don't breed.
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As i have previously stated UAN, i am a human rights activist. Hell, i even donate money to amnesty international -though i dont agree with them on this particular case.

So, do yourself a favour and read the thread before you go ahead making snide remarks :)

1234 - you are continually missing the point. He put himself in the situation, no one twisted his arm.

Way to go off on a unvalidated tangent 8) and might i also add that your moderating of this thread has been weak and extremely biased.
 
the most important part of my post is there are other Australians that are going to be executed and instead of bitching and moaning about one that is already basically as good as dead all you bleeding hearts should have focused on a solution earlier, rather than radical last minute attempts to save the life of a drug trafficker.
 
^ Maybe people are doing that too.

And KB. It actually wasn't an attack on you. But if you say that the stupid people are the one's who judge another cultures laws then... well, what exactly are human rights activists doing?
 
Nguyen 'not counting down days'
29-11-2005
From: AAP

VAN Tuong Nguyen has found an inner peace and is not counting down the days until his execution, say friends who have visited him in Singapore's Changi prison.
Kelly Ng and Bronwyn Lew, described as best friends of Nguyen, have flown to Singapore ahead of the drug mule's hanging, set for Friday morning.

The Singaporean Government has rejected repeated calls for clemency for the 25-year-old Melbourne man.

"Seeing him being at peace gave me a sense of relief and happiness for him," Ms Ng told Sky News today.

"I was able to truly tell him that I was happy for him."

The pair said Nguyen was equally concerned for their welfare.

"He wanted to make sure that we were okay," Ms Ng said.

"He said if we wanted to cry then we should cry with him, because he is of better use being there for us rather than having us walk away in tears – that would just hurt him more."

Ms Ng says told the ABC that Nguyen was in surprisingly good spirits.

"The last time I saw him was in September and the last time I saw him was the way, exactly how he was now in terms of his spirit," she said.

"He looks very well, he's been keeping himself very well, and I think that's just because he wants to live life to the fullest while he still can."

Ms Lew said Nguyen was focussed on appreciating the time he had left.

"He didn't mention the number of days that he has left because, to him, I don't think its a countdown," she said.

"To him is more saying let's live for what we have now and let's appreciate what we have now.

"Because even though this might be the only time we have left for the rest of our lives ... at least we have this time and that's what we should be appreciative for."
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up all night said:
^ Maybe people are doing that too.

And KB. It actually wasn't an attack on you. But if you say that the stupid people are the one's who judge another cultures laws then... well, what exactly are human rights activists doing?
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I didnt say that makes you stupid, just a "bad person".

I joined amnesty international on the grounds that some people are being born into situations where their rights are being perverted.

Not to help those who put themselves into danger.
 
keystroke

i don't think you seem to be grasping the point that everyone in this thread against van's death is against the death penalty as a whole

i'm positive not one person has said they are ONLY against in this case, so therefore what you're saying about other people being sentenced to death is completely redundant, as everyone in this thread who disagrees with van's death also disagrees with capital punishment TO ANYONE.

HOWEVER before you go all broken record stylez and say "oh but why isn't there a thread for each and every person" is because as UAN pointed out

1. van's death is imminent
2. van is an australian; it is human nature to be alerted to issues more readily when they concern someone from our own locale - also, it is more publicised in australian media
3. it is related to drugs, a topical issue on bluelight

the discussion triggered by van's pending execution has not been solely confined to his case - this again illustrates that people are against the death penalty full-stop, not just van's death.

a case such as this allows people to have an insight into exactly how easy other society's can end another's life (ie. for a crime that in Australia, would not be punishable by death) and can provide an opportunity for people to learn more about this, and perhaps change their opinion or become actively involved in influencing the changing of these inhumane.

i think it's pretty fucking lame to say that we aren't allowed a valid opinion because there is not a thread for every person that has faced death row. that's not what's needed, considering the discussion re: capital punishment is alive and kicking in this thread.

it is attitudes, not 'having a thread for each person' that is going to to change the state of the world afterall.
 
KemicalBurn said:
1234 - you are continually missing the point. He put himself in the situation, no one twisted his arm.
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not at all :)

my point is that if you transpose van's situation onto somebody that you know and love your argument means that you would happily see them sent off to death. now since we're talking around the ethics of this entire case and you've brought up the fact that van and his 'supporters' (for want of a better term) should just shut up and accept his death sentence, this seems a perfectly reasonable point to draw on.

and i haven't been biased in my moderating of this thread at all. in fact, i've probably edited more posts of people whom i agree with than those who i disagree with, and i've been particularly careful to delete as few full posts as possible - most times i've just made short edits.
 
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