Reporter: Tony Jones
TONY JONES: Just two weeks ago, a leading opposition figure in Singapore spoke passionately at a forum in support of Van Nguyen. Jailed three times for his outspoken opposition to the Government, Dr Chee Soon Juan is the leader of the Singapore Democratic Party. He's also a fierce opponent of the death penalty. I spoke to him in Singapore just a short time ago.
Dr Chee, thanks for joining us.
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN, SINGAPORE DEMOCRATIC PARTY: Thank you.
TONY JONES: Now why do you think that the lobbying of the Singapore Government by the Australian Government has so far been unsuccessful?
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN: Well, I think the Australian Government needs to approach the international community on this matter. I think it's absolutely crucial that the international community comes into play over here and it's just not a situation between Singapore and Australia. It really runs deeper and far wider than this. And in the upcoming months and years, you'll see a lot more people from around the world getting hanged for small-time drug peddling in Singapore.
TONY JONES: Do you believe that if there were an international outcry, if there were representatives from other countries lobbying on behalf of Van Nguyen, that would have some effect?
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN: It would, it would. I think it's important that the international community come to know of the situation that exists at this time. This wanton killing, unnecessary mindless killing of small-time drug peddlers. And we have huge, huge questions about the legal process here as well, not to mention this whole principle of mandatory execution of basically what we see as mules, drug couriers rather than big-time operators, traffickers and producers of narcotics.
TONY JONES: Why do you think the Singaporean Government would respond to an international call, or international calls, when it has not responded to the Australian Government, a close friend and ally?
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN: I believe that in the longer term the Singapore Government can be made to see that this kind of a policy, this kind of law does not serve its interests, does not serve the interests of the wider international community. And I believe that this is the only way that we can bring the spotlight to bear, to bring the attention - if the Singapore Government wants to play at the international level, then I think it's got to have a rethink on some of these very obsolete, these very archaic laws that serve no good for anybody at all.
TONY JONES: What about the efforts to get the International Court of Justice to urgently hear this case? Because, after all, Van Nguyen has very little time now. His life is effectively running out. Do you think the Singaporean Government would listen to, or respond to a call to have this heard in the International Court of Justice?
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN: I'm not sure, but it's hugely, hugely important to take this step. Because the Singapore Government has gone before the International Court of Justice in terms of arbitration of disputes between Singapore and other countries. And I think it would be in Singapore's interest to want to abide by some of these matters that come before the ICJ. And it's very important that the Australian Government takes notice of this and pushes in that direction. Because we're talking about international law that Singapore pays lip service to, saying that it wants to be part and parcel of broader network whereby rule of laws is being adhered to, at least seen to be adhered to. It would be in its interests to want to not completely disregard or at least show contempt for rulings by the ICJ.
TONY JONES: To your knowledge, has there ever been a successful international lobbying effort to save someone from the gallows in Singapore?
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN: Not from the gallows, but if you remember a few years ago there was this American teenager Michael Faye, who was convicted and sentenced to caning. At that time, huge pressure was brought to bear by the US, no less than President Clinton himself on the Singapore Government and at that time the Singapore Government caved and reduced the sentence. And basically what we're asking for - a life is at stake - for us to review, re-examine this whole idea of mandatory death sentence for, as I said, small-time drug peddlers.
TONY JONES: From what you're saying the Singapore Government has in the past at least listened to the US Government. Perhaps they simply have more power to influence things. What about the prospect of Australia seeking American help to do something?
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN: I think every channel that is available right now. We're really talking about lives at stake over here. Every opportunity, every avenue that we can pursue, no stone must be left unturned and every country, every government that will listen to this call for justice and to put a stop to this insanity must be approached. And this whole idea that we can, as collectively as an international community bring the spotlight to bear on this very difficult situation that we have in Singapore here, must be pursued.
TONY JONES: Now I know that you and a small group of protesters recently held a vigil on behalf of Van Nguyen. How much public awareness is there in Singapore about his case, in reality?
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN: Very little, very little, and you've got to understand that unlike in Australia, Singapore's not a democratic society. Every TV station, every radio station, every newspaper is under the control of the Government and the Government has thus far let very little of this information gone out to the public. And for the little discussion that we've had here has been from a pro-government standpoint. We've made some very, very important arguments against the death penalty as it is practiced right now in Singapore, provided hard evidence to show that this death penalty, there's no evidence that the death penalty is determined to drug traffickers is a deterrent to drug abuse in Singapore and the argument, the legal process here. And one very important point that has not absolutely gotten a news blackout over here, is Singapore Government's dealings with the Burmese military regime and some of the drug lords in Burma, which is, who are the biggest producers of heroin in this region, if not the world.
TONY JONES: Yes, you've gone so far as to suggest that your own Government is hanging small fish while making large investments with drug lords. Do you have any evidence for that?
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN: I'm not the one that brought this matter up. It was the Australian SBS Television itself that actually did a documentary showing the link between Singapore Government's investments in Burma that are tied in together with Asia World, a company that's owned and run by the notorious Lo Hsing Han who operates freely, produces heroin of which Nguyen has been convicted of and producing, trafficking, producing trafficking these big, big large sums of heroin. In this region and as I said, internationally as well. His son, Lo Hsing Han's son Steven Law, travels in and out of and freely in Singapore, but is barred from entering the US because of suspected drug activities. And this is the kind of situation that we're talking about. If the Singapore Government truly feels that drug abuse, illicit drugs is a scourge on society then it would not just want to just catch and hang these small-time drug peddlers. You would want to go for the big fish and go on what the source is. Pressure must be brought to bear on what they are doing vis-a-vis the situation. Press the Government on what it's doing in Burma to stop this production of opium and heroin. These are hugely important questions that I think, so far, the international community or at least the Australian community has not pursued in greater depth.
TONY JONES: We're nearly out of time, but let me ask you one last question. Can you tell us exactly what it is that awaits Van Nguyen on Friday week?
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN: He will have no contact whatsoever with anybody. Physical contact, that is his immediate family members might get to see him the night before or something in that ballpark. But he will be woken up if he gets to sleep at all and preparations will be made for him to be brought to the platform just before six o'clock. And precisely at six o'clock the executioner will be there and in the executioner's own word, "will send him to a better place" and the noose will be placed around his neck and tightened just above his left ear. He will be hooded and precisely at six o'clock the lever will be pulled, the trap door will be opened and sadly Nguyen will fall to his death.
TONY JONES: On that very grim note, Dr Chee Soon Juan, we thank you very much for taking the time to come and talk to us tonight.
Dr CHEE SOON JUAN: Thank you.
