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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards

Benzo use during opiate withdrawl, how long befor benzo dependence

F

Fatjosh

Bluelighter
Joined
May 15, 2012
Messages
176
Location
california
Hey everyone i was just Kinda need some elaboration on benzo dependency and how long it takes to be physicaly dependent. Let me just say i dont like benzos i never understood people getting high on them to me all it makes me is tired, i just quite a 240mg oxy habbit cold turkey today is day 10,it has been hell, but im so happy to be free after 4 years. all symptons r gone except the restless legs and an innability to really sleep, i have been taking xanax to get roughly 5 hours of ok sleep. I took it the first 4 days then had 2 day break and i have taken it for the last 3 nights one of the nights was klonapin, i have stayed at a 2 mg dosage the whole time i havent upped it. i just need sleep it is what drove me to opiates in the first place, i never ate them in the day i took 1 240mg dosage of ir oxy at night i would enjoy the high for a while but it was mostly the sleep, the beautiful, restorative sleep... I told myself a week of benzos because i dont need another addiction. But if i can take them a little longer i am not going to make myself suffer, How long can i take them befor i have to deal with those withdrawls and will switching between benzos help? Also a side question can u develope the actual condition of RLS from opiate use, i guess what im asking is...its ganna stop eventualy right? :( thanks in advance, josh.
 
Fatjosh said:
i just need sleep it is what drove me to opiates in the first place
Click to expand...
Yeah, I know you said "i dont need another addiction", but by self medicating with opiates for sleep has put you in a very vulnerable position.
Now using benzos instead of opiates for sleep will help in the very short term, but in most cases will leave you in a worse situation than when you were using opiates (addiction wise).
There is obviously an underlying issue with sleep (insomnia) that needs to be addressed so that you have a "goal" to achieve decent sleep drug free one day.
I think you should seek professional advice on that issue.
To answer your question though, I wouldn't rely on benzos for more than 2 weeks, but as I said it is a very difficult trend to get out of once you start.
Good luck and all the best.
 
Thats basically my point about being vulnerable to it but i really dont like benzos i have great memory but when i take those my memory sucks and i hate it but what i didnt mention too is that it seems to be the only thing that helps with restless legs, if i could get rid of that i would just take some nyquil or somthing like that. I tried the over the counter rls meds, i tried gabapentin, immodium, naproxen nothing helped the rls except benzos. My sleep problems were stress related when i started takin opiates my dad was dieing of cancer after fighying for 2 years and when i would lay in bed at night and the horror of my reality would not let me sleep
( i felt like life was a cruel joke i lost my real dad before i was born and i lost the only dad i ever knew who had been my stepdad since i was 4 years old 2 days befor i graduated highschool) , until i started getting into the medicine cabnet which was stocked by hospice for a stage 4 cancer patient and good old mr.hydrocodone solved those sleeping problems but Befor that stress i could sleep, now that im not spending 50-80$ a day in pills i feel worry free except for the rls which only happens at night. I feel them getting slightly less intense so i was just thinkin 2 or 3 more days and im hoping it will be bearable and then i swear im never taking another mind altering perscription drug again. I had the most encouraging dream the other day i had a dream i was hit by a car lol i know inspiring right? Well the encouraging part was that i was dreaming i was in an ambulance and pleading with them not to give me painkillers i remember saying "please please dont give me those, i dont want them" over and over again. But thank you for your reply and sorry for the long story i guess i just thought i might explain the source of my insomnia.
 
Ok thanks for that info.
I did a bit of research into RLS and the problem with benzos is that they help you sleep better at night. But these medications don't eliminate the leg sensations.
I'm pretty sure you have done some research too, so just understand that I am just "brainstorming" here.

"Medications for Parkinson's disease. These medications reduce the amount of motion in your legs by affecting the level of the chemical messenger dopamine in your brain.Two drugs, ropinirole (Requip) and pramipexole (Mirapex), are approved by the Food and Drug Administration for the treatment of moderate to severe RLS."

With all this information and your experience with meds in the past (opiates and benzos), I still think you should take all this and present it to a medical doctor. I don't think it would do you any harm. Also these alternatives to benzos just might work.

Let us know how it goes and don't give up.
 
xanax will help you combat insomnia for a short period of time in my experience of it - but it will only put you out for 5-6 hours max due to its short half life, and it can be really habit forming.
benzo dependence really is a personal thing. it can happen in a week or a month, or never. it depends on how you use the benzo - in your case it is to sleep. from experience, this makes it much harder to stop taking just down to the fact that insomnia is a real bitch.

have you tried melatonin? RLS is a horrible thing coming off opiates. and yes, the symptoms will go away but over time, if it purely down to opiate use. switching over to benzos can put you at risk for another addiction, and trust me, withdrawing from benzos is beyond hell.

promethazine i found helped me sleep at night when i was cold turkeyed both a benzo and opiate addiction (but it really knocked me out stone cold and i would have a terrible hangover the next morning).

if you have to use a benzo to sleep - i suggest trying zolpidem (ambien) or zopiclone, as it really does what it states, knocks you out, and it will continue to work at doing so - and once you're past the stage of withdrawal from opiates and RLS symptoms they are much easier to stop taking.
 
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Thank u guys very much for the info,
Lettus- that info on the parkinson meds sounds promising and if i dont get over the rls by the 17nth when i get paid i will go to the doctor but i have no insurance so i gotta wait till i have the cash to pay for the visit. U guys r right even as an opiate addict i would tell myself well atleast im not addicted to benzos i have seen first hand the downward spiral they induce, but the lack of sleep is killing me....and my poor fiancee who has to get up early to go to work is losing sleep over my insomnia. i have taken benzos 7 times now in 10 day with a 48 hour break, tonight i am going to take two klonapins if i need them, i usualy dont take them until its like 4am and i have given up on natural sleep.

Synthetix- i have tried ambien in the past and im never taking that shit again if i wanna trip ill eat some mushrooms lol that stuff didnt make me tired and it made me have halucinations but not the fun ones.i might be able to get some promethazine tho i can give that a try.i tried melatonin before too in FFA in highschool when we would take steers to auction who were real crazy we would feed them like 100 melatonin pills. I took a few home once this was befor my addiction and it just made me feel off, but its worth another try.and i guess what i was getting at is i thought by day 10 the rls would b gone like most of the other symptoms but can u get actual rls from having abused opiates like can it cause the actual condition.but i would just like to say that i really dont think i will psycologicaly get addicted to benzos because i am so high on life right now i thought i was a gonner cause of the opiates, i wanted to stop for so long but i dont kno if this makes sense but i didnt try for so long because i was scares that i would fail, and if i failed i might feel like it was impossible and loose my pipe dream of having my life back. And i will not let anything cripple me like that again. I really dont have an "addictive personality" i hate alcohol, i quite smoking cigs as if i never smoked them in the first place after smoking for 7 years, i dont like stimulants or most other drugs. I smoke pot which i dont consider a drug, i have eaten mushrooms for introspective trips 5 times in my life, and i took molly once and enjoyed it but i dont like to "pay to play" anything that has a comedown or hangover is just not for me even the memory shit from the benzos is driving me insane!!!
 
yeah - ambien can make you trip balls if you take too much. try it at a low dose (10mg) and you'll probably not experience it. other than that i suggest zopiclone, which is an alternative which doesnt cause hallucinations (7.5mg tabs)

sometimes opiate withdrawal symptoms can drag on for a while. you could possibly be faced with a case of permanent RLS but i doubt it, if you are really concerned about it i suggest seeing a doctor about it. Coming off a dose of 240mg of oxy cold turkey is going to have a longer withdrawal period, but you will get through it. Don't worry.

i completely respect and salute you for coming off opiates and am proud to see that you have done so, honestly.

the only problem with benzos is that they don't seem addictive at the time, but can be profoundly hard to stop taking if they are helping you sleep :(

does pot help you with RLS symptoms? have you tried smoking it before bed or is it more stimulating for you?

you could try a muscle relaxant such as soma, it could in theory help with the rls as well.

gabapentin or pregabalin is also useful for this condition if you could get ahold of it - but it is very expensive and will require a visit to a doctor.

promethazine is a good help for sleep, the same goes for doxylamine succinate which also helped me with sleep issues. they can both cause nasty hangovers though so be careful.
 
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Ok about the ambien the thing is i only took 1 but it disnt help me sleep, and im not talking full on visuals i mean subtle thing like i was lookin at a piece of plywood when i went out for a cig and i could make out 10 different shapes in the particle board that looked like a bulls head and horns, when i went back and looked for them the next day all i found was the first one i noticed the other 9 was gone i wasnt trying to get high on ambien. I will try to find zipaclone like i said i have no health insurance all my meds come off the streets. Thank you for the props on quitting, i have spoke to people i am friends with but noone seems to understand what i just accomplished....but i do it has taken everything i had and more, it has taken self loathing, spite, love, and a whole lot of support from bluelight.now as for benzos not seeming addictive i agree to an extent because i think people use benzos in 3 ways and it depends on how it effects them either A- they like getting fucked up and for some people xanax is the shit they will eat it first thing in the morning or any time of the day. B- they use it as intended for short periodes of time for extreme stress. Or C- sleep. I think u r right about the sleepers because they dont really stay awake for the effects, me if i eat a xanax i am passed out 45 minutes later.so ya they dont associate it with pleasure per say, but the other two probably should kno off the bat this is powerful shit and nothing good comes without a price. Now on to the weed, i have found it makes my cold sweats come, so iv been smoking only at night to help sleep but it doesnt help the rls.as far as somas go i could probly find some but i didnt want to because i like the way they feel, i mean im really trying to recover here even to the point im considering quiting smoking weed and i love weed i mean truely love it i have a thc molecule tattoo on one leg and a norcal star with buds around it like the cadalac symbol on the other.i love weed. But there r two things i love more than any drug 1-my old lady
2-$$$money. I just dropped a 2000$ a month habbit ima b rich lol. I have a bottle of nuerotin around i guess i could try a higher dose cause i only took 1. And if doloxamine is as effective as promethazine i will just stick with that i have been taking a swig every night to help sleep but also cause i heard dxm is good for withdrawls. I would just like to say thanks for taking time out of your day try and make mine a little easier :).
 
Alright well then I guess ambien is just not for you. It happens don't worry.

You've accomplished a lot by getting off your oxy habit. Its fantastic that you have the drive and motivation to keep going. There's still a bumpy road ahead, but you're completely on the right track to being clean and sober, and enjoying life to its full potential, so congratulations and keep it up! I've been in the same boat and I understand all the effort it takes to do so.

If neurontin didn't help your symptoms of RLS then this is most likely a case of extended opiate withdrawal, don't worry, it will pass.

To some extent yes soma is addictive. And if you're serious about giving all the drugs up including the weed then I salute you and you have my full support on the matter. A drug free life is seriously better than having a drug controlled one. You're now taking back the potential and life inside you, it's great to see that.

The DXM can help with withdrawals, but they can also aggravate your withdrawal symptoms, so take it easy on it.

Doxy is a great sleep aid and isn't addictive in my opinion either. It really is just knock out stuff and can be bought OTC.

If you're sourcing zopiclone from the streets please be really careful about doing so. Make sure you know exactly what it is before taking it. Please try doxy first though. Once again it is considered a type of benzo and can be habit forming.

Have you considered NA meetings? I know that is unrelated to your question but there you will find more and more support for yourself, and consider seeing a therapist in my opinion.
 
I want to go to meetings i really do but i live in such a small town u can fart and people r talkin about it across town 5 minutes later. A big reason i quite is....my mom had surgery a year ago and went into pain management but she is just a hypochondriac and i cant even start to help her on her addiction and say she has a problem when i am a drug addict it would b the throwing stones in glass houses.
When she first started taking norco i begged her i cried and pleaded and she assured me that she wasnt going to become a drug addict, but she didnt kno i was addicted so to her only "druggies" get hooked.now She eats 5 or 6 norcos a day 2 scrips of ambien, baclofen, robaxin, nuerotin, and whatever els i dont kno of and tells us she doesnt feel any high but i see her nodding at night its a big lie. But ya im going to stay away from somas cause i actualy like them and i seen somone i kno who eats 30 somas a day and she might as well be mentaly retarded. But u r right i have accomplished alot and its nice to feel good about myself its been a long time, man tho my emotions r on overload when im happy im so happy and its over little things, like u kno when a song comes on and it is a song that speaks to you and it pumps u up i swear iv heard rise against "help is on the way" and "prayer of a refugee" a million times and today it was like the first time. It gave me goosebumps that werent from the withdrawl. I have been riding the shit out of my motorcycle which is a true passion of mine and feeling so alive, free watching the sun set behind the california hills, lifes good, and to think two weeks ago i was the most miserable person i kno. I seriously have no desire to get high, i didnt when i was getting high but im an all or nothing kinda guy thats y tapering never worked. Im so greatful for the people who have talked to me here, people who kno of my addiction and dont judge me, im so much more than a drug addict, i was almost a straight A student in highschool, i took college prep courses, i never skipped class i may have got stoned before school and during lunch but when all my friends just ditched i went back and worked hard so that i would be somone in life, but because my dad died my mom got life insurance money but my dad haddent worked for 2 years we lost our house and his medical bills ate up alot of it, but because it counted as income for her financial aid turned me down so i couldnt go to college right out of highschool i had to wait a year, but by the time that year had come i was a year into my drug addiction and i had to hustle every day to make money to support my habbit. Then i completely gave up on school and talked my mom into investing most of what little money we had on starting to grow pot so for the next year and a half at 19 i was responsible for a 1400$ rent payment and a 1000$ power bill
and anything left over i gave to my mom, even as a drug addict i never took the money that was for my family i may have borrowed from the rent payment but it was always paid back, i hustled other peoples product to pay for my pills. This last year my tolerance doubled. It took me 3 years to hit 120 mg of vicodin. I started having to take oxy cause i couldnt keep dosing that much asprin. For me oxy and hydro were mg for mg so i went straight to 120mg oxy, and within the year i was eating 10 15mg roxi's and snorting another 7 on a "good" night. If i was taking the op oxy's i would eat 320mg. Im sorry for the life story i just started writing and this is what came out i have never really wrote it down like that. And thats just a grain of sand in the desert of my former life but now i am going to make somthing of myself.
 
Synthetix suggested zopiclone. I've suffered from insomnia, and found that this particular drug has downsides: first of all, it is only effective for 3-4 hours, so no good if you have trouble sleeping through the night insted of just falling asleep. Secondly, tolerance seems to build up quite fast. And last but not least, in continued use it made me horribly anxious during the day (not sure if this is a common reaction, but it was much worse than what I get from oxazepam, diazepam, clonazepam...). Might be still worth a try anyway.

Melatonin might be worth trying, but it wasn't enough for me. I've also used valerian root which lost it's effect in continued use really fast. How about pot - something that's very high in CBD / CBN, preferably in edible form and maybe in combination with melatonin?
 
Mindtool- it is dualy noted on the paragraph suggestion, but all i have is an iphone for all this and i have been complacent.
that being said if my wall of txt was more intimidating for somone to read because it was long without paragraphs or indentation then they dont have to read or speak with me iv done a LOT of posting this last week and i have not had a complaint from anyone els i have coresponded with regularly.
i would understand that as a sidenote but thats all u said you give a gramatical tip and thats it, which just rubs me wrong so respectfuly if u dont have anything nice to say, pls dont harsh my mellow lol.

Unelmoporsas-i took nothing but 50mg of doxylamine last night with a big dab of BHO on the T.I skillit. I am not going to really try anything els cause i got four hours of semi bad sleep compared to the 5-6 hours of ok sleep that i get with a benzo.
As for the cbd/ edible idea. The closest medical dispencery that tests levels is 2 hours away and i can never get myself to pay their prices i live in a rural town where everyone has love, so we get dirt cheap prices its hard to justify driving two hours to find buds with high cbd.
i take dabs so my tolerance to actual buds is pretty high its so much more expensive to smoke actual trees im a concentrates man and it funny cause if u have ever dabbed u will know how strong it is but im a wuss with edibles. i can never get a perfect dose sometimes its too weak but alot of times its too strong and feels like alcohol to me. I may try some melatonin, but im feeling good i think i just gotta stick it out. Thank you both
 
Fatjosh said:
Hey everyone i was just Kinda need some elaboration on benzo dependency and how long it takes to be physicaly dependent. Let me just say i dont like benzos i never understood people getting high on them to me all it makes me is tired, i just quite a 240mg oxy habbit cold turkey today is day 10,it has been hell, but im so happy to be free after 4 years. all symptons r gone except the restless legs and an innability to really sleep, i have been taking xanax to get roughly 5 hours of ok sleep. I took it the first 4 days then had 2 day break and i have taken it for the last 3 nights one of the nights was klonapin, i have stayed at a 2 mg dosage the whole time i havent upped it. i just need sleep it is what drove me to opiates in the first place, i never ate them in the day i took 1 240mg dosage of ir oxy at night i would enjoy the high for a while but it was mostly the sleep, the beautiful, restorative sleep... I told myself a week of benzos because i dont need another addiction. But if i can take them a little longer i am not going to make myself suffer, How long can i take them befor i have to deal with those withdrawls and will switching between benzos help? Also a side question can u develope the actual condition of RLS from opiate use, i guess what im asking is...its ganna stop eventualy right? :( thanks in advance, josh.
Click to expand...

I think you will be fine in this case. Benzos, unlike opioids, take quite a bit longer to produce physical dependence. Typically it takes about 2-3 months of moderate dose everyday use of a more "physically addictive" benzo (those are the short-intermediate acting ones like alprazolam, temazepam, triazolam, lorazepam, midazolam, etc) to produce a mild physical dependence. The longer acting benzos (diazepam, flurazepam, clonazepam, chlordiazepoxide, etc) take a bit longer. Withdrawal symptoms from 2-3 month of everyday usage of a benzo like alprazolam would be mild in nature and symptoms will include rebound anxiety, insomnia, and maybe some nightmares.
 
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