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OD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | Tryptamino
amphetamine is killing the coke!
- Thread starter Le Junk
- Start date
fastandbulbous
Bluelight Crew
Yeah, his book 'Legal Highs' is so full of bollocks that I'm surprised the book doesn't have hair on its front. Don't know about the other person though (although I'm not a fan of cocaine, so there's not much incentive to read a book solely about cocaine use. The only thing I find interesting about it is the pharmacology)
rachamim18
Bluelighter
But...
Anyone who's even glanced at the pharmacology knows that is not true. Coke produces an intense craving to repeat the experience [as with all stimulants].That is part and parcel of all stimulants.
Junk: Quite simply, the books you cite are garbage. They are on the line of Fester's crap. Both have been debunked by lots of people. Even if your statement made sense [which it does not], where is the data? In America, we have the pleasure of examining data until our eyes water and yet this phenomenon has never seen the light of day. Admittedly, it could happen but that would not make it a trend. As you are describing it, it is beyond common. Just another thought on the books: Anyone that suggests the price of coke is prohibitve [as compared with methamp.], is just repeating early to mid 70s old wives tales. Mg. per mg. it makes no sense to add any form of speed to coke. There is a slight differential but it does not make finacial sense...especially when you [and others] posit that this speed is what is turning the experience into a negative one. Just add an inert filler and still maintain the favorable effects you speak of.
Anyone who's even glanced at the pharmacology knows that is not true. Coke produces an intense craving to repeat the experience [as with all stimulants].That is part and parcel of all stimulants.
Junk: Quite simply, the books you cite are garbage. They are on the line of Fester's crap. Both have been debunked by lots of people. Even if your statement made sense [which it does not], where is the data? In America, we have the pleasure of examining data until our eyes water and yet this phenomenon has never seen the light of day. Admittedly, it could happen but that would not make it a trend. As you are describing it, it is beyond common. Just another thought on the books: Anyone that suggests the price of coke is prohibitve [as compared with methamp.], is just repeating early to mid 70s old wives tales. Mg. per mg. it makes no sense to add any form of speed to coke. There is a slight differential but it does not make finacial sense...especially when you [and others] posit that this speed is what is turning the experience into a negative one. Just add an inert filler and still maintain the favorable effects you speak of.
Le Junk
Bluelighter
and then, thereagain...............
I would certainly not put "The Cocaine Handbook" by David Lee into any negative catagory. It is, and always has been considered somewhat of "The Bible" of cociane afficianados.
Yes, in the early days, the cuts I experienced were always the inert cuts such as mannitol, inositol etc. But in the last 10 years something has changed dramatically. It's so bad that sometimes I even question whether or not it's even cocaine in the first place. Possibly just a mix of lidocaine and amphetamine. It certainly wouldn't surprise me. Remember, the name of the game is MONEY!
Has anyone ever considered the possibility that what they are getting is just a mix of lidocaine and amphetamine? How would that combination compare in price to that of real cocaine? Think about that one.
Cocaine used to be such a wonderful party drug. It would open up conversation, make you feel all warm inside, increase your libido, give a sense of impowerment and clarity and just be an all round good time.
Today at parties where cocaine is being used, people for the most part are hard pressed for conversation, look uncomfortable, have no uncontrolable sex drive and aren't feeling any real euphoria.
I described what cocaine was supposed to be like to a local newscaster who I party with on occasion here. He's only been using for about a year now.
He said he gets none of the euphoria, no feeling of impowerment or clarity, no increased sex drive or any of the other benefits your supposed to get from cocaine. He said he just gets kind of amped out, but for some reason still craves the drug.
My fiancee has coined the term "shhhh, we're partying", for the typical cocaine party here.
I would put first hand experience (both with new and old users) over any conjecture anyday. Something is definitely different today with the cocaine.
I can actually tell you when and where I was the last times I've done real cocaine in the last 7 years or so. And I can count them on both hands.
One girlfriend of mine actually said to me after a two day binder with some "real" coke that that was the first time she has ever done the real thing! She of course didn't know that until she did it, but she's been using what she thought was coke for over 8 years now, and finally on about her 6th year, she does the "real thing". She said it was like a whole different drug alltogether!
Now, what's up with that?
I would certainly not put "The Cocaine Handbook" by David Lee into any negative catagory. It is, and always has been considered somewhat of "The Bible" of cociane afficianados.
Yes, in the early days, the cuts I experienced were always the inert cuts such as mannitol, inositol etc. But in the last 10 years something has changed dramatically. It's so bad that sometimes I even question whether or not it's even cocaine in the first place. Possibly just a mix of lidocaine and amphetamine. It certainly wouldn't surprise me. Remember, the name of the game is MONEY!
Has anyone ever considered the possibility that what they are getting is just a mix of lidocaine and amphetamine? How would that combination compare in price to that of real cocaine? Think about that one.
Cocaine used to be such a wonderful party drug. It would open up conversation, make you feel all warm inside, increase your libido, give a sense of impowerment and clarity and just be an all round good time.
Today at parties where cocaine is being used, people for the most part are hard pressed for conversation, look uncomfortable, have no uncontrolable sex drive and aren't feeling any real euphoria.
I described what cocaine was supposed to be like to a local newscaster who I party with on occasion here. He's only been using for about a year now.
He said he gets none of the euphoria, no feeling of impowerment or clarity, no increased sex drive or any of the other benefits your supposed to get from cocaine. He said he just gets kind of amped out, but for some reason still craves the drug.
My fiancee has coined the term "shhhh, we're partying", for the typical cocaine party here.
I would put first hand experience (both with new and old users) over any conjecture anyday. Something is definitely different today with the cocaine.
I can actually tell you when and where I was the last times I've done real cocaine in the last 7 years or so. And I can count them on both hands.
One girlfriend of mine actually said to me after a two day binder with some "real" coke that that was the first time she has ever done the real thing! She of course didn't know that until she did it, but she's been using what she thought was coke for over 8 years now, and finally on about her 6th year, she does the "real thing". She said it was like a whole different drug alltogether!
Now, what's up with that?
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I agree with lejunk 100% and I am in (close enough) to NYC. The cocaine these days is adulterated with ACTIVE cuts. One needs only to go to DEA's August microgram bulletin to see seizures with other active cuts (ugg, ritalin):
In the third example, a number of multi-kilogram seizures were made by the U.S. Coast Guard
and the Drug Enforcement Administration of cocaine HCl seizures containing various amounts
of methylephedrine. One seizure (2200 kilograms) was made in the Caribbean Sea, while a
second (amount not reported) was made off the coast of Florida, and a third (amount not
reported) was made near Calexico, California. Methylephedrine has a molecular weight of 179.3
amu. It is legitimately used for its moderate CNS stimulant effects, and is often found in diet
pills. Although not controlled, it is closely monitored as a List I chemical due to its occasional
use in illicit methamphetamine production (that is, to produce dimethylamphetamine). It again
n the third example, a number of multi-kilogram seizures were made by the U.S. Coast Guard
and the Drug Enforcement Administration of cocaine HCl seizures containing various amounts
of methylephedrine. One seizure (2200 kilograms) was made in the Caribbean Sea, while a
second (amount not reported) was made off the coast of Florida, and a third (amount not
reported) was made near Calexico, California. Methylephedrine has a molecular weight of 179.3
amu. It is legitimately used for its moderate CNS stimulant effects, and is often found in diet
pills. Although not controlled, it is closely monitored as a List I chemical due to its occasional
use in illicit methamphetamine production (that is, to produce dimethylamphetamine). It again
In the third example, a number of multi-kilogram seizures were made by the U.S. Coast Guard
and the Drug Enforcement Administration of cocaine HCl seizures containing various amounts
of methylephedrine. One seizure (2200 kilograms) was made in the Caribbean Sea, while a
second (amount not reported) was made off the coast of Florida, and a third (amount not
reported) was made near Calexico, California. Methylephedrine has a molecular weight of 179.3
amu. It is legitimately used for its moderate CNS stimulant effects, and is often found in diet
pills. Although not controlled, it is closely monitored as a List I chemical due to its occasional
use in illicit methamphetamine production (that is, to produce dimethylamphetamine). It again
n the third example, a number of multi-kilogram seizures were made by the U.S. Coast Guard
and the Drug Enforcement Administration of cocaine HCl seizures containing various amounts
of methylephedrine. One seizure (2200 kilograms) was made in the Caribbean Sea, while a
second (amount not reported) was made off the coast of Florida, and a third (amount not
reported) was made near Calexico, California. Methylephedrine has a molecular weight of 179.3
amu. It is legitimately used for its moderate CNS stimulant effects, and is often found in diet
pills. Although not controlled, it is closely monitored as a List I chemical due to its occasional
use in illicit methamphetamine production (that is, to produce dimethylamphetamine). It again
sorry about the ^^^ line breaks....
but another thing--from someone I know who is in the know--when the argument comes down to speed>price>cocaine, that is completely untrue. Any cocaine coming through mexico is usally handled by the same groups that are responsible for many of the meth superlaps operating south of US borders. These people have unlimited amounts of speed, and for them, it is nothing to adulterate cocaine with speed. In fact, I am sure it is done.
Now, as for cocaine's new cuts, I stand by the fact that the 1980s cocaine and today's cocaine (unless god shines the great cocaine love light on one) is totally world's apart--WORLD'S APART--and I had the chance to do some aruba coke just 2 years ago that was a whole different drug, so it is def. something and not tolerance or years of use....
swybs
but another thing--from someone I know who is in the know--when the argument comes down to speed>price>cocaine, that is completely untrue. Any cocaine coming through mexico is usally handled by the same groups that are responsible for many of the meth superlaps operating south of US borders. These people have unlimited amounts of speed, and for them, it is nothing to adulterate cocaine with speed. In fact, I am sure it is done.
Now, as for cocaine's new cuts, I stand by the fact that the 1980s cocaine and today's cocaine (unless god shines the great cocaine love light on one) is totally world's apart--WORLD'S APART--and I had the chance to do some aruba coke just 2 years ago that was a whole different drug, so it is def. something and not tolerance or years of use....
swybs
fizzacyst
Bluelight Crew
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The next time they get some confiscated coke, I'll ask a friend in the crime lab to spot it against some speed.
I know they've found benzocaine in some before down here, but thats about all I can recall hearing about. I'm fairly close to mexico.
I know they've found benzocaine in some before down here, but thats about all I can recall hearing about. I'm fairly close to mexico.
Le Junk
Bluelighter
fizzacyst said:
My general location is Indianapolis, Indiana. But I've got the same exact uncomfortable cocaine everywhere I travel. These cities include on multiple occasions: Miami, Atlanta, Las Vegas, L.A., San Diego, Houston, Montego Bay, Jamaica and Cancun, Mexico.
It may vary ever so slightly, but that general uncomfortable, edgy, ampy, paranoid type of feeling is there everytime.
Then why do I keep going back? For one, I'm an addict. Two, I've done the Holy Grail and will forever think that the next bag is it. And three, I think that whatever it is there putting in this crap now is actually more addictive than cocaine itself.
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fizzacyst
Bluelight Crew
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- Jan 27, 2003
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Maybe thats just how you react to the cocaine?
I mean, if you got satisfactory results from a marquis reagent sort of test showing amphetamines, I'll take your word for it. Its just really wierd that you'd get it all over the place.
I'm in the southern US, and all the coke I've come across or seen test results from never showed any (meth)amphetamine. I was thinking maybe you were in Europe or somewhere far enough from Colombia/Mexico to give people abundant chances to cut it.
I've had some that was clearly cut to a large degree, but it was something inactive. Another time I had some cut with baking soda, which was a PITA as I wasn't about to snort it like it was, and didn't really feel like working it up.
For the most part, its all been really high quality hygroscopic chunks obviously taken from a large brick of some sort. The 2nd time I ever took any I was getting worried I was going to OD. I never really got into it though, so its possible I was just buying it at a time when good product was around.
I'm not saying they don't find nasy stuff in it. A friend of mine in forensics work here always gets excited when they get something thats not meth in the lab (probably 9/10 arrests/busts here are for meth), as its something different to prod at for a change. They make some attempt to measure levels of or identify certain combinations of impurities in various drugs, which they report to the DEA for tracking and statistical puposes.
Coke has come through there cut with benzocaine, various sugars, ground plastic dust, chalk, gasoline residue (!), and all kinds of OTC medications. I can't recall him ever mentioning any other stims being used though.
I feel for you, man. :/
I mean, if you got satisfactory results from a marquis reagent sort of test showing amphetamines, I'll take your word for it. Its just really wierd that you'd get it all over the place.
I'm in the southern US, and all the coke I've come across or seen test results from never showed any (meth)amphetamine. I was thinking maybe you were in Europe or somewhere far enough from Colombia/Mexico to give people abundant chances to cut it.
I've had some that was clearly cut to a large degree, but it was something inactive. Another time I had some cut with baking soda, which was a PITA as I wasn't about to snort it like it was, and didn't really feel like working it up.
For the most part, its all been really high quality hygroscopic chunks obviously taken from a large brick of some sort. The 2nd time I ever took any I was getting worried I was going to OD. I never really got into it though, so its possible I was just buying it at a time when good product was around.
I'm not saying they don't find nasy stuff in it. A friend of mine in forensics work here always gets excited when they get something thats not meth in the lab (probably 9/10 arrests/busts here are for meth), as its something different to prod at for a change. They make some attempt to measure levels of or identify certain combinations of impurities in various drugs, which they report to the DEA for tracking and statistical puposes.
Coke has come through there cut with benzocaine, various sugars, ground plastic dust, chalk, gasoline residue (!), and all kinds of OTC medications. I can't recall him ever mentioning any other stims being used though.
I feel for you, man. :/
Le Junk
Bluelighter
fizzacyst,
No, it's not the way I react to cocaine. And all of the stuff I get is of the upmost "looking" quality. It's always shale, pearlescent looking bricks or chuncks. But looks don't amount to crap!
Cocaine should never make you feel as though you are going to OD. Not unless you'd been up doing it for 3 days straight or something. Did you say that you thought you were going to OD because you were just afraid of doing it, or did it make you actually feel as though you were going to OD? If its the latter, then you've never done good coke either. That's the misconception about great cocaine.
You don't need booze, benzos or any crutches of anykind to ease your heart. It barely feels as though its even elevated in the first place. You don't crave, crash or anything. And you certainly don't consume alot either. Mostly because you don't crash after the buzz starts to wear off.
Like I said many times before, "real" cocaine is an underlying type of buzz. It's not a kick your ass type of thing. That's what's going around, is that kick your ass crap that people have been brainwashed into thinking is good coke! That's in fact the crap I'm talking about!
Great coke:
wonderful euphoria
feeling of impowerment
feeling of extreme clarity
increased libido
contentment as though everything in the world is perfect
no crash
no heartracing
no feinding
no paranoia
It most resembles that of the plateau stage of MDMA. In fact, I would say that is a very good comparison. After the initial rush of MDMA wears off, your left with a "real" cocaine type of high.
Oh, but the best part is that this feeling could go on for two or three days without crashing.
Now does this sound like what your doing?
No, it's not the way I react to cocaine. And all of the stuff I get is of the upmost "looking" quality. It's always shale, pearlescent looking bricks or chuncks. But looks don't amount to crap!
Cocaine should never make you feel as though you are going to OD. Not unless you'd been up doing it for 3 days straight or something. Did you say that you thought you were going to OD because you were just afraid of doing it, or did it make you actually feel as though you were going to OD? If its the latter, then you've never done good coke either. That's the misconception about great cocaine.
You don't need booze, benzos or any crutches of anykind to ease your heart. It barely feels as though its even elevated in the first place. You don't crave, crash or anything. And you certainly don't consume alot either. Mostly because you don't crash after the buzz starts to wear off.
Like I said many times before, "real" cocaine is an underlying type of buzz. It's not a kick your ass type of thing. That's what's going around, is that kick your ass crap that people have been brainwashed into thinking is good coke! That's in fact the crap I'm talking about!
Great coke:
wonderful euphoria
feeling of impowerment
feeling of extreme clarity
increased libido
contentment as though everything in the world is perfect
no crash
no heartracing
no feinding
no paranoia
It most resembles that of the plateau stage of MDMA. In fact, I would say that is a very good comparison. After the initial rush of MDMA wears off, your left with a "real" cocaine type of high.
Oh, but the best part is that this feeling could go on for two or three days without crashing.
Now does this sound like what your doing?
fizzacyst
Bluelight Crew
- Joined
- Jan 27, 2003
- Messages
- 4,921
Pretty much dead on, except my heart would race after going at it for a while.
The more I'd do the more euphoric I'd feel. It would make me explode with self-confidence, and a general feeling of well-being. I felt like, man, I don't know.. like I could accomplish damn near anything in the world if I just got and did it.
Most of the time I'd end up just sitting on the couch talking, totally overcome with euphoria... just ecstatic, content, glad to be wherever I was, doing whatever it was I happening to be doing.
It did make my heart pound though, to an alarming degree at times. Any stimulant is going to do that, though. The length of action was always consistent with what you'd expect from coke.
Its one of the most euphoric substances I've put into my body, epscially when combined with pot and some outdoor activity.
I never really got into it.. not because it sucked or anything, I just didn't want to end up on coke all the time. At the time, I was in a position to trade other goods that essentially cost me pennies on the gram. It probably could have turned out unpleasant had I not dropped it. I've very introverted, and coke pretty much alleviated that condition, so its particularly alluring.
Anyway, I'm rambling. I'm not calling you a liar or anything like that, just sayin' thats pretty wierd to me. I'm interested in hearing about it though, especially if it really occurs with any frequency.
The more I'd do the more euphoric I'd feel. It would make me explode with self-confidence, and a general feeling of well-being. I felt like, man, I don't know.. like I could accomplish damn near anything in the world if I just got and did it.
Most of the time I'd end up just sitting on the couch talking, totally overcome with euphoria... just ecstatic, content, glad to be wherever I was, doing whatever it was I happening to be doing.
It did make my heart pound though, to an alarming degree at times. Any stimulant is going to do that, though. The length of action was always consistent with what you'd expect from coke.
Its one of the most euphoric substances I've put into my body, epscially when combined with pot and some outdoor activity.
I never really got into it.. not because it sucked or anything, I just didn't want to end up on coke all the time. At the time, I was in a position to trade other goods that essentially cost me pennies on the gram. It probably could have turned out unpleasant had I not dropped it. I've very introverted, and coke pretty much alleviated that condition, so its particularly alluring.
Anyway, I'm rambling. I'm not calling you a liar or anything like that, just sayin' thats pretty wierd to me. I'm interested in hearing about it though, especially if it really occurs with any frequency.
I don't even think we need take Le Junk's word, considering the DEA validates it in the August DEA Microgram Bulletin (please see site, I do not like to link bluelight to the DEA). Anyway, with all of these various active cuts, it seems unlikely that one will be able to purify, without serious energies expelled, the cocaine. Again, once in a while, especially near major cities (NYC, for my experience), you will find the holy grail....I have and did a few months ago. However, I think the number of people with actual cocaine problems (the number being lower than it has ever really been) is indicative of the poorly adulterated "coke" that is passed off as cocaine these days. All one needs to do is read these boards on Bluelight; people generally do NOT like cocaine...cocaine is a drug that is awesome...as Le Junk said, the comedown is softer than cocaine today, the euphoria and confidence and generally "sexiness" is unrivaled (some will say E produces a more sexy feeling, but I dare say cocaine produces a more "adult" and controllable sexual feeling)....
Anyway, I ramble....but, truth be told, it isn't a "tolerance"...I first did coke, when I was 11, 20 years ago...it was awesome. I took a hiatus and restarted my cocaine episodes, during the years....it wasn't until the past few years that I notices, like Le Junk and other BL members, that something was different. Both Le Junk and I have, to dispell the myths that it is the magic lost, found cocaine since that has the original power...so it isn't simply tolerance or lost magic, it is nasty active cuts...
Ok, I promise, no more ramble...
swybs
Anyway, I ramble....but, truth be told, it isn't a "tolerance"...I first did coke, when I was 11, 20 years ago...it was awesome. I took a hiatus and restarted my cocaine episodes, during the years....it wasn't until the past few years that I notices, like Le Junk and other BL members, that something was different. Both Le Junk and I have, to dispell the myths that it is the magic lost, found cocaine since that has the original power...so it isn't simply tolerance or lost magic, it is nasty active cuts...
Ok, I promise, no more ramble...
swybs
Le Junk
Bluelighter
swybs,
Regardless of what they say and regardless of how they say it, we my friend, have been to the Holy Land. We have been blessed to have tasted the forbidden fruits of yesteryear, so that we can leave this world content with knowing that we have touched the Holy Grail.
We could both preach and preach (as we sometimes do) but in the end, only the truth will actually set those with blind eyes free to see what we have seen all along. Until then, our words are just words with no real meaning.
It all goes back to the statement that I made along time ago, that "if you've never done real cocaine, then how can you compare it to what your doing now".
Cocaine use in the U.S. WILL deminish, that's for sure. Like you said, with to many of todays users saying that they don't like cocaine, a change will have to eventually come. The Mexicans will be forced into seperating the two and cocaine will once again be restored to its original glory.
Unfortunately by then, I'll probably already be dead of an amphetamine/ephedrine overdose.
Why in the hell couldn't they have picked on something else that I don't give a shit about like pot or acid. Geez!
I quit!
No I don't. But I am more informed nowdays and this site has been a major player in that.
Someday, maybe, someday................
![:\](https://bluelight.org/xf/BL_Images/Orig_Emoji/wrygrin.gif "wry grin :\")
Regardless of what they say and regardless of how they say it, we my friend, have been to the Holy Land. We have been blessed to have tasted the forbidden fruits of yesteryear, so that we can leave this world content with knowing that we have touched the Holy Grail.
We could both preach and preach (as we sometimes do) but in the end, only the truth will actually set those with blind eyes free to see what we have seen all along. Until then, our words are just words with no real meaning.
It all goes back to the statement that I made along time ago, that "if you've never done real cocaine, then how can you compare it to what your doing now".
Cocaine use in the U.S. WILL deminish, that's for sure. Like you said, with to many of todays users saying that they don't like cocaine, a change will have to eventually come. The Mexicans will be forced into seperating the two and cocaine will once again be restored to its original glory.
Unfortunately by then, I'll probably already be dead of an amphetamine/ephedrine overdose.
Why in the hell couldn't they have picked on something else that I don't give a shit about like pot or acid. Geez!
I quit!
No I don't. But I am more informed nowdays and this site has been a major player in that.
Someday, maybe, someday................
Le Junk, Le Junk, Le Junk....oh, how your words ring true (like the shooters who shoot coke said the bells would ring)...I know that any vacation I take outside our confined United States will usually result in revisiting the Holy Grail...
If you every think of coming to NYC, please PM me...
But, back to this: why hasn't anyone admitted that Le Junk is right, based on the DEA's own Microgram....all of the sudden, all the nay sayers have nayed themselves out. Alas, I dream of the day when the cocaine purity returns; until then, we are forced to A&B conversions, etc. Nasty, almost not even worth it. Cocaine, like it powered the early 1900's important people, should be what it was meant by the Gods to be....
swybs
If you every think of coming to NYC, please PM me...
But, back to this: why hasn't anyone admitted that Le Junk is right, based on the DEA's own Microgram....all of the sudden, all the nay sayers have nayed themselves out. Alas, I dream of the day when the cocaine purity returns; until then, we are forced to A&B conversions, etc. Nasty, almost not even worth it. Cocaine, like it powered the early 1900's important people, should be what it was meant by the Gods to be....
swybs
The first time I did coke was begining of december and that bump I took was nothing like what I expected coke to be. After all the hype I expected it to kick my ass and make me high as a fuckin kite, but all it did was make me talk about random shit to my buddies that I'm sure they didn't want to hear. I felt awesome . The thing is, I was craving it after that first line, maybe not craving, but as soon as my buddy said " might as well split a half g man" I agreed without a second thought. Hour and a half later when he said, might as well get another gram , I didn't give it a second thought. I think coke here in my part of canada is actually prettty good, or I have some decent connections.
Le Junk
Bluelighter
njx said:
Believe me when I say this, you are very, very lucky.