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amphetamine is killing the coke!

Well, which is it? Salmon red or orange/brown?

* edit * Ah, I just noticed you've edited the post to say "orange/brown." Yup, sounds like amphetamine, most likely. It did not react with Simon's reagent, you, said, right?
 
lifeisforliving said:
Le Junk,

Are you saying that you need to go through this A/B instead of your other purification step you wrote about before?

What are the pros/cons?
Click to expand...

What's up bro? Yes. Abandoned any previously mentioned cleanup, though a nice acetone pre-wash is always good.

Cook up your coke into crack and weigh out a gram. Dissolve the gram of freebase into 20 ml of acetone (about 1/3 of a tall skinny shot glass). Add 1 drop of 30% muriatic acid and stir ever so slightly. The reaction will be immediate and will form cocaine hcl crystals at the bottom of the shot glass. Pour out the mixture into a funnel that runs into another shot glass. Rinse out any remaining coke from the first shot glass into another filter and discard this acetone, but save the coke. With the remaining freebase/acetone left in the other shot glass, repeat the process with one more drop of acid and re-filter again. Each time saving your seperate piles of cocaine.

Repeat this process until all of the freebase is neutralized. You will find that the first piles will be the best product and will slowly turn speedier as you get towards your last pile (containing the amphetamine).

Good luck, but I'm still learning more and more as I get deeper and deeper into this nightmare!

PS The cocaine in Montego Bay Jamaica SUCKS!
 
djfriendly said:
Well, which is it? Salmon red or orange/brown?

* edit * Ah, I just noticed you've edited the post to say "orange/brown." Yup, sounds like amphetamine, most likely. It did not react with Simon's reagent, you, said, right?
Click to expand...

It was late when I entered that post. The actual result was it started to fizz and then turn orange/brown with the EZ Test. Actually, much more brown than orange.

Does that help?

And I did not run a Simons regeant test on it.
 
That's perfectly clear now, I was confused by the two different colors mentioned. I asked about Simon's as this would differentiate amphetamine from meth. You had mentioned using the extreme kit in your thread about testing MDMA.
 
What process did you use for converting to base? Not the baking soda method. Please tell more.
Onemore thing at the top you say that coke is the second one ot, then farther down, you make no mention of meth etc, etc. So really are you only getting one precipitate or two or three? Just curious, good info btw.
 
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^^^^
I'd also like a more detailed explanation for the basic conversion, if available/acceptable by BL rules.

Fantastic work by the way.
 
Did you use ether for the base extraction? IF so where/how did you obtain it? I hope not the plastic bag, water method.
TIA
 
The order of precipitation of salts is due to whether they are primary, secondary or tertiary amines (primary amines have 1 carbon atom attached to the nitrogen atom, secondary 2 etc). Secondary amines are the most basic (if you want to know why, get a physical chemistry book, specific to organic chemistry), followed by tertiary then primary amines. This means that the order of hydrochloride formation is as follows

methamphetamine --> cocaine --> amphetamine.

You don't get clear cut lines (no pun intended!) where it stops being meth HCl and becomes cocaine HCl being formed.; because of equilibrium constants in amine salt formation, the lines are a bit blurred. That said, using the systen Le Junk outlined, you'll end up with quite a few precipitates from each drop of hydrochloric acid added. From there you have to do a taste test (well, a nose test!) to determine which contains the highest percentage coke. You take it from there.

There are no hard and fast rules about which fraction will contain the coke, as according to Le Junk, both amphetamine and methamphetamine get used as cuts. As meth is more basic, and amphetamine less basic, the cut alters the order they precipitate out.

Le Junk:
You should put all of your practical expertese in this field into a FAQ guide, updating it as you refine your technique; you've put enough effort in to make it well worthwile
 
Is cocaine really expensive where you are?

In my part, both methamphetamine and amphetamine are worth nearly twice (sometimes a little less than twice) as much as cocaine. It would be insane for someone here to cut their stuff that way.

It has no bearing on anything, just kind of curious.
 
Sheesh...

Not again...As for the never ending debate about cocaine adulterated with amp., etc...As has been discussed in thew very recent past, cocaine users the world over have been making the very same claim for decades. As this has been in issue in other places besides BL there have even been peer reviewed studies in an attempt to ascertain the validity of the claim. The Amsterdam study showed to a tee, that most long term users of cocaine swear up and down that their coke is no longer as good as it used to be. They also swear up and down that their coke now has a "speedy" quality leading them to believe that it is being mixed with amp. and/or ephedrine/p-ephed. In every sample assayed as the study has shown, this is never the case. As Le Junk knows, there has never been a case to date showing that any amphetamine/cocaine admixture is common [or anything resembling common]. It comes down to perception. As Swybs has pointed out, those that follow the seizure reports and assays know that no such trend exists.

If anyone is interested in the cited study, ustse. It was a similarly titled thread about a month ago, and the month before that, and the month before that, and so on.
 
have you ever done really good coke?

rachamim18,

I'm really beginning to think you've never done really good cocaine.

In a recent thread, a poster (pa..) had stated that he had tried some Puruvian flake and that it was incredible! Though the origin of the cociane may be in question, the buzz he described and the way he felt were exactly like that of truly good cocaine.

Your comment was, "that Puruvian flake doesn't even sound like cocaine at all". You went on to say that he may want to perform some sort of test to see if it was even cocaine in the first place.

That's when I knew you'd never really done the "real deal" before. I know this for a fact now! Read back over pa..'s post again and see what he describes as the effects he got from his experience. Those were consistent with the cocaine I've been preaching about all these months. I think you've only consumed what's been out there since the early 90's and can make no judgements as to what cocaine is supposed to be like.

Anyway, a buddy of mine brought his 45 year old girlfriend and ex-Playboy playmate over last weekend. She hasn't done coke in over 20 years since she had a real problem with it and had to actually get treatment. She said it was the worst drug because it would make you feel great instantly and that all of your troubles would go away and you'd feel on top of the world until you decided to stop doing it. She said it was the devil! It was just to good, she said.

Well, we finally talked her into doing a line of the cocaine we had over here (the usual stuff nowdays), being the good influences that we are. After about 5 or 10 minutes, I noticed that she looked a little uncomfortable. She was smiling along with the conversation, but really had quieted down quite a bit. I asked her what she thought of the coke and she said "that's not coke!" "There's nothing even resembling coke in that crap". Now, I could have said that my knowledgeable friend rachamim18 says that's its just you and that the speedy type of feeling your feeling right now is from overuse, but that really wouldn't apply here, would it?

After those two lines, she was done. Forever, I would presume! She said the taste, the euphoria, the talkativeness, and all the other great things she remembers about cocaine were not there. It just plain sucked she said. Oh, and one more thing. She said that if that was all that was available back then (the 80's), that she would have never had any problems with it.

I'm going to read a paragraph from the book entitled "The Pleasures of Cocaine" by Adam Gotlieb.

Effects of Cocaine:

"A few minutes after snorting one or two lines of cocaine, a person will feel the first stimulating effects of the drug. A sensation of energy and euphoria will begin to mount in the body. Within 5 minutes the full stimulation manifests itself and sensory perceptions are heightened. The mind becomes very sharp and the body surges with energy. One is likely to become quite talkative, but, unlike marijuana and hashish, the conversation does not tend towards giddiness and absurdity. Frequently the cannibis drugs makes ones being incline towards introspective thinking. Cocaine however, is generally a more extroverted drug. Under it's influence, conversation is likely to be very open and realistic. This is not to say that cocaine makes a person feel serious. Cocaine is most definitely a fun drug when used properly. It does not produce hullucinations or distortions of reality. The peak of stimulation usually lasts 20-30 minutes, but residual stimulation may continue for as long as 2 hours. When one comes down from a few snorts there is no "crash" (sudden exhaustion or depresion) as with the amphetamine drugs".

Wait a minute! What's this? No "crash!" You've got to be kidding me. This seems to differ in direct contrast to what we're getting today, doesn't it?

Anyway, he goes on to say "One may wish to take some more, but there is no craving to do so, and if one does not indulge again at this time, he is quite content with having had a good time".

rachamim18, this sounds EXACTLY like what pa.. described of his experience with that Puruvian flake called cocaine. Though, you seem to differ in your opinion. Hum, who would I believe?
 
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Dick Sizers Anonymous...

Safe to say, I have in fact actually done cocaine. As to the back and forth over the never ending saga of active adulterants...I will let the paper do my arguing for me. It comes down to the [mis] perception of many long term users. It seems to be a natural assumption. By the way, subjectively I have found the same thing among long term users of heroin as well. Any NYC junkie will swear on his mother that the deuce bags [2 dollar bags] back in the day would drop three people but if you look at data from the time in question you will find that steet heroin rarely exceeded 5% in purity! It is what it is, in the end...until you [or someone else] provides something other than subjective anecdotes I will not even consider the possibility. Is it possible that every dose of coke I've done since 1981 has been garbage? Perhaps, but the data is on my side...
 
Just because its not common, does not mean that it does not occur. It could be a regional thing, or perhaps there are just a few dealers that get the bright idea to cut their product that way, and Le Junk just happens to be in their vicinity.

You can't rule it out because you haven't encountered it. There are simple reagent tests to detect amphetamines, and he has done them, and they show such adulteration.

Its like with people saying that there are heroin-based MDMA pills. Thats totally retarded... but it does not mean that some uninformed dealer or user didn't hear about it and decide that cutting their MDMA w/ heroin would be a good idea. I've never seen it... but I bet its happened before.

He has been complaining about the situation for some time now, and asking for help with various detection and clean-up methods along the way... and this seems to indeed be the problem. It would be nice if he could do TLC against a standard and be really, really sure... but I see no reason to doubt him at this point.
 
Le Junk has done a test with reagents for the presence of amphetamine, and the results he's mentioned are those you'd get with amphetamine, so doubting him is effectively calling him a liar, with regard to the cocaine that he's been buying.

(he did send me a PM, after a couple of questions, saying thanks for a bit of info regarding the separation proceedure, so I hardly think that he's lying about what he's got)
 
Zzz...

Fizz and Fast: What Junk is maintaining, and what I am contesting, is that it is VERY common for American cocaine to be adulterated with active substances [usually amphetamine]. Noone could ever argue [effectively at least] that something NEVER happens. Anything is possible. What i am saying [again] is that it is not common, in fact it has never been documented anywhere as a trend [and believe me I have checked thoroughly]. In fact, the paper I cited said that many people have been making the same claim for years [subjectively I have heard the same about many substances] . The paper assayed samples from anyone claiming the same and doid not find one case. IT proved that it came down to perception. Did Junk perform a reagent? He very well might have. In the end though, saying that you got a hit on a reagent is not indicative of anything. In fact it does not even indicate that he actually performed it [no offense Junk as I like you]. It is very simple, if one is so inclined, to say they got any result. As it is no state secret, any interested person may ascertain what colr signifies what reagent result.

I posed a question off line to him [forgive me for repeating it Junk] that I'd like to pose here: Namely, why would a dealer waster their time and money to adulterate their cocaine with ANY active substance? IT would be far more simple to merely rely on the baby laxative, etc. In fact, since it is being posited that this active substance is taking away the desirable traits associated with cocaine why would a person do it even if the had the active substance free and in abundance? In other words: Why waste money denigrating your product?

People adulterate and dilute for a number of reasons. Among them, to increase the product's volume, to offer a more realistic experience in appearance or quality, or in rare cases to potentiate a substance. In those 3 scenarios, only potentiating would seem to warrant an active substance [as opposed to inert]. Still, the cost would be prohibitive and counter productive [also counterproductive in denigrating the overall experience as cited previously].

Lastly, as stated earlier, where is the documentation pointing to this widespread phenomenon? I have yet to see 1 assay stating this [excepting Junk's offered reagent results based on his word].
 
Hey Rach...
Adding amph to the yayo could make sense. "Real" yayo isn't supposed to make the user crave more according to lejunk. The yayo of today definately makes you want to do more and more, which to me sounds like properties of using amphetamine. Now why would a dealer want to do this, simple, it keeps the user coming back to him, making the dealer more and more money. This is definately possible/feasible, no?
 
Coke can produce some pretty serious cravings (any addictive drug can do that, really). It doesn't really have much of anything to do with the cut.
 
I will take a quote from the book entitled "Cocaine Handbook" by David Lee.

He states that:

"Amphetamine or speed is commonly used to adulterate cocaine. It is much stronger than caffeine and is usually used to restore the buzz to overly adulterated cocaine. Speed is actually quite popular in its own right, but it is not cocaine, and can be purchased for half the price".

From the book entitled "The Pleasures of Cocaine" by Adam Gotlieb, he states:

"Because of cocaines unusually high price on the underground, it is frequently adulterated with one of the less costly and often more potent (milligram to milligram) stimulant or psychoactive materials. Methedrine is probably the cut most frequently used. Many users are so accustomed to snorting cocaine cut with methedrine that when they try pure cocaine they complain that they have been cheated with badly diluted merchandise".

I have plenty more quotes from several different books with all the same responses if anyones interested.
 
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