am I depressed? Derealization/depersonalized?? No self worth/identity...

[foliocb]

I really can't put my finger on this one, but 'depression' is the only word that comes up when I think about this. I just get the feeling as of late that I don't understand anyone, and that no one quite understands me. My mom has so many grudges that she holds onto towards other people in my family, and is constantly trying to reinforce them into my head in hopes that I continue the cycle, but I am not having any of that shit and always lash back about how unhealthy all that shit is, and we frequently get into heated arguments because of it. My father, well let's just say he did some shit to me and my sister when we were young that left me mentally/emotionally scarred and is probably a key reason as to why i'm 22 and am unable to get close to any girl I come across. Or maybe im just some creeper who somehow freaks out all the girls I end up liking, and have them slowly fade away from me

that's the first mindfuck for me, am I pushing people away subconsciously, or am I just some dude that thinks way too 'out there' and thus people just slowly drift away from me because of my often reductionist and nihilistic outlook on most of their 'problems'?

I mean, I just look at so many people and 'friends' of mine with their trivial problems in life, and how most of them are just slowly wasting time by eating shitty food, watching shitty movies and calling it 'hanging out', and doing shitty drugs(i.e. alcohol) just because its socially acceptable. One part of me is sick of all that shit and is glad to be 'transcendental' to that whole mess, but the other part of me is sad and lacks any feeling of community

Must be kinda fun at times to be super religious and not have to worry about questioning things further, and just having a bunch of other half baked people searching for simplicity

I don't fucking wear jewelry like most people, or have earrings, or wear trendy clothes(not saying that it's wrong to do so), I just have clothes. Most of which don't fit properly anymore. I don't connect with this whole pretty boy shit that's going around, sometimes I look in the mirror and I feel awesome, other times I look in the mirror and pick every possible flaw and will let it get the better of me.

I just feel like i've lost most of my sense of personal identity and the ability to connect with something... someone. I just constantly look around and see so many problems in the world, and how everyone is perpetuating them by simply ignoring the fundamental flaws in the way we think and perceive- the fact that the way our society thinks is so contradicting that it creates so many 'side effects', and thus we just make more medicines to fix the side effects, rather then tackling the root problem(in a metaphorical sense of course).

I feel like i've outcasted myself from most things, and with my own banishment i've also lost my sense of self, and although I can see things in a much more neutral manner, I am not anymore happier- it makes me more sad if anything because I don't have anything nearby to hold onto. But I guess I never really did in the first place

I just feel like I have too much to say and that not many people are truly willing to be honest enough with themselves to hear things for what they really are: mostly bullshit. I try my best to look at everyone at eye level, but will admit sometimes my fucking ego is a sneaky bastard and will allow me to think i'm being selfless, but in fact am just being an egotistical dick looking down at the people i've 'transcended'.

Its weird though, I don't feel 'lonely'. But I do feel alone- all the time. Even when i'm with people at times, unless they're intellectually stimulating and can actually manage to distract me for a few hours. I feel alone all the time, especially at night when i'm in my super comfy bed, looking out at the mountains with a cold ass breeze consuming my room, looking at the moon and stars, just wanting to 'go back' if you know what I mean.

Lately I have been having such a feeling of being 'comfortably numb' it's not even funny... I just don't give a shit about the outcome of anything that's been happening, whether its job related, or family related, or if it's having friends slowly lose interest in me and drifting apart. Or my complete lack of sexuality... I just don't fucking care as of late

Self expression is important to be but I still have a lot of trouble finding something connecting to, except for music and stand-up comedy...most of the inspirational figures in my life were musicians or stand up comedians, and consequently most of them were dead before I found out about them.

Anyways, is this what depression really is? I lack meaning right now in life... maybe i'm overdue for a psychedelic trip or something. I dunno though, it seems the more I trip, the further down the rabbit hole I go, and the more detached I become from 'myself'?

By the way, I have been taking 20mg of Adderal 3x a week for about 9 months now, I think this may have something to do with it. I am planning to slowly ween off this shit and be completely off of it by the end of next month.

 

[foliocb]

A part of me doesn't even know why I posted this here for anyone to read, I guess I just want to broadcast my message because I know deep down inside that i'm not the only one that feels this way, I just don't have anyone immediately nearby to express these 'concerns' over. I know everyone gets down over the perils of living, but I am just trying to find the light in the heart of darkness like everyone else is... but I feel that in order to see and grab onto the light, I must first hit rock bottom. But what if I already have? It's not like there's a book detailing everything that's supposed to happen for life... I just don't know how to go abouts discovering my true self and something that really drives/inspires me to LIVE... and not be embarrassed at all to express myself. I love guitar and singing... but am nowhere near good at it, have only been doing it for about 3 years. It's really the only thing I have left as I see no point in getting a degree that a million other people already have. Sigh..

I just don't know how to stay on course and keep motivated at all costs... seems I either have too much time or not enough to stay focused on it... I always seem to have a generic excuse. Shitty.

 

[Charles Ferdinand]

I feel pretty much like yourself, except I haven't use drugs in a while, read my post here:
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/...r-off-dead?p=10229742&viewfull=1#post10229742

 

[Biovail]

Every time I come to this forum, it's like somebody is reading part of my mind and saying it's their own problem. Seriously, I'm dealing with the same shit (minus the adderall and one or two details) and though I don't feel comfortably numb, I feel like I'm getting there. I have some of my own issues apparently. Aspergers makes getting along with anybody difficult. I feel like I still don't understand social circles people have been a part of since high school. But most of your thoughts seem to be an echo of mine somewhat.

What is your current goal in life? What to you aspire to? The world's problems aren't yours, and though you shouldn't simply ignore them all, there is more to life than what's wrong with it. I'm guess lucky enough to know this. I was raised in the most beautiful town on earth and I would give anything, my soul even, to live here until my dying days. It's unfortunate what the world's idea of success today is and where we put our values, but put your talents to good use and recognize that the only thing limiting you in life is time, so don't waste that.

I don't think you'll find what you're looking for through any sort of introspection or drugs. My advice, quit the adderall. Give your life a focus. Get an education and make money. Money can buy happiness, and though that happiness doesn't come in the form of cars, gold, or women, if you can afford what the world naturally has to offer for you, you'll be happy. So make that your goal and stop focusing on day to day life and what has gone wrong so far.

 

[Shameful]

Wow. You pretty much summed up everything I've been going through since... well, since I can remember. I've never quite understood people and the little social "games" they always seem to play. Even when I was a little kid I remember watching that stuff and thinking, "Wow. That looks fucking stupid." It all seems so trivial. Like, isn't there something better they could be doing, to channel their energy?

But in the long run, they've all seem to be doing a lot better for themselves than I ever had. Those retards from school all have jobs now, are getting married, having kids... and here I am 25 years old and I haven't done shit. Which doesn't really surprise me. People ask me what I want to do with my life, what my goals are, and I don't know what to tell them. They say sometimes it takes some searching but trust me, I've looked. It's not here. Not on this planet anyway.

I just want to get out. Out of this place that seems to follow me wherever I go.

Wish I had some advice or something, but I'm in the same boat you are. But hey, you're not alone right? I don't know if that's any consolation... it isn't really for me.

 

[foliocb]

I just want the fire back in my life again, the fire- the drive that so many people around me seem to have, even if they're faking it. Put all their bullshit beliefs and ideologies aside, most people are much better off then I am, mentally speaking. I feel that I am 'negatively enlightened' and I don't want it to be like this forever... I want to just be able to let go of everything and just find the beauty in this heap of shit.

I need to fucking re-discover me first, though. I feel like i've drifted off through so many different ideas and people that nothing can be viewed as my own anymore. This song is spot on as to how i've been feeling this past week

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2_hNCu4iak&feature=player_embedded

 

[herbavore]

I have found that the best way to find beauty is to create it, then suddenly you are overwhelmed by the sight of it in everything from an old person's face to your own mundane street in a certain light of afternoon. Finding a way to be creative can be tricky because so much of the time our egos get in the way; but if you can truly keep yourself on the path of responding to the beauty you see, without forethought of how anyone else will respond to the outcome, that path becomes a soul saver. There are so many avenues to try: writing, music, photography, painting, dance, ceramics. I don't know about other countries, but in the U.S. it is easy to find low-cost classes like these in almost any small city through a community center or adult education. Besides getting you out of your own comfort zone, these classes are a way to meet other people that are looking for ways to infuse their own lives with beauty and meaning. I seriously think that at one of the lowest points in my life trying to learn to center clay on a pottery wheel in the dark basement of a local high school saved my life; I never could get the damn centering down, but the physical and mental engagement with creating was healing on the soul-level.

Compassion is the same way. Instead of focusing on the lack of it (which is hard not to when you have your eyes open as you do), create it. Pass it out wherever and whenever you can, simply because you can. It will come back to you tenfold. I am convinced that we are experiencing a crisis of loneliness and alienation that is very complex in both origin and nature. But the fix is as simple as it has ever been: reach out to people. If the people directly around you don't respond, look further.

The song you posted is a beautiful song but I was equally struck by the beauty of the homemade video that accompanied it. They both illustrate what I am trying to say about using the negative that you see and feel to create something beautiful. You sound like you are in a transitional place where you are yearning for depth in your life. That yearning is the spark of life. Try not to over-worry about where you are and see it more as a place you are passing through.

 

[malakaix]

I often ask myself 'What are you doing?'.. and i've never been able to give myself an answer.

The last two years of my life have felt like a downward spiral of self-destruction through an unavoidable sense of existential madness. Everything becomes harder because you realize the futility in virtually everything; i wouldn't even call this depression.. it's something that runs much deeper, it's a bit like dancing on the edge of faking it or falling into the abyss.. and im stuck somewhere in-between. I very much do understand what you mean by wanting to 'go back'.. that deep longing sense to return home, why did i ever leave to begin with.. what the hell am i doing here?

For the first time in my life, i am genuinely lost.. the verse Luke 9:58 "Foxes have holes and birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has no place to lay his head" suddenly takes on an enormous new meaning. The hardest part of all this is been unable to relate to those around you, which may consequently lead to isolation.. such is in my case, it's a bizarre place to be caught up in.. i watch friends,family and all the world around me go about there lives, the partying, working and living and here i am waiting for the punchline, wanting to wakeup.. like everyone is going to jump out and go 'A Ha! fooled you'; in which i would laugh my ass off in knowing that i was never alone to begin with, i know this to be true.. i've even experienced it through psychedelics and deep meditation, im just unable to fully realize it and integrate it.

I extend my sympathies for i know how difficult of a place this is to be in, i wish i could offer advice but im in the same sinking boat.



Edit: Awesome advice Herbavore.

 

[herbavore]

Malakaix, I still think that those who suffer a look into the abyss end up with far more to offer the world and their fellow human beings than those that never dare stand at that terrifying cliff edge.

It is profoundly lonely, no doubt about it. And though I have been there many times myself I am not there atm so it is easy for me to almost sound glib in my prescriptions. I do believe that despair kills and beauty heals. I know you to be a kind, wonderful presence here as I'm sure you are in the rest of your life. I hope that a little sunlight touches your shoulders today or a passing cloud catches your fancy and that you can perceive it as a hand reaching out to you and confirming your place in all this. Each of us is not just in the world--we are of the world. Flip the sinking boat over and hang on!

 

[Biovail]

Damn, I don't understand why everybody is searching for meaning in life. The only point in life is the point you give it.

I guess this is why drug use is a bad thing. Goals are supposed to be rewarding, inspire you to work toward them. If you do H, your goal is to do H, and you work toward doing H. You don't need any other goals.

Do you think this planet would be any better off if bees questioned why they desired nectar from flowers? At some point you have to just go about your life without asking why...

 

[foliocb]

why?

 

[malakaix]

Malakaix, I still think that those who suffer a look into the abyss end up with far more to offer the world and their fellow human beings than those that never dare stand at that terrifying cliff edge.

It is profoundly lonely, no doubt about it. And though I have been there many times myself I am not there atm so it is easy for me to almost sound glib in my prescriptions. I do believe that despair kills and beauty heals. I know you to be a kind, wonderful presence here as I'm sure you are in the rest of your life. I hope that a little sunlight touches your shoulders today or a passing cloud catches your fancy and that you can perceive it as a hand reaching out to you and confirming your place in all this. Each of us is not just in the world--we are of the world. Flip the sinking boat over and hang on!

Thank-you herbavore, you most definitely have a talent for giving advice that is refreshing to read, i appreciate the kind words.

 

[foliocb]

what if you dont know how to create beauty, herbavore?

 

[herbavore]

I bet you are selling yourself short. It doesn't have to be a recognized art form. But in your case, you are a very good writer. Writing about, and out of, the darker side of yourself could be something that leads you to a whole new place. There are writing practice groups where people just come together to write and then share their writing. The writer Sandra Cisneros has a great quote about writing through rage and despair into the light--can't find it but you get the gist, right?

If writing isn't something that you want to do, it could be anything--cooking, talking to people, just being an artful observer! The more we connect with the beauty that is available, the more we naturally create it in some form.

I am at a really low point in my life right now---I'm incapable of doing the art I usually do. So what I do to keep myself sane is try to see beauty. Thar's the extent of my own current output! For instance, I saw a lot of beauty in your original post. I know that is probably small comfort to you and I'm sorry, but I think it is a beautiful thing when a young person asks the big questions, sees the big holes in the prescribed views, throws some honest introspection into the pot and stirs it up! And then to write it all down and share it, well, that makes it all the more beautiful to me. So you are creating already.

But seriously, what about writing?

 

[Dave]

Creating beauty, like all other things, is a learned skill. In other words: try, fail, repeat. Eventually you'll find something that works. Practise.

Damn, I don't understand why everybody is searching for meaning in life. The only point in life is the point you give it.

Bingo. Some call that bleak, I call it empowering. It's your life, nobody else is going to live it for you. If you don't like hanging out, eating shitty food and watching crappy movies, then go do something awesome instead!

 

[foliocb]

Damn, I don't understand why everybody is searching for meaning in life. The only point in life is the point you give it.

I wouldn't consider myself really 'searching for meaning' at this point. I've already come to terms with the fact that meaning is subjective, and as a matter of fact everything is subjective... but anyways 'meaning' is what you make it, nothing more. Meaning is good for motivating us and giving us something to hold onto... but I think i've let go a little too much.

I feel like an ant in an ant colony, carrying its piece, its burden, back and fourth to and from its colony every single day in regimented form. Such as when I drive home from work every night, it's an hour long drive one way, and about halfway into the drive when I start going into autopilot mode, I frequently get a sudden jolt, something enters my head and screams "what the hell is this?". It's quite different from 'what is the meaning of this', or 'who am i', or such... it's more like "what the hell is 'this'..."

this thing... I don't know what to call it- life? consciousness? awareness? It feels like being awake in a dream, except unlike the movie The Matrix, you don't simply leave the dream world for good... I still find myself drifting back into this 'dream state' and going back to my regimented life like everyone else.... why? well because everyone else is doing it I guess.

Don't get me wrong, regimenting some aspects of life has great benefits, such as me having a very good diet and exercise plan now, and a lot more time to do things because of my 'organized' state of mind... but I still can't put my finger on this feeling. WHAT THE HELL IS THIS! Why am I getting glimpses of this feeling for only brief periods before going back to the dream and back to playing the game? I feel like i'm trapped in the middle and unable to pick a side- and this idea permeates a lot in my life. For instance, I can never stick to one flavor of anything when it comes to food. Ice cream? I want every flavor or I don't want ice cream at all. Food? I want every known spice on it, not just garlic salt. You wouldn't want to know half the shit I put in my smoothie every morning.

I just wish I could commit to my life already. I hate pondering so much... and I know there's no objective answers which will be spelt out for me... I don't even know why I bother sometimes.

 

[Ixchellian]

What I wonder, is where the hell did all this depersonalization & derealization comes from.... and why it is that just a little over a year ago, I never heard *anyone* say that they were suffering from a de-whatever disorder, without first going on a serious psychedelic binge.

Why the fuck is it that these two things are now being self-diagnosed by people, like they do when they feel like they might be catching a cold??? Did I miss something, or is wikipedia now the go-to source for medical wisdom?

Or is it no coincidence, that all this banter about depersonalization goes along with increasingly rampant pushing of antidepressants & stims on people by psych docs (or just too much wikipedia).... because otherwise it all just sounds like depression to me. Why make things so much more complicated?

If it looks & quacks like a duck, it probably isn't a goddamn emu. 8)

 

[panic in paradise]

If writing isn't something that you want to do, it could be anything--cooking, talking to people, just being an artful observer! The more we connect with the beauty that is available, the more we naturally create it in some form.



But seriously, what about writing?

whaaat an artful observer?? i like that...

Anyways, is this what depression really is? I lack meaning right now in life... maybe i'm overdue for a psychedelic trip or something. I dunno though, it seems the more I trip, the further down the rabbit hole I go, and the more detached I become from 'myself'?

i would look at it as, the less attached you have become to what you identified as yourself. we have so many mile-stones of self development, and this is one most people will deny themselves. it is much the same as leaving the womb, the first day of school, moving out of home the first time...those things sucked, they sound kind of silly now, but are extremely sweet - lol - those are the times we look back on and see as what everyone must do. there are many mile-stones for us, what you are experiencing now is one of them, and one that most people switch off, deny and detach from, shifting back to the reality they knew, even if it was not at all productive or destructive.

its easy to not allow this realization to play out, because there is no one to help push you along...so the easy choice of drugs in any form prescription or not is there, the classic 'mid life crisis' 'quarter life crisis' syndrome which is shown to usually be filled/relieved with material possessions or other ego desires, modern western psychology which is an attempt to counter this biological reaction through suggestion, or just chosen isolation and the personal fight for some way to be content, which is dangerous for many reasons.


i feel i can fully relate, but i have no suggestion for you atm, besides my regular meditation and yoga ones, and of course creative self expression.

 

[foliocb]

What I wonder, is where the hell did all this depersonalization & derealization comes from.... and why it is that just a little over a year ago, I never heard *anyone* say that they were suffering from a de-whatever disorder, without first going on a serious psychedelic binge.

Why the fuck is it that these two things are now being self-diagnosed by people, like they do when they feel like they might be catching a cold??? Did I miss something, or is wikipedia now the go-to source for medical wisdom?

Or is it no coincidence, that all this banter about depersonalization goes along with increasingly rampant pushing of antidepressants & stims on people by psych docs (or just too much wikipedia).... because otherwise it all just sounds like depression to me. Why make things so much more complicated?

If it looks & quacks like a duck, it probably isn't a goddamn emu. 8)

Because depression was a lack of a better word. Lets just say it quacked like a duck, but doesnt look like a duck at all. Now what do you do?...

Has nothing to do with wikipedia. My adderal usage probably exacerbated it though.

 

[bright_eyes*]

that's the first mindfuck for me, am I pushing people away subconsciously, or am I just some dude that thinks way too 'out there' and thus people just slowly drift away from me because of my often reductionist and nihilistic outlook on most of their 'problems'?

I mean, I just look at so many people and 'friends' of mine with their trivial problems in life, and how most of them are just slowly wasting time by eating shitty food, watching shitty movies and calling it 'hanging out', and doing shitty drugs(i.e. alcohol) just because its socially acceptable. One part of me is sick of all that shit and is glad to be 'transcendental' to that whole mess, but the other part of me is sad and lacks any feeling of community

Don't worry you are not alone I literally went through this exact same thing this past semester at college, and have also been taking 20 mg of adderall pretty much daily for the last year. I literally felt like I wrote this as I was reading it. When you are in it you wonder why you have to feel this way and everyone else gets to go along their simple lives, wearing their simple clothes, talking to their simple friends, doing their simple happy daily activities and it really gets you in a rut.

During this period I realized three very important things:
1. I was the reason for secluding myself, I was pushing MYSELF away from people, regardless of our difference in life views or whatever you want to call it, I was looking at the world around from the outside in, no longer a part of the community I used to submerge myself in so enthusiastically on a daily basis. It was like an alien world and all my thoughts led me to believe that I didn't belong.
2. I began to pick up on the way my "best friend" was dressing, talking, living her life etc. My boyfriend fell in love with me because I was different I was not a drinker, I didn't wear the normal clothes and I was interesting. Now I am throwing down f bombs acting all cool like I don't give a shit about anything and dressing in dark colors. Not caring about anything is suddenly cool.
3. I am extremely passionate about dance and it has always been the thing I could do to let all my emotions out, but once in college the thing I loved most became the thing that tortured me so much I never wanted to step foot inside the dance department again. I lost my sense of self expression and let things that didn't matter control the things that did matter.

I could go on and on but don't worry in time things will heal. I literally made a 180 mentally and physically to deal with my absolute plunge into a deep deep deep depression, lack of self worth and no purpose to live.

Things I did to help the situation:
1. To help the adderall situation - exercise, it releases dopamine naturally, the chemical that adderall depletes, eat lots of turkey, avocados, bananas and nice quality dark chocolate or any other foods rich in the chemical building blocks for dopamine.
2. Eat an orange before you go to bed, it will help you get sleep and take the edge of the adderall and you will wake up feeling refreshed because it has lots of good vitamins.
3. To help the feelings lifeless and like nothing matters situation - vitamins are very important to keep your complex chemical make up in check - take a vitamin b complex, super important even for a super healthy person, fish oil, which will help with your brain functioning, and a daily multi vitamin.
4. To help the social situation - this one was the hardest for me, I didn't drink for 4 months, did not go to one party, had one best friend and thought that was all I needed, but you have to reach out to those around you. If you think how I did and when someone doesn't invite me out I think they hate me, but a relationship is a two way street, and if you don't reach out they won't either, especially when they are the one with tons of other friends and you are the one who has disappeared. Hope this doesn't sound mean in a way I am writing this to myself haha.

Depression is normal, I strongly recommend against medication for your issues, a pill is the easy way out, I learned the hard way by taking adderall to try and get skinny and stay focused and thought my life was going to end, food and exercise is a better "medication" in the long term. I would also suggest getting a journal and everyday writing at least 5 things you are grateful for, even if they are as little as waking up on time or having a delicious bowl of cereal.

Remember you only endure things that you can handle and make you stronger one day, and it may be closer than you think, you will look back and realize that all of this was a stepping stone to get somewhere greater in you rlife. Stay strong and good luck, easier said than done.