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Am I a bad person?

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ForEverAfter said:
You're a freedom fundamentalist; Google "freedom fundamentalist" and do some reading.
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Well I can't argue there... I believe that the freedom to swing ones fist ends where anothers face begins.
I went to a school that didn't accept gays, but even though I disagree, I support the teachers rights... it would have only resulted in bullying anyway.
 
Just cause there's no blood on your hands doesn't mean you're not limiting other people's freedoms.
And, being a fundamentalist is never a good thing. Think about it.
 
ForEverAfter said:
Just cause there's no blood on your hands doesn't mean you're not limiting other people's freedoms.
And, being a fundamentalist is never a good thing. Think about it.
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I can say in all honestly that I don't support anything I think that limits peoples freedoms that isn't hurting anyone other than the person.

I support legalizing heroin and meth, which limits peoples freedom, but I'm also limiting their freedom by not letting them do the drug. In some states, domestic violence offenders can get off with the victims consent. And that's because it's her choice. Does it limit her freedom? Yes. She loses her freedom not to get her ass beat. However, she chooses to give up that freedom.
 
psychedelicSoul, you're not going to figure this out by thinking. It results in mental gymnastics to justify/refute your feelings that are confusing to me. I agree with some of the things you say when taken in isolation but others I don't want to touch with a ten foot pole. By airing your opinions here on a public forum it is questionable if you are accomplishing something useful for yourself. It is obvious to me that your sexuality has feelings of guilt running your thoughts. It may not be obvious to you but your guilt, shame and fear is where you need to be looking. Good person, bad person is irrelevant. Your experience is what matters and I do believe you can change. I assume you want to grow up to to be a healthy, balanced adult without all the fixations? You've probably already made great strides in that respect according to your rigid definitions of what that means, but you're treading in territory where most cannot offer you support, especially while you hold such opinionated views.

If I were to offer you advice I'd say let go of all the mental concepts related your sexuality. You're not going to think your way out of something as primitive and primal as sex and attraction. Replace everything you think you know about sex with simple mental concepts that allow you to get out of your own way and feel the buried and suppressed emotions that are running you. Let them arise without adding on another justification or statement about what you believe. You'll notice you thoughts change on their own without you having to do anything about it. You'll notice your desires change without you having to think your way out of it.

I'm reading a fantastic book right now that was recommended to me by a fellow bluelighter. It's called "Letting go: The pathway of surrender" by David Hawkins. It says with great simplicity and completeness what letting go means. I strongly recommend you read it. You can save yourself a lifetime of suffering by taking this simple advice. I'm done reading your posts. Not because you are a bad person but because you have nothing worth convincing me of and I believe you are only hurting yourself by doing this. Good luck.
 
Aside from all the religious beliefs and contradictory statements, the real question is "how comfortable are you with your own sexuality?" Humans tend to fear what they don't know/understand. Perhaps you've had same sex thoughts/experiences and your distorted views on discrimination/equal rights are simply a manifestation of your own self loathing. Find a good therapist and process through it! You can learn a lot about yourself in counseling.
 
CokeyRoberts said:
Aside from all the religious beliefs and contradictory statements, the real question is "how comfortable are you with your own sexuality?" Humans tend to fear what they don't know/understand. Perhaps you've had same sex thoughts/experiences and your distorted views on discrimination/equal rights are simply a manifestation of your own self loathing. Find a good therapist and process through it! You can learn a lot about yourself in counseling.
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Explain what "contradicts"? And my mind told me homosexuality and bisexuality were disgusted. So I tortured the bisexual thoughts out of me and used meditations/psychedelics to assist in that. I prayed and sought help from a high power, as well as fought my mind with razor blades, and iron bars.

And my views on discrimination aren't "distorted". I hate seeing mom and pop stores being shut down by politically correct fascist. That goes down to my views on the role of government. I feel the same way about religion as I do about sexuality. Even if I was gay, it wouldn't matter, because plenty of gay people (such as OutRight Libertarians) support the freedom of christian business's. My political beliefs are irrelevant to my views on sexuality.
 
So, shop owners should ask whether or not potential customers are sexually active?
... and it's not okay to discriminate against them if they're celibate?
 
ForEverAfter said:
So, shop owners should ask whether or not potential customers are sexually active?
... and it's not okay to discriminate against them if they're celibate?
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Not really, because if that was the case, then they wouldn't be discriminated against in the first place. They don't have a magic rainbow beacon over their heads that tells you they're gay.
 
So how do shop owners discriminate, then?
How can you discriminate against someone for being gay, if you don't know they're gay?
And, if you do know they're gay, how do you know if they've chosen to embrace that lifestyle or remain celibate?

Let's say a hypothetical gay customer walks into a shop, and is obviously super gay.
Are you saying that it's not okay to discriminate against him, because you can't be sure?
If so, in what situation is it okay to discriminate?

Do you have to catch a gay couple fucking in the frozen food section?
I'm not sure how - practically - what you're discussing makes sense.
 
ForEverAfter said:
So how do shop owners discriminate, then?
How can you discriminate against someone for being gay, if you don't know they're gay?
And, if you do know they're gay, how do you know if they've chosen to embrace that lifestyle or remain celibate?

Let's say a hypothetical gay customer walks into a shop, and is obviously super gay.
Are you saying that it's not okay to discriminate against him, because you can't be sure?
If so, in what situation is it okay to discriminate?

Do you have to catch a gay couple fucking in the frozen food section?
I'm not sure how - practically - what you're discussing makes sense.
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If they walk into a store acting super gay and stereotypical, then they're being discrimnated against for their behavior not their sexuality. It wouldn't matter what their sexuality is. They could be straight. Not all gay people act like stereotypes.
Also... most gay people get discriminated against for either public displays of affection or for wanting to have a gay wedding catered. In that case, they're discriminated against for holding hands or kissing (behaviors). And in the other case, the store owners are simply refusing to be part of a ceremony they disagree with.

Now if a business owner randomly assumed people were gay and kicked them out... Then his business would tank anyway, so it doesn't matter. He'd drive his own customers away.
The only time it makes sense to discriminate is if you own a business which pertains directly to marriage. I can understand because they're discriminating against a ceremony, not a person. Any other time, you'd just be stupidly driving customers away and bringing your own store under.

You really can't be discriminated against for being gay in a store. Now, your employee can discriminate if you have a job that insures benefits for spouses and they find out you're married to someone of the same sex.
 
So, people who own businesses should not be allowed to reserve the right to discriminate against homosexuals?
(Unless they're holding hands / kissing or the business in question is catering a wedding?)

I don't see how you can absolutely separate behavior from sexuality.
I mean: isn't sex a behavior?

^Should stores be allowed to turn away customers with a particular ancestry?
If not, why not?
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Because having a particular ancestry wasn't your choice.
Being in a same sex relationship is a choice.
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You implied, in your answer to the above question, that it is okay to turn away customers who are gay...
And - about the choice thing - there are lots of choices.

Like political orientations.
Should stores be allowed to turn away communists?
Or refuse to cater to a communist wedding?

What about religious inclinations?
Should gay stores be allowed to turn away Christians?
What's the difference?
 
ForEverAfter said:
So, people who own businesses should not be allowed to reserve the right to discriminate against homosexuals?
(Unless they're holding hands / kissing or the business in question is catering a wedding?)

I don't see how you can absolutely separate behavior from sexuality.
I mean: isn't sex a behavior?
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Those are the only ways they would get discriminated against. It doesn't matter if they have the right to discriminate against gays. If they didn't make any lifestyle choices or acted like a stereotype, then they simply wouldn't face discrimination at all.
 
You're shifting from what should happen to what does happen.
We're discussing what you think should be, not what is.

I'm asking you: should businesses be free to discriminate against gays?

Your answer doesn't make sense, to me.
I don't really think you're answering the question.

Is holding hands evidence that they're gay?
Is kissing (see: Europe)?

Can you construct a hypothetical situation in which it is okay to discriminate against someone?
Or are you saying it isn't okay?
(You're being slippery.)
 
Have only read the first half page (I know, naughty me)..

But ForEverAfter brings up a valid point. Jesus wouldn't have had a problem with it.

Jesus talks about fornication being wrong. Now a lot of Christians will say that fornication = gay sex but it doesn't.. it means sex outside of marriage. So.. Let gays marry. Sorted.
 
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