Alcoholism discussion thread v. 5.0

[jspun]

Good luck AlanWatts- I think that scope might have the type of alcohol that makes you blind-IPA or something like this- not EtOH. Maybe you should throw the Vanilla extract away and use whole vanilla beans- just a thought.

 

[RedLeader]

I'm thinking about throwing 9.5 months alcohol sobriety out the window tonight. Cannot get to my DOC, and I feel like I am going to go insane if the panic attacks and physical anxiety don't stop. Tonight was a bad night for me.

 

[n3ophy7e]

Red, you are going to feel a million times worse if you drink tonight. What time is it there? Can you just go to sleep and start afresh tomorrow?? That's what I've been doing the last few nights when I've been in a really bad state. Damage control at its finest: go to sleep
Easier said than done though, when you're panicking. I know. Have you got any valerian, chamomile tea, anything at all that would help you relax? Please just sit tight, remember that this WILL pass


jspun thank you so much for your input. What has kept me sober?? My therapist would hate me saying this but I honestly think it's been the naltrexone, and my boyfriend's support. I SHOULD take some of the credit for my sobriety but I'm too depressed to allow myself that honour.
Congrats on 35 days sober mate, keep it up!!

 

[RedLeader]

There's no way I can go to sleep worked up this badly. I haven't freaked out like this in a long time. Pounding heart, skin crawling and feeling warm, eyes twitching. All just physical anxiety, haven't taken any substances in months. None of the stuff you mentioned would put a dent into me when it's this bad. Have spent the past few hours trying to take deep breaths, mediate, walk, think through things...my body is just screaming at me that it needs medication.

 

[n3ophy7e]

Mate, I had a very similar episode yesterday.
Your brain is just trying to trick you in to drinking, but you do not need it. Keep doing what you're doing Red, deep breaths, distraction, meditate. It WILL pass, you know this

 

[RedLeader]

What's keeping me from doing it is that thought that tomorrow would be the worst hangover of my life. Let me get this straight, I really don't want to drink. I am just very scared right now from what my body and mind are putting me through, and almost feel like I am entering some type of survival mode in which alcohol (or similar) would take on a different role.

 

[n3ophy7e]

What's keeping me from doing it is that thought that tomorrow would be the worst hangover of my life.

Just keep reminding yourself of this. It's not worth it mate.
Also, remember that the symptoms of anxiety you are experiencing can not harm you, and they will subside. I know it feels horrendous and neverending right now, but please just hang in there

 

[Eyes On the Roll]

Been drinking daily for the past several months. For about a month I cut down by more than half.. now I'm back to a tall bottle of merlot a day, or 16 beers. Back in it. Not complaining though.

 

[motherofearth]

What's keeping me from doing it is that thought that tomorrow would be the worst hangover of my life. Let me get this straight, I really don't want to drink. I am just very scared right now from what my body and mind are putting me through, and almost feel like I am entering some type of survival mode in which alcohol (or similar) would take on a different role.

Those hangovers always lead me back to the hard stuff. I don't know if this is an issue for you, but this knowledge keeps me from drinking often.

But drinking is its own ugly end for me - and that's why it's been a week since my last episode. I hope it is truly over this time.

 

[jspun]

@ Red Leader

What's keeping me from doing it is that thought that tomorrow would be the worst hangover of my life. Let me get this straight, I really don't want to drink. I am just very scared right now from what my body and mind are putting me through, and almost feel like I am entering some type of survival mode in which alcohol (or similar) would take on a different role.

Remember man this too shall pass. Hope you were able to ride it out.

If your hung over pick yourself up and don't trip on relapsing- this could be the last hangover. I've enjoyed your posts through the years. Must best suggestion is to get yourself to a meeting. Your an Aussie, right if I'm not mistaken...know there are tons of meetings there- sure aint a lack of alcoholics and good beer.

If you did get through the night get to a meeting and share about were your at.

Sorry about the lectures- hope you pull through.

 

[jspun]

N3Ophy7E

Hate to advocate this but you could try suboxone (or whatever formulation bupe comes in the country you live) in lieu of naltrexone. Theoretically should block craving and eleviate depression- worked for me, atleast the eleviating depression for a while- but then got diminishing returns over months and tapered off back in January. Again I advocate the 12 step programs. Wonder why there is a general resistance of thisamong people trying to stay sober? Don't have to disclose meds- aint nobodies business- just be honest with yourself, find a meeting you like with people you can identify with, and stay sober- trick is staying sober and being happy- thats why I go but still in pink cloud honeymoon stage. But when I'm craving a drink a meeting eleviates the craving as if by magic- and talking to the guys about were I'm at has helped me more than a years worth of therapy- not that there is anything wrong with any structured programs- it is prudent to use all the tools at our disposal.

One of the best things- you don't have anyones concept of God shoved down your throat. Ocean and surfing has been a bit of a higher power for me lately... too bad my board doesn't float me as well after 1 year of heavy beer drinking.8(

Anyway starting day 36- on way to the beach.

 

[michael]

i don't really have much against 12 step programs, and i have a few friends who are really active 12-steppers. what does get to me is the emphasis on being powerless over addiction and the fact that it seems like 90% of any conversation i have with these friends anymore has been distilled down into aphorisms like "sick and tired of being sick and tired", etc.

 

[blahman8000]

This is absolutely not true blahman, even though it might feel like it is sometimes. My boyfriend is a prime example of how things can turn around. He has been through so many overdoses and other near-death experiences, he really should not be alive. But he's been given chance after chance after chance, and he's still here, and life is now looking pretty fucking sweet for him. So even when you think there is absolutely nothing left, there is always a reason to keep fighting. Your liver is still there, it still has some function, that is better than nothing. Please take care of it. You've got SO MUCH left to offer the world dude. Please don't give up

Thanks for the reply, n3o. My concern is that if I end up in the same condition I was back in February (which seems to be becoming a distinct possibility very soon, even if I quit now - which I intend to do), my body might not be so forgiving this time. I'm scared and almost sure that I've done permanent, lifelong damage to my liver, and will be sick for the rest of my life. I'm 24 years old and I feel like I've drank myself all the way to 80 years old, and I might not even come back. Yet the withdrawals and sobriety itself are so hellish, that I feel totally willing to give in. It's irrational, being so worried about damaging my liver yet ending up drinking to relieve my worries (and other issues). I don't know if I'll be able to get back to full health again.

I'm trying not to exaggerate, but it just feels like utter hell sometimes, like something's definitely wrong. I have a doctor's appointment in a few days, and intend to schedule an appointment with a hepatologist. I just hope I don't end up spending a week in the hospital again.

In 2 days time I will be 5 months sober. I am having a really really hard time keeping shit together though. Alcohol is constantly in my face. I crave it every single day. The last few days I've WOKEN UP craving alcohol. My anxiety is coming back in droves as well. I've abused both xanax and oxycodone this week because I just needed a fucking break.

Isn't it supposed to get easier with time????

It's GREAT that you've reached 5 months. That is a hell of an accomplishment. Continuing to abstain does get hard when it's constantly around and so available. For me, my alcoholism began around the time that I stopped Oxy's. I used alcohol for that reason, to get a break. I was replacing pain pills though, and clearly it got way out of control. But that xanax and oxy was just a hiccup in the road, and I still have faith that you can stick to this. Keep it up! For me, when I was doing well with sobriety, I turned that energy I used on getting and staying drunk, and I channeled it towards getting healthier and in an overall better position in life. Good exercise always relieved my cravings. I'd treat myself to some of my favorite healthy food when I wanted a beer. It certainly wasn't easy, but if I could go back in time, I sure as hell would've stuck with the plan. I wish you luck, and am happy you're toughing it out and sticking to sobriety.

Blahman- Long story short- my EtOH effected my relationship with my wife and 4 year old daughter. I was getting tremors at work (were I need a steady hand to start IVs).
When I went in for a physical my LFTs were high- My ALT was 240 and AST was 200 and I forget what my AlK Phos was but my liver was shot- this was back in april. I gained 50 lbs. I would take cimetidine to prevent GI bleeds and kick in my benzos. Cimetidine and EtOH both prevent the absorption of magnesium. This can cause Torsades de pointes- a potentially lethal cardiac rhythm. I'd feel my heart racing so I'd take beta blockers and mag suplements. Smoked dispesary weed and hash the first 6 months and quit- scared I was gonna lose my job. One day my 4 year old who would rarely hug me and would mad dog me came up to me and huged me saying "daddy I love you more than you think I do." Finally on 7/12/12 I got sober. By then I was peeing amber blood tinged urine, passing clay colored stools, and bleeding like a stuck pig- itching alot. My BP was sky high for my age.

Now I'm 35 days sober. Had to get the shit beat outta me. But my health, which took a year to destroy has radically improved. I have zero will power. What worked for me has been AA and I have a sponsor in mind. Last week I paddled out and surfed for the first time in 18 months- my cardiovascular system was able to handle it and surfing I believe will help keep me sober. This time I believe that meetings will not in and of themselves, nor my support group but doing the deal (aka the steps) and through action enacting a change in my thinking. I found a sponsor he just doesn't know it yet (he offered to sponsor me last week- told him I had to think about it.)

Hey, thanks for the reply. Congrats on getting sober. My experience earlier this year was very similar to yours. I've had a lot of people encourage me to go back to AA, and I think I will. I just hope I make it through this. My ALT was 114, AST 210, bilirubin fluctuated between 15 and 19. ALK PHOS was 185 at its worst. My urine was practically reddish brown. Eyes and skin totally yellow. Did they diagnose you with anything specific? Alcoholic hepatitis? Cirrhosis? I'm glad you're doing so much better. Hope things continue to improve.

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

I had an alcohol problem; I never had a really serious alcohol problem.


When I got off the booze after the extreme night-sweats, psychosis, insomnia, and anxiety, I would wake up every day just wishing I would have the courage to throw myself down seven stories. This went on for about two months. Then I found life, slowly. Man, the splendor I had missed!

 

[jspun]

@ Blahman- Didn't diagnose me with anything yet- will probably have to start with an abdominal ultrasound. Hep Pannel good idea if LFTs still elevated.
Nice to know your considering AA.

@Micheal- 95% of the shit I've been hearing is get a sponsor and work the steps.

 

[Cyc]

If anyone is looking for motivation or experiencing a moment of weakness, I suggest reading this About.com article. There are several stories of people who have suffered, or are suffering alcoholism themselves, or experienced it through a loved one. Fair warning, some of the stories are pretty shocking and sad, but if you need a splash of cold water, I highly suggest it.

It never ceases to amaze me to read about how much some people can drink. I read about those who drink a handle (26oz I believe) of vodka a night for months, even years on end, and I wonder how a person could survive. Being an episodic drinker, I find myself constantly cycling between sobriety, moderate drinking and flat out binging for days on end. I know it has to stop because while my symptoms (fatigue, acid reflux, fatty liver, and increasingly worse withdrawals) are mild in comparison to some, I can see where this whole thing is heading. I gave up hard liquor last year, and while I did improve, I find I'm able to drink nearly the same amount in beer or coolers, it just takes longer and the excessive calories are disgusting.

My mom turned 50 last year and I worry about her health so much. Her doctor is somehow ignorant to the symptoms of organ failure due to alcohol abuse (or she's lying to me) and my mom uses it as an excuse to continue drinking. Her husband is as bad as she is and I worry for the both of them. They also gave up hard liquor 2yrs ago, but I rarely see them without a strong wine cooler in front of them, and whenever I come over there's always a cold one cracked for me and ready to go.

The problem I've been trying to face is having a social life without alcohol. I have no kids, live a fairly decent life and have a lot of recreational time for sports and partying. All of my good friends and I mean ALL OF THEM are either binge drinkers, weekend warriors or daily maintainers. Thankfully, my girlfriend can take or leave the stuff else I'd literally have nobody in my life who doesn't have some form of drinking problem.

When I gave up cigarettes 6 years ago, I did it knowing I could never have another cigarette again or I'd be back to half a pack in no time. I hate to think that I need to make the same commitment to alcohol, but I fear it has come to that.

 

[Ds]

i really think that i have a drinking problem now, since being clean from heroin ive seemd to replace it with alcohol. i drink everynight after work and nothing like a 6pack, more like an 18pack of beer or a bottle of liquor. i wake up and do the same shit the next night. this has gone on for the last 2 months maybe?
i convince myself that i have a good reason to drink, i stress all day @ work, so i reward myself with alcohol. now the news of my aunt passed away has givin me another reason to drink, sure it's ok i tell myself work+this=even more alcohol, so instead of a 18 pack, i buy a case, and instead of 1 bottle of liquor i buy 2.
i drink to black out because having alot of life shit on my mind when laying down i never sleep, so alcohol seems to disolve any life shit i'm going thru atm.
my hands shake without it. and i only thought that happepend to the alcoholic that lives under the bridge, or the old man that drinks 24/7, not someone that has drank for even 2 months.
i can come up with an excuse to drink and thats what makes it scary. it went from a social thing to a more personal alone thing.

 

[phactor]

i really think that i have a drinking problem now, since being clean from heroin ive seemd to replace it with alcohol. i drink everynight after work and nothing like a 6pack, more like an 18pack of beer or a bottle of liquor. i wake up and do the same shit the next night. this has gone on for the last 2 months maybe?
i convince myself that i have a good reason to drink, i stress all day @ work, so i reward myself with alcohol. now the news of my aunt passed away has givin me another reason to drink, sure it's ok i tell myself work+this=even more alcohol, so instead of a 18 pack, i buy a case, and instead of 1 bottle of liquor i buy 2.
i drink to black out because having alot of life shit on my mind when laying down i never sleep, so alcohol seems to disolve any life shit i'm going thru atm.
my hands shake without it. and i only thought that happepend to the alcoholic that lives under the bridge, or the old man that drinks 24/7, not someone that has drank for even 2 months.
i can come up with an excuse to drink and thats what makes it scary. it went from a social thing to a more personal alone thing.

Very very common for opiate addicts to go to booze or vice versa. I myself was caught in a cycle for years, get on opiates for awhile and drink very little... taper of the opiates but ramp up the drinking. Go a few months just drinking a few beers nightly and then tapering off the booze. Then make up some excuse to get on opiates for awhile... then start all over again.

A six pack after work isn't good for you, but its nowhere near as dangerous as an 18 pack of beers. Do you think you could try buying a 12 pack instead and then slowly cut back? That would be my suggestion. If you have been drinking a 24 for a few weeks and feel more comfortable with an 18 for like 2-3 days then do so. The goal is to get yourself on a stable dose to work down from. You are not trying to get drunk, just be comfortable and able to sleep. Your consumption levels are pretty dangerous right now, but if you keep it up it will get way way worse.

I never drank that much (as in 12+ beers) personally, but I did drink daily for a long time (years, anywhere from 3-6 beers nightly) and it wasn't good when I got off I can tell you that. I should note that towards the end I started using lots of benzos and was off and on with opiates.

I made a thread about tapering alcohol a long time ago, there are probably other resources on the internet.

HOWEVER, it is always safest to withdrawal under the care of a doctor. If you are nervous about it then I would go to your doctor.

I have found that I really have to stay on top of my intake since I got off of Suboxone (and any other opiates)... I have been okay, but I had to take a 1 1/2 off of all substances (besides Suboxone) to get to this point. It was much easier to not drink when I was on Suboxone, but to be honest I would rather have 2-3 beers 1-3 times a week then be on Suboxone. Sub was great and a huge help for me, but I was nowhere close to having to be a life-time maintenance user. I have gotten drunk a few times (weddings, nights out etc) and I have to say my hangovers are totally god awful now. Its just not worth it.

I had an alcohol problem; I never had a really serious alcohol problem.


When I got off the booze after the extreme night-sweats, psychosis, insomnia, and anxiety, I would wake up every day just wishing I would have the courage to throw myself down seven stories. This went on for about two months. Then I found life, slowly. Man, the splendor I had missed!

Those are pretty serious symptoms, glad to see that you are not struggling with it anymore.

 

[xxsicknessxx]

Drinking is hard to quit its in every book, song, movie, tv, raido. And its all around us all the time, in stores, at partys, places we eat... drinking is vicious. Try to keep in mind that your drinking picks off where you left it at. So don't think it will ever be the first time it won't it will go back to the way it was the last time you drank.

 

[VanWeyden]

I relapsed last friday. I was set on that thought merely the whole day when the last two appointments I had at work were called off, so I went to my room, began to abuse my ritalin script, bought some booze and got on a train to the nearest big city where I was likely to score, bought some weed, benzos and subs there and drove back to my place in the night.

So I already was on alc and stims, threw in some cannabis and the subs (unbelievable how subs buzzed me out after taking virtually no opes for more than a year...) and was 110% shitfaced for the whole night, just doing shit, stumbling around my appartment with no purpose.

At at 8 am I went to bed and proceeded to nod/puke throught the whole saturday. On sunday I felt kind of better and took some kpins and more sub, monday morning I decided to stop this and flushed everything down the toilet but like 2 mg of sub (in case I might get some wds ).
Stressfull day at work + feeling like shit, I snorted the remaining sub and decided to not get clean but buy more opiates to stay high for the next weeks and stop then... on the way to the station I thought like "Fuck, that's dumb as hell. You can stop now or it will become harder. You don't want this. You don't want to fuck up entirely. "

So I pulled over to a meeting that took place monday evening, got it all out and cried and cried and worked out a plan how to stay sober. I sweated like a madman and had that subtle feeling of an upcoming withdrawal constantly, but now I'm the 3rd day clean again.
I'll be at home for the weekend which I'm really looking forward to!