ADD/ADHD and Drug Abuse

[DarkCode]

Yea, my tolerance is extremely low. And if I go a few weeks without taking any it feels like I have almost no tolerance when I take some again. I've simply been taking the therapeutic dose. Most college students will take a whole pill all at once, usually 20-30mg. But then they just simply are wired like nothing else. But give that same individual 5mg and ask them to go study and see how they do. They do far better. The person who took more might try to go through things faster, but by doing so there are going to be a lot of unconscious mistakes that even upon reading it later may not appear.

But when I take my 5mg, its just enough. I fall asleep at night perfectly for the first time in a long time. I sleep great now. I used to not at all. But now I can go to bed for 7-8 hours then wake up and be perfectly alert and ready without the adderall. And if I so choose I may take 5mg that day or not.

I'd say I go through about 80-100mg in a month total myself.

 

[forensic bob]

Yea, my tolerance is extremely low. And if I go a few weeks without taking any it feels like I have almost no tolerance when I take some again. I've simply been taking the therapeutic dose. Most college students will take a whole pill all at once, usually 20-30mg. But then they just simply are wired like nothing else. But give that same individual 5mg and ask them to go study and see how they do. They do far better. The person who took more might try to go through things faster, but by doing so there are going to be a lot of unconscious mistakes that even upon reading it later may not appear.

But when I take my 5mg, its just enough. I fall asleep at night perfectly for the first time in a long time. I sleep great now. I used to not at all. But now I can go to bed for 7-8 hours then wake up and be perfectly alert and ready without the adderall. And if I so choose I may take 5mg that day or not.

I'd say I go through about 80-100mg in a month total myself.

Damn, I wish i could survive on the low doses that content you.

WOuld you say you grew out of your adhd and just have the meds as a pick-me-up, or did your adhd just transform into ADD and your left an unmotivated wreck?

ADHD/ADD is a vary vague diognosis, its more of a personality type than a disease. Granted, some people have neurological ADHD, which takes the form of an extremely hyperactive child who turns into an unmotivated ADD adult (these seem to be the ones with frontal lobe dysfunction);however, most of the people Ive seen diagnosed with "ADD" are lazy, unintelligent (not meant to be derogatory), or in search of a fix.

Regardless, ive been doing experimentation and I found two sure fire ways to increase mainly the duration but also the potency of my meds. I know these are facts because the pharmacists at the drug store verified my claims:

1)Taking the medication with chemicals that make your stamach and bladder's ph alkaline (magnesium is amazing). This will result in the drug being absorbed faster, excreted slower, and reabsorbed quicker from your bladder into your bloodstream.

2) Resist the urge to piss during the first few hours after you take it...much of the ampphetamine is passed unmetabolized into the badder awaiting for you to excrete it (piss). If you dont piss, however, it will be reabsorbed into your blood stream and will continue to increase the d-amph blood plasma levels that so wonderfuly affect your brain. I find that doing this alows me to taper down from the drug, whereas filling the toilet to the rim results in an almost instantanious crash soon after.

Repeating this over the course of your life might not be such a good idea for longterm bladder health, but being ADD I honestly dont give a fuck. Now, the immediate future, is the only thing that matters
...so its pretty G routine to follow

Hopefully we'll rise to fame at the same time and blow the minds of countless generations to come with our research and achievements. Its our job not only to generate new ideas, but also to take what we know and inform the masses via internet, methe Biochemical Psychologist (or whatever i decide to be) and the neurologist.

sincerely,
forensic bob

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I've been ADHD since the day I was born and can verify this statement. Back when I was in grammer school-before the onset of my drug abuse-video games were my fix. Upon first recieving a gameboy and Pokemon:blue at age ten, I was instanly hooked. I was staying up all night playing the device, slept and daydreamed about pokemin throughtout the schoolday, and repeated the process when I got home. Before long, I began stealing money from my mother's purse at night and hitching rides with her to walmart to feed this virtual addiction.

Later in life, when i came of age, video games were replaced with (insert drugs here). Both the video games and the drugs were merely an easy escape that required absolutely no effort to get a hold of. Easily gotten, consistently effective, and pleasurable to those dopamine receptors I apprently don't have enough of, addiction was imminent since the day i was born.

I see, forensic bob!

Do you have any more opinions on this? Do you think that it's a means to preoccupy the part of your mind that is "bored" or "desensitized"? Is it something to keep the person happy/distracted from the shortcomings/problems of being ADHD? Or, is it a means to stabilize being emotionally volatile? A little of each?

I'm not 100% sure on why this is a common phenomenon but I am certainly interested in it!

Feel free to tell me what you think about these ideas, if they do or do not apply to you, and why. I can understand if I'm far off with some of my guesses, I don't like to be over-assertive with assumptions.

2) Resist the urge to piss during the first few hours after you take it...much of the ampphetamine is passed unmetabolized into the badder awaiting for you to excrete it (piss). If you dont piss, however, it will be reabsorbed into your blood stream and will continue to increase the d-amph blood plasma levels that so wonderfuly affect your brain. I find that doing this alows me to taper down from the drug, whereas filling the toilet to the rim results in an almost instantanious crash soon after.

Rofl!!!

I take 10mg once in a day and I'm set, I don't modulate my stomach's pH, nor do I hold in my urine.

If I did, it would likely last too long and I'd have to take something to fall asleep at night!

I'm really sensitive to amphetamine's effects, I also theorize I am sensitive to most drug's effects.

Great tips though for those of us who have problems sticking to our daily prescribed dose! Thanks for your contributions bob!

 

[forensic bob]

I see, forensic bob!

Do you have any more opinions on this? Do you think that it's a means to preoccupy the part of your mind that is "bored" or "desensitized"? Is it something to keep the person happy/distracted from the shortcomings/problems of being ADHD? Or, is it a means to stabilize being emotionally volatile? A little of each?

I'm not 100% sure on why this is a common phenomenon but I am certainly interested in it!

Feel free to tell me what you think about these ideas, if they do or do not apply to you, and why. I can understand if I'm far off with some of my guesses, I don't like to be over-assertive with assumptions.



Rofl!!!

I take 10mg once in a day and I'm set, I don't modulate my stomach's pH, nor do I hold in my urine.

If I did, it would likely last too long and I'd have to take something to fall asleep at night!

I'm really sensitive to amphetamine's effects, I also theorize I am sensitive to most drug's effects.

Great tips though for those of us who have problems sticking to our daily prescribed dose! Thanks for your contributions bob!

Well, in the past, I abused video games because of the effects it had on my brain. I believe the extreme subjective pleasure I felt was directly related to the dopamine imbalances in my brain.
Playing video games-imo-is sort of like playing a slot machine. When the little character on the screen does something good, I was awarded with bells, whistles, and complimentary congratulations. A Child, especially one with the heightened imagination common in those with ADHD, will react to the machine's positive reinforcement as if it was given by a real person.

How does this affect the development of a Child?

Well, if the child plays video games in excess, his brain will become accustomed to receiving dopamine induced pleasure from activities that require no effort at all and will adjust its chemical balance in response to the unnatural bursts of dopamine (just as it reacts to the consumption of drugs).

ADHD children-based on my experience-have a stronger dopamine response to irrelevant stimuli than normal children. For example, I would find the most profound pleasure in exploration and watching bugs, stars, and other interesting objects. Therefore, when ADHD children are introduced to video games, the extraordinarily high dopamine releases that come from playing it would lead them to become "addicted."

While addicted, they receive a constant surge of dopamine induced pleasure, pleasure that the brains responds to via a down-regulation of dopamine receptors. For these children, whose brains are developing permanent habits and equilibriums that will serve them for the rest of their lives, this down regulation becomes permanent. This is my theory as to why so many ADHD children, many of which play video games, develop ADD at the end of their youth.

ps- Im not trying to sound cocky, but do ya'll keep a permanent record of who said what when in case ideas such as these have never been written or published. It would be sad if I actually did say something novel and revolutionary, and it was stolen from me by blue light. I want to share my thoughts with the world, but Im scared that someone who has the means to publish their findings would read them and take them as there own.

 

[DarkCode]

Well, in the past, I abused video games because of the effects it had on my brain. I believe the extreme subjective pleasure I felt was directly related to the dopamine imbalances in my brain.
Playing video games-imo-is sort of like playing a slot machine. When the little character on the screen does something good, I was awarded with bells, whistles, and complimentary congratulations. A Child, especially one with the heightened imagination common in those with ADHD, will react to the machine's positive reinforcement as if it was given by a real person.

How does this affect the development of a Child?

Well, if the child plays video games in excess, his brain will become accustomed to receiving dopamine induced pleasure from activities that require no effort at all and will adjust its chemical balance in response to the unnatural bursts of dopamine (just as it reacts to the consumption of drugs).

ADHD children-based on my experience-have a stronger dopamine response to irrelevant stimuli than normal children. For example, I would find the most profound pleasure in exploration and watching bugs, stars, and other interesting objects. Therefore, when ADHD children are introduced to video games, the extraordinarily high dopamine releases that come from playing it would lead them to become "addicted."

While addicted, they receive a constant surge of dopamine induced pleasure, pleasure that the brains responds to via a down-regulation of dopamine receptors. For these children, whose brains are developing permanent habits and equilibriums that will serve them for the rest of their lives, this down regulation becomes permanent. This is my theory as to why so many ADHD children, many of which play video games, develop ADD at the end of their youth.

ps- Im not trying to sound cocky, but do ya'll keep a permanent record of who said what when in case ideas such as these have never been written or published. It would be sad if I actually did say something novel and revolutionary, and it was stolen from me by blue light. I want to share my thoughts with the world, but Im scared that someone who has the means to publish their findings would read them and take them as there own.

Don't get ahead of yourself. Your not touching on anything profound.

 

[forensic bob]

Don't get ahead of yourself. Your not touching on anything profound.

lol, im not talking about this particular instance, I just plan on using blue light as a means of doing research, hearing other peoples experiences, and making my own conclusions, so that perhaps-after ive been active on blue light for a while-I can look back at everything Ive typed and and learned and maybe turn it into an essay or something. SOmeones got to do it, and Its a lot easier to theorize on a forum than on Microsoft word.

I know im ahead of myself, but im a man with a plan.

 

[unsettled]

ps- Im not trying to sound cocky, but do ya'll keep a permanent record of who said what when in case ideas such as these have never been written or published. It would be sad if I actually did say something novel and revolutionary, and it was stolen from me by blue light. I want to share my thoughts with the world, but Im scared that someone who has the means to publish their findings would read them and take them as there own.

As the late great Ray Charles once said "Leave your ego at the door". This is a harm reduction board, just go with the flow of the conversation, no one is going to try and steal your ideas and publish them. You can always publish your observations later and sign your name at the bottom of the paper and get credit for whatever discoveries you make. You'll have better ideas and be a more productive member of this forum if you "leave your ego at the door". The purpose of this forum is to help others, not to help launch careers and gain personal fame and glory.

Just my two cents.

 

[capochino]

I was diagnosed with ADHD at age 8, but my mom never let me get medication for it. It sucks ass. So, I started smoking weed and doing percocets at 14.
I guess you could also say I became addicted to video games and skateboarding. I hardly did anything else. My grades sucked ass even though I raped standardized tests and shit. I wouldn't do any work in class or at home because I would just do other shit.

 

[forensic bob]

I was diagnosed with ADHD at age 8, but my mom never let me get medication for it. It sucks ass. So, I started smoking weed and doing percocets at 14.
I guess you could also say I became addicted to video games and skateboarding. I hardly did anything else. My grades sucked ass even though I raped standardized tests and shit. I wouldn't do any work in class or at home because I would just do other shit.

I also raped standerdized tests and sucked ass in class.

How much video gaming did you do?

Also, seeing as you never take medication, how did your ADHD change as you got older? SInce most ADHD people are medicated, its hard to distinguish what was caused by adhd and what was caused by the meds.

 

[MMMMKAY?!]

Nice read. Your a smart one alright :D
Damn you make me wanna try some heroin (only major drug I have never tried) lol xD with this part made me wanna try it ( I was more than likely gonna try it anyway though)
How does it compare to opiates (because I have to say not very impressed with them) Of course I know its waaay better and way more of a rush but how does the high compare[

While I was using heroin, everything was interesting, and I could get motivated easily for 8 continuous hours. I'm glad I quit using heroin however, but this has left me without medication for ADD/ADHD, and now I need testing to get medication.





Oh shit your clean!?! wow Very nice you've been clean for a while too congrats Captain :]

 

[molly897]

drug abuse definitely inflamed my ADHD. i can remember experiencing the same things before drug use but it was bearable. the swaying, multi tasking, impulsiveness, lack of interest in normal things etc.

but i was addicted to coke because of the normalcy it gave me. it didn't tweak me out, didn't make me talk fast. i sat there and had a deep ass conversation every time and realized shit i was usually too mad sober to get over. i was just content with life on coke. i didn't realize it had this effect on me because i'm adhd though. and when i stopped doing coke, all those problems just got worse. and THEN i got diagnosed with ADHD.

 

[sam123]

I most certainly started using stimulants to self medicate ADHD/ADD. In 7th grade i was diagnosed severely ADD and took ritalin for one week. I hated the meds because they made me feel more tired so i stopped taking after a week.
When i turned 17 i started a 3 year IV coke and meth and crack bingeafter realizing i needed stimulants to feel okay. Now that im sober i take vyvanse and i function so much better its ridiculous.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Thanks for the input guys! Keep it coming!

 

[edarrin]

Man this is a long thread.

I will give my experience.

Don't realy know/think I was self medicating from ADD. However, after I got off (so far at least) my 8 year opiate addiction I found Ritalin really helped with the symptoms of PAWS.

It didn't take long to realize if you snorted it you get a mild coke(ish) sort of high. This led me into a ful blown coke binge that lasted 3 weeks with only a couple of days off. Lost tons of weight. Feel like shit.


I guess what I'm trying to say that if you have had a serious problem in the past be careful.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Man this is a long thread.

I will give my experience.

Don't realy know/think I was self medicating from ADD. However, after I got off (so far at least) my 8 year opiate addiction I found Ritalin really helped with the symptoms of PAWS.

It didn't take long to realize if you snorted it you get a mild coke(ish) sort of high. This led me into a ful blown coke binge that lasted 3 weeks with only a couple of days off. Lost tons of weight. Feel like shit.


I guess what I'm trying to say that if you have had a serious problem in the past be careful.

Exactly, it's all about knowing your personal boundaries and will power when it comes to using drugs. Some people can casually use heroin (or meth, cocaine, etc.), other's can't.

This is why I have pretty much given up using full agonist opiates, and I know better than to get addicted to heroin or full agonist opiates again. I would never put myself through that again.

 

[calmAnimal]

i got diagnosed as ADD in freshman or sophmore year of highschool. i had talked to a doctor a couple times,then had the brain scan. i hated being labeled as ADD and i took the medication for 2 days then refused it. it helped me tremendously for those 2 days but i was completely against drugs at that time ( very ironic considering i became a junkie).

i identify alot with the other posts. i loved video games as a kid, even though my parents never bought any for me. i obsessed over different strategies to win. i also obsessed over wierd things like trying to figure out how many objects i could fit into a certain area. i had very weird thoughts that were like a loop and i would always try to get out of the loop and it ususally just lead to another loop lol. some one said they have a hard time putting ideas and thoughts into words. i also struggle tremendously with this.

i was in a gifted and talented program in grammar school. i scored well on standardized tests. 99% for math and science,lower 90s for english and writing. i did well in school without ever "applying" myself. i was never pushed in high school everthing came naturally with out studying. i got a 750 on the math part of the SATs and a 650 on the reading part. 5 on the AP calc test. i had an acedemic scholarship to go to Univ of SC engineering program.

my drug use through high school was limited. i smoked weed and partied more and more towards then end but i played alot of poker throughout.

when i got to SC i had never devopled skills for studying, taking notes, doing homework, etc. so instead of going to class i sold and smoked hella weed, popped pills, and partied every night. it was awesome but and terrible. i was done there at the end of the year with a 1.14 gpa.

i used drugs more and more after i dropped out. they quieted my noisy thoughts and allowed me to socialize easier. i was able to "be myself" and not be so stuck in my own head over analyzing everthing i wanted to say and then never saying anything. coke would allow me to have deep convos w/ ppl. e would allow me to be open and giddy. alcohol was for when i wanted to be crazy and let loose. but opiates, god they were heaven sent in my eyes. just pure bliss. i had surgery and thats when i first started abusing them. i followed the natural progression to the T. vicodin->percoset->roxy->oxy-> sniffing dope-> shooting dope. i even started shooting speedballs cuz i could NEVER have enough. took me about 1.5years to start shooting from that surgery but only sniffed dope twice before i was begging for a needle( which had DISGUSTED me and i swore that i never would, i posted that i would never shoot in this very forum). anyways drugs "helped" for awhile then turned on me or i turned on them. but whatever i grew from it. i now am trying to change my patterns and not medicate myself. ill let u know how that goes in a couple months lol

god this whole post seems like a ramble/ stream of conscience. i hope someone can understand me

 

[shadow_onion]

I'm starting this thread because of a phenomenon that I think would be important to address in this forum, especially in TDS.

I am pretty sure I have ADD and am getting tested for it. The fundamental idea behind it is that it is inherited and that you're born with it. Because of this, people with ADD/ADHD often have concurrent mental problems which may lead them to drug abuse.

My question to you: As someone with ADD/ADHD, did you begin drug abuse as a means to self medicate?

I am almost convinced I began using heroin to make my life more interesting, and in general to make everything more interesting. People with ADD/ADHD can only easily pay attention to things that interest them, a reason why my general education is boring/fairly uncompleted compared to my major studies which are mostly completed.

While I was using heroin, everything was interesting, and I could get motivated easily for 8 continuous hours. I'm glad I quit using heroin however, but this has left me without medication for ADD/ADHD, and now I need testing to get medication.

I am interested to hear why you may or may not think you all began using drugs (any of them, uppers, downers, psychedelics, or dissociatives) as a means to self medicate for ADD/ADHD symptoms. If not please go into detail about why you began using, if you would like.

If you don't have ADD/ADHD you can answer too if you know people in your life who have ADD/ADHD and who used drugs to self medicate before getting legitimate medication, or a diagnosis. You can also chime in if you don't have ADD/ADHD, but let's keep this positive. ADD/ADHD is a real disorder, it is not something that goes away easily without medication. There are alternatives other than medication, but most people (like myself) are unable to afford them.

I'll start. I began using heroin to cope with my poor self esteem and lack of social life. I also had the best school semester I have had to date while on heroin, this is easily explained by the fact while on heroin everything is interesting, I had 0% care about having low self esteem (heroin makes you feel like a god among men), and I had a lot of friends as people love heroin (this is not a reason to start using it - please don't - I am still recovering about one and a half years later ).

After a year of heroin use I realized I had to quit, and I've been clean for 16 and 3/4 months thus far.

I'm diagnosed ADD and agree that there's a correlation between the disorder and drug abuse. School was always kind of a bitch for me, and opiates sure as hell helped with that. Like you said, it just makes everything more interesting and makes you so much more motivated.

 

[bagochina]

I had a doctor tell me once that my ADHD was a cause for my drug abuse or was it the other way around, . She went on to script ungodly amounts of amphetamines to me after that. I personally didnt buy her 'theory' one bit but I wanted the speed. It just doesnt make sense to me, I have poly drug addiction that is caused by ADHD so here take some speed and we will see what happens.

Personally I think ADD/ADHD is way over prescribed, in extreme cases yeah medicate them but otherwise I dont think it is a good practice and makes LOTS of money. Sometimes I think ADHD can just be an easy scapegoat for someone to say, OHHH so that is what caused my drug use/abuse/etc. I dont buy it one bit.

peace.
seedless

 

[unsettled]

I just wanted to give a quick update since I last posted in this thread, I've officially been diagnosed with ADD since I last posted although I've long suspected it played some role.

I also had a few month episode where I did Heroin daily since I last posted in this thread, I think all or at least a good deal of my drug use has been my way of self medicating some kind of ADD disorder. I was already addicted to opiates before I tried H and I only smoked it but I think the whole act of scoring the drug as well as the drugs affect all satisfied some part of my ADD mind's need for constant stimulation.

I'm now trying to stick to my prescribed meds as prescribed which now includes Ritalin and Suboxone. It took a while to get an ADD diagnosis for me, my psychiatrist wanted to pursue every possible reason for why I do the things I do and why I am the way I am.

I'm starting to think of ADD as just a type of person, not so much a disorder, if life wasn't so fast paced and didn't require so much focus and multi tasking just to survive there'd be no need to classify ADD people as different or medicate them. It's just that for me I came to realize that I needed some chemical help to stay on top of all the things I need to do, also just the realization that your brain works in a certain way helps me adapt alot better too.

I'm fortunate that I get to do what I love for a living, I'm fortunate that for the most part it's not hard for me to focus because most of what I do is creative and naturally catches my interest. The thing is that even when you're a creative professional you still have to pay bills, do all your own scheduling... basically it's the more practical mundane details that get me in trouble because I ignore them because I just can't get myself to focus on little mundane details, it's literally very difficult for me to think ahead financially and I'm always running late and misplacing things etc etc... so even though I'm immersed in what I love I still find the meds help me be an overall more successful person.

All this stuff is still relatively new to me, I'm still in the process of realizing how my inability to concentrate on mundane details has negatively impacted every area of my life at different points in time. Now that I have a better idea of what is going on in my head I feel much more hopeful and empowered. Maybe in the future I won't need any drugs at all, I don't know, for now I'm just doing what seems to be working for me.

 

[molly897]

has anyone here taken a computer test with flashing letters to determine if you're ADD? I paid a therapist $250!!! months ago for an evaluation, and she gave me this test. she said if i didn't score near perfect for having ADD, she'd have asked me to come back for another evaluation. but instead she diagnosed me ADD right then and there.

basically i sat infront of a computer and was told to press the spacebar everytime a letter except X came up. it records everytime you miss a letter, or hit the spacebar too fast, or don't do anything at all etc to determine impulsiveness