A theory on why people with more intelligence are prone to depression............

[RuRu]

This was a thread posted by Drunken hobo in the social forum, which I responded to and my entries are below. I decided to move at least my entries over to this forum cuase I was just not getting any valid response to it. I would love to hear anyones input on the theories I have stated. I can say they are my own, but I will say that only becuase i have never come across anyone else's theory that is even remotely similar in wording or ideas.
1st Post-----------

Why is it that the smarter you get the more prone to depression you are?

I would like to give my opinion on this topic and see who is familiar with this theory or agrees or disagrees with it.
People who tend to be smarter also tend to be more prone to depression. Why is this?? Well my theory is that to be happy in this world there are things you need to take for granted. ex: Time, Where you go when you die, and there are many more.
Well in order to take these things for granted you have to bridge some gaps where the questions get to complicated and there are now answers. Well smarter people are unable to bridge these gaps. their intelectual mind wants to dive into the gap and look for asnwers. Unfortunatly those answers are not there. That is the problem. People with less intelligence just bypass these mind fuck problems by bridging the gap. The mind of a smarter being tends to spend to much time in this abyss. Well when you dont have the answers to certain questions that trouble you, you get frustrated, to put it very simply. So, you have less intelligence up here riding across the bridge and you have the higher inteligence wallowing around in the muck way below the bridge. Who do you think is going to be happier.
When you wallow around in this muck long enough everything tends to become muck and depression starts to creep in. It is hard to fight the depression cause you have no answers for it. While the less intelligent people just avoid the whole mess in the first place.
Well that is my theory in an abridged version. I have pondered this many a nite and have spoke with a few that seem to be in the same boat as me, and they seem to agree with me and like the way my theory seems to sum up why smarter people tend to be depressed.
Input from you all is greatly appreciated.
Peace................Ru
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2nd Post-----------
Fluke Said:

sometimes you don't realize that you should be bridging that gap.
But the more ya think about not making hassles or "gaps" (thinking in the right direction), you can make things alot easier on yourself

Easy maybe, but better I have to disagree. Let me explain.
The reason its harder to bridge those gaps for more intelligent people is that they tend to be less excepting of the bridges. Were less intelligent people tend to be more receptive of the bridges hense a leap of faith so to speak. Faith not meaning religion but just faith as the term goes. What I mean is that, a less intelligent person is more apt to except the gap for what it is and not have the need or desire to indulge in it any farther. They just except it and make their leap and move on to the next one. Where as, smart people dont except the gap for the shear face value of it, they want to explore it and find the inner workings and the mysteries of the gap.
As far as being better off. I think that the gaps are what enlighten us and further are spiritual (for lack of a better word) intelectual growth. They stimiluate the mind of an intelect, where, they just complicate and confuse one of less intelect. So to say the we may be better off to bridge those gaps, I find that hard to believe cause some of the things that you do discover in the gap is mind boggling and tends to be experinces few get to have. I would rather have that and be depressed than to be walking around in an ignorant bliss.
Peace...............Ru
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This is the original thread-------
http://www.bluelight.ru/ubb/Forum18/HTML/005136.html?reload=16
Ok lets have it, time to pick your brains and see what we come up with.
Peace...................Ru

 

[RaveAngel]

I agree with you, for the most part. But I don't know if I'd necessarily use the term *smart people.* I think that people who fall more towards idealism are more prone to depression. But even that...well... I'm not sure if it works. You're right, it is the people who endlessly search for those answers. The people who don't accept things as they are. The people who refuse to conform. I find myself depressed almost all the time, and not just because *my life* sucks. I have endless tears for a society that is being raped of its humanity. A society in which it's almost always about WHO you know and not WHAT you know. A society that is, in general, clinically depressed. It pains me greatly to see that my generation is more full of ignorant idiots than any other sort of people. I supposse maybe that's because we really having nothing to fight for. Which causes a great deal of selfishness and disillusion. Children of an idle brain. I know too many kids who want to stay in college forever, because they have freedom from the authority of their parents... yet at the same time, they still have freedom from the responsibilities of the "real world." Well... I guess I kind of strayed from the topic. So I'll stop now. But yes, I think that, for the most part, you're right.
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*Shine on you crazy diamond.....*
*Sunni came home with a vengeance*
*Somwhere over the rainbow skies are blue, and dreams that you dare to dream really do come true.*

 

[SolarFlare6]

Well I think the simple answer is "Ignorance is bliss".

 

[RaveAngel]

Solar--- ya know, throughout my whole post I meant to say that... but by the end it slipped my mind! Glad you followed up on my thoughts

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*Shine on you crazy diamond.....*
*Sunni came home with a vengeance*
*Somwhere over the rainbow skies are blue, and dreams that you dare to dream really do come true.*

 

[RuRu]

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I think you two need to reread my post becuase I stated that myself. But the purpose of the post was that ignorant bliss is not exceptableto some. The simple road is sometimes just not an option, specially for a thinker.

 

[dj_nads]

the emphasis of society has been on rationalisation, ie / logic etc
just look at psychology, philosophy, judicial system, even religion was forced to rationalise in order to survive
we spend our lives debating simple words, stupid concepts of good and bad, right wrong,
i say theyre stupid because through the same process of rationalisation we can easily disprove the existance of these as they are a system of contradicting contradictions
hahahaha
thus the majority who are "intelligent" are those who respond better to those type stimulus, logical arithmetic etc
for the rest, who proly use more of their emotional brain compared to those who intellectualise the vast majority of thier day-to-day perception, they dont get depressed because there isnt a large discrepancy between neurotransmitters that are used for logical connections than of emotional connections, cause in general they have better "people skills" ie/ better empathy because they can mimic similar emotional responses from an early age whereas in general the "smarter" dont,
as someone who was depressed, who has a fuckin high IQ, and im not particularly pleased bout that , i know for much of my life id rather be the "dumber" stupid fuck who runs round havin fun all the time
however now im pretty damn satisfied now, sustainable lifestyle, relationships, an evolving framework of perception, very optimistic re-evaluation,
compared to my bro, who has same iq as me, and is 135 kg , is psychotic, depressed has the extreme of social phobia which is called avoidant personality disorder, and has severe head injuries, fluctuating suicidal
behaviour, much addict
all that cause of a need to intellectualise and to try and impose order upon a constantly changing reality

 

[*SWeeT-e*]

What was it Sartre called it...the 'agony'? (Damn drugs...I can't even remember last year's philosophy class.

) Once you realize that there really is no purpose to your life and there is no one there to give you answers, you are forever tortured with that knowledge. Remember the Matrix? "How many times have you said to yourself, WHY didn't I take the blue pill?" (Or was it the red pill...again I can't remember...goddammit.) Burdened by knowledge of the truth vs. a blissful ignorance...is that the choice?
I see what you're saying. But I disagree that those two options are our only ones. If you possess intelligence and spend your life searching for answers, I agree that you may be more prone to depression when you find that in fact you cannot find what you are looking for. But not necessarily. It all depends on what you do with the knowledge that you gain...do you accept it and find your own peace about it...or sink into despair instead? It's your choice. It's all in how you view life. Can you hold onto your innocence and idealism when confronted by reality, or will you sink into the hole of pessimism and become a jaded cynic? It's up to you.
Anyone can be an idealist who has never experienced life. That's why ignorance is bliss. Or is it? Can you really experience true happiness if you have never experienced the depths of its opposite? You may be content, because you don't know any better. But it's like going to the fair and spending your whole day on the merry-go-round, spinning aimlessly in circles, never having too much fun, but always being 'safe'. Versus riding the rollercoaster and experiencing everything from sheer terror to that rush of exhilaration. You don't get the high peaks without the low valleys. And I would argue, you can't experience *true* happiness without knowledge.
The 'smartest' person, in my mind, is the one who has seen everything there is to see in life, the good along with the bad, and remains beautiful at heart. Scarred outwardly perhaps, but inwardly untainted by the ugliness in the world. Who has been faced with the decision of allowing oneself to become numb from the pain of the world, and knowing that this would be so much easier, yet choosing the harder path, not closing off one's heart and still letting oneself *feel*. Those are the people that I truly admire. That is the kind of person I want to be.
I dunno if I answered your question Ruru...but thanks for letting me ramble.

~kimmy.
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~*~I hope you take a piece of me with you...~*~
[This message has been edited by *SWeeT-e* (edited 25 November 2000).]

 

[RuRu]

DJ_nads and SWeet-e great posts, I am glad to finally get some knowledgable banter about this topic.
A couple of points made......The difference between the two fellows with the same IQ that DJ brought up. The first is excepting of what is created before him, and the latter is contesting what is created there. Yes the latter mihgt be more prone to depression, BUT he might also be allowed to experince a sheer happiness that the first could never fathom. But the first has figured that a smaller less greater happiness is better than none at all. That is why I agree with the statement that smarter people are more prone to depression. They are willing to forgo the chance for happiness in search of a truer happiness, they might fail, but in their eyes its worth it. One with less intelligence has decided its not worth it. Once again Ignorance is bliss, but is that an exceptable bliss. For me NO, for most yes. I for one seem to think there is more there and am willing to suffer the consequences of trying to find it.
SWeete said...........

But it's like going to the fair and spending your whole day on the merry-go-round, spinning aimlessly in circles, never having too much fun, but always being 'safe'. Versus riding the rollercoaster and experiencing everything from sheer terror to that rush of exhilaration. You don't get the high peaks without the low valleys. And I would argue, you can't experience *true* happiness without knowledge.

I agree true happiness comes with knowledge, but the masses decide it easier to just have happiness, than it is to explore and to find a greater happiness through knowledge, hence the term "Ignorance is Bliss" It may not be the best way to go, but its one that gives me a sure shot for being happy. When you shoot for happiness you will undoubtably have unhappiness (Yin Yang theory)......when you decide to shoot for greater happiness than what is presented to you, you will undoubtably suffer greater unhappiness along the way. Have to keep it all in balance.
Keep the intelectual juices flowwing, I am loving this

Peace.......Ru

 

[bc]

i actually just wrote a paper on a similar subject. ignorance may be bliss...but is it "good" (in the ancient Greek philosophical idea of goodness). i think ignorance may be bliss...but ignorance does not lead to any form of goodness. ignorance is merely the inability to differentiate between right and wrong, good and bad, the high road and the low road. if you want to understand my position, read Plato's parable of the cave, found in "The Republic". i consider myself intelligent, and i am more than slightly susceptible to depression. why? because some people are less prone to accept things for face value, to accept the given as an undeniable truth. and others, they must question all that is put before them, cannot accept what they see as what "is".
i dunno if i'd classify this as "more intelligent"... but i definitely fall into this category.
bc
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bc-
**Proud to be an Official member of the Stuck-Up/8-Up Crew**
"Fuck PLUR! it's all about hardcore ass fucking!!"
We'll make great pets...

 

[*Twitch*]

It is a function of intelligence to question your existence and your relationship with the universe. The depression caused by questioning the nature of reality has only been realized recently, since nowadays with the plethora of alternative realites available; in the form of tv, cinema, computers, drugs, etc; the intelligencia should look further than Descarte's simple "Cogito Ergo Sum" and delve deeper into their own existence and the nature of the "true reality".
You said in your post that the "bottomless pit" that personifies the questions we have about the universe had no answers. I'm in disagreement with you there. The great mass of lucky plebians out there can choose to believe in the common answers to the big questions: answers like religion. But we few have to find our own answers, and carefully thought out, logical ones at that.
So most of this depression doesn't come from not finding answers, it comes from not finding answers that really suit them; answers in which they can have "faith".
If Descartes had lived in our time, he, perhaps, would have changed his philosophy to, "I think, therefore, I am something, I've no idea what, though."
Of course, if you explore religion, you also offer up new questions. My fave is, "Is this all?" :> A multitude of religions teach of other planes of existence, but lack of knowledge leads logical thinkers to question the nature of these also!
Myself, I've found logical reasonable answers to my questions, they may not be enough for me to become a philosophical evangelist, but they're enough to overcome the depression.
Joe
.....has left the building.

 

[RuRu]

Twitch........

Myself, I've found logical reasonable answers to my questions

I am intrigued to hear some of these answers as well as the questions that spawned them. Either here or through email send them to me. very interested to see what you came up with and where they go.

 

[LiQwidVibeZ]

Very true SolarFlare. If your a well traveled and educated person you know and have seen first hand all the suffering that goes on in this world. Innocent kids are raped and killed everyday. Basically lifes not fair ...its such a simple concept but for some can be hard to accept. Sometimes you have to just live in the now, not in the past or present, and make the best of what you have. If your ignorant to the struggle and bs some people go through in thier day-to-day life its so much easier to be happy. This reminds me of the simple carefree happiness kids have and the kind of emotions I wish I could have once again. However, to go back to that state of mind I would lose all the experience and wisdom that Ive learned over the years and be a fool again. Sometimes I just wish I didnt care so much about people and happiness would be easier to obtain.
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The scene is what you make of it.

 

[NYTFLY]

I'd say, the more you think, you more prone to depression you are. The more you agonize over the details and try to rationalize things, the less answers you come up with, and the harder to try to rationalize, and it becomes a downward spiral. The problem lies not in the rationalization and logic process; this works remarkably well for things like school and work, and helps the thinkers achieve and perform. However, when trying to apply rationality to things like interpersonal relationships, love, friendship, and most importantly feelings, one finds that it is all inherently irrational and illogical. The key is learning to let go of the minut and realize that these things are inherently not solvable through mind but through heart. Feelings are not rational; but you have them and you must deal with them. Trust your instincts; do what feels right. It most likely is in these kinds of matters.
[This message has been edited by NYTFLY (edited 28 November 2000).]

 

[G-boi]

Men cause most of their suffering needlessly... The more intelligent you are the more you are likely to believe that you deserve to be punished.
"use every man after his desert, and who should escape whipping?" Hamlet Act 2 Scene 2

 

[STPwLSD]

I've always thought it was the more 'artistic' people that tend to be the most depressed,... and I felt like I'd had an epiphany when I realized artists are tortured souls. I think that is what some depression is all about, at least the depression you can give a cause to (not the type that is just plain chemical). I get depressed at times just because I can't express the thoughts and feelings inside of me. Ask an artist why they are depressed, most of the time they will say "I don't know", when I believe they ususally just can't express it. Of course it could all just be chemical and there is no true explanation,... maybe only the intelligent ones realize they are depressed,... and possibly want answers or solutions, thereby applying or supporting your "gaps bridging" theory,...
Aww, hell, I don't know.

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The Stars up above, who Play with Laughing Sam's Dice....

 

[bc]

STP....most people who are considered artistic, or to be relatively talented in the arts, are generally thought to be quite smart as well...
bc
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bc-
**Proud to be an Official member of the Stuck-Up/8-Up Crew**
"Fuck PLUR! it's all about hardcore ass fucking!!"
We'll make great pets...

 

[firstrays]

Yeah, most artistic people are highly intelligent, but don't you think they tend to concentrate on one or the other? You don't see too many astrophysicists painting a masterpiece do you? Or you don't see a god-like musicial genius discovering a Nobel Prize level medical breakthrough, or am I just missing something? I know personally I would MUCH rather concentrate on my musical or my drawing/painting skills than taking a masters level mathematics course. But maybe that's just me,... or maybe I'm just not that intelligent...
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Comin' from the land of the New Rising Sun

 

[jilljamie_99]

i agree that intelligence can lead to depression but i think its all perception. its how we perceive the world around us that can lead to true happiness. someone said that the intelligent are searching for a higher level of happiness that cant be understood by people of less intelligence. i think that is a bit egotistical when intelligence varies in so many ways. maybe the ultimate happiness isnt so complicated. sometimes i think people who are what society perceives as intelligent live too much in their own world that they cant see the world as it truly is. maybe what seems basic to the "intelligent" person is really true happiness: finding love, first holding your child, friendship, beauty, laughter. its too bad that the more intelligent seem to shy away from psychology for fear of the unanswerable because i think they would have a lot to contribute

jill

 

[RuRu]

sometimes i think people who are what society perceives as intelligent live too much in their own world that they cant see the world as it truly is. maybe what seems basic to the "intelligent" person is really true happiness: finding love, first holding your child, friendship, beauty, laughter.

I have to disagree with this in some ways. What the world truly is??? I am getting at the point that intelligent people dont accept this. The world is not trully how it is percieved by most. there is more there and most choose not to find it becuase it tends to just open up more questions. Whereas the more intelligent seem to be prone to look for this. ever hear someone say they just cant stop there mind from thinking. If they could shut it off for a time things would be much easier. yea alot of us say this, But most can shut it off for a period, however short that period is. imagin this, that you could not shut it off period, wheether you wanted to think or not, it was always there and and your consious was always aware of it and trying to analyse (sp) all the data. That is very tough specially when you get the data in such a disoriented way, that nothing matches up right a way, its all kind of a mess. And until it matches up you are in the never never land where things dont make sense.
you also stated true happiness and what you thought it was. Whos to say there is not more and things even greater than this for true happiness. I understand what you are saying and I too beleive those things are centers for happiness. But again, whos to say there is not anything deeper. yea you can say well I cant imagine anything deeper. And that is tru you cant imagine it, still does not mean its not out there!?!?!
Just my HO about it all.............

Peace...............Ru
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"""Virtual JAY"""
What the HELL are you talking about.......Pissing on wippits is fun
I can't go to work STONED!
I am just T........Rashed!!!!!!!!

 

[jilljamie_99]

i guess you can search for a deeper meaning in everything. that deeper meaning may or may not exist but the intellectual continues to look for those answers when the *average* is able to accept what they are seeing at face value. so i guess the intellectual will keep searching for answers hoping it will lead them to a greater understanding. maybe if the *intellectual* learns that life is not something that can be figured out logically but accepts the choatic variables they will find some sort of peace. as for not being able to shut off thinking i think that can lead to insanity as it does for many highly intelligent individuals. have you seen the move pie (3.14, cant find the damn symbol on my keyboard

) he believes that life can be broken down into mathematical numbers which can eventually be broken down to a single core number (3.14). in his search for answers he slowly goes insane...if you havent seen it go rent it!! it exemplifies your ideas about the *super intellect* not being able to turn off their mind, being bombarded by outside stimuli and interpreting it in their mind with no end. i do believe however that there are plenty of *super intelligent* people out there able to be "happy" and "survive" without losing their mind in the process. maybe if they could find a way to channel those thoughts every once in a while into something that will eventually lead them to a definitive answer it would help. im not saying to stop trying to figure out the universe but take a break and enjoy life for its beauty and wonder...we do not and will never have all the answers.
jill
ps. let me know if you see the movie cause id like to hear your thoughts on the end of the film. you'll love it!