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3-pseudotropyl 4-fluorobenzoate freebase?

I was under the impression that the local anesthetic action of cocaine was thought to be tied to the proximity of the benzoyl ester to the amine of the tropane, and that this was bolstered by the fact that carbomethoxy phenyl tropane cocaine analogs (i.e., excision of the ester off the benzene ring) lacked local anesthetic activity. I was also under the impression that tropacocaine, the desfluorinated version of the compound we are speaking of, has been used in dentistry as a local anesthetic. As a result, I am very surprised at F&B's statement that the fluorinated compound lacked local anesthetic activity, as the only conclusion I get from this is that the para-fluoro group nullifies its Ca2+ channel blocking activity. Is there something wrong with my reasoning? Fortunately monofluorinated aromatic compounds are a bitch to synth in your kitchen, or else we'd have another epidemic.
 
hussness said:
I was under the impression that the local anesthetic action of cocaine was thought to be tied to the proximity of the benzoyl ester to the amine of the tropane, and that this was bolstered by the fact that carbomethoxy phenyl tropane cocaine analogs (i.e., excision of the ester off the benzene ring) lacked local anesthetic activity. I was also under the impression that tropacocaine, the desfluorinated version of the compound we are speaking of, has been used in dentistry as a local anesthetic. As a result, I am very surprised at F&B's statement that the fluorinated compound lacked local anesthetic activity, as the only conclusion I get from this is that the para-fluoro group nullifies its Ca2+ channel blocking activity. Is there something wrong with my reasoning? Fortunately monofluorinated aromatic compounds are a bitch to synth in your kitchen, or else we'd have another epidemic.
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tropacocaine has been used as a local anaesthetic. the data as regards the local anaesthetic action of the parafluoro is confusing, it has been reported that snorting it does not numb the nose.
 
@Jam- I still haven't done proper trials, i'm going to see if i can fit it in tonight, i'll report back my findings.
 
Another one bites the dust.

Concerning hussness' comments, he has done most of the explaining already, and based on what he says, I am in 100% agreement that *if* p-F-tropacocaine lacks local anesthetic activity, then this goes against the grain of what might be expected upon the basis of known SAR information.

Now, im not disagreeing that it doesnt have local anesthetic activity... things arent always like they seem (strawberry's & cream). The only way that this can be conclusively verified is by getting ones hands dirty and actually testing the stuff.

Also, it seems weird with people knocking the testing of various compounds based on the freak accident that occured when MPPP was made by a graduate chemist all those years ago. People are trying p-F-tropacocaine and the only evidence of its activity comes from Chinese whispers, ive not seen anything in the form of journal references to back up the claim that its 0.4 x cocaine. It's not like MDPV then, since even that one had a patent to back it up.*

While it may not be a POTENT local anesthetic, one would imagine that if snorting the said compound, they would do so for it in its pure state, and not mix it with e.g. benzocaine like what that might theoretically be expected to occur if one had discernable amounts of WIN 35,428 at their disposal.

Thus, while it might not be expected to cause numbing of the mucous membranes (doesnt coke just numb the whole of the users face, like in the movie Blow?), you'd at least expect for it *not* to be painful based on the benzoylester linkage which is an intrinsic part of its chemical structure. based on the fact that street grade coke is not infrequently 50% active, pure p-F-tropacocaine would seem like it would not disappoint its user base in the same way as if you tried to flog, for example, dexedrine as cocaine.

Just throwing in my 2 cents.

*If pseudotropine dehydrates, what is the toxicity of 2-tropene going to be like? I know the obvious answer is that due to the fact that it is not going to cyclize in vivo to the N-methyl pyridine, then it will be perfectly fine.
 
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I'm pretty certain it has been mentioned in a few papers. That Otto Snow book covering it maybe rubbish, but he did at least give lots of reference.
 
Could any kind soul provide any information as to how one might acquire a salt (acetate perhaps?) from the freebase of this compound? I know this isn't really very advanced question - merely an informative link would do.
 
Perhaps I was not clear enough.

One has a certain amount of the freebase of this compound. One has no prior experience with changing bases into salts or vice versa. One has been told that this compound "doesn't like HCl" and wants to know which other acid to use instead, and the steps necessary to end up with a dried salt which can be insufflated.
 
People are trying p-F-tropacocaine and the only evidence of its activity comes from Chinese whispers, ive not seen anything in the form of journal references to back up the claim that its 0.4 x cocaine. It's not like MDPV then, since even that one had a patent to back it up.*
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The ref is somewhere in the series of monographs entitled 'The Alkaloids'; as to where in there, fuck knows as it was 20 years ago that I read that (so Geordie Whispers might be closer to the mark =D).

Oh and it's def not a local anaesthetic as I opted to put a little under my tongue which had been mixed with a small amount of tartaris acid - all I got was that bloody horrible alkaloidal taste (& an attack of 'Mr Hyde'-ness)

djfriendly - try the admixture with about 20-25% by weight of tartaric acid - this will form the tartrate salr on contact with moist mucous membranes (might sting a little due to lack of local anaesthesia, but you can't have everything!)
 
Ah, dawn breaks - make solution, evaporate. Or try the dry method suggested above.
 
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One thing that worries me here is that no one said anything about doses.

What is the avarage recreational dose of pharm. grade cocaine anyways? (too lazy to search :P).
 
What is the avarage recreational dose of pharm. grade cocaine anyways?
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Although some people seem happy with less, and others will always want more, around 50-80mg is probably considered average. However, with such a short half life, desire to redose usually comes quite quickly for those who enjoy the drug.
 
Does this compound require ecgonine or other restricted chems?

I.e even if it's legal - wouldn't it be illegal to make. (like some LSD analogues)
 
Reminisant B said:
Does this compound require ecgonine or other restricted chems?

I.e even if it's legal - wouldn't it be illegal to make. (like some LSD analogues)
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It would be very hard to argue it is not an analogue in countries like the US with analogue laws, after all it is essentially cocaine minus the methyl carboxylic bit.

it is synthesised very easily from tropine or tropinone or pseudotropine or tropidine.
 
I haven't got time to write it up now but i have done a trial with this compound (freebase) via the oral route now @ 50-60mg (tanita was away).

It took about 45minutes to come on although i had a full stomach, so that might have had something to do with it.

At the half hour point i thought nothing was going to happen but then a steadily building euphoria and enjoyment set in, the peak effects lasted for an hour maybe and then i started coming down. Overall the effects were mild(ish) and i would probably go for 75mg next time

The two things that made it feel VERY much like cocaine for me were:

1. cocaine sexual energy
2. the desire to redose

I could see this being quite fiendish for a lot of people so beware.

So far the HCL, citric and maleate salts have been unsuccessful in forimng in any great quantities (to keep things on topic)
 
Yo!

I thought about it but i figured if it just sat on and didn't dissolve into mu nasal membranes it would probably be the same rectally. I'm probably wrong so someone correct me if you feel the need.

I've had rectal cocaine before so not a problem with the act in itself.
 
See to be honest I'm not sure what is particularly making this freebase so difficult to manage (since I'm no chemist).

The rectum is very different from the nose in terms of absorption (it has several different mechanisms of doing so), it can absorb a lot of different things that the nose cannot.
 
Might just well give it a go then.

I don't know whats making it so hard to form as a salt either to be honest. Maybe someone hanging about ADD will have a good answer.
 
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