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16mg Suboxone per day 5 years to NOTHING! Terrified

TY- ItsAllF, I hope that you don't have too hard of a day. All-nighters are the worst sometimes. Yep I have my faithful candy crush game as my most productive thing that I'm able to do lately.
So I'm thinking that the max days that the substance would be excreted in urine-(I don't even know if any of it is "active" at that point)---is nine days. But then I was thinking-about the "half-life"-elimination, and if I go again by the max. known of about 75 hours, so that would mean that at 75 hours at least "half" of what was in my system is gone?

Don't let my ramblings tax you ItsAll! I hope that you have a chance for a nap or something!

Despite detoxing here, I have just had four of the best nights sleep that I've had in at least six months. I really think that stuff, (the suboxone)--had "turned"-on me if that is possible. Creepy-crazy insomnia where I will fall asleep exhausted and then wake-up thinking that it is six hours later but it has only been five minutes. (again, this was while I was taking the drug!).......I was chalking that up to the menopause that I've been going through, but it is entirely possible that the drug played a part.
 
I work for family, and they know where I'm at with recovery and all. So I can leave whenever I want..luckily. I'd be effed in the ay if I didn't have a job with a family that knew I'm just 8months sober.

Half-life means after 75hours, half of the substance is no longer playing a role in sensory function. This is just an example of the average half-life of Buprenorphine: http://www.bing.com/images/search?q...996D7B8CED4CD8FE7C5A18C2162B9&selectedIndex=4

I would definitely say that it was the Buprenorphine causing your insomnia. After getting clean, I couldn't get enough sleep. If you're able to sleep well now, I would go as far to say that your withdrawal will be very moderate for Buprenorphine, nothing compared to a full agonist opioid. The more sleep you get, the better off you'll be through this trial. Since you've already started, I wouldn't go back to Buprenorphine to fix withdrawal symptoms. I would rather go with a shorter acting opioid...if I were to THINK I needed to do so.
 
Great Link ItsALL! TY-----yeah, you know I'm thinking that if I were to take some suboxone, that would only put me back to where I was yesterday or the day before! And prolong the general misery.
That 1st chart is for a "single" 16mg dose but still, even the massive accumulation has to eeek-out at some point I hope.
Speaking-of family. Mine is aware of what is going-on but they do not understand how long it takes for w-drawl to set-in with this crap. (One retired from one of this countries best hospitals for detox/rehab and they still have zero clues) They are kind of hovering waiting for me to explode or something.
So I am afraid to make any moans or even loud sighs ha ha.
At least I know that they will insist that I get to the ER if I pass out or start looking real bad. Still no word from the doctor.
 
To find the amount of time for any drug to be pretty much eliminated out of ones system just take 5 or 6 times the half life of the drug in question, unless the dosage is unusually high this will give you a really good estimate..

100 mg of a half life ten hour drug..
100-50 10 h
50-25 20 h
25-12 30 h
12-6 40 h
6-3 50 h
3-1.5 60 h

300 mg half life 10h drug

300-150 10 h
150-75 20 h
75-40 30 h
40-20 40 h
20-10 50 h
10-5 60 h

kinda shows how 300mg of a specific drug is eliminated almost as fast as 100 mg of the same drug. and the nice chart that IAF provided is calculated to 185 or 5 times the average half life of BP or 37h.
 
Dr's office called. five day withdrawl plan being sent to pharm. Take one 8mg first day, to breaking one film into quarters for the last day. I said "Will this work?" they said it will prevent withdrawl symptoms.
I don't exactly trust this but I probably will pick it up. I am considering waiting until I begin actually vomiting, diarrhea, or passing-out before taking some. It still seems to me that this is only going to promote a build up of this garbage in my system and lead me right back to.......I don't even think I want to fool with the prescribed dose. if I do take some but probably what I will do is start with half a strip and see if I can only take it every three days or so? Just rambling here. I'm still worried and confused. And scared but at least this will buy me some time I guess.
 
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Stupidly--I assumed that half-life equaled about half the time it would take for it to be gone. Now I see from this program/chart it is saying about a month from now, if I don't take any more I will still have 1mg in my system? This really confuses me. Ugh.
 
waiting4 said:
I said "Will this work?" they said it will prevent withdrawl symptoms.
.
Click to expand...
prevent is likely to be strong a word.. but you can do this.. please look into the other medications that have been suggested.. not the opiat antagonists IMO though.. but the neurontin for sure.. I think you are taking a big step in setting yourself free.=D<3

You should start to begin to get better from the acute withdrawal ten to fourteen days after last dose.. here is something to consider and possibly explore with your doctor about

>Thread: Switching from Subutex to Morphine for faster withdrawal...bad idea?<
 
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Update. So I picked-up the 5 day detox supply, and some Imodium. Getting out of the house did make me feel much better. What was in the bag were 5 8mg strips. It said to take 1.5, 1,..... I seriously considered waiting, and then I decided that I really needed some relief and that I didn't get a chance to say, "good-bye", and that just one more would not make such a big difference in what could be a long process......

I dissolved one strip. It made a huge difference in my mood. My physical symptom besides nausea was what I think of as squirrels in my stomach-nothing life threatening, but that was pretty annoying. I got a few odd stares from family members when they noticed that I had more than a few words to say after being pretty unsociable for the past couple days.

Another idea that occurred to me is that maybe I should just go ahead and follow this 5-day detox almost exactly as prescribed. The dr. closed-out my case. That was the choice between waiting 'till Thursday to continue the maintenance or go for the 5-day detox plan which provided more immediate relief.

So, now I have a choice.
Do I go ahead and try this 5-day plan? I've actually never heard of it being done this quickly for someone on my amount and time of use.
Do I try it and keep trying to find another sub. doctor just in case?
Do I try to spread-out the 5 strips in what I would think is a more humane way? (just trying to figure-out my choices, and rhetorically asking but feel free to tell me what you would do or did).
I could visit my GP and get that 2nd opinion, even though they do not prescribe the drug but just to have a doctor who knows what's going on. I could bite the bullet and not touch the remaining four strips.
-or even spread them out to "a little"--every two days.
I have a little bit of time to decide. Remembering the weird withdrawal symptoms reminds me of learning that some addicts are even addicted to THAT! I tried to psych myself up on the drive to the pharmacy and it really did help to be occupied and out and about, and music was just on the verge of starting to sound better. I also think that I detected a slight improvement in vision. There was a police car following me on a few miles of the drive-which normally makes me nervous, but that was fine. It was all fine really except I definitely felt much better about a half hour after consuming the 8mg strip.
Ah-well. All of this thinking about the half-life etc. how long and how bad will it get and what should I be prepared for? I have a little break from that too.
 
Like I said, I jumped off of Buprenorphine(at least 16mg/day..some days I would do 56mg+...which is probably just cuz I like snorting drugs+Alprzolam (at least 4mg/day...at least. some days would be 20mg), after being on it for over 4years. I didn't have a horrible withdrawal process what so ever.

I can't say anything moral other than follow your doctors advice. Get a second opinion always about medication, especially if you're unsure of it. Being addicted to Buprenorphine sucks. You could of easily taken .5mg and would have been alright, but that would require a longer period of waiting for alleviating effects to come in. By our nature, we are not patient at all when it comes to the effects of taking drugs. If you want to be trapped in Buprenorphine maintenance then try to find another Buprenorphine doctor if you're not able to see you other one anymore. I don't know why a doctor would "close your case" because you needed medication. I haven't re-read your thread, so I don't know if you fucked up your last prescription or what the deal was, but Buprenorphine doctors are looked at extremely close by the DEA. So if you came in early for your prescription, he might have very well ended your treatment with that 5-day detox plan. Which will work if you follow the instructions.

I am 25, so I'm sure being half your age played a role in me not withdrawing from a jump of >16mg. Like you've already noticed though, occupying your mind makes a tremendous difference in the withdrawal process, so do what you can to help you stay active. If you're going to have to go back to an opioid, I'd honestly recommend a full agonist, outside of methadone.
 
Thanks itsall--The trouble was that I had an outstanding bill for one office visit, and then I did not have my full payment for the one that I went for so the doctor refused to see me.
I have not spoken to the dr at all and I was told that she has been out sick so I don't even know what's really going on with her.

The closing out of my case they said is the policy although that was never mentioned to me and I have had to sign agreements over the years and I never saw this. They actually did not have a "financial" discontinue in writing policy because they are publicly funded and i was under the impression that even though they require payment--they have a sign that they can not refuse to see anyone, so I thought that if I followed all of the written policies that I have signed, that i would be ok as a slow-payer.

That was the choice that I was given on Monday. Wait 'till thursday or 5-day detox and close out my case. Like 5-day detox is what is offered as withdrawl for people on the drug, who are not coming back. By Monday, I had cold-turkeyed for 4 days already, and I was sure that another 4 days like that would be bad. I have journaled all of it and I have been working on my report, but some people are telling me to just "forget" it although I have verbally ratted-out the nasty person who I spoke with on saturday and they know that I know that that wasn't right.

We had never spoken about going off the suboxone and I didn't even know about this 5 day detox policy that they have. I was a patient with this place before this dr arrived, and they have had a few suboxone dr.s before this one. Plus there was no office fee when I started, but a few years ago the fee started so I had to pay.

I'm on day 4 of this detox and not feeling bad at all but I took 8mg monday, next day 8mg, next day, about 6mg, and today about 4--depending how much med is in the strips when I cut them. Tomorrow I'm supposed to take 4mg again and then nothing. (but it looks like I'll have a tiny bit or one strip left)......so except for the 4 days with nothing, and the decrease, I still have a loong way to go as far as detoxoing.

If I actually get through this without being very sick, I will be very happy. Although I am concerned about paws/depression-and I'm being realistic that I could be feeling "bla" or worse than "Bla" for at least a month-If i could get through that I would still be very happy because I had been under the impression that IF/when I ever decided to wean-off...well I thought that it would take like 6 months or a year just to slowly lower the dose. And THEN have to deal with whatever withdrawal happened. So this could be a good thing.
 
Buprenorphine treatment is done by the doctor, but it's dose and continuation decisions are left mostly up to the patient. These are guidelines for doctors on Buprenorphine treatment. I live in Alabama, so suing a doctor for mal-practice is damn near impossible, and entirely impossible since I was opioid dependent. I still feel weird today, but I was also on an extremely insane amount of Alprazolam everyday along with the Buprenorphine. The feeling I have, especially after physical or mental activity, is very similar to how I feel after smoking cannabis all day, but hours after the real effects of cannabinoids are gone. Weird tingly buzz, that is neither overly pleasant nor uncomfortable at all.

The feelings I had while taking Suboxone were very similar to my withdrawal from Buprenorphine alone, not identical but close. I noticed a huge difference in myself when I switched to Buprenorphine, but I haven't noticed a difference since I've not had Buprenorphine or Alprazolam...other than that I can't sleep for 3-14hours and feel just as rested either way, but that I'm contributing to Alprazolam. I had really bad insomnia before I started taking Alprazolam.

I never got truly dope sick from Buprenorphine withdrawal. It is very stressful with some discomfort, but when I compare it to detoxing off of oxycodone, it's nothing. It's really not worth the hassle of being tied up in maintenance for a longer period of time than you already have been. Buprenorphine makes you pretty worthless while you're on maintenance.

Good luck, and I don't know if I can give you anything more.
 
So yesterday I really struggled (mentally)-it was a very "bla"-day. But yesterday was only day "2" I guess, since taking nothing at all. Took 4mg on Friday morning. about 4mg on Thursday, about 6mg Wed. Tuesday and Monday 8mg,(<---the "5-day detox") with that 4-day dry-spell preceding that.

So far, I have had no Restless leg, but I know that could still come. Again, TY to the person who mentioned that antihistamines could make that worse! I surely would have taken a Tylenol pm, (which has antihistamine). So really I am still in the "danger zone", (still waiting), but so far everything is fine!

I am not taking the Imodium unless I need it, and I only needed it last week on Monday before I started the 5-day. I only took two pills, (the recommended dose), because I didn't want to overdose on that.

The mental struggle was over taking what I have on hand-(some T3s and an oxy), and I still have one 8mg strip Suboxone left. Since I couldn't decide what I would take, I didn't use any, and it turns out that when I woke up, I feel "normal". Today could be a long day and this could be a long week but right now I feel like I could really do this!

ItsAll---so you jumped off of suboxone and a benzo? I'm pretty sure that a lot of people would have to be in a hospital for that? I was in the hospital for an operation in the 70s and my roomate was undergoing Benzo-withdrawal. She was in very bad shape. I've also seen the tremors that people get from that-(the withdrawl from xanax etc.) and it was enough to keep me away from that addiction i guess.

I think that sometime this week I will feel the full physical effects of any weird suboxone w-drawl. The "bla"/depressed feeling yesterday was really bad, but it was only one day. I had some minor physical symptoms, sneezing, watery-eyes, yawning, nothing serious yesterday, but it made me hopeful that something was happening. No cardiac symptoms at all (yet?). So, I guess that I'm still "waiting".
 
Update--spoke too soon and I knew that I was tempting fate, oh well. I was feeling great/normal, and then had some coffee and before I was even finished with 1 cup, cramps from hell.
Cramps, sweating and chills,severe nausea. -felt like full-blown w/drawl was setting in.
So I peeled off a quarter of the remaining suboxone strip, and while I was waiting for that to work-(it did), I soaked in a warm tub with a wet bath towel on top of my stomach.
As soon as I felt that I was able to keep it down, I took one immodium pill.
The coffee seemed to trigger the whole nasty episode.
Now I'm thinking that I may want to take the immodium as a precaution, before having any coffee in the morning for a few days. And finish the remaining suboxone in small pieces, as needed, or when feeling physically sick, spaced-out by as many days as possible. I'll try to ride it out with just the immodium, and use the suboxone only if sickness sets in. I only have 3/4th of an 8mg strip left, -that doesn't seem like "enough", but maybe that will work.
 
For me it was impossible to taper out subutex. Though I tried for nearly a year, I could not reach below 2mg (it was impossible), and only stable at 4mg - coming down from 24mg. I was totally worn out and gave up and shifted strategy. I smoked heroin for 2 weeks and went to a remote rented cabin with bensos, weed, vodka and some small quantaties of oxy (20mg/day)... Now I have been clean for 1.5 month. But the battle is still raging, though on much lower level.
I dunno if I dare to recommend this way of quitting... It was and is hard still.
 
The thing with staying at 2mg suboxone, and I did that for about two years, is that my body felt like it was in a constant state of withdrawal for some symptoms. That amount over a long period of time was hard on my heart, and my stomach was forever gurgling. -----I'm so happy to hear that you are now drug-free shredder. -I hope that I can get to where you are soon, and while I'm in that "bla/depressive"-state, I'm trying to work on mental issues about how to deal with cravings and paws in the future. Looking at the 13 page bl thread about case studies, helped to remind me that even suffering a little is worth preventing serious damage or death from abusing. And how fortunate I am compared to those who had some really bad stuff and death happen.
 
thanks, my friend. You know all those symptoms you listed. I have/have had them too. Still my heart races a couple of times every day, short breath, head aches, and lethargic and so on. At least my legs don't hurt anymore. It was terrible.

I cannot stop drinking my morning and afternoon coffé, but I drink now only two cups a day. Coffé is indeed not good, as you said it starts the heart and RL and so on.
Well I cannot recommend jumping from suboxone to H or oxy for a short while and kicking from there with the help of bensos, weed, sleepings pills, vodka. It's too dangerous. In fact, when it was at worst I took it all for two days. A very dangerous mix. But I then used for a while and later on kicked "the new drugs" one by one, it took 2-3 months - after the psycial detox in the cabin when I almost died.
This was actually more simple than taper out subutex. And much faster. But don't do this alone. But I hade to do it alone. I had no other choice. Now, for me. There is only one way. I cannot do this again, cannot return to using, and I have children, and an ill wife to care for.
I nutshell I went from opiates with long half time to shorter half time. Simply becuase it was too hard to kick subutex. It was a trap for me, even if it saved me at first once, nevertheless, it trapped me in the end... IMO opiates with shorter half life is easier to kick like oxy or even H
But it is possible to kick it. I did it my dangerous way. I was sooo afraid of the detox.

I hope you will find help and a way out. I do hope for you. :)
You seems to be a smart girl. I think you will find a way out. Surely.
 
Hey waiting. since those doctors thought it would be a good idea for you to detox maybe they should prescribe you meds to facilitate any easy withdrawal. please check into Neurontin as it may have a real positive effect on your comfort during the acutes. >here< >here< >here<. hang in there your doing great.. and if you only have a few of the oxides etc you may just want to get rid of them as they will only provide you with a brief respite from the withdraws but actually bring you back to the begging of this path your taking. Your doing great=D
 
update. i was released from the hospital last night after being there all week on the cardiac unit for severe low blood pressure, dehydraion, and wdrawl. will say more when i can. they spent about a mil on me and excellent care since i had complained and they saw where they had really screwqef up.
 
Thank-you to everyone who helped me out here while I was waiting for that to set-in. I'm still not 100%, but MUSIC SOUNDS GOOD TODAY and I am able to sit up long enough to get my headphones going. This has been really hard.
I would be dancing to this so hard if I could stand-up without falling down.
This is for you guys:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MW6E_TNgCsY
 
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