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1000X more powerfull!!! OMG!!

Sentience

Sentience

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Oct 15, 2009
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Have you ever read some nonsense like this in the papers? 100x more powerful? 1000x more powerful? Even 10x or 20x?

Generally what this actually means is that the dosage would be a few milligrams vs a few hundred mg. The effects for most practical purposes would be comparable. A drug that is active at 60mg is "more powerful' by weight than a drug which is active at 200mg...Does this make a whole lot of difference? Well, as far as methods of ingestion, or how easy it is to cary, but shouldnt drugs be judged by how a typical recreational dose affects somebody rather than the number of mg that it takes to make an active dose?

Most of us probably realize that when a drug is 10x stronger that means that less of it needs to be used....it doesnt mean we go out and take 10x as much to get a high that is 10x more powerful until we flip out and start attacking strangers for drug money. lol.

I think its important to counteract some of this ignorance with education. How many times more powerful is the pure alkaloids in Salvia compared to cocaine? Is Salvia 10x more harmful than cocaine? Hardly....though it is pretty weird, so maybe its a bad example...But going by this logic, Fentanyl should be 100x 'worse' than morphine or heroin. The most dangerous think about fent is that it depresses your breathing/heart rate a bit much if you overshoot a recreational dose even slightly, and its way harder to eyeball, but its hardly 50x more of a blight on society than heroin. That is just nonsense.

Do you think most people realize this, that its just a matter of threshold dosage being a different number of milligrams or do they really think that users are walking around 100x higher than they have ever been before?
 
I'm just hoping bromadol catches on so I can read the crazed "NEW ULTRA-DEATH DOOM DRUG IS TEN THOUSAND TIMES STRONGER THAN HEROIN AND IS COMING TO GET YOUR CHILDREN!" headlines.

Do you think most people realize this, that its just a matter of threshold dosage being a different number of milligrams or do they really think that users are walking around 100x higher than they have ever been before?
Click to expand...

Around 40% of America thinks that the Earth was created in seven days.
 
phrozen said:
I'm not sure where this should go.


---> Homeless
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Yeah, I wasnt either. Is 'Drugs in the media' only for posting articles? I was discussing how the media talks about drugs when they write articles, sensationalizing how potent some drugs are in misleading ways. Since it was talking about the media it seemed like the best fit at the time.

Maybe I should have included a media example of them talking about how some drug is 100x more potent and misleading people into thinking that people are walking around 100x more intoxicated because the drug is so strong.
 
The most common place to see this problem is when discussing opioids. This is also a subject that makes it easiest to explain the situation clearly.

Opioid users, due to our current prescription and prohibition laws, have to make due with what is on hand, or what comes around, often times because they have no other choice (croaker burned down, dealer arrested, etc). This leaves users constantly trying to get high or get well with unfamiliar opioids.

Enter equi-anaglesic conversion charts. Used by physicians to determine how much opioid medication to prescribe to a patient, or how much medication to dispense if a switch is needed or recommended, etc.

Ex.

http://www.globalrph.com/narcotic.htm

http://www.ohsu.edu/ahec/pain/part2sect3.pdf

Someone who uses 100mg Morphine IV a day comes across twenty 4mg Hydromorphone tablets, or ten 10mg Methadone tablets, or a vial of 50mg/ml Meperidine. They need to know how much is equal to their Morphine habit.

Drug users then start to look at these charts and, going by the lingo on several news reports and quasi-medical websites, see the designations of "10x more potent" or "100x stronger than". From here drug myths and trends are altered or started (see the history of the OxyContin phenom in the US).

When in fact, all it comes down to, is that xmg of one opioid produces roughly the same analgesic effect of xmg of another. Most use 10mg or 30mg of oral Morphine as the basis for any comparison (with Benzodiazepines the standard is 10mg of oral Diazepam).

All about the weight to effect ratio. Fentanyl and its relatives (Carfentanil or Ohmefentanyl) are not tens or hundreds or thousands or tens of thousands of times more fun than Morphine or Heroin, it just takes that much less, by weight, to perform the same amount of pain killing according to a few studies.

Outside of drugs that have direct physical effects (analgesia, anxiolysis, etc) it gets trickier to explain away the ridiculous, news reporter sensationalist 'x times stronger than LSD or cocaine etc' nonsense, but often times it simply means it takes less of chemical A to achieve an effect than chemical B.
 
Yep. Thats exactly what I was driving at.

If anyone offhand knows of an article that is specifically guilty of this, please share. I know I read one just recently.
 
Actually, president Nixon is guilty of this. During the Turkish Fascist-Junta government, Nixon got the Turks to give up growing poppy, in the false belief that most Heroin was being made from Turkish Opium (most was Indian). Anyway, there was a movement to breed high Thebaine poppies and grow them in the US, so we could destroy the Heroin flow by forcing our international Cold War allies (Turkey, India, etc) to tighten controls and destroy crops.

The reason he gave up this strategy was in the false belief that Thebaine-rich Opium would be diverted domestically and go to the production of the then newly discovered Bentley Compounds (super-potent synthetics, like Etorphine) would replace Diamorphine as the illicit opioid of choice. If this occured, Nixon and his clueless UNODC/BNDD/etc allies were under the impression that the addicts to Bentley compounds would be thousands of times worse than the junkies addicted to Diamorphine.

Heres the link to the whole story:

http://www.edwardjayepstein.com/agency/chap32.htm

Epstein's book Agency Of Fear, Chapter 32, 'The Coughing Crisis'.
 
yeah a good example of this is like how they say "Buprenorphine is 40 times stronger then morphine" . Now if you ask a opiate user which drug would make them feel better/higher between Bup and morphine they would most likely say morphine. same thing can be said for that alkaloid in Kratom, Mitragynine, they say its like 20 times more potent then morphine...
 
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