ADD/ADHD and Drug Abuse

[raybeez]

has anyone here taken a computer test with flashing letters to determine if you're ADD? I paid a therapist $250!!! months ago for an evaluation, and she gave me this test. she said if i didn't score near perfect for having ADD, she'd have asked me to come back for another evaluation. but instead she diagnosed me ADD right then and there.

basically i sat infront of a computer and was told to press the spacebar everytime a letter except X came up. it records everytime you miss a letter, or hit the spacebar too fast, or don't do anything at all etc to determine impulsiveness

Sounds bunk to me. Video games require a different level of cognitive functioning than focus/concentration requires in real life situations.

It's why kids with ADHD can spend hours sitting in front of a TV playing Xbox but can't sit in front of their homework for 10 minutes

 

[34-dihydroxyphen]

What they need to do is create an effective SDRI. I was just refused my Adderall because my doctor, who I first started seeing in order to get Suboxone and get off of opiates, thought I looked "off". Basically, he accused me of being high, even though I wasn't.

Pisses me off because I have never displayed drug seeking behavior with him. I just tried Strattera (by my own suggestion) and found it to be ineffective, then I come back saying that I want to get back on Adderall and he accuses me of relapsing even though as far as he knows I have been clean three years (some small relapses, now totally opiate free other than Subs for 6 months).

While my use of Adderall may fall into the abuse category (I sometimes go on 4 day binges if I want to complete a task I find important), I find it too unpleasant to ever get addicted to and am willing to try any other pharmaceutical to treat my (quite severe, totally demotivational) ADD.

Fuck this doctor, and fuck the permanent stigma all former drug addicts have to endure whenever they see a medical professional. Some of us do get clean after all.

Anyone know how to get what I need without falling into the "drug seeking behavior" category? I am going to bring in official documentation about my ADD next week when I see him, hopefully it works out. I cannot afford a drug test, I already pay too much for my doctor visits, and switching doctors would lead to the "consultation" appointment which would come out to about the same cost. I think I'm fucked if he decides to test me, it might jeopardize my Suboxone script as well.

 

[wtblife]

Well I started doing drugs mainly because it was a way to be more social and I was curious, can't judge something unless I try it...

I continue to use drugs because I feel like shit mentally and physically almost every day and they keep me occupied, but ADD does have a part in it. I'm constantly craving drugs I don't have because just like with almost everything else in my life, I need constant change. Most drugs are too dull for me and that just leads to reckless behavior and interest in things like datura.

I abused amphetamines because I never felt like I was able to reach my full capacity, I always felt and still do feel, inferior/sluggish. I've been a terrible student ever since elementary, and recently in college I've been having a really hard time. I'm constantly questioning whether I'll continue school and this is leading me to use drugs more in order to keep moving forward. I can't stand not being productive, but I also have a hard time actually doing it nowadays...

Before even touching drugs I was actually constantly accused of being on them by cops and school officials because I've got a lot of issues and sometimes I can't put in the effort to function normally or answer questions very well. One time went to the nurse's office because I had a really bad migraine and was feeling really shitty overall so I couldn't really tell her what was wrong and she brings in the principal and shines a light in my eyes and whatnot, thinking I'm on something.

 

[motiv311]

Yes captain heroin.
I was diagnosed with ADHD in the 7th grade... I would do ANYTHING to get attention , and I would pay NO attention to school. My parents had 4 other kids to worry about... and I sort of slipped threw the cracks.

fast-foward to high school. . I have a poor GPA , I;d just moved to a new area. And I felt fat. Bottles of adderall stacking up in my Medicine cabinet (because I would never take them)

I tried weed with a kid from my english class... loved it... alcohol , loved it too. So I tried taking the "medicine" I had always hated before and BOOM! loved it too. . .

I finally got friends, strait A's, a girlfriend, lost weight, improved self esteem. Before long, the adderall didn't cut it anymore. I started snorting meth... then doing opiates for the comedown... By the time I graduated, I had nearly lost everything I had gained those last two years of high school.

went away for college and got into heroin. . which was the ultimate bliss for me. (For some reason I think ADD kids tend to love opiates)

my girlfriend in college died of a drug OD... so I began the quitting process. .

I still take adderall and Klonopin... medicinally. But one day I plan to be totally sober

 

[molly897]

Sounds bunk to me. Video games require a different level of cognitive functioning than focus/concentration requires in real life situations.

It's why kids with ADHD can spend hours sitting in front of a TV playing Xbox but can't sit in front of their homework for 10 minutes

yup but i failed the test. which meant I had ADD supposedly. i wasn't able to pay attention at all, to the computer i mean. it's a respected method among physicians but says right on there *do not use solely for diagnosis* I felt ripped walking out... i knew right off the bat that doesn't mean i have ADHD

 

[molly897]

What they need to do is create an effective SDRI. I was just refused my Adderall because my doctor, who I first started seeing in order to get Suboxone and get off of opiates, thought I looked "off". Basically, he accused me of being high, even though I wasn't.

Pisses me off because I have never displayed drug seeking behavior with him. I just tried Strattera (by my own suggestion) and found it to be ineffective, then I come back saying that I want to get back on Adderall and he accuses me of relapsing even though as far as he knows I have been clean three years (some small relapses, now totally opiate free other than Subs for 6 months).

While my use of Adderall may fall into the abuse category (I sometimes go on 4 day binges if I want to complete a task I find important), I find it too unpleasant to ever get addicted to and am willing to try any other pharmaceutical to treat my (quite severe, totally demotivational) ADD.

Fuck this doctor, and fuck the permanent stigma all former drug addicts have to endure whenever they see a medical professional. Some of us do get clean after all.

Anyone know how to get what I need without falling into the "drug seeking behavior" category? I am going to bring in official documentation about my ADD next week when I see him, hopefully it works out. I cannot afford a drug test, I already pay too much for my doctor visits, and switching doctors would lead to the "consultation" appointment which would come out to about the same cost. I think I'm fucked if he decides to test me, it might jeopardize my Suboxone script as well.

my boyfriend and i use the same doctor, we both got adderall from him. i brought my documentation right away to him so i didn't have to go through that drug seeking bullshit either. this should benefit you.

he took me off it once and put me on an anti depressant, i thought he was accusing me right away of bullshitting. the med didn't do anything so i went back in 3 days and said "look, I don't know what further testuing you need but the adderall helped me and if not adderall I would love something that does exactly that"

and he let me try it again, for a month. came back a month with acid reflux disease (go figure), and surprisingly this dude i think just gives a shit about me. he lets me try what i think will work. i don't take advantage, but i do know what i'm taslking about precisely when i describe what i go through. i can explain why the medicine works better than the other, and why it doesn't.

if he isn't willing to work with you then tell him thank you i will take my problems elsewhere

sorry for double post

 

[zombiesarepeaceful]

In the BEGINNING, no. If I think back, I started out of curiosity and to calm the constant chain of random thought in my brain that tormented me (wasn't diagnosed as ADHD yet).

It helped, but what I started out with (dxm and pot) didn't really cut it for treating my adhd symptoms. I didn't get a taste of ritalin or amphetamines until I was diagnosed ADHD at age 17 (I'm 20 now) and I thought holy shit...this is what I should've been doing all along. I could think straight and feel normal for once. I had to quit seeing that shrink when I turned 18, so I was mindfucked for another 2 years until i found a doctor who actually agreed that adult adhd does exist. I'm now currently back on adderall...and have my shit together more than I did when I was unmedicated. Inbetween the years when I was first diagnosed and couldn't see a shrink, I did self medicate...I tried crack...and to be honest it did the most for my adhd, moreso than adderall, but obviously it doesn't last long enough to be sensible and is too expensive, and it's kinda obvious to be smokign up a crack pipe every half hour to stay calm. Luckily I only experimented with it when it was offered, and I recognized that it wasn't practical and never hungered for it..it was just nice to use when offered for free. From time to time when I can't afford my script or something or on a day where my hyperactivity is worse, I'll drink or do whatever's lying around just to calm down and get out of my head that never shuts the fuck up. So in a way, I still do self medicate.

 

[motiv311]

amen.... If im sober by age thirty ill be happy

 

[Depressicaa]

I was always anti-drug. Then weed came along and I thought it was like it was the best drug ever, I was always afraid of drugs and pills though, I was offered coke and refused it on being afraid of getting addicted. Adderall I must have though, I tried it once, and in a month I was seeking it out actively. Now that I know I haven't gotten addicted to anything besides that, I'm not so sure. I can call Adderall my Anti-drug, but its really just my DoC, as of this moment.

 

[Nytol]

What a great thread!

I am certain I am ADD, and have been since I was young probably, judging by many of the stories on here.

I am in the UK and it is not such a discussed issue, I looked up a while back that Adderal and Ritalin are approved meds, but is anyone from the UK and had experience in what our medical system is like for diagnosis and prescribing such things?

With street speed being dirt cheap and easily available surely they can not be too concerned with abuse???

It was mentioned somewhere, but I do think that ADD and Depression have a link in one way or the other.

We have too much to think about and process, for most of human existence, food, procreation and shelter were our only concerns.

Now consider how much shit we worry about on a daily basis, we catastrophise many things that are really not important.

I found it very interesting to read about the heroin helping the ADD too, first time I've read that.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

has anyone here taken a computer test with flashing letters to determine if you're ADD? I paid a therapist $250!!! months ago for an evaluation, and she gave me this test. she said if i didn't score near perfect for having ADD, she'd have asked me to come back for another evaluation. but instead she diagnosed me ADD right then and there.

basically i sat infront of a computer and was told to press the spacebar everytime a letter except X came up. it records everytime you miss a letter, or hit the spacebar too fast, or don't do anything at all etc to determine impulsiveness

When I was diagnosed, there was a similar computer test, but this was just one of many things I did, and this was the only computer-based part about it.

I hated the computer part actually because it was early in the morning and I wasn't feeling all that awake/alert in the first place, and I don't know, sitting still and only hitting the space bar.... it was just too little. I felt like if there was a lot more going on my attention would have been integrated better. Instead I'm thinking "when is it going to be over????" and it's at least 30 minutes of this... by the end of it I had restless leg syndrome.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

CH DON'T get on amp type stims. I'm no Doc but You seem like a smart cookie by your posts and not disorganised, I did in 2004 by a top psych who bought up ADD/HD, and gave me 20mg of MPD, 6 years now and 6x the dose later

He never told me this thou:

Methylphenidate produces d-amphetamine and cocaine-like reinforcing effects in both humans and non-human animals. Preclinical self-administration studies show that methylphenidate is self-administered by animals30 under a variety of conditions, including when substituted for cocaine or d-amphetamine in drug-experienced animals or when initiated in drug-naïve animals. Methylphenidate has reinforcing efficacy similar to cocaine and d-amphetamine. In non-human primates, methylphenidate can maintain high rates of self-injection in progressive ratio studies and is chosen over cocaine in preference studies. In clinical studies methylphenidate is self-administered by humans and produces patterns of reinforcing and subjective effects similar to d-amphetamine. Methylphenidate and d-amphetamine produces similar patterns of subjective effects, including increases in rating of euphoria, drug liking and activity and decreases in sedation.

I'm doing just fine on dextroamphetamine.

I think the problem is that too many people are over-diagnosed with ADD and ADHD, and not enough people are being told to try exercise and a correct diet BEFORE getting on stimulant based medications.

Then, they will continue a sedentary life style, while continuing to neglect a proper diet. This will only lead to bad things.

However, I actually am more hungry on the medication than off of it, as well as I tend to go to sleep for 6 to 8 periods of time *AND* wake up feeling refreshed while on the medication.

Before I had ever used stimulants, I either didn't sleep at all (insomnia) or would sleep in for an entire half or whole day at a time (hypersomnia).

I really do think there is some miraculous effect that a medicinal level of dextroamphetamine has on my mind. I also know that I cannot use the medication every day while also retaining its efficacy, so I do take breaks still.

I don't even normally use my entire daily prescribed dosage, which also helps keep things under control.

 

[NeighborhoodThreat]

However, I actually am more hungry on the medication than off of it, as well as I tend to go to sleep for 6 to 8 periods of time *AND* wake up feeling refreshed while on the medication.

Before I had ever used stimulants, I either didn't sleep at all (insomnia) or would sleep in for an entire half or whole day at a time (hypersomnia).

I really do think there is some miraculous effect that a medicinal level of dextroamphetamine has on my mind. I also know that I cannot use the medication every day while also retaining its efficacy, so I do take breaks still.

I don't even normally use my entire daily prescribed dosage, which also helps keep things under control.

I feel that dextroamphetamine is a miracle drug for people with ADHD, it has helped my girlfriend and a few other friends of mine who have ADHD lead regular lives and they are very grateful for it.

 

[theartofwar]

I gotta ask this here i dunno where else too - I have a friend w a real bad dexamp habit. I'm really in a tough spot with this kid and recently I haven't been able to handle my own - but this kid scares me with his use. I don't really fuck with amps. I dunno where to even start - does tapering work ? What's the best way for him to quit ?

 

[Ixchellian]

I've probably been dealing with ADD since.... um.... forever.

Epic 6-8hr Lego builds were a regular thing for me as a kid, yet you couldn't get me to sit down for a paragraph's worth of homework.
And still, I'd fly through textbooks and test far ahead of my classes, leaving exhasperated teachers in my wake wondering how I could not complete a single class assignment, yet ace all my exams.

Later on, working on vehicles & firearms took the place of Legos.... and because I tend to collect things that I can go all ADD on, I usually end up with a lot of both.

I've always wondered why when I took opiates, I'd get tweaked & be motivated to accomplish 2x more than what I'd do sober.... whereas my buddies would simply nod out. And when I started doing meth, I never got the fiend-demons & dope-fucked attitude that others got after just a relatively short while. Granted, I'd still be up for days.... but that's been a normal sober thing since I was a kid too.

 

[yougeekay]

im not gonna read anything hear but i was diganosed with ADHD in FOURTH grade (they tried giving me ritalin to a fourth grader!), 21 now, and I personally believe the disorders are not real, and really just discriminates against natural human behavior so that people who don't fall in line so easily can be turned into a basket case by giving them stimulants (adderal, ritalin)... sure it makes people work and do their homework but does it help them? no.

 

[halfoz]

recently diagnosed with ADHD-Inattentive Type. I'm almost 40. Started using drugs cause some chick liked getting high. My drug abuse skyrocketed in my 30's, but I definitely wasnt looking to self medicate.

one of the things about, say, meth is that insane hyper focus you get where you can get so fixated on something you forget to do anything. problem is, that for me that hyper focused was combined with an equal amount of distractability. so my drug use really magnified the problem: i worked like a dog, but got nothing really ever accomplished.

i eventually quite the meth and got on adderall, but while they're a lot harder to abuse- the high is so much more low than meth- they still caused problems.

what led me to drug use was not having a complete set of values growing up in an abusive home. anything that made me feel different i sought out, and kept seeking out more and more extremes until i got to meth, which ultimately brough me down.

i'm now talking to my doc about starting strattera, cause its apparently a non-stimulant.

if anything my ADHD has led me away from drug abuse.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

I gotta ask this here i dunno where else too - I have a friend w a real bad dexamp habit. I'm really in a tough spot with this kid and recently I haven't been able to handle my own - but this kid scares me with his use. I don't really fuck with amps. I dunno where to even start - does tapering work ? What's the best way for him to quit ?

How much is your friend using?

The best way is to slowly taper, or to discontinue your frequency in lieu for once a day dosing.

I'm not really sure what else you can do for them if they don't recognize they have a problem.

I use the medication frequently personally, but don't have a problem with it. I can't take my daily dosage every day so that is a good sign, I still have days off the medication, but less so when I am finishing up the last month of school. 8(

I would say, if they don't have the self control, tapering won't work for them. If they have the self control, well they probably won't need to taper in the first place.

This is the catch 22 with amphetamine abuse; you kind of just have to give it up and will yourself not to give into temptation.

 

[theartofwar]

Hm, he's going through about 240-280mg of d-amp a day right now.

I dunno i might try n get him some XRs and like cut the shit in half , i have no idea dude . Have you ever tried to argue and convince some1 who is spun how to get help ? It's fucking like pulling teeth bro , I'm admittedly not the most patient person when it comes to other guys , but this kid is really straining me. Both for his health and my own fucking sanity i need this kid to stop being tweaked for real.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Hm, he's going through about 240-280mg of d-amp a day right now.

8( If I took that much, even in 10mg dosages or something not too much above that, I would be vomiting and in a serious overdose situation.

At that level it just gets unenjoyable; this is especially true with methamphetamine, and I know not to build a serious tolerance to these drugs

That's a lot. I'm glad that you aren't doing that TAoW! I am very sorry for your friend.

If I were you (I'm not though so it's up to you); I would offer to say "hey give me your supply" - and not take any yourself - and slowly let him taper it out.

240 to 280 milligrams a day is pretty high; how is he acquiring this? Illicitly or prescribed? I would hate to think a doctor would willingly get that much dexedrine in a person to begin with.

And what dosages is he doing? 10mg at a time? 40mg? 80mg to 100mg? This is important to know.

I would say if he allows you to hold onto them; you only give him 20mg in a single dose, maybe as often as needed (without going over say 75% of his original dosage); then slowly decrease how much you will give him in a day or at least allow for him to get off of you (a 7 day pill holder thing is perfect for this, you have to dispense it EVERY time and it CAN'T be in their possession or even vicinity) by a total of 10mg or 5mg closer to the end, but you can go a bit quicker in the beginning.

Despite whatever horribleness he may feel, a normal dosage of this medication will still work on him; and it'll still provide relief; even though the high will likely not exist in the same capacity.

On the same parallel he needs to be eating and sleeping more regularly (is he taking care of himself adequately as he is detoxing, is the question).

I dunno i might try n get him some XRs and like cut the shit in half , i have no idea dude . Have you ever tried to argue and convince some1 who is spun how to get help ? It's fucking like pulling teeth bro , I'm admittedly not the most patient person when it comes to other guys , but this kid is really straining me. Both for his health and my own fucking sanity i need this kid to stop being tweaked for real.

Have I tried to tell someone who didn't need help to get it? I would attempt to; it doesn't work very well IME. I told this person who makes any The Dark Side regular look like a high functioning adult (on average; no disrespect to anyone who is like this or has been like this): this person was basically doing shitty things (defined as totally disrespecting the rights, property, etc of family/friends including myself, no remorse sort of thing, chronic lying, etc.) so I decided to tell them politely as I could how they are not welcome in my residence anymore. Needless to say they didn't quite believe me but have a reason to now. They tried breaking in to say the least. Tried being the operative word. %)

I won't go into this but some people are just truly out of control. If they are content with watching themselves go through this level of a drug addiction, you have to let them go through it; you can't stop them.

If they are someone who can be reached, someone who doesn't disrespect you, who doesn't "black out" or go into borderline psychotic episodes of amphetamine psychosis (I'm not lying when I'm saying I'd probably get there on that much per day myself 8() - someone who you can trust/is family, then yes - go for it. Offer to help them taper.

I wish them the best, although I'm not sure who they are in actuality.

PS - I wouldn't do XR's; they'll likely "explore" ways to get around that (whether or not they work - I am not trying to trigger anyone or glamorize drug use). As well, XR type medications often will increase the duration to the point of added length/duration of psychosis, they will often lengthen the period of chemically induced anorexia. It'll also encourage them to abuse the medication IMO; strictly because the beads of the XR medication, aside from the oh-so-easy to open capsules, is more pure than the tablets. I figured this out through experimentation of my own.

I personally still found the IR product to work better swallowed whole, as opposed to even crushing the XR medication. I never felt the XR medication worked well for me, and I felt like I would have had to escalate the dose to get it to; for whatever reason. The entire time on the IR formula, I feel it works, and it's easier to keep the dose lower. ** I was not abusing either medication in actually and took it at prescribed doses or below-prescribed doses. I have never actually heard of many people taking this drug where I live and I would not want to have to get it from anyone other than a doctor. I have documented ADHD; and would willingly trade not having ADHD... for never using stimulants again. Really. And the devil has yet to appear with this contract, although I have a vial of my blood handy ... so to this day I am stuck on medication to be functional. Because I have PTSD, I am barely functional as is. I am not trying to glamorize drug use and I would hope no one thinks I am by anything I said here, because I am at times sickened by the way I have had to rely on medication. I wish I wouldn't have to take this drug. It's not necessarily good for you in terms of not damaging the brain (especially when abused)

The point of helping him, of course, is to get the dose lower and at least the frequency too, while also aiming for overall quitting/sobriety but also concurrently trying to implement positive diet/exercise. You know a lot about all of this so I won't give you the lecture; but I hope this information goes to help multiple people as well.

Lastly; sometimes the XR formula does, in fact, work better for some people. I don't want to be misleading as to say it "never" works right for anyone; just me.