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Harm Reduction Pill injection research into filters

herm1t

Bluelighter
Joined
Jun 7, 2010
Messages
50
Written for opiophile, but decided I'd post it here as well :)
Introduction & Context
I recently attended a pill injection workshop in Australia, among the people at this workshop, there was a man called Dr. Bruno Raimondo, him and his team are running research into opioid pills such as OxyContin, MSContin and Subutex and the effectiveness of filtering. In the morphine forum I already summarized a document he did, I managed to obtain a copy of the slides he used at the presentation, although he has not released the formal version (which I will link to when he has) of the research, the slides he has emailed me are sufficient for the information people need to know.
Too long didn't read:
Don't heat pills, 2-3ml of water soaking your finely powdered pill, with a 1ml rinse through your filter (SHOULD be using a wheel filter) will give you the best results. Wheel filters are necessity they don't retain any drug (95-99% is let through, cotton filters let through less). Expect health problems down the road if you shoot cotton filtered pills.
Harms of pill injection
Injecting pills (or anything) can result in contaminants entering your body such as insoluble particles or bacteria and fungi. These things can irritate and inflame tissue and veins, cause infections in skin/muscle (granuloma, abscess). They can also result in local and systemic infection from the bacteria/fungi.

Insoluble and undissolved particles can cause microcirculation capillaries (5-10um) to become blocked, they clog up in the heart and lungs. Granulomas in the lungs are caused by inflammation which leads to scar tissue (fibrosis). Congmomerate masses lead to restrictive lung disease and pulmonary hypertension. The particles also reach other organs (liver, kidney etc).

Key particles in pills (OxyContin, MSContin, Subutex)
iMr8h.png

Other insoluble particles included are:
Magnesium stearate (5-30um)
Titanium dioxide (100um clumps) (ms, oxy)
Other particles that change form in heat are:
Stearyl alcohol MP is 59*C (ms, oxy)
Eudragit RS 30D clumps at >30*C (oxy)

All these particles cause problems in your heart, lungs and other organs, the chemicals that change form in heart are the reasons why pills should NOT be heated, and you will soon find out there is no advantage to heating.

Why pills shouldn't be heated
hvsyT.png

As you can see, of these images under a microscope, heating pill solutions cause enourmous particles to dissolve in the mix. These particles will pass through the filter (wheel or cotton) and recongeal, precipitating out in your filtered mix or veins.

Ok so I shouldn't heat, what about Rollie cigarette filter filtering (or cotton).
nSWUr.png

For comparison: MSContin rollies reduce particles >5um by 60%.

What about the drug retained?
yojge.png

For subutex 97% of the drug is returned in this process.
Drug is not retained in the filter after this, even if the filter is wet.
.
Wheel filters (and why they rock!)
Here is the solution of two pills under a microscope before and after wheel filtering
DDFwZ.png

But how many particles are removed by the wheel filters?
XMv7e.png

But what about drug recovery
MLOuC.png

For subutex drug recovery is 99%
*Note: One of the researches reminded me to say that when they first did these tests, their technique with wheel filters was poor, and that morphine recovery is more like 95-99%

So as you can see, using wheel filters removes all the particles that cause harm (basically), with a rinse of water after first filter, you can retain 95-99% of the drug (better then a cotton/rollie filter) while removing 99% of the particles that cause harm, and heating is generally a bad idea that does NOT help at all, and does more harm then good.
Note: Hand rolled cigarette filters filter to about 50um.

Another document for the national drug safety council, which focused mainly on morphine and wheel filters, also contains a lot of information. It is located here.

I also posted this in Australian drug discussion but was told to also post it here.
 
Thanks for sharing this with us, there is a lot of excellent information here!!

I'll add this to the Other Drugs directory.
 
Thisthread was also posted on AusDD with a bit of comment fyi
 
^Cool. Lots of good info. We all know wheel filters are imperative when injecting pills, but this really helps explain and show the exact benefits of doing so.

Good work !
 
Ive always wondered why theres a need for so much water...Ive used wheel filters and used 3cc rigs,but only used 1.5 ml's,2 at the most give or take of water(for MS Contin)I would never be able to inject 3-5 ml's of liquid,My veins wouldn't take it.especially with a 3cc rig....I always drew it up with a 1cc rig after the filtering for the injection.I would pull pack a little under a ml of solution,and I suspect I extracted at least 90% of the morphine.huge rushes etc from 100 mg tablets.

Great thread by the way!
 
yea when i was injecting subutex daily i invented a method where i would put a piece of cotton in the barrel of the syringe(push it down to the bottom) then i would rip up little pieces of coffee filter and stuff it in on top of the cotton. id stuff ab 40units worth of filter and would run water thru it before i used it. when i just use a regular cotton w subutex i lose about 10-15 ccs and with this i lost none. so im getting more of the drug, and its getting rid of 10x the amount a regular cotton would. theyre a bitch to make and im not sure its a good idea to reuse them after a day. but they literaly make such a big difference
 
yea when i was injecting subutex daily i invented a method where i would put a piece of cotton in the barrel of the syringe(push it down to the bottom) then i would rip up little pieces of coffee filter and stuff it in on top of the cotton. id stuff ab 40units worth of filter and would run water thru it before i used it. when i just use a regular cotton w subutex i lose about 10-15 ccs and with this i lost none. so im getting more of the drug, and its getting rid of 10x the amount a regular cotton would. theyre a bitch to make and im not sure its a good idea to reuse them after a day. but they literaly make such a big difference

I think you mean you lost 10-15 units.
 
I have the MS Contins and they gel really bad! But I have heard if a wheel filter is used you can inject the solution. I do inject the morphine IR's however and just a few weeks ago I finally invested in wheel filters! I never noticed how not clear my solution was before using just qtip cotton. But I had nothing to compare it to and to the naked eye it looked and seemed very clear. Best investment I ever made!!!

But I am still curious about the MS Cotins. OntarioGuy you said you have injected the MS Contins? They gel tho! Do yours gel? Im pretty sure that all extended-release morphine gel when water is added. Are you sure you dont mean the IR's? I have yet to try out filtering one of my MS Contins with a wheel filter. Maybe I will test it out in the morning with a wheel filter. I just dont see how its going to work concidering how bad they actualy do gel. And I will not inject gel into my veins. I think I have done enough damage using regular cotton for a few months. On that note who would inject a gelly solution into their veins!!!?? Not me!!
 
Ive always wondered why theres a need for so much water...Ive used wheel filters and used 3cc rigs,but only used 1.5 ml's,2 at the most give or take of water(for MS Contin)I would never be able to inject 3-5 ml's of liquid,My veins wouldn't take it.especially with a 3cc rig....I always drew it up with a 1cc rig after the filtering for the injection.I would pull pack a little under a ml of solution,and I suspect I extracted at least 90% of the morphine.huge rushes etc from 100 mg tablets.

Great thread by the way!
1cc rigs for 100mg tablets? Morphines solubility is only like 50-60mg/ml to my knowledge, so max a 1cc rig could hold is 60mg. The extra water allows the morphine to dissolve easier, and for other contents in the pill which are also water soluble to also dissolve at the same time, im assuming that allowing all the particles + morphine in the pill means that more morphine ends up in the mix in the end, but the particles you dont want are filtered out. I guess 1.5ml wash + a .5ml rinse would be fine.
I have the MS Contins and they gel really bad! But I have heard if a wheel filter is used you can inject the solution. I do inject the morphine IR's however and just a few weeks ago I finally invested in wheel filters! I never noticed how not clear my solution was before using just qtip cotton. But I had nothing to compare it to and to the naked eye it looked and seemed very clear. Best investment I ever made!!!

But I am still curious about the MS Cotins. OntarioGuy you said you have injected the MS Contins? They gel tho! Do yours gel? Im pretty sure that all extended-release morphine gel when water is added. Are you sure you dont mean the IR's? I have yet to try out filtering one of my MS Contins with a wheel filter. Maybe I will test it out in the morning with a wheel filter. I just dont see how its going to work concidering how bad they actualy do gel. And I will not inject gel into my veins. I think I have done enough damage using regular cotton for a few months. On that note who would inject a gelly solution into their veins!!!?? Not me!!

It doesn't matter whether they gel, the wheel filter will filter all that gel out, whether or not the wheel filter will function well filtering gel is a different story though..I inject MSContin ERs and they don't gel, I don't think any australian MSContins gel, only american ones.

yea when i was injecting subutex daily i invented a method where i would put a piece of cotton in the barrel of the syringe(push it down to the bottom) then i would rip up little pieces of coffee filter and stuff it in on top of the cotton. id stuff ab 40units worth of filter and would run water thru it before i used it. when i just use a regular cotton w subutex i lose about 10-15 ccs and with this i lost none. so im getting more of the drug, and its getting rid of 10x the amount a regular cotton would. theyre a bitch to make and im not sure its a good idea to reuse them after a day. but they literaly make such a big difference
While this sounds better then just a cotton it is not ideal, you would still be getting thousands of soluble and insoluble particles that are large enough to become a problem, block capillaries and generally fuck your shit up, so it would be best to invest in wheel filters if you are shooting pills and care about your health.
 
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Herm1t: I did not know you were in austrailia. The ones in the US do gel. :(. I'm not going to waste a wheel filter trying. The gel is pretty thick. Your very lucky that they don't gel. I'm so jelous right now! I get a ton of them every month. My only choice is to eat them. Boooo US MS COntins!

Great thread btw! Very informative!!
 
Herm1t: I did not know you were in austrailia. The ones in the US do gel. :(. I'm not going to waste a wheel filter trying. The gel is pretty thick. Your very lucky that they don't gel. I'm so jelous right now! I get a ton of them every month. My only choice is to eat them. Boooo US MS COntins!

Great thread btw! Very informative!!

Plugging isn't a very popular pastime for most people but you could look into it if you haven't already. As for injecting I have heard pre-filtering with cotton is the way to go with ms contins (to get the big gunk out). Obviously after that crude filter you then put it through the .2 um wheel filter. I've also heard heating up the solution to disperse the morphine out of the gel and then cooling it in a fridge/freezer to bring it back down to 4 or so degrees to solidify all the binder crap is also beneficial but obviously is a little bit time consuming.

I thought last time I prepped a mscontin it gelled (with the aussie 15mg and 30mg ones I have) but I'll try again soon when I get my filters, and if it doesn't I'll be over the moon.
 
I also get the instant release ones. So it isnt a big deal that I cant inject the extended release ones. Altho it would be nice! I just know that the morphine gets traped in the gel. So im not sure about them. Maybe ill try the way you sugested, oxycondone. I have tried plugging them a few times. I crush them up add hot water to disolve it as much as possible and so the gel isnt that thick and theres no chuncks. Im not sure if it worked better or not bc the oral BA is only about ~30% and I think rectal is ~35%. So either way they just suck, IMO. But thank you for the sugestions. They are much apreciated!!!
 
Informative, OP, thanks. There's a vogue down under - particularly in New Zealand - for 'home cooking', a relatively simple kitchen process to convert MSCs, dihydrocodeine and OTC codeine-based pills into straight injectable morphine. Would be worldwide practice but for the difficulty obtaining some chemicals needed for the process in the wary nations
 
def use the wheel filter, pills are dangerous to shoot as you all probably know. and ps never heat ur pills

lots of great info on this thread, Im new but it was really helpful and Im grateful for that and a pile of quadbars :)

mod note: please edit your post to add info instead of posting again right afterwords.
 
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I'm really curious what you guys mean by gel, say you get 2ml of cold water and sit in the spoon, you then get a very finely crushed pill, im talking flour/shavings from a hose clamp crushed, you place that in the spoon, and it starts to gel? It turns to a shampoo/hair gel consistency?
 
Informative, OP, thanks. There's a vogue down under - particularly in New Zealand - for 'home cooking', a relatively simple kitchen process to convert MSCs, dihydrocodeine and OTC codeine-based pills into straight injectable morphine. Would be worldwide practice but for the difficulty obtaining some chemicals needed for the process in the wary nations

Hey if you are talking about using AA to make homebake - this is a pretty dangerous practice and I would discourage anyone from doing it outside of a properly equipped lab. AA is pretty toxic stuff - inhaling the fumes can cause lung lesions etc etc - check out the relevant material safety data sheets (google is your friend)
 
Great study. I don't inject, and I hope I never do, but I like to learn about all this kind of stuff anyways.
 
So your not supposed to use warm water on pills or heat them in a spoon?

wtf is a wheel filter?
 
Ive always wondered why theres a need for so much water...Ive used wheel filters and used 3cc rigs,but only used 1.5 ml's,2 at the most give or take of water(for MS Contin)I would never be able to inject 3-5 ml's of liquid,My veins wouldn't take it.especially with a 3cc rig....I always drew it up with a 1cc rig after the filtering for the injection.I would pull pack a little under a ml of solution,and I suspect I extracted at least 90% of the morphine.huge rushes etc from 100 mg tablets.

Great thread by the way!

You can make a more concentrated solution. Well, there is a solubility issue for morphine obviously, but if you are working with a decently soluble drug, just filter more, and then store the solution for later, and use some now, and save some for later. :)

So your not supposed to use warm water on pills or heat them in a spoon?
No, not at all. Did you read the entire first post? It goes over why and how the heat doesn't not only do no good but does bad things which are avoidable.

wtf is a wheel filter?

Look at the last link in my signature.
 
herm1t- yea a gel kinda like hair gel. Im not sure how to desvrible it but yea kinda like hair gel. Once you crush the pill and add water it thickens pretty quick into a gel-like substance that is not suitable for injecting. And I would never add heat to it bc I know how bad heating pills is and I deff would never inject gel into my veins. Just isnt safe. The new oxy formula for the oxycontins do the same thing but more of a waxy gel. Its pretty gross. This gel traps the good stuff in it so theres no extracting it even if a wheel filter is used. altho I havent tried the wheel filter to see if it would work. I just doubt that it would. its a pretty thick gel.
 
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