I still don't like Peyote? It makes me feel weird

[sheepie]

I did peyote (actually peruvian torch) this weekend. It was... mediocre at best. 20grams. I was with my friend. We got to a point where we could barely even speak because it took too much work to think of what words to say. I felt really weird and uncomfortable. This is the second time this has happened.

People say it takes the best of MDMA and Shrooms, but I feel like it takes the worst of both. Maybe I'm just unlucky?

My environment was in a mountain by the way.

I didn't experience any visual hallucinations besides colours were really vibrant.

 

[lightitup]

Peyote and peruvian torch are incredibly different, they are not even the same genus of cacti. They contain many different alkaloids, and the only thing they have in common in that they both contain mescaline in decent quantities.

Try extracting the mescaline if you would really like another experience. It is really easy, and there are guides for it all over the place.

I've only used peyote, but in my opinion (don't know about dosage by grams sorry) it sounds like you used too little for a real psychedelic experience.

 

[psilocybonaut]

I assume you have experience with other psychedelics, like mushrooms and LSD? And you enjoy the effects? If so...

I think you've been underdosing. 20 grams of Peruvian torch is just NOT enough. And as we all know, low doses of psychedelics can provoke anxiety and confusion if you don't hit the "trip" dose.

I've been reading on Erowid/other sites about the Mescaline % in Peruvian Torch by weight. The percentages vary wildly, from 0.817% to 1% to 2% (~<1% is more likely)

Diameter
Length is a traditional method of measuring a dose of columnar cacti. "A piece the length of your forearm, from elbow to knuckle" (12-15 in.) is a common recommendation, which unfortunately doesn't take diameter into consideration. Due to the relative unavailability of accurate scales, many amateur cacti enthusiasts continue to measure dosages by length rather than weight.

T. peruvianus tends to grow to a larger diameter than T. pachanoi [RS, KTrout], meaning that at equal potency, less length is required of peruvianus for the same dose. Even after standardizing all other factors (assuming an average of 90% water by weight and 1% mescaline by dry weight),7 the difference between the mescaline content of a 9 cm diameter and a 6 cm diameter cactus is significant. An 8 cm long section of a 9 cm diameter cactus would yield approximately 400 mg of mescaline--a good solid dose-- while an equal length section of a 6 cm diameter cactus would yield only 180 mg, just above a threshold dose.
http://www.erowid.org/plants/cacti/cacti_article1.shtml

So instead of giving the dried weight (20g) of the cacti, it's more traditional to measure it in length by inches for dosing.

Also, from what I'm reading, according to this bluelight archive, the traditional first time dose for Peruvian Torch would be somewhere around 43g dried, from some estimates I'm reading.

From what I've gathered, peruvian torch dried dosages (claimed to be stronger than san pedro, claimed, not exactly proven) start at around 40g for a worthwhile trip. I was planning on doing 50-60g for my first mescaline cacti experience.

one person claimed effects from 20g.
so it looks like Peruvian Torch can vary greatly in its alkaloid content. Read this:

1kg fresh cacti is:
40g dried if you consider that fresh cacti is 96% water...
60g dried if you consider that fresh cacti is 94% water...
80g dried if you consider that fresh cactii is 92% water...
100g dried if you consider that fresh cacti is 90% water...

Usually fresh Trichocereus is thought to be be 94% water, so 1kg fresh (heavy dose) should be 60g dried.


Anyway...
let's assume that DRIED san pedro/peruvian torch range from 0.3 to 2.3% mescaline, but the "average" cactus is most probably closer to the lower of these numbers (0.3 - 0.33 % ).

Now, here are oral mescaline dosages:
Threshold 100 mg
Light 100 - 200 mg
Common 200 - 300 mg
Strong 300 - 500 mg
Heavy 500 - 700 mg

So
40g dried cactii is 800 mg mescaline if content is 2% which is highly unlikely
40g dried cactii is 132mg mescaline if content is 0.33% which is much more probable
so there's probably little risk for a badtrip starting with 40g
80g dried cactii is 264mg mescaline if content is 0.33%
150g dried cactii is 495mg mescaline if content is 0.33%
200g dried cactii is 660mg mescaline if content is 0.33%

So I think one should acquire at least 500g dried cacti in order to be able to experiment with different dosages until he finds out what is a "strong dose".
Try 30-40g at first (just to ensure your cactus isn't 2% mescaline)...if there was some moderate effect then try 60g, but if 30-40g only gave you very weak effects (which is quite probable if your cactus is around 0.33% ) then try 80g....if still not enough for strong & very visual effects then try 120g (or even 150g if 80 was really weak)...and 200g would be the maximum dose to achieve heavy effects out of a 0.33% mescaline dried cacti...
This is the way I would work my doses up as I think double dosing isn't much physically dangerous with cacti as long as one thinks he's able to make the difference between weak/moderate/strong and heavy effects.

..but let's guess that 100g dried would be a really strong dose with any reasonably potent cacti which would be around 0.66% mescaline.

all these quotes are from the bluelight archive above, check it out.

 

[sheepie]

Thanks for the read, it's pretty interesting. I get what you're saying about the "trip dose". I remember when I took ~1.2g of shrooms it wasn't enough and I just felt weird. Looking back, it's a pretty similar feeling to what I felt the other day. Right now I just get the feeling that pushing the dose even higher won't really help and I'll end up regretting it - but I'm probably wrong about that .

One thing is I can't stand the nausea.

I think I'm going to extract the mescaline. It would be better in the long run I think.

Oh yeah and to ^^ I heard Peyote and Peruvian torch have similar alkaloids in comparison to San Pedro

 

[lightitup]

Oh yeah and to ^^ I heard Peyote and Peruvian torch have similar alkaloids in comparison to San Pedro

Interesting, I didn't know that. I wasn't trying to be an asshole, just trying to help spread knowledge.

I really want to try the mescaline extract, I haven't had the best results with cacti, and the nausea is BRUTAL to say the least.

 

[Bardeaux]

20g of your average peruvian torch really isnt enough ime. I took 30g once which was very active but not quit as strong as I was hoping. After that my doses were all 50+g which were plenty strong enough.

Definitely dont get discouraged. Mescaline is one of the better psychedelics out there imo.

 

[aenimaxoxo]

A lot of people are getting P. Torch powder nowadays. I recently took 35 grams of the powder and had the most intense, mind scaping trip that I have ever experienced. Extremely personal, intensity fluctuated between +2 and +4.

I also find that treating the cactus with intense respect and praying to it beforehand raises the spirituality of taking the cacti powder. It may be placebo, but I really did not expect to have such strong effects off of what others would consider a normal - high dosage range.

40 grams of powder seems to be what others are saying is a good dose on other forums, but 35 was definitely enough for me. It might also have been because I took 50mg of DPH while eating the cacti powder / dough and kept all of the cactus inside of me, allowing my body to further ingest the alkaloids fully.

Mescaline is definitely a worthwhile experience, its different than LSD and Mushrooms and feels way out of its class of phenythylamines. Good luck, bluelighter! I really hope you get to feel the true power of Mescaline soon!

 

[sheepie]

Thanks for the advice!

If I made tea instead of eating it raw, will I escape of most of the nausea?

Extracting mescaline seems like a lengthily procedure and I'm not down to do it at this point (school, etc). Maybe some other time.

 

[Bardeaux]

The cactus tends to turn into a green sludgy smoothie concoction when mixed with water. This is how I usually prepare it and have never experienced much nausea, but from what I hear from others it can be very nauseating.

 

[greenberryhaze]

Just wanted to point out that doing an A/B extraction doesn't separate mescaline from the other alkaloids, not that it's a bad idea.