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The New Powers of the Victorian Police

I'm with p_d on this one. We need to be MORE educated, not less. The problem is how we implement our education system. It's very narrow minded and doesn't allow for anyone to think outside the box. I for one would like to see an ethics and morals or similar class introduced from a young age, and not just a 1 hour a week pep talk that brings religion into the picture.

Young students should also be encouraged from a young age to take an interest in what is happening in the world around them (both locally and internationally). Those who know more of the big picture generally have a heads up in life. These draconian stop and search laws are a fine example. If more people took an interest in these laws that effected them I'm sure they wouldn't have been written into legislation quite so easily.
 
thestudent14 said:
Firstly I'd never wish to cut sport haha.

I think cutting maths after yr 8 is a good idea, I don't see how anything you learn after that is helpful in almost every career maybe not science but the topics in highschool science should be more related to life. And for those who choose to continue to do maths can as an elective if they believe they have potential for it.

I'm not saying that this is a perfect solution but I do believe it would be an improvement and at least worth trialling. At the moment you have more and more students leaving earlier and I don't blame them because the content is not relelvant enough to their futures and then you have a whole lot of other students who stay through and realise they have learnt very little helpful to them in the past 3-4 years of highschool.
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You seem like a smart person ... but i could pick the shit out of what you just wrote!!:\ Im also with busty and phase here.. %) As an ADULT i have always wanted to keep learning, why wouldnt you ? You live you learn you learn you think ?! and then it comes back to living and choices i spose <3
 
I think some people might have mis understood what I meant. I don't want to cut or massivly dumb down maths and english I believe they need to teach more relevent material.

Like when I was doing Maths B. Typically when doing some hard subject you can at least think "ah yeah il probably never use this parabolic motion stuff but maybe an aircraft engineer could". But a large chunk of the maths we were doing didn't seem to have any relevence to anything ever. It was like maths just for the sake of maths.

I think this is a large probem with how many stupid people their are today. Not only are they not intrested in the first place, but can't see why they are learning it for anyway.

Like shakesphere. Is there anything learning about shakesphere is good for? Seriously anything at all? Not even the way its written is relevent anymore. How are kids ever going to get intrested in education english gibberish.

At least in y12 physics we got to play with x-ray machines and play with radioactive materials (think it was strontium 90).
 
Woah. Interesting read

Welcome to the REAL Australia. Some people are surprised to learn that in this country there are only 2 constitutionally protected rights and freedoms

1. the right to democratically elect a Parliament from time to time

2. the right not to have a religion imposed on you by the state.

THAT IS IT

Everything else you perceive as a "freedom" can be taken away from you.

Enjoy proceeding in public unmolested by authorities??...all it takes is an act of parliament (at the most) and suddenly that freedom has disappeared for good and there's not one thing you can do about it.

If you read the debates from the constitutional conventions of the 1890s you will see that this country was founded upon racism and inequality and purposely engineered to stay that way.

***waits for drunken bogan to tell me to kiss the flag or fuck off to Iraqistan***
 
I see exactly what you are trying to say static_mind. I only recently left school and the amount of Mathematics targetted towards very specific career paths is pretty rediculous. The bottom line is if you aren't interested in the material (which 90% of people aren't) you are going to have a hard time retaining the material.

The Western Education system as a whole does not allow much for invidualism and strongly discourages free thought by strict guidelines. I was fortunate enough to be in a very unusual class in year 5-6 where were allowed to bend the guidelines of the sillibus a hell of a lot more. For major projects we drew up our own contract, what we wanted to achieve, what we want to have learnt by the completion of our project, and at the end of it a detailed summary. It worked really well and the trust and freedom promotoed by the teacher gave the whole class a spark for learning and knowledge.

It takes a bit more effort on the educational systems part but enouraging passion for learning and knowledge CAN be instilled at a young age...but that would be bad for those in power.
 
This
Busty_st_clare wrote
If you think more people are leaving school earlier for long and productive career's then you'll find out the hard way that a basic qualification is less than minimum to succeed in today's society. It gets you a foot in the door but you need to be training until the day you retire otherwise you will be left behind. These days my 8 year old knows how to manage her finances and how to spot a bargin at the shops. If you are relying on school teachers to give your kids basic life skills you are failing as a parent.

Why don't we just give everyone who finds a subject challenging a shovel and just get them digging trenches asap? Seriously, learning about interest rates and profit margins in rug shops is A Current Affair 101. You do realise the vegie maths was created so that those who didn't give a shit wouldn't drag the bell curve down? Maths at school is pretty basic stuff, it might not seem relevant because of the way it is taught, I was lucky I had some pretty good maths teachers that challenged me and grew my mind. It is like crosswords, rarely do you find the need to fill in spaces on road signs, but it is a form of mental exercise that even fends off dementia.

Lets ignore any university course requires Statistics at least for one subject to pass, as I'll accept that plenty of great careers don't necessarily need a degree. Surely the more knowledge individuals in a society hold, the less government has to do to hold your hand. The smarter society is as a whole, the less dumb shit happens.

High School is not the end of your education, you have to remain mentally active for the rest of your life.
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And this

Phase_dancer wrote
What!! If anything maths and science should be introduced at a younger age. I agree with what Busty implied; dumbing down a country like Aus is a ridiculous notion. It's something I'd only expect to hear from those who, for whatever reason, can't or won't apply themselves to learning new stuff.

If anything it's the parents of today who need education in relation to advising on life skills. FFS, good parenting includes staying abreast of current trends and maintaining a relationship with their kids, teaching them how to avoid or minimize the pitfalls.

I'm sorry to have to say it, but to suggest maths and science be sacrificed and even discontinued after year 8 if a career choice doesn't require it, is ludicrous. I know people in their thirties and older who are working full time, but still haven't decided what they really want to do. Yet, like I've seem many times, some of these people will go on to do well in a chosen career path. Perhaps teaching higher level stuff to those who can manage it at an earlier age may make a career vision come at an earlier age...?

Maths, as Busty pointed out, doesn't just apply to hard sciences, it applies to everything done in a scientific manner, and lot's of subjects that are only loosely related.

Science can definitely include some aspects of drug education without necessarily sacrificing a good curriculum. I also see Sports and PE as appropriate subjects to introduce relevant drug related topics, as are most subjects if you look at how broadly drug use impacts on society. I don't see why any one subjects needs to be significantly sacrificed for a proper education on drugs.
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Are both fine rebuttles. And Whilst I still think there needs to be a change in the curriculum to some extent I dunno that cutting maths/science earlier would be beneficial.

I do get very frustrated though seeing so much time being spent on subjects that won't be helpful to the majority of people. At my school we didn't have an accelerated maths program, as a result I was stuck bored out of my brain yr 7-10 doing something I could ace without ever trying. But if maths was optional from yr 9 then more complex maths could be taught earlier and I feel that both the people who discontinued maths and the people who pursue it would be better off.

However... I can also see as P_D mentioned there is people into their 30's who still aren't sure of what they want to do. But once they decide surely they could apply themself and learn the maths or science material required which with most careers the only math you would require you should have established by the end of year 8, year 9 level for most apprenticeships. So perhaps they should be optional from year 10.


Perhaps cutting it out isn't the answer, infact of that I'm pretty much sure you are both correct. But as Static_Mind said, there is SO much irrelevant stuff taught in schools today. I wasn't sure I wanted to be a teacher, I'm still not even certain. However I've always known my career path would likely co-exist with maths, most of my peers were certain that theirs wouldn't.

I dunno, I know it's a ludacris idea to pull back on mainstream subjects so that the education system could be more individualised, I guess a fundamental problem here is man power. Schools would requite more class's with more teachers that they can't afford and I know our education system isn't bad, I mean nearly all of my friends are on their paths to a chosen career so I guess the system is working. But I still feel that would have benefited more if the education system was tweaked.
 
Sameria said:
I see exactly what you are trying to say static_mind. I only recently left school and the amount of Mathematics targetted towards very specific career paths is pretty rediculous. The bottom line is if you aren't interested in the material (which 90% of people aren't) you are going to have a hard time retaining the material.

The Western Education system as a whole does not allow much for invidualism and strongly discourages free thought by strict guidelines. I was fortunate enough to be in a very unusual class in year 5-6 where were allowed to bend the guidelines of the sillibus a hell of a lot more. For major projects we drew up our own contract, what we wanted to achieve, what we want to have learnt by the completion of our project, and at the end of it a detailed summary. It worked really well and the trust and freedom promotoed by the teacher gave the whole class a spark for learning and knowledge.

It takes a bit more effort on the educational systems part but enouraging passion for learning and knowledge CAN be instilled at a young age...but that would be bad for those in power.
Click to expand...



I wasn't overly interested in the material at school and left school early. Now I plan on doing a bachelor of science that I am going to struggle in due to my lack of schooling in the two primary subjects earlier. Even if you people aren't interested at school you never know how important the knowledge could be. Needa keep teaching maths and science for sure.
 
I get what you're saying there Jakeperson, even I myself knew that staying on to year 12 would be handy in the long run. But I was unhappy at school at the time so dropped out in year 11. I knew i had no interest in studying most of the subjects I had at my school - of which the range was quiet restricted - so I left. I do plan on furthering my education later on in life but I'm certainly in no rush. You're only young once after all ;)

I've widened my larea of learning greatly since leaving school. Of course not so much of a traditional learning, certainly nothing that will get me any formal qualifications - but learning more about subects that interest me and help me better understand the world around me; something that I found school tought subjects to be very lacking in.

Back OT, schools should be teaching basic things like civil rights. Unfortunately not many teachers willing to stick their neck out like that :/
 
Sameria said:
Back OT, schools should be teaching basic things like civil rights. Unfortunately not many teachers willing to stick their neck out like that :/
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This would be a very short class given the lack of protection there is for civil rights in Australia. They would spend the whole time talking about implied rights rather than real ones
 
I know this is fairly off the opening topic now, but just wondering. What would all you guys think of a Drug Ed subject in highschool. I think it's not a bad idea. In year 8 1st semester we had sex ed, I think a drug ed in the second semester would be good. It would have to be a very structured course I think. We all hate the "Just say no" saying.

But what would be put into such a class?
* Pro's and con's of drugs.

But I think there would have to be more time based on what drugs can't be taken together and why.
 
I think they should promote "just say no". Whilst carefully going on to talk about what might happen IF someone doesn't say no. The risks, the positives etc.

The best solution to not having to deal with the stresses a drug user has to face is just saying no, but if that can't be achieved for whatever reason - teaching kids about the more prominent street drugs would greatly improve their chances OR it might make them curious about drugs.

It's all a two way street, and education turns to curiosity quite commonly.

There's an old saying - Curiosity Killed the Cat. I know if it weren't for my parents feeding me stories of pink elephants, lsd, and the hippy era. I 'd probably have never developed an interest in psychotropic substances. I think i've said this before, but the only drug i never really got interested in was weed - which lately i've been smoking a bit of since the injury just to help get my mind off the discomfort.
 
Getting back to Victorian Police Powers...

Funny how the police have tightened the rules on getting peoples phone records to see who has called them and who they have called.

Now politicians and journalists records have to be approved by the assistant police commisioner rather than an inspector.

Seems funny how the rules are different for some. :p
 
This is shit, but really coppers have been able to do this anyway if they really want. Last time I got my bag searched the cop said her reason for searching was me refusing a bag search, and I got 2 options, get searched or get arrested. And the time I refused the house being searched because they had no warrant I just got thrown out of the way :\
 
footscrazy said:
This is shit, but really coppers have been able to do this anyway if they really want. Last time I got my bag searched the cop said her reason for searching was me refusing a bag search, and I got 2 options, get searched or get arrested. And the time I refused the house being searched because they had no warrant I just got thrown out of the way :\
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Thats fucked up dude, on both counts.

Surely without a house warrant if you were found with any illegal substances it wouldn't hold up in court and would be considerred under false pretences? Or would it just become your word against theirs on if they were aloud in the house. I'd love to hear more on this.
 
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Australian constitution

Ignatius J. said:
Woah. Interesting read

Welcome to the REAL Australia. Some people are surprised to learn that in this country there are only 2 constitutionally protected rights and freedoms

1. the right to democratically elect a Parliament from time to time

2. the right not to have a religion imposed on you by the state.

THAT IS IT

Everything else you perceive as a "freedom" can be taken away from you.

Enjoy proceeding in public unmolested by authorities??...all it takes is an act of parliament (at the most) and suddenly that freedom has disappeared for good and there's not one thing you can do about it.

If you read the debates from the constitutional conventions of the 1890s you will see that this country was founded upon racism and inequality and purposely engineered to stay that way.

***waits for drunken bogan to tell me to kiss the flag or fuck off to Iraqistan***
Click to expand...
hi
i have just stumbled across the Aust Constitution recently, I REALLY recommend everyone that 35 or 40 min to listen to it.... youtube has it ...Australian Constitution for Dummies... KNOW YOUR RIGHTS....TELL EVERYONE
 
Honestly the US is the best place to come for personal freedom IMO
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Ha, is that a joke? The US of A presents itself as land of the free and all that nonsense, but you guys are the biggest hypocrites of them all. Not to say Australia isn't, because we are guilty of this fact also, but common?

And why do you feel the need to carry a gun on you at all times? What's that, like some license to kill? Must be a nice part of town if you are strapped every-time you go to get milk. Then the clerk shortchanges ya and BOOM! Busta-cap

Anyone who lives in any developed country and thinks they are 'free' in every sense of the word is lying to themselves. Maybe if you were raised by wolves. Or live on your own island.

But back to the OP. I agree with everything Busty has said.
 
As much as America would appear to be the "land of the free" this is simply not true anymore. There may be indiviaul cases of freedom (such as cannabit legality in some states) but the powers to be are not a fan of this, so it won't spread too far.

The personal freedoms of america have been raped and soiled on since the patriot act and other post-9/11 legislation - funnily enough created by the rich to gain more power/money and restrict personal freedoms even more. Many American citizens see the gun as the last stand they have against a hostile government - a very valid concern.

Australia is worse mainly because we don't even have any set in stone legislation that governs personal freedoms/civic rights etc. America (at least to my eyes) violates these personal rights much more than the Australian government, even though some of these rights were outlined in the 'Bill of Rights'. No doubt this is due mainly to size, crime activity and political tomfoolery than Australia.

As much as I hate to say it, weed ain't everything.
 
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