Opioids Dr is trying to get me off Oxy & switch to Suboxone

[jamesBrown]

are you prescribed any medication for your migranes?

 

['medicine cabinet']

If i read correctly, you said you took an extra half of an 80mg oxycontin? It says on the bottle to not crush or break and to always take the pill whole. Maybe the dr thought you were misusing them because you didnt follow the directions on the bottle? Just a thought....\

Suboxone is nowhere near as effective as oxycodone for pain relief. Also, suboxone and subutex is FDA approved to treat addiction. Buprenorphine is given for pain in some places, but as far as i know the only pain medicine that contains buprenorphine is buprenex and its only injectable. I dont think they make a bupe containing pill that is marketed for pain relief. It is the same drug, yes, but im surprised he would try and get you on suboxone instead of oxycodone.

I know sometimes dr's will rx a drug for an unintended purpose, like clonidine for opiate WD and so on, but i would tell him that you are skeptical about the switch. Also buprenorphine has a much lower cieling than oxycodone. If you are on the max dose and it doesnt relieve your pain and gives you too many side effects, its not like you can up your dose for more pain relief like you can with oxycodone.

 

[Depressicaa]

Clear out your PM box.

A benzo can help along with opiate treatment as well.

 

[jamesBrown]

If i read correctly, you said you took an extra half of an 80mg oxycontin? It says on the bottle to not crush or break and to always take the pill whole. Maybe the dr thought you were misusing them because you didnt follow the directions on the bottle? Just a thought....\

Suboxone is nowhere near as effective as oxycodone for pain relief. Also, suboxone and subutex is FDA approved to treat addiction. Buprenorphine is given for pain in some places, but as far as i know the only pain medicine that contains buprenorphine is buprenex and its only injectable. I dont think they make a bupe containing pill that is marketed for pain relief. It is the same drug, yes, but im surprised he would try and get you on suboxone instead of oxycodone.

I know sometimes dr's will rx a drug for an unintended purpose, like clonidine for opiate WD and so on, but i would tell him that you are skeptical about the switch. Also buprenorphine has a much lower cieling than oxycodone. If you are on the max dose and it doesnt relieve your pain and gives you too many side effects, its not like you can up your dose for more pain relief like you can with oxycodone.

First of all....sometimes the pills ARE prescribed in a way where they must be broken in half. In fact, my mom got a prescription like this before and the pharmacy gave her a pill-cutter-in-half-er so she could do it.....so maybe he actually was supposed to only take half. Also...im prescribed 12 mg's of subooxne/day.....yet im only given 8mg pills.....what do you think that means im suppposed to do? But your probably right,I think he even stated he takes 1 80mg oxy every 8 hours.....that would mean he shouldnt have to cut it in half. Only he knows what the bottle says I guess.

Also....there actually IS a buprenorphine drug prescribed specifically for pain. Its called Tamgesic and its for chronic pain and post-op pain. It has been talked about quite alot on BL.

Aso....when suboxone(bupe) is prescribed for pain it is only prescribed in tiny doses under 2mg's because at higher doses(above 4-8mg's) the pain killing properties are not "active"...it has alot to do with bupes full agonist metabolite norbupernorphine being able to bind to your receptors, killing your pain, in low doses only. There have been MANY posts talking about the exact mechanism of action in this scenario...you can do a search on BL and find it I think. This makes the "ceiling dose" problem you were talking about.....inert. In fact, I dont take my prescribed dose of sub, I only take 0.5 mg doses because it actually gets me really high and kills pain very well.

*Also....Tamgesic only comes in 0.2-0.4mg doses which kill pain very well......and oxycodone doesnt have a ceiling dose.....the more you take the stronger the effects will be, always, there is no dose where this would stop. And I agree that oxy probably would be best for him in this situation but the doctors maybe know something we dont, who knows?....i think he should just do what they say and tell them how effective the mdication is...if its not working, im sure they will switch to somethign that will work.

 

[Scoliosis]

Hi J, hope you saw my reply - no disrespect*

I was given 500mg Naproxen, Relpax, and a few other things - lost track ... nothing worked. they also tried to get me on anti-deppress's and I tried something for 5 days and threw them out. Got ill feelings and no sleep.

The only thing that really does help was the 5mg endocet / percocets and the acetaminophen made me ill so now i have the 10mg instant release oxycodone instead - took the edge off and also 1mg lorazepam REALLY helped relax me and assist with sleep. I swear the loraz helps. The docs disagree.

I now take nothing. They rx'd something else too, i forgot the name - and was not covered by mydrug plan - the pills were like $80 each.

Perspective:

on a pain scale 1- 10 with 10 being like a broken bone or worse my migraines are at a 15. I thought i was having an aneurysm -

are you prescribed any medication for your migranes?

 

[Scoliosis]

Yup, i told everyone the truth.

i apologized and said i would never do so again.

they have me coming in weekly for a check up and released 1 week worth of meds for the 1st 6 weeks.

Today, my 2 weeks supply and i run out tomorrow AM - my last 80mg dose.

!!!!!!!!YES!!!!!!!!

................. thought you were misusing them because you didnt follow the directions on the bottle

I explained i have never done any drugs or had issues with addiction / booze, etc... and they are simply skeptical.

....... buprenorphine has a much lower cieling than oxycodone. If you are on the max dose and it doesnt relieve your pain and gives you too many side effects, its not like you can up your dose for more pain relief

This is another valid point too, someone else told me this. i am better off trying a natural treatments like massage, acupuncture, and then lowering my does of the oxy rather than moving up the table to this other stuff like meth / suboxone.

Great reply!! thanks a lot.

If i read correctly, you said you took an extra half of an 80mg oxycontin? It says on the bottle to not crush or break and to always take the pill whole. Maybe the dr thought you were misusing them because you didnt follow the directions on the bottle? Just a thought....\

Suboxone is nowhere near as effective as oxycodone for pain relief. Also, suboxone and subutex is FDA approved to treat addiction. Buprenorphine is given for pain in some places, but as far as i know the only pain medicine that contains buprenorphine is buprenex and its only injectable. I dont think they make a bupe containing pill that is marketed for pain relief. It is the same drug, yes, but im surprised he would try and get you on suboxone instead of oxycodone.

I know sometimes dr's will rx a drug for an unintended purpose, like clonidine for opiate WD and so on, but i would tell him that you are skeptical about the switch. Also buprenorphine has a much lower cieling than oxycodone. If you are on the max dose and it doesnt relieve your pain and gives you too many side effects, its not like you can up your dose for more pain relief like you can with oxycodone.

 

[Scoliosis]

as per the MRI and my spinal pics - HONESTLY, YOU WOULD DROP IF YOU SAW THEM - my spine is shaped like an ' S ' and also rotates + degenerative too.

Anyone I showed the image to was in total and utter disbelief and thought I forged / photoshopped the image.

p.s - and then I have been told by 2 different docs that my pain should not be that bad. I need a break , my back is hurting now.

Did you try straight up telling them that? Thats how I stopped going to my previous doctor, I told her that I wanted benzos for as needed use and not to be on a daily psych medication, and she said she disagreed with that...daily meds were better than as needed ones. That's okay, just time to find someone new. The more you beat around the bush about it, the more they are going to think you are looking for drugs. If you have MRIs/etc proving that you have legit pain, from my experience, doctors don't leave you hurting. I feel like many doctors do overprescribe, but this guy doesn't seem like he's trying to save his ass. Perhaps he is working from what he's seen work with other patients and wants you to try it?

I don't have chronic pain, I have on and off backpain and whenever it hurts and I go to a dr, I get a script. They can tell I'm in pain and not lying, generally I can even tell if a "friend" is telling me they are in "pain" and want to know if I have anything spare hanging around. Being in pain sucks, and I also think you should mention to the dr about how you don't wanna be on drugs forever. That you are currently looking for a natural approach, maybe even ask for some suggestions to incorporate it into your medication regiment? I think willingness to try new things also shows honesty, because I know if I'm hurting and I get a suggestion about even a simple exercise which may help, I'm eager to try something new before I dismiss it as not working --- give other opiates a chance, you might be surprised with what happens.

 

['medicine cabinet']

Oxycontin is a controlled release pill. Stuff like suboxone or percocets can be split in half. They say to not do it with pills like oxycontin or MScontin because it effects the way the pill is broken down.

 

[jamesBrown]

Oxycontin is a controlled release pill. Stuff like suboxone or percocets can be split in half. They say to not do it with pills like oxycontin or MScontin because it effects the way the pill is broken down.

true....he probably shouldnt have cut the pills in half. but this more than likely isnt the only reason the doctors are changing his medication. for one, the whole problem started with him saying the oxy wasnt killing the pain enough....thats the whole reason he took more. trying another medication might work better for him.

 

[Scoliosis]

im telling you, i would have been better off telling them i sold them or something

Sometimes honesty is not always the best policy. Seriously. Shame on them.

Oxycontin is a controlled release pill. Stuff like suboxone or percocets can be split in half. They say to not do it with pills like oxycontin or MScontin because it effects the way the pill is broken down.

 

[SkagKush]

they may want to put u on subs cause uve been using oxy for a long time, and no that u will suffer WDs, this may b a trick to get u off opiates.....? since they think ur abusing them.

 

[jamesBrown]

they may want to put u on subs cause uve been using oxy for a long time, and no that u will suffer WDs, this may b a trick to get u off opiates.....? since they think ur abusing them.

I highly doubt the doctors are trying to "trick" him in any way. Its not uncommon for a doctor to re-prescribe pain medication to a patient who is obviously having troubles with his original meds. Especially when he was taking massive amounts of opiates. Believe it or not, suboxone can be very effective at killing pain. It just has a stigma that unfortunately goes against this fact that makes it hard for people to believe, and, in this instance, makes people "appaled" that the doctors wanted to switch them to subs.

I think alot of people overthought this situation. I think the OP should just do what the doctors say and be honest with them about how effective the medication is. Thats what pretty much everyone should do. Theres no good coming from going onto a website and complaining that your doctors are screwing you, because, no matter what you try to say, that is basically what has happened here.

 

[SkagKush]

i didnt mean trick per say, but i feel u. just a high dose of bupe wouldnt kill as much pain as oxy.

 

[jamesBrown]

i didnt mean trick per say, but i feel u. just a high dose of bupe wouldnt kill as much pain as oxy.

I know that, thats why he should take a low dose of bupe. It should work fine.....if not, im sure they will put him on another medication rather than watch him suffer.

 

[SkagKush]

hmm, now im curious what they will prescribe.

 

[jamesBrown]

I think its odd how the OP stated that switching to suboxone from oxy would be "...moving up the table". Im pretty sure oxy is a much more serious drug with many more side effects than suboxone. I mean for gods sake, suboxone is only a partial agonist!

 

[ironman7]

I'm an opiate addict,and am currently on Suboxone therapy.I now take 16mg a day.I started out 5 years ago on 2mg.I have kicked suboxone and gotten completely clean several times.Let me tell you,for me anyway, SUBOXONE WAS THE LONGEST MOST PAINFUL KICK EVER! It doesn't matter what dosage I'm at when I stop.Suboxone has a half life of 7 days.I was sick as a bastard for 15-16 days until I could leave the house.Also be careful with benzos.I had 6 seizures when I kicked xanax and/or klonipin,in a treatment facility.As far as the OC's go.If you take them for any length of time(months or years) you are going to be very uncomfortable when you stop,even if your doc tapers you down gradually. I also suffer from horrible migranes. I haven't had one in a couiple years.The last one I had I couldn't walk or talk.I was given a spinal tap,and 50mg of atavan was administered IV along with several large injections of demerol and oxymorphone(dilaudid).I was still throwing up,couldn't open my eyes and couldn't speak. Pain is an enemy of life,we all want to live without it.However,I had to ask myself,what am I willing to go through when it's time to stop the meds.

 

[jamesBrown]

I'm an opiate addict,and am currently on Suboxone therapy.I now take 16mg a day.I started out 5 years ago on 2mg.I have kicked suboxone and gotten completely clean several times.Let me tell you,for me anyway, SUBOXONE WAS THE LONGEST MOST PAINFUL KICK EVER! It doesn't matter what dosage I'm at when I stop.Suboxone has a half life of 7 days.I was sick as a bastard for 15-16 days until I could leave the house.Also be careful with benzos.I had 6 seizures when I kicked xanax and/or klonipin,in a treatment facility.As far as the OC's go.If you take them for any length of time(months or years) you are going to be very uncomfortable when you stop,even if your doc tapers you down gradually. I also suffer from horrible migranes. I haven't had one in a couiple years.The last one I had I couldn't walk or talk.I was given a spinal tap,and 50mg of atavan was administered IV along with several large injections of demerol and oxymorphone(dilaudid).I was still throwing up,couldn't open my eyes and couldn't speak. Pain is an enemy of life,we all want to live without it.However,I had to ask myself,what am I willing to go through when it's time to stop the meds.

Have you ever tried 0.5 mg doses or maybe 0.3??? because thats what I take and it feels VERY euphoric everyday, gives me an energy boost, and acts as an anti-depressant.....yet, at the same time, I can stop taking the suboxone anytime with no withdrawals. I have taken several breaks from my suboxone just to see if I was addicted and not once did I have a withdrawal symptom. the longest break I took was 15 days long. The only reason I take the breaks is because the subs feel even better when you start taking them again after a break.

Also...I was a heroin addict before I got onto suboxone....I was IV'ing MASSIVE amounts of black tar heroin everyday for 4 years. I was able to switch over to 2mg's of suboxone on the first day, and quickly drop down to 0.5 mg doses or less.

im curious if you tried the dose levels I was talking about because you might not have experienced the severe long withdrawals if you had gone that low. Atleast thats my experience with it.

 

[ironman7]

I was also a massive IV heroin user.I've been on Suboxone on and off for about 5 years.For the first time,I don't even think about dope.I still used to crave when I was on lower doses.I've been an animal my whole adult life.Drinking,drugging and chasing women.I have recently gone through tremendous change in my life and don't behave like that anymore.I know alot of people on Suboxone/Subutex and everybody is different.My friend Sean takes 32 mg a day.Others take 1mg and say they feel high.I also take 1mg of klonipin daily and that helps alot.I'm very hyper-active and get riddled with anxiety easily.The 16mg suboxone/1mg klonipin combination works great for me.

 

[jamesBrown]

I was asking you if you ever lowered your suboxone dose to less than 1mg before you stopped taking it to prevent the horrible, long lasting withdrawls you were complaining about?