Opioids Kratom use for newly clean opiate addicts??

[PetSMiLE]

First i'd like to say hello the the Bluelight community... it's been a while. I love the forum and have learned a helluva lot here over the past couple years, but I noticed that coming on BL while trying to get clean(-er anyway) definitely complicates the process - for me at least. All the drug talk makes me more inclined to think about using. That being said, i take nothing away from BL and its overall mission of harm reduction which is invaluable.

Anyhow, after a year and a half or so of doing the ol' suboxone/opiate of choice switcharoo routine (ie not being able to let go) I finally got off ALL opiates. The long and protracted mental withdrawal sucked badly, but I must admit I found kratom extremely helpful toward the end when finally kicking my suboxone crutch.

As far as getting high, kratom obviously did not do very much when I was using... those with an appreciable opiate tolerance know the stuff is only useful to help quell WD's. However, with a near-baseline - not sure if i can ever get back to total baseline - tolerance I just found out the other day how enjoyable kratom can be.

It gave me a fabulous, energetic buzz and I was also shocked at what a great aphrodisiac it seemed to be. My question to the opiophiles out there is-- to what extent can a mild opiate like kratom be enjoyed without falling into the same trap that "recreational heroin/oxy use" typically leads to.

I might add that I *am* well aware of the fact that kratom is addicting, can lead to WD symptoms, and that some people have had habits so bad they needed to use suboxone to taper off. Still, it is clear that kratom is a much more mild and user friendly substance... which i presume could be used recreationally with far less danger than the stronger, more instantly gratifying opiates.

It was so difficult finally getting clean for me that I have ZERO desire to even attempt any kind of structured schedule for semi-regular heroin/oxy use. After all, I've already learned the hard way and it totally screwed up my life in a big way. I just feel that casual kratom use is a different animal and would not be too much of a risk to try... anybody who's been in a similar situation have any advice? Is it reasonably possible to enjoy kratom and not fall back into hardcore opiate addiction??

Of course even flirting with kratom right now - after only being clean about 3 months - might seem foolish, and it probably is. But although I am withdrawal-ish free (aside from a little PAWS depression), I can still ABSOLUTELY feel this "edge" inside of me sometimes that makes me realize why I got so attracted to opiates in the first place!!!

I just hope that "somethings missing" feeling will fade at some point, and it gradually has throughout the last 3 months of total abstinence... but the idea that it may never totally go away is very depressing to me.

Any feedback is much appreciated. And sorry for the lengthy post!!

 

[tablehead]

It will be even more risky since you are used to taking opiates on a regular basis. Youll blow out the first high rly quick and want to redose. avoid redosing and keep to dosing 1 time a week (chippy) and you should b fine.

 

[100mgbluepill]

I did almost the same exact thing you have done and im currently almost a daily user of kraom though i havnt had it for 5 days. I feel great when i take it, takes away the edge and any desire to take any sort of opiate. When i dont have it i honesly feel completely normal with no added desire to relapse and i think the fact that i can basically get it whenever i want jus puts my mind at ease and i have no cravings. Hope you can find a way to get rid of the edge because thats what i have been fighting for a long time, very depressing that it never really goes away.

 

[PetSMiLE]

I did almost the same exact thing you have done and im currently almost a daily user of kraom though i havnt had it for 5 days. I feel great when i take it, takes away the edge and any desire to take any sort of opiate. When i dont have it i honesly feel completely normal with no added desire to relapse and i think the fact that i can basically get it whenever i want jus puts my mind at ease and i have no cravings. Hope you can find a way to get rid of the edge because thats what i have been fighting for a long time, very depressing that it never really goes away.

So when you first started taking kratom, after getting clean from traditional opiates, what was your initial "schedule" like?? How often did you decide you would indulge per week... I am very curious since now you say you are a near-daily kratom user which like ANY opiate can happen very easily no matter HOW your opiate regimen starts off.

Although it is very encouraging that in spite of your kratom habit deepening, you seem to still be largely in control. 5 days off from any opiate without feeling any WD's or getting overly-jonesy with the cravings is great!! At least from a relative standpoint having been thru what we have been thru, anyway.

I am all but sure I will end up taking kratom now and then so long as i can promise myself to stay completely away from stronger opiates. I know the addict's brain constantly tries to justify any excuse to use again and convince themselves it's ok, and this may sound naive BUT...

I feel like just knowing there is a less addictive, still-satisfying buzz out there that i can indulge in makes it *much* easier to avoid thinking about heroin or oxys. With kratom you can tickle your opioid receptors without resorting to much more dangerous (and expensive) opiates to get off-- besides nowadays intense nods are the very last thing I need!!!

Thanks a lot for your input. Good luck with everything!

 

[100mgbluepill]

I was taking it everyday, i have chronic pain in my stomach that makes it to where i cannot eat and while i was going without meds i took kratom to help and it worked great. I got a great buzz from 5-7 grams of bali kratom which allowed me to eat llike a normal person and when i ran out of the ounce i bought i had no symptoms for those 5 days except my normal stomach problems.

How do you plan on dosing? Tea or the capsules?

 

[PetSMiLE]

I was taking it everyday, i have chronic pain in my stomach that makes it to where i cannot eat and while i was going without meds i took kratom to help and it worked great. I got a great buzz from 5-7 grams of bali kratom which allowed me to eat llike a normal person and when i ran out of the ounce i bought i had no symptoms for those 5 days except my normal stomach problems.

How do you plan on dosing? Tea or the capsules?

Mostly in a tea... in the past I have either made a tea (sometimes with chocolate flavor) or if i was lazy or in a hurry i would just dump my dose in some yogurt and eat it all. I do not notice much overall difference between the tea and eating the ground leaf, except that the tea comes on a lil quicker.

I already know that (like tablehead mentioned) whatever days i do dose, it will be extremely difficult to not re-dose at least once during the dosing day. I think kratom's active compounds have pretty short half-lives because the high doesn't last too long for me. As such, i am not even going to pretend to hold myself to a strict "no multiple doses" plan... since it will only be disheartening when i break the rule within a couple weeks.

So i was thinking that a realistic schedule, which still prevents any withdrawal, would be NO MORE than two dosing-days in a week... with a 3 tea limit for those days. Also, the chosen dosing-days MUST be at least 2 days apart.

Obviously this is not the strictest regimen in the world, and i suppose it is probable that a definite mental habit will develop... but since kratom is not too expensive and addiction liability nowhere near as bad as heroin or oxy I really don't care much. Besides, look at all the religious coffee drinkers out there dependent on caffeine to function!! Everyone's got their poison, the trick for me here is just to stick to the above schedule.

In any case, assuming I *do* stick to my weekly limit-- even if i were to drink 3 teas on every single day i dose does anyone think such a dosing schedule will eventually lead to withdrawals and trouble in general??