Important: What should be in the Codeine FAQ?

[MrIbis]

^ It's more like a gram is soluble in 100ml of water at that temperature.

I use around 300ml or a bit less, I don't measure it anymore. I have used codeine a lot and had quite a problem with it and my liver has just been verified to be fine via a liver function test.

In theory no that is ridiculous to use that much water, have you seen any data on what the solubility of APAP is that low? I haven't but I'm guessing it's going to still be a potentially dangerous amount in solution, not even counting the particles suspended in the liquid. Unless you do an experiment to confirm that theory (not consuming it of course) or see some solid data then I would not try that. Even if it's only 5 grams of APAP it's more then you want and if you use a CWE regularly or consume APAP regularly, drink a lot etc, then that could be dangerous.

I try to use as little water as possible! I mean having to have any more than one sip of that foul fluid is nigh unbearable.

 

[Mr Blonde]

^ I'm happy with you and lefty handling the treatment side of things, you two know a lot more about it then I do. My only experience there is going cold turkey and dealing with that, I could probably add something to do with that side of it.

I agree with you that for most codeine users OMT is probably highly un-necessary, but I guess that's not a conversation for this thread.

 

[Anon54]

^ It's more like a gram is soluble in 100ml of water at that temperature.

I use around 300ml or a bit less, I don't measure it anymore. I have used codeine a lot and had quite a problem with it and my liver has just been verified to be fine via a liver function test.

In theory no that is ridiculous to use that much water, have you seen any data on what the solubility of APAP is that low? I haven't but I'm guessing it's going to still be a potentially dangerous amount in solution, not even counting the particles suspended in the liquid. Unless you do an experiment to confirm that theory (not consuming it of course) or see some solid data then I would not try that. Even if it's only 5 grams of APAP it's more then you want and if you use a CWE regularly or consume APAP regularly, drink a lot etc, then that could be dangerous.

yeah I've looked around the internet of the solubility of APAP in water colder than 20 degrees & can't find any information. there should be a gragh somewhere on the internet comparing solubility at different temps in how many mLs. Wish someone could find some info on this and post it here.
interesting to know its solubility properties at 5-10 degrees so people could more accuretely know how much water is safe to use. because ime the more water ya use the more % codeine u end up with compared to the amount originally used. plus the extraction is faster

 

[Mr Blonde]

^ I really don't want to take this off-topic anymore but there is no need to take the temperature down to that low. 21 degrees is fine, I use cold water out of the tap and use enough water to dissolve the tablets, have never had any problems.

 

[Anon54]

I try to use as little water as possible! I mean having to have any more than one sip of that foul fluid is nigh unbearable.

uuuummmmmm the more water u use the weaker the taste is.
cuz ya drinkin all ya codeine outta just a tiny bit of water. u should actually add more water to your end product if u think it tastes to strong to weaken the taste.

 

[Mr Blonde]

Seriously guy, this thread is not for that type of discussion.

So Mr Ibis, leftwing and myself have volunteered ourselves to help out with this. Drug mentor you put together a fantastic list of potentiators in your thread along with experiences of each one, that should definitely be included in this thread and I'm sure you would be able to contribute more as you continue your experiments. Anyone else?

 

[Anon54]

^ I really don't want to take this off-topic anymore but there is no need to take the temperature down to that low. 21 degrees is fine, I use cold water out of the tap and use enough water to dissolve the tablets, have never had any problems.

U use up to 300mLs of just cold tap water, really?
I suppose in theory it would be safe but I thought everyone put it in the freezer for a while. that's what it says in every CWE manual I've ever read. Maybe I've been wasting m time waiting for the water temp to go so low. gtg now anway sorry to get off topic.
gl with the FAQ

 

[Jabberwocky]

^ I'm happy with you and lefty handling the treatment side of things, you two know a lot more about it then I do. My only experience there is going cold turkey and dealing with that, I could probably add something to do with that side of it.

I agree with you that for most codeine users OMT is probably highly un-necessary, but I guess that's not a conversation for this thread.

sounds like a plan. i've got a few other things going on at the moment but will invest as much time toward this as possible.

a lot of what needs to be included in the codeine FAQ has been covered umpteenth times in there already so i'm liking this idea

 

[phase_dancer]

OK, Anon54, your questions seemed to have been answered. Let's get this topic back on track with suggestions for an FAQ. Spurious and/or off topic talk will be unapproved.

Great Mr Blonde. If I can leave it to you guys to get something together between yourselves, then great. Contact me when you've a rough draft, or if you need any help.

Meanwhile...anyone think of anything important that hasn't been included?

 

[Anon54]

Regarding potetiating Codeine

I dont know if there should be any info on the FAQ about potentiating because all the information is conflicting. Read this thread I wrote about Codeine to Morphine conversion and evidence of different websites stating conflicting information:

Potentiating the Conversion of Codeine > Morphine:
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=511261

some sites say prometh doubles effects, some say take before, some say take after. Some say diphenhydromine stops the conversion all together some say grapefruit juice potentiates, some say the opossite. Some sites say Morphine isn't even the main matabilite that has its main analgesic effects etc.

So If someone is going to right a FAQ about potentiating I hope they do alot of research and have some reputable websites to back up the information they claim.

 

[Mr Blonde]

^ You just need to use knowledge and analytical skills to solve that problem. Promethazine is a CYP2D6 inhibitor, meaning technically you are getting less codeine converted to morphine when you use it. But, it adds sedation to the experience which a lot of people like and are happy to sacrifice a little bit of the codeine for.

I don't know where you are reading this nonsense about diphenhydramine, but if you use studies and research on CYP2D6 interactions you will learn a lot more then just reading what I'm guessing are drug forums with a lot lower standards then Bluelight.

 

[MrIbis]

Anon54: ffs don't you get it yet mate? THIS THREAD ISN'T ABOUT USING CODEINE.

We're brainstorming ideas for a big thread to counter-act all the fucking codeine-chemical-romance threads that seem to pop up in here on a more than daily basis. I'm sure everyone of us is just as much as fan as you are mate - but there is a place for the kind of banter you're putting forth, and it's in Other Drugs. I don't mean to be rude, but we've addressed your questions and been nice about it when clearly this wasn't the place for it - and mentioned that as well.

Please move your off topic discussions elsewhere.

 

[Mr Blonde]

He did raise one good point, that is the one of sources. I wouldn't go so far as to create a bibliography but a reading section with links would suit the mega thread well.

 

[Anon54]

I originally asked my Question in Aus drug discussion and asked to move the question to this thread as all Codeine questions will not be answered no more because of this new FAQ thread ideas.
I appreciate the help with answering my questions.
Im just hopeing ppl do there research about codeine potentiating before putting it on the FAQ & they have reputable sources to back it up. (thx for agreeing Mr Blonde)
that so called nonsense I wroute about diphenhydromine stopping codeine from working is from the Codeine page on wikipedia. Wikipedia usually has pretty accurate info with good sources. maybe it is BS. I don't know.
anyways, back on topic here is a vid from youtube about simple CWE:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wdV2YOa4Xc
maybe a vid like this could be made but in much more detail so nobody has to ever ask questions about the actual prosedure.

 

[MrIbis]

I didn't mean to take a stab at you mate.

I appreciate that knowledge is attained by the asking of questions. Just i think the time for random questions in here has passed

 

[Moral Decay]

maybe could cover whether or not taking high doses of codeine occupies the opiate receptors preventing harder opiates from working.

could also mention the different potentiators and their effects. I myself have had some exhilarating effects taking Chlorphenrimine with codeine. makes it less sedating and more exhilarating for lack of a better term at the same time as reducing the histamine reaction.

 

[phase_dancer]

Im just hopeing ppl do there research about codeine potentiating before putting it on the FAQ & they have reputable sources to back it up.

Everything will be researched, and checked, I'm sure. imo this particular subject doesn't need to be addressed in great detail, although the dangers with potentiation need to be highlighted. Recreational poly-drug use, in whatever context, should not be encouraged. Basic HR.

 

[Anon54]

yeah FAQ is a good idea because im sure my simple questions about accidently freezing the water or wheather Codeine is dissolved equally have been answered 100 times. I should have utse to begine with but it's just an overwhelming amount of posts to sort through

 

[Anon54]

here is a good website containing info on Cytochrome P450 Drug Interactions including Codeine. Maybe it maybe useful in the FAQ as it states the inducers & the inhibitors.

the part that confusers me is whether an inhibitors such as diphenhydromine slow or or reduce the conversion of codeine > morphine. Obviously inducers would potentiate Codeine.
Grape fruit juice is an inhibitor that's proven to work for valium. & it has metabolits of temazepam, nordiazepam & oxezapam. doesnt slow or stop the conversion to these metabolites unless the diazepam potentiation out weighs the effects of all these metabolites.
This stuff is all to technical for me. Anyways, I'm just providing the link.

http://www.ildcare.eu/Downloads/artseninfo/CYP450_drug_interactions.pdf

 

[Mr Blonde]

^ That is a very useful chart, I have a copy of it.

Inhibitors will reduce the conversion of codeine into morphine, meaning you get less morphine out of the dose.