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AADD Moderators: Tronica
Legal Highs - And the bad side effects??
- Thread starter looey
- Start date
chemi
Bluelighter
I must say I agree with Coolio, BL has asked companies for their ingredients before and they have been shown to have previously either been misleading, incomplete or downright WRONG.
They could argue the reasoning for this is to keep business secrets under wraps. Pfft...
They could argue the reasoning for this is to keep business secrets under wraps. Pfft...
Jakeperson
Bluelighter
Use the search engine, you obviously haven't been looking very hard. There is info all over BL about this substances.
However coolio, in Aus importing any of these substances could land you in trouble. HBWR can be bought locally however.
Jakeperson
Bluelighter
Pipes aren't. Cathinones are in the grey area however federal police are now cracking down on Mephedrone hard and precedent is legal to be set soon.
Anything that's an analogue of another substance is generally considered illegal here
Anything that's an analogue of another substance is generally considered illegal here
Hi Guys,
I am in NZ where these pills are available everywhere from Headshops to Dairies.
Just wanted to clarify that the party pill brands listed above are not spiked with RCs such as the UK products. These products have been developed by Stargate in NZ who are an ethical company who developed the products as safer alternatives to methamphetamine, which is a big problem down here.
The ingredients listed are true, however they list the plant rather than specific chemicals extracted from the plant, eg: Geranium extract = DMAA. Bitter orange = Synephrine. Guarana = Caffeine.
We use these products all the time, while not as strong as the real thing, they certainly give a decent energy kick and some mild euphoria, well worth a try IMO, however there are some basic rules to follow: Take them on an empty stomach. Do not exceed stated dose (Trust me). Do not mix with alcohol.
I am in NZ where these pills are available everywhere from Headshops to Dairies.
Just wanted to clarify that the party pill brands listed above are not spiked with RCs such as the UK products. These products have been developed by Stargate in NZ who are an ethical company who developed the products as safer alternatives to methamphetamine, which is a big problem down here.
The ingredients listed are true, however they list the plant rather than specific chemicals extracted from the plant, eg: Geranium extract = DMAA. Bitter orange = Synephrine. Guarana = Caffeine.
We use these products all the time, while not as strong as the real thing, they certainly give a decent energy kick and some mild euphoria, well worth a try IMO, however there are some basic rules to follow: Take them on an empty stomach. Do not exceed stated dose (Trust me). Do not mix with alcohol.
Sameria
Bluelighter
^You seem an awful lot like someone who would benefit from people using legal highs. Let me guess, you own a headshop in NZ?
Ha ha, I wish.
Seriously though, all the Cathinones, ketones etc are illegal here under our analogue laws. They are not available here in any commercially available products. BZP and all related Piperazines have been banned for over a year now too, so you will not find them in any party pill type products either.
What you will find is pills containing a mixture of legal substances such as Caffeine, Synephrine, Octopamine, DMAA, PEA, Hordinine, Evodamine, L Tyrosine, DLPA etc. These substances are certainly active, just look them up on wiki or something if you want to know what they do.
Jakeperson
Bluelighter
Isn't that what you meant to say?
Every one can clearly see this. And every thing you said may be true, however it does not stop the fact that some of these products have been found to contain substances that weren't listed.
Coolio
Greenlighter
- Joined
- Feb 29, 2004
- Messages
- 6,938
None of those substances produce euphoria, Johnnywas. DMAA is the closest thing to a recreational drug you listed. Nobody gets high on caffeine. Synephrine and octopamine will effect your blood pressure and that's about it, they don't do shit. And amino acids aren't going to get you high either
As far as Stargate being an ethical company... didn't we have the problem of them refusing to admit they were selling methylone-based pills back in the day, keeping the ingredient a secret until someone performed an analysis of their own proving it was methylone?
As far as Stargate being an ethical company... didn't we have the problem of them refusing to admit they were selling methylone-based pills back in the day, keeping the ingredient a secret until someone performed an analysis of their own proving it was methylone?
I'm not into online arguments so will just agree to disagree.
As far as I am aware Stargate list all ingredients. They got M1 authorized by the ministry of health before releasing it and it was never mainstreamed, rather sold only to those who were already using street xtc pills. I also believe Stargate helped identify the ingredients in Neodoves, Phasedancer can probably confirm what role they played in that?
As for euphoria, I get mild euphoria from AMP, which is a mix of DMAA, Chocamine and Caffeine. Same with the dutch herbal xtc that contains synephrine, caffeine, vitamins and aminos. Maybe I,m special
I do find it strange that other forums are fill of glowing reports of these products, while this forum is fill of totally negative reports. The truth is likely somewhere between these two extremes. I mean surely these companies need repeat customers to survive?
Anyone who is thinking of trying these products, I would recommend trying Exotic (drop 2 on empty stomach). This is a good legal pill. It has less DMAA than other similar products and provides a nice mood lift and quite pronounced euphoria without too much stimulation or side effects. I would be very interested to hear what other (who have actually tried it) think of this product?
As far as I am aware Stargate list all ingredients. They got M1 authorized by the ministry of health before releasing it and it was never mainstreamed, rather sold only to those who were already using street xtc pills. I also believe Stargate helped identify the ingredients in Neodoves, Phasedancer can probably confirm what role they played in that?
As for euphoria, I get mild euphoria from AMP, which is a mix of DMAA, Chocamine and Caffeine. Same with the dutch herbal xtc that contains synephrine, caffeine, vitamins and aminos. Maybe I,m special
I do find it strange that other forums are fill of glowing reports of these products, while this forum is fill of totally negative reports. The truth is likely somewhere between these two extremes. I mean surely these companies need repeat customers to survive?
Anyone who is thinking of trying these products, I would recommend trying Exotic (drop 2 on empty stomach). This is a good legal pill. It has less DMAA than other similar products and provides a nice mood lift and quite pronounced euphoria without too much stimulation or side effects. I would be very interested to hear what other (who have actually tried it) think of this product?
Verybuffed
Bluelighter
Hey Johnnywas, do you know why the Australian TGA seized the entire last shipment of these legal highs that was due to be sold by the Off Ya Tree stores? Do you also know why the Australian Government leaned on them and forced them to remove all party pill items from sale?
If these things are as legal as you say why would this happen? And what is to stop the average customer from having their order seized as well?
Also Starlight didn't identify the correct ingredients in the Neo range, it was Bluelight. Starlight came up with an incorrect ingredient listing.
If these things are as legal as you say why would this happen? And what is to stop the average customer from having their order seized as well?
Also Starlight didn't identify the correct ingredients in the Neo range, it was Bluelight. Starlight came up with an incorrect ingredient listing.
MrIbis
Bluelighter
Johnnywas: Maybe you just like lame drugs?
Stargate did mislead customers, because funily enough, their license to distribute those drugs was quite abruptly pulled as soon as m1 was listed as the active ingredient.
Glowing reports from people who don't know any better doesn't really cut the grain. People also buy these pills from shops, then sell them at raves to unsuspecting kids as E for 3x the price. these unsuspecting kids take their usual dose of pills and have seriously toxic effects because the ingredients are DANGEROUS. sheesh, doesn't take a doctor to figure that out.
Also, as everyone else said - it's pretty obviously you either work for one of these companies or are closely aligned with them.
Also that 'free form amino acids' bullshit has been used by other scamming companies in the past, Neorganics is a pretty solid user of that old lie.
Stargate did mislead customers, because funily enough, their license to distribute those drugs was quite abruptly pulled as soon as m1 was listed as the active ingredient.
Glowing reports from people who don't know any better doesn't really cut the grain. People also buy these pills from shops, then sell them at raves to unsuspecting kids as E for 3x the price. these unsuspecting kids take their usual dose of pills and have seriously toxic effects because the ingredients are DANGEROUS. sheesh, doesn't take a doctor to figure that out.
Also, as everyone else said - it's pretty obviously you either work for one of these companies or are closely aligned with them.
Also that 'free form amino acids' bullshit has been used by other scamming companies in the past, Neorganics is a pretty solid user of that old lie.
If listed on a NZ product 'free form amino acids' = L-tyrosine and DLPA. I understand in the UK it likey means cocktail of RC's.
As for the TGA, the sound like an evil, corrupt harm maximization based organization. From reading about their seizing products from an Aussie vendor in another thread on this forum it sounds like the reason for seizing the products was the fact that the products listed contraindications on the back of the pack, which they decided was a therapeutic claim. FFS, I guess they prefer the 'Not for human consumption' Bath Salt style of product. I'm sure future vendors will no longer list ingredient or warnings on their products. A great step forward for mankind wouldn,t you agree?
At the end of the day, most of whats sold as MDMA in NZ is now a mix of Piperazines and Mephedrone. These herbal formulas do provide a safer, predictable alternative. DMAA is now a Class D controlled substance in NZ. This is a positive step forward. This means regulations can now be put into place such as compulsory labeling requirements, dosage limits, advertising restrictions and age limits. The formula's can then be improved, made better and safer. Surely this is the way forward?
As for the TGA, the sound like an evil, corrupt harm maximization based organization. From reading about their seizing products from an Aussie vendor in another thread on this forum it sounds like the reason for seizing the products was the fact that the products listed contraindications on the back of the pack, which they decided was a therapeutic claim. FFS, I guess they prefer the 'Not for human consumption' Bath Salt style of product. I'm sure future vendors will no longer list ingredient or warnings on their products. A great step forward for mankind wouldn,t you agree?
At the end of the day, most of whats sold as MDMA in NZ is now a mix of Piperazines and Mephedrone. These herbal formulas do provide a safer, predictable alternative. DMAA is now a Class D controlled substance in NZ. This is a positive step forward. This means regulations can now be put into place such as compulsory labeling requirements, dosage limits, advertising restrictions and age limits. The formula's can then be improved, made better and safer. Surely this is the way forward?
Verybuffed
Bluelighter
The ingredient listing on the product seized and the product you are selling now is identical. There have been no changes made.
Verybuffed
Bluelighter
Diablo XXX, the ingredients are still listed as the same.
As far as I am aware Diablo XXX is a UK product containing unlisted RCs. They stole the name and packaging from the NZ product Diablo, which lists all ingredients on the back of the pack and does not contain RCs.
I think this is where a lot of the confusion has come from. As soon as a NZ manufacturer has a popular product it seems a certain UK manufacturer puts out a dangerous knock off product.
This practice has been happening since the 90,s with red dawn etc in the US, where some knock offs contained DXM, others were not even active.
I think this is where a lot of the confusion has come from. As soon as a NZ manufacturer has a popular product it seems a certain UK manufacturer puts out a dangerous knock off product.
This practice has been happening since the 90,s with red dawn etc in the US, where some knock offs contained DXM, others were not even active.
Verybuffed
Bluelighter
Oops I did mean Diablo. I have the packet here in front of me now.
Is the issue because the say "Do not take if pregnant, lactating, suffer from mental illness or high blood pressure. Don't mix with other drugs or medicine, keep hydrated and party responsibly" Is that the therapeutic claim?
Is the issue because the say "Do not take if pregnant, lactating, suffer from mental illness or high blood pressure. Don't mix with other drugs or medicine, keep hydrated and party responsibly" Is that the therapeutic claim?
Yes, I believe that is considered a therapeutic claim by the backward thinking TGA. I hate to say it people, but the future of legal highs in Australia is going to be RC-spiked non-consumables such as plant foods, fertilizers, bath salts, incense etc. Thank the TGA (Disease industry) for that.