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N&PD Moderators: Skorpio
Stimulants of the Future II
- Thread starter Hammilton
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dread
Bluelighter
horrible. bk-n-methyl-xylopropamine? Check out the side effect profile of xylopropamine and see if you want to add beta ketone and n-methyl to it. This would very likely be another mephedrone, if not worse...
Aromatic nitrogens are a bit suspicious ...
This could very well be worthwhile. Also 4-propyl and 4-allyl should be worth exploring. The methyl homologue seems promising enough. I see no reason why the larger alkanes wouldn't perform just as well...chloral hydrate
Bluelighter
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As far as the pure stimulants go/ not hallucinogens or whatever I'm still interested in b-phenyl amphetamine. Kind of like cortex's amphenidate but this is a mix between desoxypipradrol and amphetamine.
And be careful with the 3,4-substitued whatever, 3,4-dihydroxy-amphetamine is supposedly a neurotoxin according to wikipedia. Don't know how much truth that is though. TMA-2 is very similar to 6-OHDA another neurotoxin yet I guess it's safe.Last edited:
dread
Bluelighter
amdopamine is a neurotoxin. It's produced as a metabolite of MDMA and is (part of) the reason why MDMA is neurotoxic.
However not all 3,4 substitutions are bad. MMA seems fairly benign...
negrogesic
Bluelight Crew
Yikes at 3,4-dimethylmethcathinone...
Nagelfar
Bluelight Crew
What Phenyltropane looks the most promising? (To whom it may concern)
ebola?
Bluelight Crew
So it causes cellular death and/or axon pruning, not just unpleasantness? It is in restricted medical use, for high blood pressure.
ebolachloral hydrate
Bluelighter
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No, he means alpha-methyl dopamine, really is that used for high blood pressure?
I doubt it's really extremely dangerous of a metabolite, I could see it forming from MDMA or even amphetamine but not to a permanent irreversible toxicity. Certainly nothing MPTP like. Plus, they said nicotine is a neurotoxin.
ebola?
Bluelight Crew
According to F and B, it is.
Well, it's good to hear that it's not too neurotoxic, really (I define "neurotoxic" as causing semi-permanent to permanent effects...not temporary adaptations).
I've been looking for something that feels like MDMA but without the horrid day-after, but if the chemical were likely that persistently neurotoxic due mainly to a unique-ish metabolite...well, I'd need to reconsider taking it at all.
ebola
dread
Bluelighter
MDAI combined with low dose selective DRI?
In theory it should be quite close to what you're looking for. There was even a study where a combination of MDAI and a DRI were given to rats and no signs of neurotoxicity were found. Although the DRI used was a funny one, not a typical DRI...
fastandbulbous
Bluelight Crew
It's not dangerous, just unfortunate, alphamethyldopamine is a 'false' neurotransmitter in that it gets used in the same way a dopamine molecule would be used, only it's less efficient at it's job. That's how it reduces blood pressure (and causes depression)
It's like a sub-standard replacement
chloral hydrate
Bluelighter
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- 139
Seems you're right ebola, bulbous it also seems to be what the medication "methyldopa" decarboxylates to, same as "l-dopa" decarboxylates to dopamine although I'm not sure if the former crosses the bloodbrain barrier. Not very toxic obviously.
hugo24
Bluelighter
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nuke
Bluelighter
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See these pages:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cocaine_analogues
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Nuklear/Nocaine
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CPCA
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troparil
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WIN_35428
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RTI-31
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RTI-32
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RTI-51
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RTI-55
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RTI-274
These papers:
Keverline-Frantz, K.; Boja, J.; Kuhar, M.; Abraham, P.; Burgess, J.; Lewin, A.; Carroll, F. (1998). "Synthesis and ligand binding of tropane ring analogues of paroxetine". Journal of medicinal chemistry 41 (2): 247–257.
Runyon, SP; Carroll (2006). "Dopamine transporter ligands: recent developments and therapeutic potential". Current topics in medicinal chemistry 6 (17): 1825–43.
Carroll FI, Kotian P, Dehghani A, Gray JL, Kuzemko MA, Parham KA, Abraham P, Lewin AH, Boja JW, Kuhar MJ. Cocaine and 3 beta-(4'-substituted phenyl)tropane-2 beta-carboxylic acid ester and amide analogues. New high-affinity and selective compounds for the dopamine transporter. J Med Chem. 1995 Jan 20;38(2):379-88.
Kimmel, H.; O'Connor, J.; Carroll, F.; Howell, L. (2007). "Faster onset and dopamine transporter selectivity predict stimulant and reinforcing effects of cocaine analogs in squirrel monkeys". Pharmacology, biochemistry, and behavior 86 (1): 45–54.
Balster, RL; Carroll; Graham; Mansbach; Rahman; Philip; Lewin; Showalter (1991). "Potent substituted-3 beta-phenyltropane analogs of cocaine have cocaine-like discriminative stimulus effects". Drug and alcohol dependence 29 (2): 145–51.
Xu, L.; Kelkar, S.; Lomenzo, S.; Izenwasser, S.; Katz, J.; Kline, R.; Trudell, M. (1997). "Synthesis, dopamine transporter affinity, dopamine uptake inhibition, and locomotor stimulant activity of 2-substituted 3 beta-phenyltropane derivatives". Journal of medicinal chemistry 40 (6): 858–863.
ebola?
Bluelight Crew
Fine, fine. I would consider behaviorally significant impairment lasting years (but followed by recovery) "damage". Maybe axons regrown following the drug induced death of their predecessors, but then subsequent regrowth would fit the bill...although the axons would grow in an entirely new configuration, perhaps counting as "permanent damage".
Anyway, I really meant that receptor down-regulation, feeling bad for a few days, etc. doesn't count.
ebola?
Bluelight Crew
nuke:
man...the data up on the wiki is so much more opulent for the DARIs than novel sub'd phenethylamines or other releasing agents. What gives?
ebola
fastandbulbous
Bluelight Crew
It's the local anaesthetic activity that's responsible for the bulk of the cardiotoxicity (inhibiting propagation of the trigger pulse from the sino-arterial node)
dread
Bluelighter
Yes, and the benzoic acid ester is mostly responsible for the local anaesthetic activity. Remove that ester / replace with straight phenyl and local anaesthetic effect is gone, pretty much.
Anyway if you guys think there's no point in discussing these substances here, I'll respect that.
Nagelfar
Bluelight Crew
The similarity in 2D of nocaine & phenmetrazine interests me, with the former being relative to its compared assays a mild drug and the latter colloquially the best of its class, is what interests me.
Though I suppose they may be no more similar to one another than to methylphenidate, it is just the arrangement of the 2D images as I see them on Wikipedia that makes me think otherwise? 2Ds can be shewn many ways - The top ring on either being interchangeable with a tropane to get cocaine-types and the like - but the branch coming out of their regardless of what it is (a tropane portion or a piperidine ring) is responsible for the binding creating reuptake inhibition of the monoamines... it does to me look like nocaine & preludin have interchangeable parts potentially though, in a closer knit fashion than elsewhere in the myriad of variant types- Status
