training flatout

bighooter

bighooter

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 31, 2008
Messages
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Would it be beneficial if I was training twice a day? maybe even 7days a week!
Doing cardio in the morning and weights in the evening.

My goal is to get very muscular, not necessarily massive but just very muscular/low body fat. But obviously want to get as big as possible.

I mean surely aslong as I eat enough calories and keep myself in an anabolic environment i'll grow right?

My theory is if the body is constantly getting battered and needs to repair different muscles everyday its going to crank up the GROWTH hormone production thus turning you into a powerful beast.

Your thoughts n comments would be appreciated.
 
As you've noted doing this will require a lot more calories. Other problem you may run into is CNS burnout and overtraining.

I'd say 4 weight sessions and 3 cardio sessions would be the most you'd want to aim for without introducing more problems than benefits.
 
central nervous system burnout eh? What are the symptoms of that?

Because about a year ago when I was training twice a day I was CONSTANTLY lethargic allday and as soon as I put my head on the pillow I was sound asleep (had the best sleep of my life for the couple months I was training)

However my dear friend I wasnt consuming enough calories so this is probably why I was so lethargic, however my resting heartbeat was rediculously low which in turn made me have NO ANXIETY. However I was very depressed still... this could be why I was so lethargic. Or it may of been CNS damage?

At the moment though Im training on a daily basis either weights or cardio and am having difficulty sleeping, mainly due to sweating too much because im on prozac.
But then again I know because im eating alot that cant be doing me no good, because I wake up in the middle of the night starving hungry. Probably due to a massive drop in blood sugar. Which is unavoiadable really because if I dont eat before bed Im too hungry and cant sleep. I need carbs to get me asleep. But this is why I think eating too much is a bad thing because your just creating massive spikes in insulin which cant be no good for you in the long run.

Hence why after everything ive said Im more focused on getting lean and strong as possible than big n bulky n strong. Its tough to get the balance right.

Too me though sleep is the most important thing in my life and when im not sleeping properly i can feel my body slowly aging. Although the prozac is making me feel better when it comes to sleep it isnt helping. But this is why I need to train twice a day just to completely where myself out I think.
 
You can work two different muscle groups a day, you just shouldn't push it too far and be sure the muscles worked have plenty of time to recover once you finish your work out. You also have to keep in mind what secondary muscles you worked. I've found it best to work the same muscle groups two times a week, with about 4 days recovery for each group. The longer the workout, the more energy you need. Thus, more calories. Where and how do you think Phelps won all those swimming medals? His caloric intake was through the roof, and he swam for hrs. a day.


/V
 
Oh, and are you taking any benzos? When I take a benzo, I always wake up with hunger pains. I ask because something like prozac is usually taken with a benzo of some sort.

/V
 
If you're overtraining, you'll definately know it....I'll stick to my homie Gregg Valentino on this topic with his infamous quote, "There's no such thing as overtraining, just under-recovering."

I pretty much workout at least 6 days a week for at least an hour a session...I follow a split like this, although I want to change it ---Any suggestions?

Chest
Back
Legs
Shoulders/traps
Bi/Tris/Forearms

Abs are done everyday as well as calves.
 
You can afford to overtrain if you take steroids, but it will do more harm than good if you aren't on a cycle IMO.
 
i cant understand how it can do more harm if you do it naturally, surely the more you train the more your will grow?
 
DJ25 said:
You can afford to overtrain if you take steroids, but it will do more harm than good if you aren't on a cycle IMO.
Click to expand...

It's just harder to overtrain on steroids because recovery time is so much faster..
 
bighooter said:
i cant understand how it can do more harm if you do it naturally, surely the more you train the more your will grow?
Click to expand...

You need to do more research because you're missing a lot of the fundamental parts of weight training... To grow your body needs energy, protein, rest and more food. Your muscle is damaged from weight training to fatigue, and it is only after the muscle is repaired that it hypertrophises (grows). You can train 3 times a day but you'll get worse results than if you trained hard every second day. Yes, you read this right; if you want to gain muscle you need to eat a lot and sleep a lot and rest a lot.... training is probably 10% of muscle growth.
Also, understand you can only do 1 thing at a time; 1) lose fat, or 2) gain muscle. You can't do both at the same time (well, with GH maybe...). Do some research (find some ebooks via torrents) and you will realise that all your theories mean shit, b/c bodybuilders have already thought about it and would have flushed out any trick along time ago (some BBers actually have paid to sponsor studies university studies! that's how serious they are!)
As I said in the other post... don't overthink this. Start training and learn as you go. Overtraining is what stupid people do 6 weeks before summer... work steadily and smartly.
Gyms can be intimidating (even I think so after just a few yrs off) but if you can get started it's probably the hardest part of it all (ie getting started)
Good luck :)
 
Just as a rule of thumb, beginning bodybuilders do well following routines that have names that you can google along with "beginner" and get 100+ hits.
 
PARooolller said:
It's just harder to overtrain on steroids because recovery time is so much faster..
Click to expand...

Exactly. It's harder to overtrain off steroids because the opposite is true and also you can manage to do less before failure, the body will tell you once it tired. Off steroids you also ache like hell the next day which is a decent sign that you've worked your muscles well on steroids you don't seem to get the next day ache which means that you will just train again. You also risk injury on gear as you can often lift much more than your tendons etc can handle.
 
no im sorry im not having that

i must be extremely fit or immune to excercise then because I train everyday and dont even get a good sleep at night because I have too much energy.
I eat 6+ small meals a day and have done for a long time and have been working out proper for at least 4years.

I dont understand how Im overtraining if I still have a rediculous amount of energy and therefore cant sleep at night, maybe prozac has something to do with the energy I have. Maybe it counteracts the effect of CNS damage?

Also you obviously can gain muscle if you are running and doing weights at the same time. Aslong as you keep your body in an anabolic state I dont think you'd lose muscle, in fact you may even grow quicker due to better blood circulation etc due to cardio.
 
bighooter said:
no im sorry im not having that

i must be extremely fit or immune to excercise then because I train everyday and dont even get a good sleep at night because I have too much energy.
I eat 6+ small meals a day and have done for a long time and have been working out proper for at least 4years.

I dont understand how Im overtraining if I still have a rediculous amount of energy and therefore cant sleep at night, maybe prozac has something to do with the energy I have. Maybe it counteracts the effect of CNS damage?

Also you obviously can gain muscle if you are running and doing weights at the same time. Aslong as you keep your body in an anabolic state I dont think you'd lose muscle, in fact you may even grow quicker due to better blood circulation etc due to cardio.
Click to expand...

You're the one who asked the question... if you knew the answer why ask? :\
To grow muscle you need to be in an anabolic state.. your body is not going to build muscle if there is a calorie defecit. So like I said, it's one or the other. When you do cardio to lose fat you are burning more energy than you are taking in from food. A lot of this is counter-intuitive (ie the more often you train the worst it is) so you'd do be doing yourself a huge favor if you didn't assume you knew everything. :\
 
bighooter said:
My goal is to get very muscular, not necessarily massive but just very muscular/low body fat. But obviously want to get as big as possible.
Click to expand...

I'm sure you already know this, but if your goal is to get "very muscular/low body fat", it's much easier to get muscular first, then work on cutting the body fat. It seems like, by throwing running into the mix, you're trying to do both goals at the same time.

LOL, BTW, is your avatar a guy who shot up a college classroom?
 
Binge Artist said:
I'm sure you already know this, but if your goal is to get "very muscular/low body fat", it's much easier to get muscular first, then work on cutting the body fat.
Click to expand...

Exactly. I'm bulking at the moment (with a clean diet though, IMO a bad diet is only necessary for ppl with really fast metabolisms) so am not worrying about cardio, because if I did cardio in the morning and weights at night as bighooter suggests, then when would the body recover?
Your body doesn't grow in the gym. Period. It does that at home.
 
^honestly, I'm not even sure if cardio*** is a good idea for a cut. Certainly, a crucial element of cutting is a caloric restriction. But the main goal for a cut is to retain muscle while losing fat. So, since cardio causes recovery problems, even for people on a bulk with the benefit of caloric/nutritional surplus, imagine the grief it would cause folks who are lingering through a cutting diet.

In sum, I believe cardio might hamper the necessary weight work required to maintain muscle during a cut.

***and by "cardio", I'm talking about something fairly intense, like jogging. I admit that morning walks on a treadmil (especially done on an empty stomach) can be beneficial.
 
djsim said:
You need to do more research because you're missing a lot of the fundamental parts of weight training... To grow your body needs energy, protein, rest and more food. Your muscle is damaged from weight training to fatigue, and it is only after the muscle is repaired that it hypertrophises (grows). You can train 3 times a day but you'll get worse results than if you trained hard every second day. Yes, you read this right; if you want to gain muscle you need to eat a lot and sleep a lot and rest a lot.... training is probably 10% of muscle growth.
Also, understand you can only do 1 thing at a time; 1) lose fat, or 2) gain muscle. You can't do both at the same time (well, with GH maybe...). Do some research (find some ebooks via torrents) and you will realise that all your theories mean shit, b/c bodybuilders have already thought about it and would have flushed out any trick along time ago (some BBers actually have paid to sponsor studies university studies! that's how serious they are!)
As I said in the other post... don't overthink this. Start training and learn as you go. Overtraining is what stupid people do 6 weeks before summer... work steadily and smartly.
Gyms can be intimidating (even I think so after just a few yrs off) but if you can get started it's probably the hardest part of it all (ie getting started)
Good luck :)
Click to expand...

Well said!

/V
 
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