The Mephedrone Thread (4-mmc)

[tyrael]

I would think it would. You're mixing a depressant with a stimulant, so they would dull the effects of each other. Being that you were more drunk then high on 4MMC, the effects of 4MMC would have been dulled.

Of like VeryBuffed said, possibly too cut.

 

[Verybuffed]

I would think it would. You're mixing a depressant with a stimulant, so they would dull the effects of each other. Being that you were more drunk then high on 4MMC, the effects of 4MMC would have been dulled.

Of like VeryBuffed said, possibly too cut.

Real 4-MMC will overpower alcohol and MDMA to the point where it is not worth taking/wasting MDMA. Alcohol DEFINITELY intensifies the effects of 4-MMC dramatically.

 

[phase_dancer]

Yeah i thought so, this shit is heaps toxicer than we think.

Some of us were shouting warnings long ago, but they seem to mostly fall on deaf ears

While I can fully understand the curiosity of exploring a new substance, I'm still amazed at how many people will go hard, despite warning from those who have looked a little deeper, and there being no scientific evidence that indicates the stuff is safe. I'm quite convinced this stuff can and will produce permanent damage from long term and possibly even occasional heavy use. If you are going to use 4-MMC, then at least keep well abreast of any scientific publications on it and take heed of any anecdotal accounts of side effects, particularly those concerning circulation, chest pains etc.

Seeing that I'm hearing more and more of people taking large doses of 4-MMC, and then having trouble with breathing, pains, numbness etc, here's something recent by vecktor from the advance DD thread. Some people need to think long and hard about this.

Originally Posted by 65daysofstatic View Post
Neither is 10...

this is moronic.
10g is most certainly could be a lethal dose under certain circumstances.

when discussing toxicity ingeneral the concept of LD 50 is used. this is the dose that kills 50% of the test subjects, so for 50% of the test subjects the LD50 dose is not a lethal dose.

you morons need to read up on the long term adverse effects of low dose ephedrine given that you are exposing yourselves to the pharmacologically smilar paramethylephedrine metabolite. Ephedrine use causes vasocostriction of the vessels that supply blood to the heart, pathalogical examination of ephedrine users showed evidence of damage caused by lack of oxygen to the heart muscle, some users of 4MMC are reporting chest pains which sound a lot like angina, where the heart is not getting enough blood. even if there is no immediate serious effects this is a dangerous thing, the damage may accumulate.

Hence moderation is the key, avoiding the kind of stupid doses which lead to heavy exposures to the vasoconstrictive metabolites. I personally wouldn't touch 4-MMC with a shitty stick.

If any one wants to take the bet, I bet that scientific examination will show

1, 4-MMC is neurotoxic to neurons like methcathinone

2, 4-MMC is cardiotoxic due to vasoconstriction of the vessels supplying the heart muscle

3 Serious detectable pathalogical changes in heart muscle will be seen in heavy users.

some people are being really dumb with hothey use this untested drug, it is not big or clever or impressive to consume 10g it is plain stupid. it's not suprising because the typical profile of the heavy 4-MMC user posting here is, young, male and ill educated.

please be smart with dosingand consumption of this drug.

 

[MrIbis]

I would think it would. You're mixing a depressant with a stimulant, so they would dull the effects of each other. Being that you were more drunk then high on 4MMC, the effects of 4MMC would have been dulled.

Of like VeryBuffed said, possibly too cut.

That hypothesis is so incorrect - just coz you take one upper and one downer doesnt mean the effects are cancelled out.

It can just create a very unique synergistic effect.. I used to hate it when idiots would say "oh if you take (x) drug (say benzo) with (x) drug (meth) they'll do nothing"

which is a total lie, the benzo meth high is an amazing euphoric stimulant high... Same goes for alcohol with most stims.

 

[CrackSnapplePot]

Some of us were shouting warnings long ago, but they seem to mostly fall on deaf ears

phase_dancer - don't be disheartened, there are definitely some heeding the warnings. I and I'm sure many others appreciate what you and the other knowledgeable BLers are doing to spread information and warnings about potential dangers with drugs like 4mmc. I first signed up here to find info on 4mmc specifically, and although not a great deal is known per se, the information we have is invaluable.

 

[MrIbis]

But all this information is also subjective - and doesn't apply to everyone (the vasoconstriction issues). The process of banning drugs like this happens far to quickly, before we even get a chance to do the research because of a handful of morons overdoing it.

Not much we can do about the idiots though. the ignorant far surpass the intelligent in number

 

[ryan0202]

Re: alcohol and 'drone, I've done 'drone after about 6 beers and still got crazy effects after railing about 0.2 - 0.3g.

Alcohol definitely didn't cancel out the effects of the 'drone.

 

[Jakeperson]

I found with dropping it that I got more of an MDxx like high where I wouldn't have enjoyed drinking alcohol on it.

However this probably won't apply to every one as lots of people enjoy drinking on pills.

 

[psycosynthesis]

Just been reading the other threads. The amount that some people are doing of this is ridiculous. I know its been said but I reckon it is only really a matter of time before someone seriously fucks themselves (or even worse, others) with this one.

Play Safe as (hopefully) always kids.

 

[bettingawaywithit]

i seriously do give a shit what this stuff is called, it gets me twated, thats what matters

 

[psycosynthesis]

^The point of these boards is so that people can inform themselves about the drugs that they use or want to or are considering. Fair enough if that's your attitude, but this isn't the place to be parading it.

 

[bettingawaywithit]

and getting pissed on it just maximises the effects, makes it more and more like MDMA, although on decent sysnthesis of MDMA u can drink till the cows come how and u wont get pissed, but this stuff is just the bizz, it mixes well with other plant foods, its cheap, and most of all its legal

cash in while the legitimacy is high

 

[bettingawaywithit]

lighten up man, its all in good fun

 

[bettingawaywithit]

back to the original post...its true, drugs dont cancel each other out, unless u end up on narcam after an od, that just makes u rattle straight awaycost effective snowballs are the way forward i reckon, just be careful what u mix

 

[psycosynthesis]

lighten up man, its all in good fun

Remember the last bit of that saying?

 

[Sykik]

till someone losses an eye?

but people, please be carefull... it seems to be getting rather popular so spread the news to your uneducated friends about the apparent dangers of this drug...

and mixing drugs is always dangerous, especially a drug that people don't know what it's effects are on its own, let alone with a cocktail of other drugs in the bloodstream.

 

[rolls]

2ct2 and meph was a good combo

 

[tyrael]

"That hypothesis is so incorrect"

So, when tripping out and taken to a hospital a nurse giving you a benzo (and/or antipsychotic depending on the situation obvoiusly :S ) to reduced the effects of the other drug are "so incorrect"?

"oh if you take (x) drug (say benzo) with (x) drug (meth) they'll do nothing"

Never said that. However if one were to take a drug which induces depressive properties, and another which stimulates. (Obviously depending on the receptors involved) There would be a certain level of cross effects.

Also depending on the actual drug itself, it is quite possibly that one could feel the effects of one drug as a posed to another.

I have tried 4MMC myself (a sensible 200mg dose), however being an RC I erred on the side of caution and did not drink. So I couldn't personally say whether the 4MMC "drowns out" alcohol - my comment was working off basic principles**.

That being said, I'm happy to agree with people here who have either done extensive research (and can tell on a pharmacokinetic/pharmadynamic level) or (a collective) anecdotal evidence that 4MMC's effects are greater then alcohol's.


**Obviously here I'm talking in the general sense - not specifically about 4MMC.

 

[MrIbis]

^An Anti-psychotic KO is totally different - those drugs are designed to knock the patient out to prevent them suffering/and the people around them - suffering from a psychotic episode. It's not using drugs in synergy - thats a pre-defined knock-out route.

im not even gonna bother with this argument... i've done extensive research on all these substances, and can provide my own anecdotal evidence...

 

[madmick19]

So, when tripping out and taken to a hospital a nurse giving you a benzo (and/or antipsychotic depending on the situation obvoiusly :S ) to reduced the effects of the other drug are "so incorrect"?

Also depending on the actual drug itself, it is quite possibly that one could feel the effects of one drug as a posed to another.

I have tried 4MMC myself (a sensible 200mg dose), however being an RC I erred on the side of caution and did not drink. So I couldn't personally say whether the 4MMC "drowns out" alcohol - my comment was working off basic principles**.That being said, I'm happy to agree with people here who have either done extensive research (and can tell on a pharmacokinetic/pharmadynamic level) or (a collective) anecdotal evidence that 4MMC's effects are greater then alcohol's.

**Obviously here I'm talking in the general sense - not specifically about 4MMC.

theres a few issues here worth covering or pointing out, one thing is that doctors and nurses find it difficult to keep up with all the drugs that are about. so when faced with making clinical decisions- they are done with the best information that is available to them at the time. Dr Platypus would be better suited to discuss this point.

Mixing drugs is always more problematic then taking one on its own- espically if large amounts of both are taken. Also drugs have different modes of action and halflife/ effect. so you might be noticing one more than the otrher but both may still be active in your body.

another point is that trying to differntiate weather one s better than the other is a subjective measure as both substances are different. It is down o preference and expected action/out come. Back to the old zinberg model of drug set and setting influencing substance experiences.