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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic

How do I know if CWE worked?

curious_24

curious_24

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Joined
May 23, 2009
Messages
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Midlands
I occasionally take around 65mg of codeine and find that this gives me enjoyable but fairly mild effects. The only way I can get this much codeine is by taking 3x 200mg ibuprofen/12.8mg codeine and 2x 500mg paracetamol/12.8mg codeine - a total of 600mg ibuprofen, 1g paracetamol and 64mg codeine.

I would like to eliminate the non pyschoactive drugs and just end up wth the pure codeine. I tried a test CWE today using 8 paracetamols (just standard 500mg pills) and ended up with an almost clear liquid. My concern however is that even though the liquid was clear, the water still tasted very bitter (remember I did not use codeine/paracetamol pills, just cheap paracetamol).

Before downing the liquid, how can I know whether the liquid I have is safe to drink? I've UTFSE but this step seems to be a leap of faith as far as I can see.

Suggestions welcome! :D
 
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Let it get really cold, but not so cold it freezes (some binders seem to get really swollen if they freeze). This shouldn't take that long, since it's shallow. You will see the APAP actually crystallize out and you will be able to feel it as grit when you stick your finger into the liquid above the sludge and then rub your fingers.
Click to expand...

Did you do this part correctly? If you did, then its ok to drink. If not, stick the liquid back in the fridge and redo this step, if you see crystals being formed then you still have a good amount APAP in the solution. You will always have some APAP, just a greatly reduced amount. Filter out what comes up and you should have a purer solution.
 
curious_24 said:
I never saw any crystals, just a layer of white sludge on the bottom of the glass. I tried re-cooling and refiltering but nothing more came out. As I said above, the water was mostly clear but still tasted very bitter.

Also, i'm using coffee filters similar to theese -

http://www.globalpackagegallery.com/main.php/v/bev/coffeetea/MeliHa_CoffeeFilters.jpg.html

Will they filter out enough of the paracetamol?
Click to expand...

Are you using only coffee filters? If so, I'd suggest using a layer of tight cotton material (dress-shirt type material) and then a coffee filter. In my extractions, the top layer catches the majority of the APAP and binders.

Also, might I suggest cone coffee filters without "micro perforations" as that sounds like it would let alot more APAP through.
 
What type of filters do you use?
My coffee filters don't have the micro perforations, didn't notice that on the pic.

Would the dress shirt actually help as there are no visible particles left in my end result? I also tried a CWE with Nurofen Plus but the water always looked like milk regardless of how much chilling and filtering I did.
 
curious_24 said:
What type of filters do you use?
My coffee filters don't have the micro perforations, didn't notice that on the pic.

Would the dress shirt actually help as there are no visible particles left in my end result? I also tried a CWE with Nurofen Plus but the water always looked like milk regardless of how much chilling and filtering I did.
Click to expand...

I use ones similar to the ones you posted a pic of, without the "micro perforations." Just a standard cone coffee filter.

If you are getting a completely clear solution, you should be ok. How long does it take for all of that to filter through the coffee filter? Mine usually break apart at the seam if I leave them for too long.
 
Two coffee filters, one placed on the glass with it's edges "wrapped around" the glass, then the other placed in the first filter but not wrapped around it or anything, is absolutely fine.
You know it's safe to drink by having a firm belief in science really =D
As long as the water is cold then you have nothing to worry about in terms of there being too much Paracetamol in the solution or not getting the Codeine.
 
Does anyone know if the little amount of APAP and binders/fillers that gets through the CWE procedure is enough to give the end solution a bitter taste? Basically if you did a CWE on Just APAP tablets what should the end solution taste like?
 
It's Codeine that accounts for the majority of the bitterness. Paracetamol will probably have a slight bitterness but if it's a strong taste, it's likely to be down to Codeine.
 
Science pretty much tells you that as long as there aren't any/many solids in your solution and you didn't use way too much water then there can't be much paracetamol/ibuprofen. Codeine has a very bitter tase, if your CWE isn't bitter as fuck I would bet there is very little codeine in it, if any.
 
The bitter taste is perfectly normal, even a perfectly clean extraction will taste absolutely foul.

And I use the same coffee filters, stack one inside the other, pre-dampen them so they don't absorb your codeine, and you'll be fine.
 
1 gram of APAP is the therapeutic dose anyway. Why go to all the trouble just for taking out 1g of APAP? I guess if you take it more than 4x a day or you want to do more than your normal 65mg, then that would make sense, but...

Also, APAP and codeine taste different. Just take a sip and if it tastes strongly like APAP, put it in the fridge again.
 
As others have probably mentioned, some acetaminophen will dissolve in the water, but the colder the water is the less will dissolve. On the other hand, opiates like codeine are extremely water soluble. So they will suspended in solution regardless of temperature.
 
monstanoodle said:
It's Codeine that accounts for the majority of the bitterness. Paracetamol will probably have a slight bitterness but if it's a strong taste, it's likely to be down to Codeine.
Click to expand...

That's the thing that worries me - I did a CWE with just paracetamol tablets (no codeine at all) and even though the end product was pretty clear, it still tasted bitter as hell.

What I may do is prepare my test CWE then disolve paracetamol tablets in another glass containing the same amount of water, one half at a time until the two solutions look and taste the same. An inprecise method I know, but it will give me some idea of what gets through the filters.

In response to the above post, the ibuprofen really doesn't agree with me so I need to stop using it completely. Although i'm an opiate lightweight, I can barely feel 25.6mg codeine so will need to start CWE-ing(?) cocodamol to achieve my desired dosage.
 
Virtuoso said:
As others have probably mentioned, some acetaminophen will dissolve in the water, but the colder the water is the less will dissolve. On the other hand, opiates like codeine are extremely water soluble. So they will suspended in solution regardless of temperature.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I get the science behind the solubility of the two compounds, it's the reliability of the filtering that i'm not too confident about...
 
There will always be APAP left in the solution, the process reduces the amount, it doesn't eliminate it. You can tell if it worked if you have a lot of "mass" captured in the filter. You should try filter larger amounts, it will result in a better opiate:APAP/ibuprofen ratio. Keep the stuff you don't use for later.
 
Don't worry yourself. I've been doing it for around 2 years now and my liver is absolutely fine.
So as long as your water is cold it works perfectly ;)
 
Not to be the twack of the ear here, but the amount of paracetamol and ibuprofen you're trying to avoid, is not nearly even close to being a toxic or even dangerous dose. Just take your pills and you wont have to worry about loosing any of the opiate.

Once you start to really get above 5 grams of paracetamol, then I'd start to consider CWE.

BTW there are SO many tutorials on how to do it properly. There are even some well made VIDEOS that are step by step. Just search a little. Good Luck.



~vIcOdIn is DeLiCiOuS~
 
Of course it's going to taste bitter - the acet/paracetamol isn't the only thing in the tablet that tastes foul. There's so many binding agents, fillers, and dyes that also contribute to that taste.

The large amount of sludge left in the filter should be your signal that the process worked correctly. It's still going to taste horrible. Pure codeine ITSELF is bitter as hell.

And while both doses of ibu and para are safe to take, it's generally not safe to take them both at the same time. From what I understand, there's been a big hullabaloo here in the states over NSAIDs, especially when combined with acet/para. Especially if you do it frequently, or want to experiment with larger doses. I would continue doing the CWE myself, if I were in your shoes.

Trust in the science, and trust that two coffee filters WILL get rid of enough apap/para to make it safe to consume. The bitter taste just comes along with it. If you have 3 grams worth of para, and you filter out 2.5 grams of it, don't you think you've done enough?
 
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