Street drugs vs Pill IV (why is everyone scared of orange?)

[robatussin]

i was browsing the IV bupe thread along with many others in the past, the general consensus seems to be only shoot subutex, not suboxone *if you have the option. The only reason I have read tht suboxone is worse for IV use is its color and taste fillers. I have seen both suboxone and subutex shot, and I have not seen a difference.

If you buy heroin on the street, it cn be anywhere from transparent, transucent, and even a cloudy brown color, addicts certinly do not care bout color if they need a fix. With subutex I have seen clear to cloudy and suboxone even mixed wih diphenydramine is translucent. I know a suboxone weighs .4 grams per pill, I think subutex is about the same. (I would like someone to weigh one if they can)

I won't get in to the naloxone becuse that is not part of my question.

My question is: How does soluble color or flavor in one pill make people think the white version of the same drug is safer? Just becuse we don't see it does not mean fillers are not present in your solution. Also how would you rate the safety of shooting pills as opposed to street drugs?

You never know the cuts put in dope (or coke esp.), but you can read the pamphlet and see the fillers in pills. This is more than I usually type so any feedback appreciated.

Mods: If this is the wrong place for this thred, move it but my questions have everything to do with harm reduction. I do not want to tempt half the suboxone popultion to start shooting

 

[djsim]

Isnt it because Suboxone has naloxone in it, rather than orange coloring?
I would assume that the naloxone is what scares people off... b/c whether or not naloxone causes precipitated WD or not when IVd, it's more the 'scare factor' that naloxone poses...

If I was an opiate addict and someone offered me opiate with naloxone in it, i'd turn it down no matter what anyonbe on the internet or elsewhere said... b/c let's face it, precipitated WD is some scary shit. I've seen paramedics save the lives of junkies with naloxone before in Sydney, and no shit, the dude got up and started beating the shit out of the paramedic.

You see my point though, right?

Mods: If this is the wrong place for this thred, move it but my questions have everything to do with harm reduction. I do not want to tempt half the suboxone popultion to start shooting

it's all good man you've got a pretty good idea of OD material after 1400 post methinks

 

[citizen_snips]

AS said subutex is probably preferred just because it's more suitable for people as a whole, i've known a couple who (not while i was there) shot suboxone and ended up going off in an ambulance thanks to the severity of the withdrawals that kicked in.

 

[robatussin]

AS said subutex is probably preferred just because it's more suitable for people as a whole, i've known a couple who (not while i was there) shot suboxone and ended up going off in an ambulance thanks to the severity of the withdrawals that kicked in.

to both that responded: The buprenorphine will crete precipitated withdrawls as its affinity is higher than all agaonists I know (except tramadol) , even naloxone. If a person is on bupe regularly, this is not an issue, but let the facts be known, if you are about to come off a shorter acting full bliss type opite and shoot subutex lets say a few hours after your last dose, guess what? PRECIPITATED WITHDRAWL!!! oh no!

So in summary if one is transitioning from one opiate to the other, both wil cause precip withdrawl i believe the affinity of bupe is even higher than that of naloxone (figure that one out). I can provide a link but I have to go get my script. I just want to know what makes "flavor and color" bad when white is a color too and the pills weigh roughly the same, and I am starting to doubt shooting pills (depending which ones) might be safer than shooting street drugs which this site also seems to think collectively (except the rational ones)

 

[FrostyMcFailure]

IV suboxone just seems stupid imo. If you want to IV get some real drugs that dont have binders & fillers that could potentially cost an arm.

 

[phatass]

when i shot up subutex (Arrow) i would use a micron filter and get a clear solution...

 

[The Hebrew Hammer]

i still dont get the bupe shooting aspect...

i remember when i first got on maintenance and still wanted to get high i would save up l;ike 40mg and take it with practically no effect, i cant see shooting it anybetter, unless someone is opiate naiave then taking bupe recreationally seems pointless, and if you are opiate naive then wtf are you doing shooting shit up??

just my opinion...

 

[DeLee]

ALOT of people who go on the bupe program here in Sweden shoot their Subutex. (Or used to, now they sell their Suboxone and buy Subutex...)
You get 100% of the bupe and the relief hits you instant and i think it is a needle fixation also, previous IV heroin users etc.
But Suboxone doesn't work as good as Subutex IV... sure you can IV and get effect but it differs from Subutex - thats why people sell their Suboxone to buy Subutex.

But when adding an antihistamine to Suboxone its fine... sedating.

Anyway, here in Sweden the Suboxone ain't orange anymore... just the taste.
Personally i would rather shoot street dope than pills... but i do not follow my own rules all the time.. :/

 

[megawoof]

why dont people just obtain buprenex its cheap as chips and is MEANT FOR IV why shoots pills aint good idea

 

[Captain.Heroin]

Also how would you rate the safety of shooting pills as opposed to street drugs?

Street drugs are much safer. The inactive ingredients in pharmaceutical pills typically are very hard for the body to get rid of if you miss a shot. Medical complications with pills are more likely than street drugs (like heroin but not including all street drugs).

If you trust the people who you do business with, and you have consistent quality product, IV heroin is a lot safer than IV suboxone.

Both can be done safely though, and are very easy to accomplish. It's in essence the same prepping procedure.

You chop up the heroin or suboxone tablet, mix the fine powder in with water, let the sediment settle, draw back the clear(er) solution leaving the cut at the bottom. And there you have it, heroin or buprenorphine prepped for injection.

 

[a100unitSHOT]

So, this has been my argument the whole time. Although I don't see a point in shooting bupe, I don't get why people freak out about shooting pills. Like back when I used to shoot OC, I'd get so much shit for it because "You're not supposed to shoot pills!" But, at least you know that the pills are pharm grade and we know what's in them. Somehow, people think that shooting street drugs is much safer, but we have absoluetly no idea what the fuck the person before us put in them. Yeah, binders and fillers are bad, but some of the shit I've heard of dealers putting in their dope? Come on...

 

[v4lium]

I would rather shoot pills with binders than dope filled with cornstarch or icing sugar or something even stupider.

 

[thugpassion]

When I jump back on subutex Id never shoot it the very first dose that I took, maybe after youv been on it a little while but never right off the bat. I dont even like throuing a whole or half pill in my mouth at first, I break off crumbs over the course of a few hours until I feel alright.

 

[edarrin]

I (used?...hopefully) to shoot dillies all the time. Thrice daily or more at times. For years. I'm still here...sort of at least.


The suboxone are f'ing huge. Must have a much higher level of binders, fillers, flavours and other assorted goodies.

I haven't seen subutex here in Canada but I would think they would be safer just by looking at the size. An 8mg suboxone is pretty huge compared to an 8mg dillie.

The naloxone isn't a very pleasant thought either although I hear that once you are switched to the partial agonist it doesn't have much effect.

My .02

 

[Captain.Heroin]

The naloxone isn't a very pleasant thought either

How many times do I have to say this?

The naloxone in suboxone is inert.

 

[johanneschimpo]

why dont people just obtain buprenex its cheap as chips and is MEANT FOR IV why shoots pills aint good idea

Because buprenex is comes in vials of 0.3mg and suboxone is 8mg, a difference of 25 times more bupe. And I'm pretty sure 1 vial costs more than 1 pill.... not worth it. Buprenex also isn't popular in the US, while suboxone is very easy to get. So there's some probable reasons why it isn't used. [No I don't shoot pills.]

 

[Absynthe]

Fascinating. I gave my cat who had terminal cancer, buprenex for 4 months, last year. Normally sells for $14 for .8 ml. I bought it wholesale, and gave it twice a day to her. I'm thankful I was able to, because those 4 months were so very precious to me. I think the retail cost is waaay too expensive, per ml here in the states.

 

[CretiNation]

How many times do I have to say this?

The naloxone in suboxone is inert.

inert isn't the best way to put it because it is not inert, it just doesn't have as high a binding affinity for mu receptors as bupe. i have IV'd pure buprenorphine hcl and suboxone (micron filtered) and there is definitely a difference in the rush, but not in the high. there is a slow, but nice rush from pure bupe and i don't really feel any comparable rush when IV'ing an identical dose of suboxone. the high is the same though...

back on topic... even when i used a 0.22 micron filter on suboxone the solution still came out orange (MUCH more clear than cotton filtered sub), so i do not think the dye is really that harmful... the pill is gigantic for the dose though, and the binders and fillers in it seem to make their way into h2o pretty easily... i mean the pill IS made for sublingual use so it's a bit scary seeing how well the fillers can dissolve in h2o.

 

[phr]

I would rather shoot pills with binders than dope filled with cornstarch or icing sugar or something even stupider.

I don't know what type of dope you're used to getting, but 98% of the stuff I've had dissolved perfectly into a clear light golden solution.
Of course you can't know/see exactly what you're shooting when you're doing dope, but just looking at a clear used cotton, versus a cloudy/colored one after shooting a pill kinda sways me...

 

[sonic]

JC covered this.. people IV suboxone because it's the most economical way to do buprenorphine at this point in time. I don't advocate it. If you are looking for treatment, put down the needle and take your suboxone sublingually, snort it if you must abuse it. Taking it sublingually in an alcohol solution works good too.