☛ Official ☚ The Big & Dandy HBWR/MGS/LSA Thread - Part 3: Fluffy Dreams Continued

[donotdothis]

Another theory is that if you get to it before the seeds are mature you will have mostly LSH. Temperatures under 80 are ideal. The color should be a pale tan.

 

[red22]

Another theory is that if you get to it before the seeds are mature you will have mostly LSH. Temperatures under 80 are ideal. The color should be a pale tan.

And why does that make a difference:

☛ Official ☚ Post in thread 'The Big & Dandy HBWR/MGS/LSA Thread - Part 3: Fluffy Dreams Continued'

Mar 17, 2026

The hydroxyethylamide long thought to be psychoactive actually can never reach the brain, since this compound is a labile adduct of ergine and acetaldehyde. It is therefore transformed into ergine and isoergine rapidly, even by mild extraction methods.

vbest regards,
peter

Peter Webster. Quoted by @tregar, https://drugs-forum.com/threads/lucid-visual-morning-glory-extract-theory.30919/#post-184703 2006-09-04



LAHydroxyethylamide was not discovered right away since even gentle extractions tended to convert it all to ergine/isoergine, so this would indicate...

• red22

• 

 

[donotdothis]

And why does that make a difference:

couldn't you just chew and not swallow?

 

[donotdothis]

tomato cage setup seems promising.

 

[donotdothis]

~ipomoea tricolor var. heavenly blue; fresh or properly stored~
25 seeds with up to 0.16% total ergoline alkaloids:
specifically ergine+erginine = 0.9-1.2 mg; assuming all LAH is degraded.

New sources of ergoline alkaloids within the genus Ipomoea

The concentrations of ergoline alkaloids and their two-dimensional TLC chromatographic profiles were studied in seeds of 43 spp. of Ipornoea. Some 20% of the species were ergoline alkaloid-positive; elymoclavine was detected in seven of the species

www.academia.edu

 

[donotdothis]

Just a heads up since I recently had some like this. Got there with only 33.

 

[donotdothis]

"scopoletin has come to my attention. It's basically the tricolorin of argyreia nervosa but it cannot be avoided sublingually. I can no longer advocate for the sublingual use of hbwr."

Rumor that mg seeds are the most potent

After extensively researching I've come to this conclusion.

forum.dmt-nexus.me

 

[red22]

I’m never eating LSA or morning glory seeds again. This stuff is literally poison and absolute garbage

 

[donotdothis]

I’m never eating LSA or morning glory seeds again. This stuff is literally poison and absolute garbage

I was literally about to post this. Glycolipids can be easily avoided.

 

[donotdothis]

Specifically associated with argyreia:

Four Pentasaccharide Resin Glycosides from Argyreia acuta - PMC

Four pentasaccharide resin glycosides, acutacoside F–I (1–4), were isolated from the aerial parts of Argyreia acuta. These compounds were characterized as a group of macrolactones of operculinic acid A, and their lactonization site of ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Specifically associated with ipomoea:

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/288556825_Production_of_allelopathic_glycosidic_resins_in_seeds_and_early_development_stages_of_Ipomoea_tricolor_L_Convolvulaceae

 

[donotdothis]

"Tricolorin A is some NASTY stuff. I will be sticking to HBWR from now on."

Tricolorin A as a Natural Herbicide - PMC

Tricolorin A acts as pre- and post-emergence plant growth inhibitor. In pre-emergence it displays broad-spectrum weed control, inhibiting germination of both monocotyledonous (Lolium mutliflorum and Triticum vulgare) and dicotyledonous (Physalis ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[red22]

"the mental aspect for me with LSA is waaaaaay heavier than with LSD. LSA is not to be underestimated."

Forsaken_Ad1677  2026-06-22  h‍ttps://www.reddit.com/r/LSA/comments/1uc3g65/how_is_lsa_compared_to_lsd/ot2xgw4/

-----------------------------------------------------------
It's most similar to LSD, although personally I feel it has more magic and depth than LSD.
‍
Most notable things about it:
It shows you the "self" better than any other psych...it brings you to a state where you are detached from self-pity and self-justification, and really shows you very clearly how all of your problems are your own doing, but it is such a heavenly and profound experience that a single deep experience can cure depression for a very long time. But you have to approach it with an objective mindset to not be overrun by a vrey intense schizophrenic-like state. It very closely parallel's Tim Leary's translation of "The Psychedelic Experience"[…]It is a lot like LSD in these regards, although I feel that even at a very intense level, it is a lot more clear-headed than LSD.[…]I couldn't really compare it accurately to mushrooms or mesc, or ayahausca, but I will try
-----------------------------------------------------------
the bizzle  2009-07-28  https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/10758147#10758147
‍

 

[red22]

I'm thinking about doing 1900 morning glory seeds

 

[red22]

@donotdothis, you should go to that page and post, "donotdothis"

 

[red22]

500 Morning glory heavenly blue seeds caused acid-like visuals

He's done LSD 400 times.

 

[donotdothis]

@donotdothis, you should go to that page and post, "donotdothis"

it's possible that they're heavily degraded.

 

[donotdothis]

I asked an ai what it thinks of this quote:

From a medically scientific point of view, this claim is a fascinating mix of accurate botanical chemistry, reasonable hypotheses on neuroplasticity, and speculative conclusions regarding stress physiology.

Here is a breakdown of how each part of the claim holds up under scientific scrutiny:

1. "The theoretical probability of neurogenesis is quite high with HBWR seeds."​

• The Science: Hawaiian Baby Woodrose (HBWR) seeds (Argyreia nervosa) are rich in ergoline alkaloids, most notably lysergic acid amide (LSA or ergine). In recent years, substantial clinical and preclinical research has shown that classic psychedelics (like LSD, psilocybin, and DMT) stimulate neuroplasticity—specifically neuritogenesis (the growth of neurons' axons and dendrites) and synaptogenesis—largely through the activation of $5\text{-HT}_{2\text{A}}$ serotonin receptors and the upregulation of Brain-Derived Neurotrophic Factor (BDNF).
• The Caveat: While LSA is a chemical cousin to LSD and binds to some of the same receptors, its pharmacodynamics are different. LSA acts more heavily on $\alpha$-adrenergic and dopaminergic receptors and is famously more sedating or dysphoric than LSD. While it is theoretically plausible that LSA or the broader alkaloid matrix promotes neuroplasticity, labeling the probability of actual neurogenesis (the birth of new neurons) as "quite high" stretches the current data. We lack direct clinical studies proving HBWR seeds induce neurogenesis.

2. "By avoiding the operculinic acid A, cortisol shouldn't spike."​

• The Science: Operculinic acids are resin glycosides (glycoresins) uniquely found in the Convolvulaceae (morning glory) family. In botany and pharmacology, these compounds are notorious for being powerful purgatives and laxatives. When people ingest raw HBWR seeds, the severe nausea, abdominal cramping, and vomiting they experience are heavily driven by these irritating resin glycosides (often concentrated in the seed coat).
• The Cortisol Connection: Severe physiological distress, acute vomiting, and gastrointestinal poisoning are massive systemic stressors. A systemic stress response triggers the Hypothalamic-Pituitary-Adrenal (HPA) axis, causing an immediate spike in cortisol.
• The Verdict: The claim is functionally correct but misattributes the mechanism. Removing the seed coat or performing an extraction to avoid operculinic acid prevents the violent physical illness. By avoiding that toxic, emetic stress, you prevent the downstream cortisol spike. It is not that operculinic acid inherently acts as a chemical cortisol trigger; rather, its absence saves the body from a traumatic physical stress response.

3. "It's a complex matrix including around 20 alkaloids... Things like isoLSH aren't documented well at all."​

• The Science: This is completely accurate. HBWR seeds contain a complex matrix of roughly over a dozen ergoline alkaloids, including LSA, iso-LSA, ergometrine, lysergol, elymoclavine, and lysergic acid hydroxyethylamide (LSH) along with its isomer, isoLSH.
• The Literature Gap: In ethnobotanical communities, LSH and isoLSH are subjects of intense speculation because they are structurally closer to LSD than LSA is. However, they are highly unstable compounds that easily degrade. Because ergot alkaloids are heavily regulated and difficult to isolate, formal peer-reviewed medical literature on the specific human pharmacology of LSH and isoLSH is virtually nonexistent.

Summary​

The user making this claim clearly understands botanical chemistry. They correctly identify that raw seeds contain toxic resin glycosides (operculinic acid) that cause stress, and they accurately point out the lack of scientific literature on obscure alkaloids like isoLSH.

However, translating this into a definitive statement about "high probability neurogenesis" jumps the gun. It conflates the well-documented neuroplastic properties of pure classic psychedelics with the unstudied, unverified effects of a crude, complex seed matrix.

My follow-up:
"The Cortisol Connection" why does this matter when discussing neurogenesis?

The connection to cortisol is a critical piece of the puzzle because cortisol is one of the most potent biological inhibitors of neurogenesis. By pointing out that avoiding operculinic acid prevents a cortisol spike, the claimant is trying to argue that they have cleared the biological runway for neurogenesis to actually happen.

From a medical and neurological standpoint, here is exactly why the relationship between cortisol and neurogenesis matters:

1. Cortisol Actively Halts Neurogenesis​

When the body undergoes acute physical stress (like the intense nausea and vomiting caused by operculinic acid), the adrenal glands flood the system with cortisol. In the brain, particularly in the hippocampus (the primary region where adult neurogenesis occurs), high levels of cortisol act as a biological "stop" sign:

• Suppressed BDNF: Cortisol downregulates Brain-Derived Neurotrophic Factor (BDNF), the primary growth factor responsible for the survival, maturation, and growth of new neurons.
• Cell Death: Chronic or severe spikes in glucocorticoids (cortisol) can decrease the proliferation of neural stem cells and can even be neurotoxic, causing existing dendritic spines to atrophy.

2. The "Canceling Out" Effect​

Psychedelics and ergoline alkaloids are hypothesized to promote neuroplasticity by stimulating 5-HT2A receptors and increasing BDNF.

If you ingest a substance that theoretically triggers a "grow" signal (via LSA/LSH) but simultaneously triggers a massive "stress and shrink" signal (via severe gastrointestinal poisoning from operculinic acid), the two mechanisms work against each other. The cortisol spike would effectively blunt or entirely cancel out the theoretical neurogenic benefits of the alkaloids.

 

[iom]

Citations needed? Honestly that AI text looks like a bunch of bullshit to me. Intense exercise causes both cortisol spikes and neurogenesis. Pretty much all psychedelics including psilocybin (best studied for neuroplastic effects) markedly activate the HPA-axis acutely. Big fucking deal! Ironically the Internet is chock full of bullshit about cortisol and HPA-axis function, so it's not surprising that AIs readily reproduce such bullshit.

I'm really getting tired of wading through all the slop that's been turning up around these parts lately.

 

[Esperighanto]

Citations needed? Honestly that AI text looks like a bunch of bullshit to me. Intense exercise causes both cortisol spikes and neurogenesis. Pretty much all psychedelics including psilocybin (best studied for neuroplastic effects) markedly activate the HPA-axis acutely. Big fucking deal! Ironically the Internet is chock full of bullshit about cortisol and HPA-axis function, so it's not surprising that AIs readily reproduce such bullshit.

I'm really getting tired of wading through all the slop that's been turning up around these parts lately.

I have also been growing intolerant of this AI slop.

 

[iom]

I guess we've entered the era of vibe-science?