Please help me (poly dependence)

[pnillyg]

Need some honest advice from people who understand this stuff because I feel stuck in a loop right now.

The last few weeks I’ve been on and off opiates after doing an ibogaine flood dose + one booster. I keep getting into this cycle where I stop, push through a few days of withdrawal, start feeling mentally/physically horrible, then relapse again trying to soften it or function.

The amounts haven’t been insanely high compared to my past, but because of my history it seems like my body gets dependent insanely fast now. Recently it’s mostly been oxycodone in shorter runs (like 30–75mg/day ranges for several days at a time), then stopping, then trying to get through it again.

I’ve tried:
- thugging it out cold turkey
- kratom
- 7-OH
- low dose bupe
- Butrans patches (5mcg and 20mcg)
- ketamine at times
- clonidine/gabapentin/comfort meds
- rapid taper ideas
- meetings/support people around me

But every time I get a few days in, I either get crushed mentally, can’t function, or cave because I’m exhausted from withdrawing over and over again.

Right now I genuinely don’t know what the smartest move is anymore:
- fully cold turkey and suffer through it
- stabilize on bupe temporarily
- stop trying to “half land” with kratom/7OH
- go back for more ibogaine
- or something else entirely

I’m also on:
- Lamictal
- Gabapentin
- Remeron
- Seroquel
- benzos PRN
- Ambien or Lunesta PRN

I know this is messy and I know I’m playing chemistry set with my brain trying to avoid another full collapse, but I’m trying to be honest about where I’m at instead of pretending I have it handled.

If anyone has been through this specific cycle of repeated mini relapses/withdrawals after ibogaine or has thoughts on what actually helped break the loop, I’d appreciate hearing it. I’m so tired

 

[Shambles]

The prescription that got me through decades of pretty extreme polydrug addiction was bupe. I know it has its haters but I found it incredibly useful.

For me the key was to not focus on complete sobriety - that’s too drastic a change to feel achievable. Rather I gradually cut down - and eventually cut out - one substance after another.

Most took many, many months - years in some cases - but it slowly happened. Quitting bupe itself wasn’t too bad - personally I crushed the tabs and titrated my daily doses downwards.

Nowadays I use drugs at times, but in a much more controlled way. Obviously I have to be extremely cautious but, touch wood, it’s working so far.

It can absolutely happen for you too

 

[SuperPsych]

Hey! It's been a while!

I finally found something that worked for me, I should have thought to message you.

The sublocade shot worked as well as could be hoped for me.

I did one 300mg injection after stabilizing on 8mg Sublingual buprenorphine for 2 weeks. Then 1 month later I did a 100mg shot. After that shot I did another 100mg shot about 6 weeks later. After that shot, I had zero withdrawal symptoms by the time of my next appointment, so I skipped it. 1 month went by, then 2. Was surprised that outside of a very occasional feeling of muscle soreness or fatigue, I felt fine! And when I say that, those feelings were VERY mild. Was easily able to forget that I was even in slight withdrawal while at work, and those feelings passed VERY quickly.

Unfortunately I ended up with a bad burn at work that got an insanely painful infection, so I fell into some 7OH use that I am trying to handle on my own, tho I am seriously considering the sublocade shot.

The first step is the scariest. Once you get the shot, there is not chance of using opioids for at least a couple of months. As an addict that is TERRIFYING, but once I got the shot and saw how nice it was to not have to worry about dosing for a month without WD, I was sold. I believe that sublocade is the absolute golden standard. SR-17018 sounds promising, but I have yet to try it and it might not be the best choice for chronic relapsers such as myself and presumably, you.

Sounds like opioids are your biggest issue rn and I would focus solely on that before attempting to stop anything else. Benzos are easier to taper than opioids IMO and can be done at a future date. The fact that you're on 2 drugs that work on different GABA receptors, I'd drop the opioids before messing with that system.


I can't speak highly enough of the sublocade shot

 

[Shambles]

That’s amazing, Psyche! So happy for you!

Stick with it - it only gets easier with time

 

[SuperPsych]

That’s amazing, Psyche! So happy for you!

Stick with it - it only gets easier with time

Thank you so much! I am feeling some very mild WD from my 7-OH slip up. Mainly cravings, difficulty relaxing and on and off leg soreness and/or restlessness (very mild compared to typical WD).

Took .5mg Buprenorphine at work which hasn't helped much. I have .5mg more. I'm hoping that gabapentin will be enough for me to get through, otherwise I gotta decide between sublocade again or trying SR-17018. Leaning towards SR-17018 mainly because I'd like to keep this slip up from my doctors because I fear it affecting my ADHD treatment.

Keeping my eyes on the prize though! Thinking of the money that I'll save by not using 7-OH or Kratom helps. Thanks again for the kind words.

Best of luck @pnillyg ! You obviously want to be free of the burden of relying on opioids to feel normal. It's a constant battle, slip ups happen; rarely do people get it on the first shot and remain sober. It's a learning process. I hesitate to tell people this as it defeats the purpose somewhat, but I was still able to feel 7-OH while on sublocade, so when I was craving an opioid high I would use that, get it out of my system and then the sublocade continues to do its thing It works its way out of your system so slowly that it's an insanely gradual taper. Nearly painless, in my experience. I don't get on BL as much as I used to, but feel free to shot me a message if you have questions or want to talk to someone

 

[Shambles]

Thank you so much! I am feeling some very mild WD from my 7-OH slip up. Mainly cravings, difficulty relaxing and on and off leg soreness and/or restlessness (very mild compared to typical WD).

Took .5mg Buprenorphine at work which hasn't helped much. I have .5mg more. I'm hoping that gabapentin will be enough for me to get through, otherwise I gotta decide between sublocade again or trying SR-17018. Leaning towards SR-17018 mainly because I'd like to keep this slip up from my doctors because I fear it affecting my ADHD treatment.

Keeping my eyes on the prize though! Thinking of the money that I'll save by not using 7-OH or Kratom helps. Thanks again for the kind words.

Best of luck @pnillyg ! You obviously want to be free of the burden of relying on opioids to feel normal. It's a constant battle, slip ups happen; rarely do people get it on the first shot and remain sober. It's a learning process. I hesitate to tell people this as it defeats the purpose somewhat, but I was still able to feel 7-OH while on sublocade, so when I was craving an opioid high I would use that, get it out of my system and then the sublocade continues to do its thing It works its way out of your system so slowly that it's an insanely gradual taper. Nearly painless, in my experience. I don't get on BL as much as I used to, but feel free to shot me a message if you have questions or want to talk to someone

I’m a big believer in respect over sobriety.

Slip up now and then? Maybe bosh a G of brown once in a while? Maybe a henry of rock? Maybe a wild night raving?

All totally acceptable imo.

Just so long as the eyes remain on the prize.

Control matters so much more than arbitrary concepts of sobriety imo.

 

[Deleted member 593549]

long slow tapers are the only way.

get onto bupe and do a slow easy long taper is what i would do.

so ibogaine didn’t magically eliminate opioid dependence like they say? damn dr Joe Rogan can’t be wrong.

 

[Shambles]

My philosophy has always been that it took me literal decades to reach the supposed “rock bottom” (arguable but was definitely hypershit) so, obviously, it’ll take a similar amount of time to climb back out.

That sounds depressing - possibly even defeatist - but just seems realistic to me. What goes around comes around. Any action requires an equal and opposite counteraction. Common sense imo.

But this is not a negative. Think how many great times you had on the way down! Now you get to experience elements of that again on the way back up - only with (hopefully) hard-won life lessons that (mostly) hold you back from repeating the same mistakes.

As long as (relatively - it’s all always relative) positive changes are in effect you’re on the right track imo.

 

[SuperPsych]

I’m a big believer in respect over sobriety.

Slip up now and then? Maybe bosh a G of brown once in a while? Maybe a henry of rock? Maybe a wild night raving?

All totally acceptable imo.

Just so long as the eyes remain on the prize.

Control matters so much more than arbitrary concepts of sobriety imo.

I absolutely agree!

I used to be horribly addicted to methamphetamine. Got to the point where I was smoking and shooting around a gram a day, going up to 7 days at a time without sleep.

After rehab I quickly learned that the complete sobriety will never work for me. It's taken a lot of mess ups and learning and molding my life like clay. Currently love my job, doctor actually trusts me enough to actually treat my ADHD. Life is better than its ever been for the most part. I still crave meth every damn day and think about it damn near constantly. I have a "1 gram of meth per year" rule. What I typically do is buy a gram and immediately find out that it is still insanely addictive and I end up binging the gram and hating myself, but the reminder of just how bad it is helps me to keep in mind the rest of the year that those cravings and memories of pleasant highs is all bullshit that my addicted brain feeds me to try and get me to use again