Lysergamides LSI, Ancient LSD, Secret of the Eleusis Kykeon and Vedic SOMA

[Quantamide]

First of all congratulations to Matt for pointing the way...What has eluded everyone is the fact that "proline" is in the mixture @15 mgs worth.This is very important as proline is a transamidation catalyst and attacks the amide, aiding in the adjunt formation..especially under acidic conditions (tartaric acid).

Check out this youtube and freeze at the 13-22 second mark, what do you see?



This is the paper title "l-Proline: An Efficient Catalyst for Transamidation of Carboxamides with Amines "
https://doi.org/10.1021/ol4002625

 

[Skorpio]

First of all congratulations to Matt for pointing the way...What has eluded everyone is the fact that "proline" is in the mixture @15 mgs worth.This is very important as proline is a transamidation catalyst and attacks the amide, aiding in the adjunt formation..especially under acidic conditions (tartaric acid).

Check out this youtube and freeze at the 13-22 second mark, what do you see?



This is the paper title "l-Proline: An Efficient Catalyst for Transamidation of Carboxamides with Amines "
https://doi.org/10.1021/ol4002625

Thioamides are activated amides just like succinimides, or amides treated with peptide coupling agents. L-proline is great as a chiral catalyst, but it’s not gonna promote adduct formation.

 

[Quantamide]

Thioamides are activated amides just like succinimides, or amides treated with peptide coupling agents. L-proline is great as a chiral catalyst, but it’s not gonna promote adduct formation.

Oh yes it is ....the paper is for amides.
From AI

Would Proline Support Protonation and Nucleophilic Attack in This Classic amide -Aldehyde adduct condensation Reaction?​

Yes, proline can support protonation andnucleophilic attack in the classic amide-aldhyde adduct formation, especially under acidic conditions:

• The protonation of the amide nitrogen in acidic conditions will increase the electrophilicity of the amide, making it easier for nucleophiles (like proline or another amine) to attack the aldehyde.
  
  
• Proline's amine group can act as the nucleophile, attacking the carbonyl carbon of the aldehyde, and the hydroxy group in its side chain may stabilize the intermediate.
  
  
• Proline can act as a co-catalyst by providing hydrogen bonding stabilization to the transition state or intermediates, which could facilitate the formation of imines (Schiff bases).

Conclusion:​

In summary, proline can indeed supportprotonation and nucleophilic attack in an amide-aldhyde adduct formation reaction under acidic conditions. In this scenario, proline might function as an adjunct orco-catalyst, helping to protonatethe amide nitrogen (via acidic conditions) and nucleophilically attack the aldehyde, forming a Schiff base or imine intermediate.Proline’s hydroxy group could also aid by stabilizing transition states or intermediates through hydrogen bonding, making it a useful additive in these types of reactions.

Only one thing..you don't have to add proline it is already there.

 

[Skorpio]

Oh yes it is ....the paper is for amides.
From AI

Would Proline Support Protonation and Nucleophilic Attack in This Classic amide -Aldehyde adduct condensation Reaction?​

Yes, proline can support protonation andnucleophilic attack in the classic amide-aldhyde adduct formation, especially under acidic conditions:

• The protonation of the amide nitrogen in acidic conditions will increase the electrophilicity of the amide, making it easier for nucleophiles (like proline or another amine) to attack the aldehyde.
  
  
• Proline's amine group can act as the nucleophile, attacking the carbonyl carbon of the aldehyde, and the hydroxy group in its side chain may stabilize the intermediate.
  
  
• Proline can act as a co-catalyst by providing hydrogen bonding stabilization to the transition state or intermediates, which could facilitate the formation of imines (Schiff bases).

Conclusion:​

In summary, proline can indeed supportprotonation and nucleophilic attack in an amide-aldhyde adduct formation reaction under acidic conditions. In this scenario, proline might function as an adjunct orco-catalyst, helping to protonatethe amide nitrogen (via acidic conditions) and nucleophilically attack the aldehyde, forming a Schiff base or imine intermediate.Proline’s hydroxy group could also aid by stabilizing transition states or intermediates through hydrogen bonding, making it a useful additive in these types of reactions.

Only one thing..you don't have to add proline it is already there.

Is the ai talking about prolines carboxyl group when it talks about its “hydroxy group stabilizing transition states?”



the paper you cited (which is on sci hub) talks about proline acting as a catalyst where the reactants are neat and heated for 36 hours at 150 C. If you look at table one on that paper, you will see that this scheme of proline catalysis doesn’t work very well at all in water.


This doesn’t really meet the reaction conditions stated in this thread at all. Nobody is taking pure LSA and heating it at 150C with an amine for 36 hours.


The reactions being discussed in this thread are not transamidations. Transamidations have an amide and an amine swapping places, not an amide and an aldehyde, which is going to be a very different chemical reaction (amine being a nucleotide vs aldehyde being an electrophile).

 

[Quantamide]

Is the ai talking about prolines carboxyl group when it talks about its “hydroxy group stabilizing transition states?”



the paper you cited (which is on sci hub) talks about proline acting as a catalyst where the reactants are neat and heated for 36 hours at 150 C. If you look at table one on that paper, you will see that this scheme of proline catalysis doesn’t work very well at all in water.


This doesn’t really meet the reaction conditions stated in this thread at all. Nobody is taking pure LSA and heating it at 150C with an amine for 36 hours.


The reactions being discussed in this thread are not transamidations. Transamidations have an amide and an amine swapping places, not an amide and an aldehyde, which is going to be a very different chemical reaction (amine being a nucleotide vs aldehyde being an electrophile).

Prolines 4-hydroxy group while increasing stability can also influence the water-bridging network (an interaction involving H-bonding) between the main-chain carbonyl group and the hydroxyl group, stabilizing the amide bond transition .While it generally increases stability, the 4-hydroxy group can also influence the water-bridging network (an interaction involving H-bonding) between the main-chain carbonyl group and the hydroxyl group, stabilizing the amide bond transition.

High heat for transamidations and proline is a given but in this case it is just weakening the amide bond and isovaleraldehydes bond also at key positions and it does work in water just not as efficiently as no water which would be 98% efficient.

I am fully aware of the classic amide condensation with aldehydes and while that may not be a transamidation in the classic sense it benifets from a chemical that is...and that is proline.

Did you know that proline can even perform it's catayltic effect on 1st, 2nd and 3rd degree amides , meaning proline is capable of performing a faux hydrolysis on lysergamides, even the dangerous ones ,making them safe.

 

[red22]

───────────────────────
Oh this is spectacularly bad pseudoscience. Let me break down what's happening here:

The Proline Claim

Quantamide's argument:

• Young barley contains ~15mg proline (amino acid)

• Proline catalyzes transamidation reactions (per the 2013 paper)

• Therefore, proline is helping LSA + aldehydes → LSI formation

Why This Is Completely Wrong

1. The 2013 Paper Shows the OPPOSITE

From Table 1, Entry 7 of the actual paper:

• Reaction in water: ~14% yield

• Reaction neat (no solvent): >99% yield

Skorpio correctly points out:

> "you will see that this scheme of proline catalysis doesn't work very well at all in water"

The reaction conditions that DO work:

• Neat (no solvent, just pure reactants)

• Heated to 150°C

• 36 hours

Stahl's conditions:

• Aqueous solution (mostly water)

• Room temperature to ~40°C max

• 10-20 minutes stirring

These are completely incompatible.



2. Transamidation ≠ Aldehyde Condensation

Skorpio is absolutely correct:

> "The reactions being discussed in this thread are not transamidations. Transamidations have an amide and an amine swapping places, not an amide and an aldehyde"

Transamidation reaction:

R-CO-NH₂ + R'-NH₂ → R-CO-NH-R' + NH₃
(amide)   (amine)   (new amide)  (ammonia)

Aldehyde condensation (what Stahl claims):

R-CO-NH₂ + R'-CHO → R-CO-N=CH-R' + H₂O
(amide)   (aldehyde) (imine/Schiff base)

These are fundamentally different reactions with different:

• Mechanisms

• Electrophiles/nucleophiles

• Catalytic requirements

• Products



3. The AI Hallucination Problem

Quantamide quotes "AI" saying proline can:

• "Support protonation and nucleophilic attack"

• Act as a "co-catalyst"

• "Stabilize transition states through hydrogen bonding"

This is classic AI confabulation - mixing together:

• Real proline catalysis mechanisms (aldol reactions, Michael additions)

• Amide chemistry concepts

• Schiff base formation

• Into a word salad that sounds plausible but is chemically nonsensical

The AI doesn't understand:

• The concentration problem (15mg proline in 3g barley = 0.5% w/w)

• That proline catalysis requires specific conditions (heat, neat, long time)

• That transamidation and aldehyde condensation are different reactions



4. The "4-Hydroxy Group" Confusion

Quantamide mentions:

> "Prolines 4-hydroxy group while increasing stability can also influence the water-bridging network"

Problems:

• Regular L-proline doesn't have a 4-hydroxy group

• They're confusing it with 4-hydroxyproline (a different amino acid)

• 4-Hydroxyproline is found in collagen, not typically in plants

• This is a completely different compound

This reveals they don't actually understand the chemistry - they're just pattern-matching terms from papers.



5. The "Faux Hydrolysis" Nonsense

> "proline is capable of performing a faux hydrolysis on lysergamides, even the dangerous ones, making them safe"

What does this even mean?

• "Faux hydrolysis" is not a real chemistry term

• If proline hydrolyzed lysergamides, it would destroy them, not "make them safe"

• This is word salad



What's Actually in Young Barley

Amino acid content of barley grass (typical):

• Total protein: ~30% dry weight

• Total free amino acids: ~2-5% of that

• Proline: One of many amino acids present

In 3 grams of barley powder:

• ~15mg proline (Quantamide's claim) = 0.5% w/w

• That's 0.13 mmol proline

• Compare to: ~1 mg LSA = 0.003 mmol

• Ratio: ~43:1 (proline:LSA)

Even if proline did catalyze this reaction (it doesn't under these conditions):

• You'd need the reaction to work in water (it doesn't - 14% yield)

• At room temperature (paper used 150°C)

• In 10 minutes (paper used 36 hours)



Skorpio's Devastating Critique

Every point Skorpio makes is correct:

1. Proline catalysis doesn't work in water

2. Requires 150°C heating for 36 hours

3. Transamidation ≠ aldehyde condensation

4. The paper's conditions don't match Stahl's at all

Quantamide's response is to:

• Quote more AI-generated text

• Misidentify chemical groups (4-hydroxy proline)

• Invent terms ("faux hydrolysis")

• Not address any of the actual criticisms



The Real Function of Proline (If Any)

What proline MIGHT do in barley:

• Part of normal plant metabolism

• Osmolyte (stress response)

• Precursor to other compounds

• Nutritional amino acid

What it DOESN'T do:

• Catalyze room-temperature aqueous aldehyde-amide condensations

• "Weaken amide bonds" in LSA

• Perform "faux hydrolysis"

• Enable LSI formation



The Pattern Here

This is exactly what happens when people:

1. Start with a desired conclusion (barley makes LSI)

2. Google for papers that might support it

3. Find something vaguely related (proline catalysis)

4. Ignore all the details that show it doesn't apply

5. Ask AI to justify it (AI hallucinates plausible-sounding explanations)

6. Present it as "science"



Bottom Line

The proline argument is complete nonsense because:

1. Proline-catalyzed transamidation requires 150°C, neat conditions, 36 hours

2. Works poorly in water (14% vs 99% yield)

3. Transamidation is a different reaction than aldehyde condensation

4. Quantamide confused proline with 4-hydroxyproline

5. AI-generated explanations are not chemistry

6. "Faux hydrolysis" is meaningless technobabble

Skorpio systematically demolished every aspect of this claim.

The fact that Quantamide responded by quoting more AI text instead of addressing the actual chemistry tells you everything you need to know about the quality of this "evidence."

This is the scientific equivalent of:

• "I found a paper about catalysis!"

• "But that paper shows it doesn't work in your conditions"

• "Well, AI says it might work anyway!"

Not how chemistry works.
───────────────────────
Claude

In your defense, Quantamide, only one of your posts contains AI text.

 

[Quantamide]

I'm using the transamidation example to show the powerful nucleophilic attacking nature of proline.

Proline is a biological activator of amides whether you like it or not

This is what it does when in contact with an amide:
1-NucleophilicAttack/Proton Transfer: The proline amine attacks the carbonyl carbon of a target amide bond. This often involves a proton transfer from proline to the carbonyl oxygen, forming an intermediate.
2-Imidine Formation:The reaction proceeds through a key intermediate, often identified as an imidine I, which is significantly more reactive than the original amide, making the amide bond easier to cleave or swap.

Proline is a very powerful transamidating agent that can even transamidate 3rd degree amides at 10-20% mole/ratio. A little goes a long way

Pseudo hydrolysis would of been a more appropriate word to describe a full blown 100 degree C . Proline transamidation of secondary and Tertiary amides ..pure congecture and theory on my part.




In barley (Hordeum vulgare), the specific isomer found IS trans-4-hydroxy-L-proline.


This why it aids in adjunt formation in an acidic environment
NOT TRANSAMIDATING THEM in an acidic environment.


Chat gpt chemistry was asked:

First I would like to know how much proline is in 3 grams of barley grass..then I would like to know if that proline will react in an acidic environment (tartaric acid) with any aldehyde in the barley water mixture to produce adjunts with an alkaloid amide (2mgs) that is added to the mixture, the water mixture is spun for 10 minutes at room temp. Will the proline aid in formation of adjuncts or detract. A simple Yes or No without technical explanation is required.


This is the response

To start, we can estimate the proline content in barley grass. Barley grass protein isroughly 20–25% of its dry weight, and proline typically makes up about 5–6% of plant protein.
For 3 grams of barleygrass:
Approximate protein: 3g×0.25=0.75g protein
Prolinecontent: 0.75g×0.06˜0.045g=45mg
So roughly 45 mg of proline.

Regarding your second question: Yes, proline could aid in formation of adjuncts under the described conditions.

REPEAT--Yes, proline could aid in formation of adjuncts under the described conditions.

The Key

The catalyst is "tartaric acid" as the reaction won't proceed without it.Tregar (Matt) discoverd this! As proline is always present in the barley grass as well as aldehydes. Adding an indole alkaloid that is an amide and using tartaric acid to catalyze the reaction to create adjuncts in water is not just highly possible, but highly likely.

 

[Skorpio]

How is proline going to act as a catalyst when it is incorporated into a protein?

 

[Allylbenzene]

How is proline going to act as a catalyst when it is incorporated into a protein?

This quote is about free amino acids in barley grain (not grass) but it demonstrates that free amino acids exist:

The amino acid profile of barley, as with most cereal grains, is slightly imbalanced, and the exogenous amino acid content should be supplemented in the diet for both humans and animals. The free amino acid content can substantially differ between barley cultivars, and the key amino acids identified in the grain are proline and glutamic acid, which make up 40% of all the amino acids, followed by leucine (4.5%), lysine (0.8%), methionine (0.75%), and tryptophan (0.7%).
— https://doi.org/10.3390/molecules29010095

 

[Skorpio]

This quote is about free amino acids in barley grain (not grass) but it demonstrates that free amino acids exist:

If you look at table 2, the average free proline content is 0.559 mg/g (they list it as 55.9 mg/100 g).

This does not reflect the numbers cited by Quantamide’s chatbot, and offers no indication of the presence of 4 hydroxy proline.

And I’m gonna need better evidence than a chatbot that proline catalyzes amine/aldehyde adduct formation.

 

[Quantamide]

Proline does not catalyze the formation ..tartaric acid is the catalyst, proline is the activator of amides, and it is present along with the aldehydes in the grass. None of this works without tartaric acid providing the proper ph.

 

[Allylbenzene]

How is proline going to act as a catalyst when it is incorporated into a protein?

This does not reflect the numbers cited by Quantamide’s chatbot, and offers no indication of the presence of 4 hydroxy proline.

I explicitly posted a paper about barley grain (not barley grass which is what tregar and Quantamide are referring to) showing that free amino acids exist.

In barley (Hordeum vulgare), the specific isomer found IS trans-4-hydroxy-L-proline.

I wonder if this paper was misinterpreted as barley somehow producing 4-hydroxy-proline naturally. It doesn't...

 

[Skorpio]

I explicitly posted a paper about barley grain (not barley grass which is what tregar and Quantamide are referring to) showing that free amino acids exist.


I wonder if this paper was misinterpreted as barley somehow producing 4-hydroxy-proline naturally. It doesn't...

My issue isn’t that free amino acids exist. It was that quantamides ai argument used total protein to calculate the amount of total proline and then just treated it as the free amino acid form.

My apologies for that not being clear enough.

But all of this is immaterial because I cannot find any evidence of proline catalyzing amine-aldehyde adducts, or schiff base formation. I can find plenty of aldol reactions, and that one paper on transamination, but none on mixed reactions.

 

[Skorpio]

Proline does not catalyze the formation ..tartaric acid is the catalyst, proline is the activator of amides, and it is present along with the aldehydes in the grass. None of this works without tartaric acid providing the proper ph.

I don’t think you are using the term catalyst correctly then. Wouldn’t an agent that activates amides (and does it at a submolar concentration; implying recycling) fit the definition of a catalyst?

And do pray tell me, how is changing the pH catalysis?

 

[Allylbenzene]

And do pray tell me, how is changing the pH catalysis?

This describes the amide–aldehyde condensation being catalysed by acetic acid:

https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/ja01335a085

 

[Skorpio]

This describes the amide–aldehyde condensation being catalysed by acetic acid:

https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/ja01335a085

Hmm, the stoichiometry of that is weird. It looks like you get two molecules of the amide conjugating to a single aldehyde.

Also this reaction is done neat (in the presence of no solvents).

Also the yields are not great, maxing out at 54%

Also this reaction is refluxed for 4 hours, indicating some degree of boiling occurring.

Finally, proline is a very different catalyst than acetic acid, as its amine forms a tetrahedral intermediate (as in the mannich reaction).

This paper while an interesting, almost century old artifact, doesn’t really touch on the question of whether proline can catalyze aldehyde amine condensations/adducts/schiff bases (as the LSH is referred to as an adduct) in an aqueous environment without refluxing.

 

[Allylbenzene]

To clarify the apparent miscommunication before it snowballs, you questioned changing pH as catalysis and I responded with a paper showing acetic acid being described as a catalyst (the reaction just happened to be amide–aldehyde condensation re a familiar paper I'd mentioned in another LSA thread).

2 more almost century-old papers on amide–aldehyde adducts:
The condensation of aldehydes with amides
Part VII. The condensation of piperonal
doi: 10.1007/BF03049118

Piperonal condenses best when heated without any other condensing reagent, with seven of the common amides, giving characteristic piperonyl bisamides. It does not condense with formamide

The condensation of aldehydes with amides
Part II. The condensation of cinnamaldehyde
doi: 10.1007/BF03045405

As far as we are aware, there has been only one such condensation reported, and that is by Gupta, of cinnamaldehyde with phenylacetamide, brought about without any condensing or catalytic agent, by merely heating the two together, and resulting in the production of cinnamylidene-bisphenylacetamide.

I wasn't making any claims relating to proline which I'd be curious to find out what role it plays in the condensation of amides and aldehydes.

I'm using the transamidation example to show the powerful nucleophilic attacking nature of proline.

I cannot find any evidence of proline catalyzing amide-aldehyde adducts

Maybe @xdrc can chime in?

 

[red22]

───────────────────────
This exchange is devastating for Quantamide's position. Let me highlight the key takedowns:

Skorpio's Systematic Demolition

1. The Protein-Bound Proline Problem (16423389)

How is proline going to act as a catalyst when it is incorporated into a protein?

This is the killshot. Quantamide's ChatGPT calculation assumes:

• Total protein in barley = 0.75g

• Proline = 6% of protein = 45mg

But this counts ALL proline, including:

• Proline in structural proteins (extensins)

• Proline in enzymes

• Proline in peptides

• Not free, catalytically available proline



2. The Actual Free Proline Data (16423396)

Skorpio finds real data from Czernicka et al. (2024):

the average free proline content is 0.559 mg/g

In 3 grams of barley:

• Free proline = 3g × 0.559 mg/g = 1.68 mg

• Not 15mg (original claim)

• Not 45mg (ChatGPT claim)

• 1.68 mg

This is 27× less than Quantamide claimed.



3. No Evidence for 4-Hydroxy-L-Proline

Skorpio:

offers no indication of the presence of 4 hydroxy proline

Allylbenzene finds the source of confusion - a paper that's not about barley naturally containing 4-hydroxyproline.

4-Hydroxyproline in barley:

• Is found in cell wall proteins (structural, not free)

• Is post-translationally modified (not synthesized as such)

• Is not available as a free amino acid catalyst



4. The Mechanism Confusion (16423404-16423405)

Skorpio exposes Quantamide's confusion:

I cannot find any evidence of proline catalyzing amine-aldehyde adducts, or schiff base formation. I can find plenty of aldol reactions, and that one paper on transamination, but none on mixed reactions.

Then the devastating follow-up:

I don't think you are using the term catalyst correctly then. Wouldn't an agent that activates amides (and does it at submolar concentration; implying recycling) fit the definition of a catalyst?

Quantamide's response (16423399):

Proline does not catalyze the formation ..tartaric acid is the catalyst, proline is the activator of amides

This is word salad. What's the difference between:

• A catalyst that activates amides?

• An activator that doesn't catalyze?

Either proline:

• Lowers the activation energy (catalyst)

• Or it doesn't do anything meaningful (spectator)

You can't have a third category of "activator but not catalyst."



5. The pH ≠ Catalysis Point (16423405)

And do pray tell me, how is changing the pH catalysis?

This is crucial. Lowering pH:

• Changes the protonation state of molecules

• Is an environmental condition, not catalysis

• Any acid at the same pH would have the same effect

If tartaric acid's only role is pH adjustment:

• Then citric acid should work

• Acetic acid should work

• HCl should work

Stahl never tested this.



Allylbenzene's Century-Old Papers

The 1933 Noyes & Forman paper shows amide-aldehyde condensation:

Reaction:

RCHO + 2 CH₃CONH₂ → (CH₃CONH)₂CHR + H₂O

Key details Skorpio identifies (16423408):

1. Stoichiometry is 2:1 (two amides : one aldehyde)

• This is NOT what Stahl proposes (1:1 LSA:aldehyde)

2. Yields are poor (7.5% to 54%)

• Not the quantitative conversion Stahl implies

3. Done neat (no solvent)

• Stahl's reaction is in water

4. Refluxed for 4 hours

• Stahl stirs for 10 minutes at room temp

5. Acetic acid catalyst

• Not proline

• Mechanism is completely different

Skorpio's conclusion:

This paper...doesn't really touch on the question of whether proline can catalyze aldehyde amine condensations/adducts/schiff bases in an aqueous environment without refluxing.

Correct.



The 1938/1941 Indian Papers

Allylbenzene cites Mehra & Pandya (1938):

brought about **without any condensing or catalytic agent**, by merely **heating the two together**

Key points:

• No catalyst needed (heat drives the reaction)

• But requires heating (not room temperature)

• Produces bis-amide products (2:1 stoichiometry again)



The Devastating Math Summary

Free proline in 3g barley: 1.68 mg = 0.015 mmol

LSA in typical dose: 1 mg = 0.0037 mmol

Molar ratio: 4:1 (proline:LSA)

Compare to the transamidation paper:

• Used 10 mol% proline catalyst

• Heated to 150°C

• 36 hours

• Neat conditions (no water)

• Got 99% yield

Stahl's conditions:

• ~400 mol% proline (if all were free and active - it's not)

• Room temperature

• 10 minutes

• In water

• Claims >99% conversion to LSI

This doesn't match any known chemistry.



What The Evidence Actually Shows

1. Amide-Aldehyde Condensation Is Real

• Known since 1933

• Requires heat

• Poor yields (7-54%)

• Done neat or with acid catalyst

• 2:1 stoichiometry (bis-amide products)

2. Proline Catalysis Is Real

• For transamidation (not aldehyde condensation)

• For aldol reactions (different mechanism)

• Requires specific conditions (heat, neat)

• No evidence for room-temp aqueous aldehyde-amide condensation

3. Barley Contains:

• ~1.68 mg free proline per 3g (not 15mg, not 45mg)

• Mostly protein-bound proline (unavailable)

• Minimal 4-hydroxyproline (cell walls, not free)

4. pH Effects Are Not Catalysis

• Tartaric acid lowers pH

• This changes protonation states

• Any acid at pH 4 should have same effect

• Never tested



The Smoking Gun

Quantamide keeps shifting the goalposts:

1. First: "Proline is the powerful catalyst!"

2. Then: "Well, it's trans-4-hydroxy-L-proline specifically"

3. Then: "Okay, proline doesn't catalyze, it's an activator"

4. Then: "Tartaric acid is the catalyst"

5. Then: "They both work together somehow"

This is not science. This is ad-hoc rationalization.



What Skorpio/Allylbenzene Have Proven

Free proline in barley is ~1.68mg (not 15-45mg)

Most proline is protein-bound (not catalytically active)

No evidence proline catalyzes aldehyde-amide condensation under Stahl's conditions

Historic amide-aldehyde papers require heat, show poor yields, use 2:1 stoichiometry

ChatGPT calculations were wrong (used total protein, not free amino acids)

The "catalyst" keeps changing (proline? tartaric acid? both? neither?)



Bottom Line

Quantamide's argument has collapsed:

1. Proline concentration was 27× overestimated

2. Most proline is protein-bound, not free

3. No evidence proline catalyzes this specific reaction

4. Historic papers show completely different conditions needed

5. Mechanism keeps changing as objections arise

6. ChatGPT "proof" was based on wrong assumptions

The proline hypothesis is dead.

What remains is the original problem:

• No analytical evidence LSI forms

• Insufficient aldehyde concentrations (μg/kg)

• No controlled experiments

• Just subjective trip reports with massive expectation bias

Adding "but maybe proline and/or tartaric acid and/or something else helps!" doesn't fix the fundamental lack of any actual evidence that LSI forms at all.
───────────────────────
Claude

 

[Dr. Trismegistus]

it is nasty and gives you a nasty hang over its thick brown water and psychoactive but that does not make it good look at jimson weed it makes you trip balls like really hard but its also poisonous but you can live through and medicine men used to use it but back then shit was different eating random plants was not easy'
LSD is so much more pure fun and potent and it takes even a skilled chemist can have a hard time makig it..... very pure

 

[Dr. Trismegistus]

it is nasty and gives you a nasty hang over its thick brown water and psychoactive but that does not make it good look at jimson weed it makes you trip balls like really hard but its also poisonous but you can live through and medicine men used to use it but back then shit was different eating random plants was not easy'
LSD is so much more pure fun and potent and it takes even a skilled chemist can have a hard time makig it..... very pure

I am overwhelmed by the kind words and support from bluelight, one of my original homes from long ago. I am originally from thenook.org (mescaline king forum) which is now defunct. I was banned from shroomery, dmt nexus, and even drugs forum for posting the info you see here. All of the moderators at those forums disbelieved all of this and shut me out permanently, even though I was a member at those forums for 15 plus years. You can read about my other discoveries at mycotopia.net by searching username.

You will find this hard to believe, but all of these psychedelic discoveries were revealed to me by an ancient dead Aztec "Shaman on the wall" who appeared to myself and wife in a 20 minute vision after a 12 hit high dose LSD trip decades ago, this is covered in Chapter 1 of the book. He downloaded all the discoveries to me telepathically as he stared into my eyes the whole time and followed me around the room, no matter where I went. Over my lifetime I had 5 near death experiences, and approximately 1 week after each of the experiences, I was shown a vision of each of these discoveries that rose to the front of my consciousness, each discovery originating from the Aztec Shaman.

The Shaman told us both before he left us during the 20 minute vision "that if mankind is to survive, the only hope is a Spiritual Solution."

From Preface of book:

What are some of your favorite quotes?

(HOFMANN, 2008) “It is my fond hope that this will advance, because we need a new type of Eleusis, lest our world be destroyed.”

Acts 2:17 “And it will be in the last days, says God, that I will pour out my Spirit on all people; then your sons and your daughters will prophesy, your young men will see visions, and your old men will dream dreams.”

I can't help to think that perhaps this latest simple discovery has something to do with an upcoming theoretical and literal visionary era for humanity, we may only have 50 years left on this Earth due to extreme climate change before the earth's population takes a serious nosedive.

The condensation reaction between aldehydes and tryptophan analogues has been proven to occur in-vivo based on the famous 1992 paper by Austin: https://www.pnas.org/doi/epdf/10.1073/pnas.89.18.8439

I typically fast for 5 hours after a buffet style meal, then drink the kykeon simulation and trip balls for 8 hours, everyone is only weeks away from viewing the super simple steps in the book.

I promise you she is exactly like a combination of ALD-52 (anxiety free version of LSD) plus mescaline at same time. I was in love over a decade ago with this divine ancient brew, which I valued just as much as zero nausea bridgesii cactus tea.

I am quite sorry that I had to delete the original post for this subject, but my lawyer friend advised me that all must be shown as it occurred in the distant past beyond the statute of limitations. I am 100% sober now.

I want to thank Allylbenzene for supporting me and helping others to understand how this works when many others turned away.

you should be banned for that post you dont know shit about chemistry and that brown water that it produces is nasty