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It seems most at people are ignorant when it comes to drugs

TheUltimateFixx said:
While the training of doctors obviously covers drug effects and interactions, the main focus is on diagnosis. If you want someone that knows all the minutiae of every counter-indication and side-effect, you want a pharmacist. There's a reason pharmacology is a specialty. The only thing is the pharmacist isn't licensed to prescribe.
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In the UK a pharmacist can prescribe for minor ailments depending on the circumstances. I don't know the full scope they can operate under. It makes sense though.
 
In my lifetime I've been prescribed tons of different drugs meant to help with symptoms. I was diagnosed borderline schizophrenia 1975. First hospitalization was given Thorazine to sedate me and manage my anger. AKA liquid lobotomy. Not all the drugs prescribed caused me harm, but it is true doctor prescribed drugs for mental health, they are at best a guessing game as to what is helpful or not.
Everyone's systems reacts differently in one way or another, some people do well with certain drugs and drug combinations while others may suffer.

I'm glad I'm at a point in life that I no longer need antidepressants or antipsychotic medication to have a full and meaningful life. I believe people come into their own understanding of what they need for the life they desire, with or without prescription medications. This.is not to say I don't take anything for my physical or mental health, I was to stop the two I listed because of unwanted side effects, however, stimulants work differently and provide the help the other two could not.

You have to know yourself, for many years I could not determine what was best for mind and body, but over time I learned and that's what it takes to be proactive in your health care.
 
Innerpeace said:
Moreover, many boomers still believe the doctor knows best, without doing research on the drugs
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I know from experience that researching medical stuff online usually makes things worse. That being said, I have always researched any new med that I have been prescribed before to see if there are any interactions with my current meds and for side effects. I could be wrong, but I feel like most of you here on BL would agree is justified and rational for a person to do such a thing.

I can confirm that your statement is true:

Was having a discussion about meds with my aunts who recently visited. They were all born at the pinnacle of boomerism, and I believe them to be smart, rational people. Higher learning doesn't equate to being smart or having common sense, but all of them have Master's or even Doctorate degrees. I told them about doing research on meds. All of them were super confused, like shocked that I would even do that.

Seeing their reactions to this, I said: "Are there actual people who will just take any medication prescribed by any type of doctor, even if they do not know what it is or what it is supposed to help??"

Their confused reply was something like "Yes!! When a doctor prescribes you a medication, you take it no questions asked"
 
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Allylbenzene said:
Imo these observations are fairly justified.
What makes doctor's such terrible drug distributors for corporate healthcare?

• They don't appreciate the full extent of possible side-effects from their drugs.
• They fail to educate patients on the real impact of their drugs.
• They don't fully understand how their drugs work biologically.
• They regularly commit acts of medical negligence but tend to not recognise they have done so - and so offer zero remedial action to mitigate their ignorance.
• They aren't trained to understand the importance of diet.
• They have a limited range of approved drugs to work with.
• Their drugs all have side-effects. Often the primary action of the drug causes the negative effects so calling them "side"-effects is misleading.
• They are legally required to follow guidelines which promote only their suppliers drugs.
• They are trained by their suppliers who "mould" their educational & training material, both directly & indirectly.
• Their suppliers have sales targets, a marketing team and a legal team to manage lawsuits.
• They don't appreciate the extent of fraud & misdirection in the scientific arena where their drugs originate and are "proven" to work based on manicured statistics & specially crafted academic studies.
• In some countries they receive financial incentives for prescribing certain drugs, either directly or indirectly.
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All of this is unfortunately often the case. One more issue that I think is quite crucial is that most psychologists and psychiatrists do a poor job at understanding what actually goes on with the patient.
TheUltimateFixx said:
While the training of doctors obviously covers drug effects and interactions, the main focus is on diagnosis. If you want someone that knows all the minutiae of every counter-indication and side-effect, you want a pharmacist. There's a reason pharmacology is a specialty. The only thing is the pharmacist isn't licensed to prescribe.
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the problem with focusing on diagnosis is that the patient is forced into textbook patterns which may be totally off. Both regulations, research methodologies and the education of psychologists and psychiatrists would need to drastically change to break out of this straitjacket. But well, I guess there is hope, taking into account how much these fields have improved from their totally disastrous state in the 50s and before.
 
it is true doctor prescribed drugs for mental health, they are at best a guessing game as to what is helpful or not.
Everyone's systems reacts differently in one way or another, some people do well with certain drugs and drug combinations while others may suffer
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The way individuals react to different substances can be unpredictable, and so much of how the nervous system works in response to myriad substances is still not well understood. Thus, while I think self-educating about drug interactions and targeted receptors and so on is a good thing, I'd be wary about putting too much stock in that knowledge. Weird reactions can and do happen, including paradoxical reactions. It's good to read up on things, but I wouldn't expect that knowledge to match reality every time.

Edit: This response was for OP and others. It was not targeted at the user I quoted.
 
M!$TER-ED said:
In my lifetime I've been prescribed tons of different drugs meant to help with symptoms. I was diagnosed borderline schizophrenia 1975. First hospitalization was given Thorazine to sedate me and manage my anger. AKA liquid lobotomy. Not all the drugs prescribed caused me harm, but it is true doctor prescribed drugs for mental health, they are at best a guessing game as to what is helpful or not.
Everyone's systems reacts differently in one way or another, some people do well with certain drugs and drug combinations while others may suffer.

I'm glad I'm at a point in life that I no longer need antidepressants or antipsychotic medication to have a full and meaningful life. I believe people come into their own understanding of what they need for the life they desire, with or without prescription medications. This.is not to say I don't take anything for my physical or mental health, I was to stop the two I listed because of unwanted side effects, however, stimulants work differently and provide the help the other two could not.

You have to know yourself, for many years I could not determine what was best for mind and body, but over time I learned and that's what it takes to be proactive in your health care.
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They gave me Thorazine when I was younger and it gave me my first sleep paralysis experience. Scared me so bad I was afraid to sleep for a week. I had the brand name too the generics don't knock me out like the brand name did. Fucked me up for a day or two.
 
Most "drug trials" only take place on patients taking them for the first time. The 1st medical trial typically exists when a certain drug is being tested with intentions of getting the drug approved to bring it to market (typically for profit over the important needs of patients).

I am a firm believer medical trials need to continue in at least additional two more phases. This way the first medical drug trial's results can be double checked against many patients that are still alive and/or did the drug actually provide help. This will also prove or disprove if side effects are accurate for adverse drug reaction or CDI (combined drug intoxication).

The 3rd trial could produces facts on "long-term affects's of certain drugs, instead of many doctors practicing under the guidelines produced from generic (undertested) single trials. The hospital Dr's or PCP's without these follow up drug trial tests, are basically in many cases treating patients with misinformation that could be beneficial to patients.

Now that the DEa, some pharmacies, insurances companies are playing "doctor without attending extensive medical schooling, performing residential training, and specialized MD training." This is 100% disrespect to doctor's education, training, extended training, medication training, and specialized pain management training.
 
Well my friend passed away three days ago, had a car accident . I last saw him April 1st. I stopped by after work, he invited me in his new man cave, we known one another at least five years, and consistently hung out, texted, and talked on the phone. We worked together for maybe four years. I could write more but it's okay

We helped one another out . He was great to work with. He was a friend. He scared me a month and a half or so ago when doctors were trying pramipexole, as he was super sped up, I thought he may have been on meth, bc he used to buy opioids for pain, in another state he had connections to . But he came around and I have all his texts on Android and I phone , as I had to buy an I phone for work

He did a lot of cocaine in the seventies and eighties, and had Parkinson's since I've known him. The medicines worked for years then they didn't work so well. His physical movement, balance, and walking went downhill faster than anyone I've ever seen this happen to. I cried hard and this helped.

I haven't done any psychedelic s, dissociatives, nothing except cannabis since mid November and even though it's in my stash, along with mdma, I have no desire to do them, as I've been working to make money and working on another goal which takes up my time and is a good distraction, addiction , and nice to be away from the feeling of dissociation s esp, they to me are the easiest to use when really not needed for a fast temporary change of how you feel about things
 
Hey, I'm sorry @Innerpeace . Yeah doctors are, you know, everyone has their limitations about knowledge, everyone has their own lives and focuses, sometimes the t's aren't crossed and the i's aren't dotted, nothing is perfect science and not everything legal is safe. I'm sorry for your loss.

And @Them Witches , yeah my old therapist told me that when you see a drug advertisement on TV that has something like "series side effects include: ", she said that they don't list those because they have to cover every incident, she said they are required to list them because a significant amount of people had those symptoms or death. She didn't specify how many incidents, but those side effects are listed because they aren't merely possible but passed a threshold of amount where they are required to be listed.
 
Innerpeace said:
I think everyone needs to know the information available then blindly trust a guy that achieved their doctorate degree. Why wouldn’t you want to have some knowledge of what brain chemicals the drug works on. Moreover, many boomers still believe the doctor knows best, without doing research on the drugs

It seems this type of thinking stopped more so with Gen X. Maybe im wrong, hopefully so

My brother and I have recommended to dad to research before taking the drug. Dad seems to take whatever the dr prescribes vs having a drug you found through researching online that seems to be best for you , at the time. This is what happened thirty years ago when he and mom let sea put me on four different experimenting with adhd drugs. Hopefully Im wrong about him and he does research drugs he puts into his system bc he takes quite and maybe a lot

Many doctors are known to recommend drugs the company provides samples for this first, I know bc I worked in a doctors office , then end up automatically prescribing drugs of their choice

You are correct buddy was trying to help, and he can’t take it, bc it cause lower legs to cramp really bad. He thinks he’s figuring the leg cramps out , bc it’s been going on for many years
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Facts....Anecdotal but I went to a therapist (1 time albeit)just to experience it. Dude didn't like the way I wore my hat cuz it was backwards..............he has a MASTERS.
The only people who will know what to do is yourself by making calculated guesses of what works best for u.
 
Seroquel does the opposite of psychedelics, ask your doctor for clonidine, it's a sleep med that does'nt have strong psychoactive effects and also wont cause a severe addiction.
 
streaM Freak said:
yeah my old therapist told me that when you see a drug advertisement on TV that has something like "series side effects include: ", she said that they don't list those because they have to cover every incident, she said they are required to list them because a significant amount of people had those symptoms or death. She didn't specify how many incidents, but those side effects are listed because they aren't merely possible but passed a threshold of amount where they are required to be listed.
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This what I meant and trying to say :

A Sequential, Multiple Assignment, Randomized Trial (SMART) is a research design used to evaluate long-term, adaptive treatment strategies by sequencing multiple interventions over time to understand patient effects. These trials are particularly valuable for building personalized treatment sequences or optimizing strategies for chronic conditions.

Key concepts associated with this approach include:
These structures differ from traditional parallel studies because they deliberately adapt the patient's treatment plan over a long-term timespan for educational and clinical optimization.

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(1) this would help opioid tolerant patients that can handle the medication if it suits the patient
(2) this would help stop hospitals from not treating acute post-op pain or acute breakthrough pain because the patient is in pain management & their daily accustomed MME will be sufficient.
(3) these extra (SMART) trials would have highlighted and proven Suboxone oral film and other forms cause chronic gum reduction and destruction of teeth.
(4) doctors need to be updated on important factors regarding what they prescribing
(5) patients regain ground again if they need to medically document what drugs work for them and what doesn't
(6) long-term opioid tolerant patients can safely and effectively be prescribed a Benzo without side effects

I think one of the issues of SMART is the cost of the trials and it could take money out of the doctor's pocket. That's just it MONEY, PROFIT, and ONE SIZE FITS ALL Patients
 
N0ph0n0 said:
Seroquel does the opposite of psychedelics, ask your doctor for clonidine, it's a sleep med that does'nt have strong psychoactive effects and also wont cause a severe addiction.
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Daily PO Clonidine 0.9mg is my jam jam... It has many positive medical uses. Duraclon IV (Clonidine HCl) IV is nice. I like alpha-2 receptor drugs.. like alot.

Precedex (Dexmedetomidine) IV or infusion is only Rx'd in ICU and is 8-10 times stronger than Duraclon IV as a selective alpha-2 adrenergic agonist.

Precedex (dexmedetomidine) is a fast-acting, selective 𝛼2-adrenergic agonist utilized for sedation in the ICU and during procedures, favored because it causes minimal respiratory depression and allows patients to be aroused. Key side effects include hypotension, bradycardia, and dry mouth. It is administered via intravenous infusion.

Last month I was in the ICU for 4 days. The had Precedex 400mcg/100mL infusion full retard mode for 3 days and day 4 reduced it down to match my Clonidine 0.9mg PO the best they could. They were also bringing Diluadid 8mg IV : 4hrs for 4 days with my normal daily pain meds, benzos, etc. Precedex is the fucking bomb.
 
Them Witches said:
Daily PO Clonidine 0.9mg is my jam jam... It has many positive medical uses. Duraclon IV (Clonidine HCl) IV is nice. I like alpha-2 receptor drugs.. like alot.

Precedex (Dexmedetomidine) IV or infusion is only Rx'd in ICU and is 8-10 times stronger than Duraclon IV as a selective alpha-2 adrenergic agonist.

Precedex (dexmedetomidine) is a fast-acting, selective 𝛼2-adrenergic agonist utilized for sedation in the ICU and during procedures, favored because it causes minimal respiratory depression and allows patients to be aroused. Key side effects include hypotension, bradycardia, and dry mouth. It is administered via intravenous infusion.

Last month I was in the ICU for 4 days. The had Precedex 400mcg/100mL infusion full retard mode for 3 days and day 4 reduced it down to match my Clonidine 0.9mg PO the best they could. They were also bringing Diluadid 8mg IV : 4hrs for 4 days with my normal daily pain meds, benzos, etc. Precedex is the fucking bomb.
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Why do a2 adrenergic agonists make opiates feel better?
 
N0ph0n0 said:
Seroquel does the opposite of psychedelics, ask your doctor for clonidine, it's a sleep med that does'nt have strong psychoactive effects and also wont cause a severe addiction.
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surprisingly a good mental health med, well, temporarily, they basically throw it after you in the wards, 25mg small dose and your gone into dreamland, if you stay awake it just kinda cleans your brain out of any thoughts, kinda like alcohol but way less shitty and not recreational
 
Featherfall said:
surprisingly a good mental health med, well, temporarily, they basically throw it after you in the wards, 25mg small dose and your gone into dreamland, if you stay awake it just kinda cleans your brain out of any thoughts, kinda like alcohol but way less shitty and not recreational
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This is the first time i heard seroquel being described positively, seroquel and haldol are like the most nightmareish drug i ever had the horror of being put in my body. All it does to me is turn me into a sad zombie, i feel like im in a restraining jacket, im sad and cant do anything, plus it causes me to have severe dystonia.
 
N0ph0n0 said:
This is the first time i heard seroquel being described positively, seroquel and haldol are like the most nightmareish drug i ever had the horror of being put in my body. All it does to me is turn me into a sad zombie, i feel like im in a restraining jacket, im sad and cant do anything, plus it causes me to have severe dystonia.
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its still an antipsychotic and makes you stupid, its enjoyable enough when your depressed and need a break and to forget for a bit at least ime, its just very much not recreational, like smelling salts
 
N0ph0n0 said:
Why do a2 adrenergic agonists make opiates feel better?
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Selective Alpha-2 agonists ( Clonidine, Dexmedetomidine) produce superior pain relief by targeting different. complementary pathways.

Alpha-2 agonists act on spinal receptors to block pain transmission and release neurotransmitter released.

Opiate/Opioid agonists activate at the base of the brain and a little bit further into the base/lower section. Alpha-2 connect at the base of the skull and down the spine. both active ingredients compliment the CNS and alpha-2 relax the SNS.

Dexmedatomide is amazing. I have never felt anything as relaxing and disregard for being in the hospital. Depending on the dosage it is similar to Propofol without the respiratory depression. Thus why the primarily use it in the ICU and requires monitoring vitals. Another plus is without much respiratory depression administering high dosages of IV opioids is not a concern. While on a considerable high dosage of Dexmedatomide infusion, they Rx'd Diluadid IV 8mg every 4 hours with my daily Oxycodone 30mg every 4 hrs and Methadone 10mg every 6 hours. It was a good ride in the ICU for me and honestly would not have minded staying a few more days. With my high tolerance, I was awake about the full 72hrs. There was no debating with staff about being able to handle whatever they wanted to throw at me.
 
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I think it’s less about ignorance and more about lack of proper education and awareness.Many people don’t get accurate information about drugs,their effects,and risks,so they either underestimate or misunderstand them.Open conversations and better education can help people make more informed and responsible decisions.
 
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