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☛ Official ☚ The Big & Dandy HBWR/MGS/LSA Thread - Part 3: Fluffy Dreams Continued

The book release is 2nd week of January, as I want to have a copyright date of 2026, and will appear end of January on McKenna Academy podcast, the Brainforest Café, view on you tube: https://mckenna.academy/mka-podcast/

Book is now available: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0GCH1XGVT/ref=sr_1_1?asc_source=01HDRG07ZP5FJRJVES5GYSHWKK&tag=snx1-20

ISBN: 979-8-218-88163-4


I am a lab chemist, 30 years experience, made a ground breaking discovery on how to make LSI from LSA in less than 1.5 hour, the experience with 25 HBWR seeds is even beyond that of 100ug of ALD-52

The 8 hour long experience is like a combination of ALD-52 and mescaline, hits way more brain receptors than LSD.

She is an "ultimate psychedelic". In the distant past over a decade ago, took Ayahuasca over 140 times, zero nausea bridgesii cactus tea over 120 times, and LSD over a hundred times, and yet find this LSI + LSV + LSC combo to be my absolute favorite.

LSI, ancient LSD, Secret of the Eleusis Kykeon and Vedic SOMA

Contents


Preface: Questions and Answers

Chapter 1: The Shaman on the wall

Chapter 2: The Eleusinian Mysteries

Chapter 3: SOMA, the divine Elixir of Vedic India tradition

Chapter 4: The Effects of LSI and how she was discovered

Chapter 5: Theoretical Simulation of the Claviceps Paspali based Eleusis Kykeon:

Experiment 1: 25 HBWR seeds yielded 130mg LSA extract residue (25 x .04mg LSA per seed) = converted to LSI/LSV/LSC= felt exactly like 100ug of LSD, but even beyond LSD (like combo of ALD-52 + mescaline)

Experiment 2: 25 HBWR seeds yielded 139mg LSA extract residue (25 x .04mg LSA per seed) = converted to LSI/LSV/LSC again felt exactly like 100ug of LSD, but even beyond LSD (like combo of ALD-52 + mescaline)

Experiment 3: 30 HBWR seeds yielded 160mg LSA extract residue (30 x .04mg LSA per seed) = converted to LSI/LSV/LSC felt exactly like 120ug of LSD, but even beyond LSD (like combo of ALD-52 + mescaline)

Chapter 6: Reference: ALD-52 and mescaline trip reports from experienced psychonauts in the literature (combo of both similar to LSI + LSV + LSC Eleusis Kykeon simulation triple action): compare to LSD.

Chapter 7: A brief history of morning glory seeds, HBWR seeds and LSH or Lysergic Acid Hydroxyethylamide

Chapter 8: Psychedelic Brain Receptorome discovery

Chapter 9: The important role THH or tetrahydroharmine plays in traditional Ayahuasca discovery

Chapter 10: How to make THH or tetrahydroharmine: Caapi feminine teaching Spirit discovery

Chapter 11: Theoretical Aloe vera enhanced penetration Ayahuasca capsules discovery: relation to Jonathan Ott’s early 1990s experiments.

Chapter 12: Theoretical Zero nausea Bridgesii cactus tea

Chapter 13: DMSO, nature’s healer

Chapter 14: House music life long pleasure and inspiration

Chapter 15: Walking outdoors in nature daily for 1.5 hour

Chapter 16: Philosophy

Chapter 17: A summary of the ALDHI method from James my chemist associate friend

Chapter 5 question:

When you performed these experiments, why didn’t you go above the equivalent of 120ug of LSD?
I did not feel the need to exceed the equivalent dosage of 120ug LSD (subsequent experiments) as I found the resulting psychedelic experiences to go above and beyond anything I could have ever hoped for. I give a trip report after each experiment forming a combo of LSI, LSV and LSCr.

1) The experience lasts 8 strong anxiety free hours with a 10 hour duration
2) There is a pleasant stimulation all night long into the wee hours of the morning, just like ALD-52 or mescaline exerts
3) The strength becomes stronger and stronger until she reaches a peak 3.5 hours in
4) There are profound Spiritual revelations, insights and intense healing, she is a feminine teaching spirit.
5) A brilliant diamond like shimmering of all visuals, infinitely fascinating
6) Tracers with open eyes as powerful as lightning strikes, none of the choppiness of LSD visuals, rather the visuals are flowing.
7) Intense, bold neon-like colors are seen all night, just like a combo of ALD-52 + mescaline, far, far more colorful than LSD. I have seen neon colors like purple-yellows, red-greens, and orange-blues that don't belong on this earth
8) Infinite way over the top euphoria felt all night (just like a combo of ALD-52 + mescaline). Anyone who has ever had cactus understands the mescaline euphoria I am talking about.
9) The beauty seen with open eyes is infinite and divine, no words to describe. This was one of the main reasons I took this psychedelic, the enhancement of beauty is just so over the top, extreme and heavenly.
10) The closed eye-colored geometrics seen which progress to real visions the longer the eyes are kept closed are just like what you see on a combination of LSD + mescaline, hundreds and hundreds of way beyond 4k visions many of them playing as if in a movie.
11) The music enhancement is just incredible and heavenly. I've felt more with this LSI, LSV and LSCr combo than with any traditional psychedelic except for mescaline that I was an extraterrestrial being, immersing myself in new sensory phenomena for the first time. Where LSD heightens and clarifies the sense of hearing, this Eleusis kykeon brew simulation produces auditory hallucinations, heightening the hearing sense but also causing sounds to be quite different than normal. I am a music lover and always listened to house music most of the night during the experiences, as on LSI, LSV & LSCr combo, every instrument and beautiful voice stands out on its own, every song is "epic". Like hearing a song for the very first time.
12) As for aphrodisiacal use of LSI, LSV & LSCr combo, wow! it brought energies out of me that I never knew I had.
13) There is zero or no anxiety with this potent 3 psychedelic combo, just like with ALD-52. This would explain why there were no bad trips reported in the Eleusis Kykeon literature.
14) There are no physical side effects: no body load, no nausea, no vasoconstriction, no cramping, just pure psychedelic bliss.
15) The next morning (I would typically get 6 hours sleep after the experience) I felt re-born with a massive serotonin "reset". I would go walking in nature with my shih tzus the following morning and all of nature looked as if brand new with a curiosity of nature's divinity.

Note: I do not recommend using morning glory seeds, only HBWR seeds...my results with up to 150 morning glory seeds were extremely disappointing (even below threshold effects), I believe the mg seeds are mainly 75% clavine alkaloids with less than 25% LSA, the levels of LSA in mg seeds being probably around .001mg per seed vs HBWR seeds at .04mg per seed. The morning glory seeds resulted in zero entheogenic effects, no euphoria, no stimulation, no visuals, and even no physical symptoms like dilated pupils...do not use. Stick only with HBWR seeds.

Eleusis Kykeon theoretical simulation Materials list:

1) 25 HBWR seeds, approximately .04mg LSA per seed.
2) 0.001g scale
3) One oversized shot glass for the spinning of the seed dust, and one regular shot glass for the fridge, and a 6 ounce half pint tall canning jar 4" tall x 2.75" wide.
4) magnetic stirrer with 3/8" x 1" long stir bar that can spin easily and fast inside the shot glass or canning jar.
5) everclear (95% grain alcohol or similar high proof alcohol)
6) coffee grinder
7) mortar and pestal
8) long pyrex brownie dish (9" wide x 15" long)
9) 2 razor blades
10) a fan, and a hair dryer to use for last 5 minutes of water evaporation from the pyrex dish (optional)
11) 3 grams of the secret herbal substance very high in isovaleraldehyde, valeraldehyde & crotonaldehyde.
12) distilled or spring water
13) DL tartaric acid powder is preferred or 100% pure citric acid powder can be used, if using citric acid powder, simply use more of it to get the ph to ph=4. I give amounts of DL tartaric acid powder to use, 30mg in beginning on step #7 and 10mg later at very last step #15 end spin.

--> The few easy steps from Chapter 5 are in the book, drawn as black and white sketches, most of the time is spent waiting 20 minutes between the 3 basic steps. <-- LSI is forming internally (in vitro) in the liver, this is all explained in book.

Book is now available: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0GCH1XGVT/ref=sr_1_1?asc_source=01HDRG07ZP5FJRJVES5GYSHWKK&tag=snx1-20
 
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Learned something new, downloaded the "Kindle App" onto my phone, and now I'm able to read the book on phone and view the simple steps from Chapter 5 for how LSI was made from HBWR seeds, made a kindle ebook available yesterday: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0GCH1XGVT/ref=sr_1_1

I was banned from dmt nexus, shroomery, and reddit for attempting to post just the theory of how this works, the moderators did not believe any of this, deleted my posts even though I was a member for nearly 20 years, and banned me permanently, so now you understand why I am weary of posting even just the theory on forums...so I have little way of getting the word out.

As I wrote in last chapter of book, "I don't mind what happens" to accept the present no matter what the guise as that's all we have.

I did have a conference call with Mark Hofmann and he is letting chemist at Shulgin Institute know about the book, and there is a MAPS conference on the Kykeon coming up with all Greek people, he laughed and said that we were the only 2 non-Greek people.
 
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I was banned from dmt nexus, shroomery, and reddit for attempting to post the steps in the book, the moderators did not believe any of this, deleted my posts even though I was a member for nearly 20 years, and banned me permanently, so now you understand why I am weary of posting this info on forums...so I have little way of getting the word out.
Hey tregar, while I am not a member of those boards (although visited for 18 years) maybe I can understand why you got banned? Sometimes these come dangerously close to synthesis posts and even at BL that is not permitted. It is a way of keeping the site legal, and a way to not hurt anyone. We can talk LSI until we are blue in the face (no pun intended) . But synthesis posts will be looked at. I know you understand. If we did not do that this place may have been gone years ago. But again I am only guessing as to why they banned you. Info is good, speculation is good, science is good, but synthesis not for a place like this. I think you are ok on this at this level. But careful. Information can be a dangerous thing.

I know I posted this a few times here yet it is not in this thread. It must have been another thread if I find it I can merge. But in 2009 a friend I knew grew HBWS in a greenhouse. He send me these pods where the seeds were in. Very fresh. So I took 3 of them and was as high as 100 mics of acid. (good acid as 100 mics is strong) Now the info on the boards has people saying to take 10-20. And I can see that if the seeds have been sitting around a while. But if I had done 10 of the fresh ones I had I would have been in trouble and i am experienced. Fresh seeds need to be treated differently. Some of the morning glory seeds I had right off the vine and were so fresh they were mushy. 100 of those was strong. It was like it had been speculated, each seed the being equivalent of 1 mic of LSD. But I believe that is only for fresh seeds.

Fresh morning glory seeds and fresh HBWS are a different beast to the seeds that have been sitting 6 months to a year. They go flat quick and leave people with the side effects. But fresh seeds are so strong that caution is needed and they should not be treated as "weak". I think the weak part comes from people taking seeds that have been sitting around a while.
 
Thanks for comments JackARoe. I was banned just for posting the theory of how this works, even when there is a new discovery, you will find 95% of the people will immediately shun it, and not even bother to read how it works.

I will mention that LSA to me is sedating and uncomfortable with no visuals, but once the LSA was stirred over 5 years ago with the 3 grams of cereal grain very high in all 3 of the aldehydes, the experience completely changed into an "ultimate psychedelic" that was no different from a combination of ALD-52 and mescaline to me at the same time, a ground breaking discovery.

Glad to hear your experiences with fresh seeds was extremely positive and life changing.
 
...banned from dmt nexus, shroomery, and reddit
maybe I can understand why you got banned? Sometimes these come dangerously close to synthesis posts and even at BL that is not permitted. It is a way of keeping the site legal, and a way to not hurt anyone.
For context, all those sites have the equivalent - and even more detailed - synthesis steps posted which aren't removed. It's not so much a question of banning synthesis posts but more prejudice and assumptions by the mods (or in the case of dmt-nexus, the owner... who runs a business selling various substances and has interests to protect).
 
Book: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0GCH1XGVT/ref=sr_1_1?asc_source=01HDRG07ZP5FJRJVES5GYSHWKK&tag=snx1-20

This is not covered in Chapter 5 of the book, but I have taken the brew to as high as 40 seeds, converted the 40 seeds to the LSI brew stirred with the 3g of Aojiru young barley, and drank, and experienced a profound psychedelic trip just as powerful as 160ug of LSD !!!!!!

.04mg LSA per HBWR seed x 40 seeds was the equivalent of 160ug of LSD. I had hours of colored closed eye visions, just incredible !!!!!!!!!! and the music was beyond heavenly and the euphoria was extreme. My all time favorite psychedelic !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! just like a combination of ALD-52 and mescaline at same time.

She is a perfect "ultimate psychedelic", the ancients knew their Sacred stuff.

Best part: It seems you can take this as high a seed dose as you want, and yet ZERO side effects!!!!!!!!! no nausea, no vasoconstriction, no cramping, just pure psychedelic bliss.


All of this is shown in Chapter 5 in 3 super simple steps. I found the 30mg of DL tartaric acid powder I used at high media: https://www.himediastore.com/dl-tartaric-acid-extra-pure-10626

The simple extraction shown in Chapter 5 is just used to separate the nausea causing seed pulp in the seeds from the pure LSA. The claviceps paspali ergot the Priest used in ancient Greece had no pulp, so they simply stirred the ergot which grew on the barley together.

Dennis Mckenna contacted me, and I will be on his show the Brainforest Cafe on Jan 16 Friday, view on you tube: https://mckenna.academy/mka-podcast/
 
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I think at one point it was said LSH was a more potent way of taking LSA. But I don’t know if that’s a natural occurring alkaloid. I have an interest in this stuff, so I want to backtrack and read up on the LSI and see if I can find any posts or threats about LSH and LSI.

.04mg LSA per HBWR seed x 40 seeds was the equivalent of 160ug of LSD.
This is where I wonder if the freshness of the seed matters, 40 seeds is a lot. So if I had a full-blown experience from 3 HBWS that were 2 weeks old, maybe some of those recipe needs to be adjusted? I don’t know. Again that felt like 100 mics from just 3. I had those same seeds three months later, and it was still very very strong, but not like the first time I took them when they were two weeks old. I suspect vendors that sell HBWS sell seeds that have been sitting around.

One of my best morning glory trips was one in December years ago. A friend and I were throwing a football around, and the football landed in some vines. And my friend knew I had an interest in that so at that point as his family were landscapers and greenhouse owners, he decides to tell me, hey man, I planted these for you back in the spring. (my face was probably funny looking with a dumb look) So I picked what we could, took the seeds out of the pods and put them in my palm. They had the consistency of mashed potatoes when I was chewing them and were not as bitter. It was just before I drive home, which was only a few minutes. But by the time I swallowed those seeds I felt it coming on pretty strong 10 minutes later. When that happens, I’m usually like oh shit with any drug. I made it home in 10 minutes, went to my room, lit a candle and tripped hard the rest of the night.

Morning glory seeds, and HBWS that are over 4 to 6 months old are a lot less potent than the fresh ones right off the vine. I know I’ve done that a few times, even when I had access the quality LSD. There was something organic about those fresh trips.
 
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.04mg LSA per HBWR seed x 40 seeds was the equivalent of 160ug of LSD.
This is where I wonder if the freshness of the seed matters, 40 seeds is a lot.
Tregar is relying on the presence of LSA which is to be condensed with aldehydes of choice. Using older HBWR seeds would be preferable in this case,

Morning glory seeds, and HBWS that are over 4 to 6 months old or a lot less than the fresh ones right off the vine. I know I’ve done that a few times, even when I had access the quality LSD. There was something organic about those fresh trips.
One explanation is the fresh seeds contain more intact LSH which decomposes into LSA (a sedative) over time. Morning glory seeds also contain psychoactive clavine alkaloids eg penniclavine, elymoclavine, agroclavine, chanoclavine.
 
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One explanation is the fresh seeds contain more intact LSH which decomposes into LSA (a sedative) over time.
That is why i love this place. So if LSH is naturally occurring it could make sense as to why fresh seeds are stronger, should LSH truly be stronger. if it degrades to LSA, which is also pyschedelic, must be slightly weaker. Makes me wonder what happens to LSA over months.

Difference between LSH and LSI? I will read through tregar's literature. So we have LSD, LSA and LSI and LSH.

I am sure our ancestors that used these natural tools knew that fresh was best too. Now I want to jump back into all the literature. I may go back far, see if Louis Lewin's Phantastica would be a start. That has quite a history. I also have that huge encyclopedia from Christian Ratsch. I need to look through again.
 
...should LSH truly be stronger. if it degrades to LSA, which is also pyschedelic...

LSA seems mild and not particularly psychedelic. Here is entry #26 on LSA from TiHKAL:
LA-111 Ergine, d-Lysergamide
This is an active compound and has been established as a major component in morning glory seeds. It was assayed for human activity, by Albert Hofmann in self-trials back in 1947, well before this was known to be a natural compound. An i.m. administration of a 500 microgram dose led to a tired, dreamy state with an inability to maintain clear thoughts. After a short period of sleep, the effects were gone and normal baseline was recovered within five hours. Other observers have confirmed this clouding of consciousness leading to sleep. The epimer, inverted at C-8, is isoergine or d-isolysergamide, and is also a component of morning glory seeds. Hofmann tried a 2 milligram dose of this amide, and as with ergine, he experienced nothing but tiredness, apathy, and a feeling of emptiness. Both compounds are probably correctly dismissed as not being a contributor to the action of these seeds.

So we have LSD, LSA and LSI and LSH.
The pattern is essentially: forming an adduct of LSA + aldehyde of choice. A few of the aldehydes are outlined below.

Isovaleraldehyde (LSI), valeraldehyde and crotonaldehyde as per tregars book/reports. The acetaldehyde adduct is the main reason why people enjoy fresh Morning glory seeds. Acetaldehyde is easily found.

These smaller aldehydes seem ideal to maintain the potency of the final adduct. The larger aldehydes that have been tried are described below (based on benzaldehyde, phenacetylaldehyde and phenylpropyl aldehyde).

The cinnamaldehyde and cuminaldehyde adducts are unique and worth exploring; they're stimulating and sedating respectively.

The vanillin and benzaldehyde adducts aren't recommended as lysurgeon explains on dmt-nexus. Lysurgeon also explored other aldehydes and reported his findings.

The piperonylacrolein (found in sassafras roots) adduct shows promise thanks to a report on shoomery (LSA + cwe sassafras root bark).

The syringaldehyde adduct has a promising report but reliable food sources are challenging. Ideally you would buy the pure aldehyde which is available.

The anisaldehyde adduct hasn't been tried afaik but it's promising since cuminaldehyde gives great results and shares a similar structure. Piperonal also hasn't been tried afaik. Both of these aldehydes are available otc if you know where to look.
 
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LSA seems mild and not particularly psychedelic. Here is entry #26 on LSA from TiHKAL:
Never saw that, or did not know that was the same as LSA. But I imagine straight up LSA in a decent dose would have one "sort" of psychedelic. I would love to test all pure aspects. LSH, LSI, LSA and then whatever is next.

Then what is the content in fresh seeds that causes a stronger trip than LSA? And what does LSA degrades into? Seems really old seeds are all side effects, so does LSH,LSI from fresh seeds turn into LSA and then LSA turns into something else? Pretty incredible how short of a shelf life they have. 6 months at best.
 
Then what is the content in fresh seeds that causes a stronger trip than LSA? And what does LSA degrades into? Seems really old seeds are all side effects, so does LSH,LSI from fresh seeds turn into LSA and then LSA turns into something else? Pretty incredible how short of a shelf life they have. 6 months at best.

Nowak 2016 identified lysergic acid hydroxyisopropylamide in amounts between one-third and one-tenth of LSA's amount in I. tricolor seeds.✱

Owsley said Albert Hofmann told him that lysergic acid hydroxyisopropylamide was "nearly identical to LSD in effect."✱✱


Identification and determination of ergot alkaloids in Morning Glory cultivars. Nowak J, Woźniakiewicz M, Klepacki P, Sowa A, Kościelniak P. 2016. Anal Bioanal Chem. 408(12):3093-102. doi: 10.1007/s00216-016-9322-5

✱✱"No, that’s not true. Ergot contains many natural, highly psychedelic alkaloids. [ Isoergine ] is one of them; hydroxy-methyl-lysergamide is another one, and in fact, is considered nearly identical to LSD in effect. Albert Hofmann told me so himself. They believe that it was this derivative contained in extracts of [ C. paspali ] that was used in the [ Eleusinian ] Mysteries."

Interview with an Alchemist: Bear Owsley Interview. Bruce Eisner's Writings. 2004-01-10.

hydroxy-methyl-lysergamide is a truncation of N-(alpha-(Hydroxymethyl)ethyl)-D-lysergamide, which is a synonym of lysergic acid hydroxyisopropylamide.

Also, this statement …

"Ergot contains many natural, highly psychedelic alkaloids"

… is a big exaggeration and it's surprising that Owsley said that.
 
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Shulgin already explained this.
What did he explain? Can you site a write up of repost. I looked in the thread but may be missing it. I will reread the last few pages and try and understand.

I still think at this point LSA is psychedelic and still see vague info on why it is not. And if he said LSA is not psychedelic do you agree with that?

This info changes when different people post. So I need to play devils advocate. I know nothing so the questions may be remedial.

Basically if one had pure LSA it is speculated (and it can only be speculated at this point STILL) that is not psychedelic. A person will not trip on LSA. So that the actions of the seeds are from LSH and LSI?? That really is a yes or no question.
 
What did he explain? Can you site a write up of repost.
He wrote it in entry 26 of TiHKAL which I quoted in my earlier post further up this page.

Entry 26: https://isomerdesign.com/pihkal/read/tk/26#5309

I still think at this point LSA is psychedelic and still see vague info on why it is not. And if he said LSA is not psychedelic do you agree with that?
I'd be inclined to agree with Shulgin that LSA is mildly psychedelic and uninteresting.

Basically if one had pure LSA it is speculated (and it can only be speculated at this point STILL) that is not psychedelic. A person will not trip on LSA. So that the actions of the seeds are from LSH and LSI??
The seeds contain varying quantities of lysergic alkaloids like LSH, LSA; and clavine alkaloids (eg penniclavine). The actions of the seeds are due to all alkaloids present.

Some people choose to further process the seed alkaloids with the intention of turning any LSA that is present into an adduct using an aldehyde (of which there are dozens of options).
 
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The hydroxyethylamide long thought to be psychoactive actually can never reach the brain, since this compound is a labile adduct of ergine and acetaldehyde. It is therefore transformed into ergine and isoergine rapidly, even by mild extraction methods.

vbest regards,
peter


Peter Webster. Quoted by @tregar, https://drugs-forum.com/threads/lucid-visual-morning-glory-extract-theory.30919/#post-184703 2006-09-04



LAHydroxyethylamide was not discovered right away since even gentle extractions tended to convert it all to ergine/isoergine, so this would indicate that the equilibrium lies far toward the ergine/isoergine side of the equation. And it suggests strongly that to produce LAH from ergine you would need some special conditions, which are probably not just having it in the presence of even higher concentrations of acetaldehyde, amounts that you wouldnt at all want to ingest!

Also, since LAH->>ergine in mild conditions, you must assume that it would happen in the bloodstream, even if LAH were able to pass the digestive tube. So there is anotherdoubt about whether it could actually arrive at brain receptors.

Of course, there may be some complicating factors here that aren't described in the papers I've read, That's possible with a great many aspects of LA chemistry (there are still a couple of quite important and unexplained results I got in certain experiments - I even asked Sasha and he couldn't clarify!) but for me, the odds of LAH getting to receptors and causing the initial reaction leading to psychedelic experience are quite low.


Peter Webster, 2016-01-05, personal correspondance
 
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