7OH tolerance

[sHR00m]

Opia only. Closest feeling to morphine, heroin, oxycodone. What is funny is I know people that are hooked on Fetty and they are flopping around the bed with RLS and struggling cuz their plug is not answering. Yet a 2-4 min drive to a smoke shop and they are selling it for decent prices and in singles. A 60mg Opia got my bro off Fetty Empty in 10 mins flat and he does smaller amounts of fetty but has been dependent for 4 years.

7-OH in large doses is too much for opioid naive people. Even for people that fart around with Roxi 30mg here and there but never create a dependency. 7-OH is just like a stronger opioid absolutely. If I haven't done it in 2 days a 240mg dose feel close the heroin with 1000mg gabapentin and Busbar. I have taken 720mg 7-OH doses so many times. I am disappointed in myself for wasting money on 7-OH b/c it gets out of hand quickly and a tolerance builds faster than any opioid/opiate I have ever done. It does bind to the mu receptors 10-14 times the affinity of morphine.

It is instant release that works PO faster than any opioid I have ever taken. I have seen people nodding off on 15mg the first time. not me... I 240mg dose pushes vibrations out of the body that is very floating, warm just like heroin in some ways. On a blind test, most people that have taken opioids before would not know. They would say damn that works fast well.

Pain management should absolutely Rx 7-OH in IR, ER, IR & ER combo, and IV forms of 7-OH. It really works on pain like Roxicodone and Methadone, Morphine.

Interesting. For me kratom builds tolerance insanely quickly. Like becoming completely tolerant to it within one dose. 7OH on the other hand works reliable in its action and I find the dosage increases far less compulsive then lets say ODSMT. 50 mg would give me a good buzz. It seems almost like kratom alkaloids and 7OH are different in their action.

 

[chippermonk]

These are all good points. But they have good and bad grades for the same brand. For example the Opia 30 mg strawberry got a B plus. Other Opia products got lower grades although Opia tends to test better than many brands. I did not look up Ultra 7 on that site, but that brand (80 mg tabs specifically) got very good reviews on Reddit.

Point is I don't think they are hacks just trying to promote any brand for financial gain.

If that is the testing site I was looking, I believe they were rating products in terms of how accurate their product description was for 7 oh quantity. Just as a hypothetical example, two products might advertise as each having 20 mg of 7oh but the site would test and find that one product had the full 20 and rate it an A, whereas the other only had 16 and rate it a B. Something like that ( Opia always rated highly, but interestingly there was always still some potency variation between their different Opia products, it was NOT consistent)
That seems well and good if you are trying to gauge how much 7oh a particular product has but it won't tell you about impurities, poor manufacturing, possible intentional additives. I also remember a comprehensive analysis last year of legal amanita products showed that they were adulterated with all kinds of unmentioned psychoactive substances beyond what they claimed to have. Anything for a buck, fuck the user. I've never heard that to be the case with 7 oh products but it wouldn't shock me to find out that it does happen. We're not talking about a regulated industry here. I guess they can do that with leaf powder, too, but it seems less likely than than with extracts.
I think maybe this is some of what you are concerned about @4DQSAR ?

 

[Them Witches]

Interesting. For me kratom builds tolerance insanely quickly. Like becoming completely tolerant to it within one dose. 7OH on the other hand works reliable in its action and I find the dosage increases far less compulsive then lets say ODSMT. 50 mg would give me a good buzz. It seems almost like kratom alkaloids and 7OH are different in their action.

7-OH is best used as the 1st opioid dosage of the day. After that it does not work well at all. First thing in the morning for a dependent person, not much can touch it. For PO only, it works faster than anything available. I really wish an Rx version was available for breakthru pain every 2-3 days in large doses. Always large doses with 7-OH.

 

[Them Witches]

Opia is the only brand that works that comes is a tablet form. The Ultra 240mg packs for $29-$33 each is cheaper than ordering online. &-OH should cost $15 buck tops per Opia Ultra 240mg.
Every other brand I have tried flat out sucked compared to Opia.

The brand Perks -- 100mg tablets/ 4qty = 400mg rated 7-OH blows ass compared to 240mg of Opia 7-OH.
400mg of Opia....Now were talking something special and adding on top 1000mg of Gabapentin is icing on the cake.

 

[Psynaught]

I cannot account for every smoke shop/head shop. The ones in my area have taken off the shelves and sell it to certain previous customers. Most of these shops are own buy people not directly from the US and they do not want it to be on the shelves on day and by night the laws change. Tomorrow morning the open the shop and catch a charge closing the shop. They do not want the smoke,

This is smart because undercovers doing recon think the shop no longer carries it on the shelves.

I cannot comment on anything else except I still get 7-OH at 15-20% less than what it costs to order it online per case basis in the shop I frequent. Because not many people are going in for it because it is off the shelves they have started giving packs for free and on the front to keep my business. They still have garbage bags full of every other brand but a small batch of Opia left. I will not buy anything but Opia.

I am new to the 7OH game but buy Opia when Kures offers a sale. Same with Ultra 7 Stacks, the 80 mgs were also on sale. They got great reviews in Reddit. I keep my 7OH/real opioids use to once every 5 days (I have Oxy, Tramadol, and fent stashed because I do not trust doctors) so I just keep stocking up. I've had surgeries where they gave me less than half the medication they should. Then I had a Cytoscopy (they shove a camera down your penis all the way back to your prostate...beyond painful) with zero meds. I had horrible pneumonia, with coughing so bad it made me vomit. No meds. Since I have been tortured by doctors on multiple occasions I keep pain meds on hand. I ave pretty severe pain in my feet. I just deal with it during he day and the kratom gives me a break at night.

I buy Kilos of Kratom from a trusted online vender. I have been taking 5 grams of Kratom a day for more than 2 years now, never more. I only take the stronger stuff every 5 days or so. I've had a stash of real Oxy 30 mgs for many months...actually close to a year. I started with 35-38 and still have 30.

 

[Psynaught]

I developed this opinion on how opiates/opioids work on humans in pain verse not in pain. It shows why people not in pain that take them to get high quickly start to lose the feeling they were after. We all know this as tolerance and dependency obviously. What is happening in the brain is the mu receptors are being tickled without their door's being open for business. Of course they feel it but after a while the mu receptors are still closed for business in a way.

Someone in pain has their mu receptors doors open at all times. People in pain feel more from opiates/opioids as they transition from being on guard to relief. This transition increases the reward center aspect of it.

Does this make sense?

Yes, and this is 100% why docs prescribe (or used to) pain medication the way they did/do. For example, after I surgery I was told to take (for example) 10-15 mgs of Oxy every 4-6 hours. Don't wait for the pain to become severe, take the drugs on schedule. Thus the drugs PREVENT severe pain...they are not fixing it AFTER the fact. That is the proper us of opioids, and it worked great. I also never really got high this way but I stayed moderately pain free (tolerable) after surgery. Mind you had had full facial reconstruction and pretty major shoulder surgery. The interesting part is, I never got high and pretty much terminated all pain meds after 7-9 days or so. I got zero withdrawals.

These were the good old days before politicians and doctors lost their minds and abandanded a system that worked fantastically for 98% of all people. Suddenly politicians had to "do something" about the "opiod crisis" and doctors put money ahead of patient suffering to appease politicians.

 

[chippermonk]

This is another blue light thread by someone whose MGM15, which is I guess is a synthetic derivative of 7 oh, supposedly tested positive for fentanyl.
But I read somewhere that fentanyl tests can do false positives? It would be good to know if this report is accurate.

Thread 'MGM15 - 3 different sources laced with fetty' https://www.bluelight.org/community/threads/mgm15-3-different-sources-laced-with-fetty.949219/

 

[Psynaught]

OMFG I just took a quarter of an Ultra 7 double stack Ultra 7 Seven and got wasted! I was so high that for about 10 minutes I was debating whether or not to use Narcan, that is how high I was, it was insane.

I am going to start a separate thread.

 

[Psynaught]

Opia is the only brand that works that comes is a tablet form. The Ultra 240mg packs for $29-$33 each is cheaper than ordering online. &-OH should cost $15 buck tops per Opia Ultra 240mg.
Every other brand I have tried flat out sucked compared to Opia.

The brand Perks -- 100mg tablets/ 4qty = 400mg rated 7-OH blows ass compared to 240mg of Opia 7-OH.
400mg of Opia....Now were talking something special and adding on top 1000mg of Gabapentin is icing on the cake.

I just took 20 mgs of Ultra 7 Seven double stack (a quarter tab) and got high out of my mind. I posted a thread about it here: https://www.bluelight.org/community/threads/20-mg-of-7oh-and-i-was-wasted-out-of-my-mind.949800/

 

[4DQSAR]

I think maybe this is some of what you are concerned about @4DQSAR ?

More the fact that WHOIS declines to divulve who owns the domain or what their physical address is. Then Hunter.io showing that their are NO email addrsses associated with the site and the ONLY email address I could find was a Gmail address!

You cannot built trust if you go to such extreme lengths to ever be held accountable for a batch poisoning people, just as an example.

They don't say where funding comes from so assume it comes from the vendors. Occassionally giving something a bad review would be awfully convenient if that vendor had no stock, for example.

It just screams 'scam!'

But that's just my opinion. I wouldn't trust any of them. In the UK kratom was banned after a bunch of kids died because 'Crystal Kratom' was being cut with tramadol.

Obviously, as someone who can find their way around instrumental data, it's absence is also a concern. Testing EVERY batch would be costly and I see no sign whatsoever of that investment.

But while I have to say 'do your own research' but shart with WHOIS, then use Hunter.io and then ask why people should trust them? I've yet to come across a legitimate business that goes to such lengths to hide who they are or where they are.

 

[sHR00m]

From my understanding the 7oh that you get from kratom leaves is minimal, around 2%.

From what I've read its much less than 2%. 2% could roughly account for the amount of mitragynine. IIRC 7OH exists in such low amounts in kratom leaf that usual tests don't even reliably establish how much of it is in a kratom sample. BTW I don't understand how you can make 7OH schedule 1 while not also outlawing kratom. Maybe someone can chime in about that.

 

[4DQSAR]

Mitragynine picrate is an item of commerce. Obviously that's used to make 7-OHM.

I guess is their is one upside, I've heard people are using KH2SO5 (Oxone) which is a far, far safer route than the two the original Japanese (?) researchers offered.

But going around the loop again, yield is 60-65% and preprative chromatography is used to isolate the active.

But I asked the simple (to me) question - if you are using prepatative chromatography, wouldn't that also allow mitragynie psudoinoxyl to be isolated? It's far, far more active and if you want strong product, would you even MENTION that in fact your product has this even more potent opioid in it? Especially knowing that the DEA will step in eventially. It would simply make your product more potent.

As things stand, it's the worst of all worlds. Some vendors have tried to set up their own self-regulation group but since the vendors pay, they are hardly an independent group.

Everywhere I see dubious QC sites whose provinence is hard to find. If USERS were to set one up, that might be better. But as it is, people are trusting self-regulation... a system famous for not working.

 

[Psynaught]

UPDATE: One thing needs mentioning: I have taken 4 different brands of 7OH and Opia are by far the weakest. I know there is a lab stating that their 30 mgs tested at 26 mgs but they just feel very weak to me. 2 nights ago I took a half (30 mg) Pressed and it felt much stronger than the Opia. Same with some 30 mg tabs I got from 7OHblack.

As I mentioned above 20 mgs of the Ultra 7 hit harder than the 30 mg Opia tabs.

Man, I have really stocked up on these, LOL. Getting ready for the ban.

 

[Psynaught]

From what I've read its much less than 2%. 2% could roughly account for the amount of mitragynine. IIRC 7OH exists in such low amounts in kratom leaf that usual tests don't even reliably establish how much of it is in a kratom sample. BTW I don't understand how you can make 7OH schedule 1 while not also outlawing kratom. Maybe someone can chime in about that.

I've been taking Kratom for several years. 5 grams a day which I've dropped down to 4.5. I have no need to do more. 7OH...that stuff feels better than fent and almost as good as Oxy (well OK....a def step down from Oxy). But I know that things could escalate real quickly with the 7OH. I've seen first hand some people have terrible WD's from 7OH.

 

[4DQSAR]

BTW I've taken a look at a few of those on-line labs offering qualitative analysis. All I can think is they are customer-facing because no compatent chemist would draw ANY confidence from the wording. No methodology was given anywhere I looked and the places we used said nothing beyond name, services (in detail) and not costs. Never the price as if you are someone after HUNDREDS of tests, they will expect people to shop around and ASK hard questions.

One particularly caught my eye - Testing for heavy metals $100.

Now if that's just qualitative analysis, that's a con, as cheap wet chemistry tests WILL be used unless ICP-MS or similar is used... and if you have that capacity, you damned well say so!

In short - DO they test them all? Because quantitative analysis down to the mg level with excipients present is a bit uncetain as excipients ALWAYS arrive that fool most tests. I mean, 'supermix' AKA 'turbomix' for crack. Just phenacetin but to my knowledge most Dutch crack was cut with it for years. As long as it's cheaper than the product, the bulking agents thay defy tests WILL have value to vendors of dodgy product.

Could also be as I mentioned - the presence of other alkalouds. The ones they DON'T quantify.

 

[thurston]

Opia only. Closest feeling to morphine, heroin, oxycodone. What is funny is I know people that are hooked on Fetty and they are flopping around the bed with RLS and struggling cuz their plug is not answering. Yet a 2-4 min drive to a smoke shop and they are selling it for decent prices and in singles. A 60mg Opia got my bro off Fetty Empty in 10 mins flat and he does smaller amounts of fetty but has been dependent for 4 years.

7-OH in large doses is too much for opioid naive people. Even for people that fart around with Roxi 30mg here and there but never create a dependency. 7-OH is just like a stronger opioid absolutely. If I haven't done it in 2 days a 240mg dose feel close the heroin with 1000mg gabapentin and Busbar. I have taken 720mg 7-OH doses so many times. I am disappointed in myself for wasting money on 7-OH b/c it gets out of hand quickly and a tolerance builds faster than any opioid/opiate I have ever done. It does bind to the mu receptors 10-14 times the affinity of morphine.

It is instant release that works PO faster than any opioid I have ever taken. I have seen people nodding off on 15mg the first time. not me... I 240mg dose pushes vibrations out of the body that is very floating, warm just like heroin in some ways. On a blind test, most people that have taken opioids before would not know. They would say damn that works fast well.

Pain management should absolutely Rx 7-OH in IR, ER, IR & ER combo, and IV forms of 7-OH. It really works on pain like Roxicodone and Methadone, Morphine.

I've been using 7 oh for chronic pain management and it is good and works really fast but the legs are a little short. I feel like I need to take another about 3 hrs after the first. I agree a time release version would be awesome.

 

[thurston]

@Them Witches - I would certainly like to see a proper instrumental analysis of products being sold AS -OHM because from what I hear, preparative chromatorgrpahy is the only way to obtain a pure product but if a side-product is active and can be isolated, would you throw it away or added to the wholesale material? I've heard someone HAS found a much safer route than the two offered by the original Japanese (?) researchers which makes use of KH2SO5 (Oxone)... but even with that, yield is around 65% at best.

What do we know about mitragynine pseudoindoxyl other than it having an extremely high (low) affinity for the MOR? Is there research that may be able to spot it in product?

For what it's worth I've noticed all 7 oh pills have a strong kratom taste.

 

[4DQSAR]

For what it's worth I've noticed all 7 oh pills have a strong kratom taste.

Well, impossible to know if that's significant. Unless someone who has identified samples of all the kratom alkaloids can assert what each one tastes like.

To be clear, taste can be a valuable way to at least roughly knowing what you have. In the UK where Afghan brown heroin is the most common street opioid, it's known that the actual product has almost no taste (being the freebase and so not soluble in saliva) so if it's bitter, there is a reasonable chance bash has been added. White (SE Asian) heroin is the hydrochloride salt but typically has 5-10% caffeine added to lower the MP so it can be smoked. So that SHOULD taste extremely bitter.

But I'm old enough to have seen TV shows and films in which law enforcement officers would taste the product and assert they KNEW what a drug was. A fantastic way to wind up dead and something that went from being a trope to being Dagenham (two stops beyond Barking).

 

[Legiøn]

I’m sorry to ask this here but I’m new and a smidge desperate for help. I am currently taking Suboxone for pain management. I normally take 2-3 8/2mg strips daily split through the day.

I have taken 7-OH, 160mg chewed and swallowed. Any help with proper dosing would be appreciated because I am here after the ingestion (five mins ago) and it seems I may have overdone it by quite a bit.

Again any feedback is appreciated. Even if it’s anecdotal about your own sub/ 7-OH combo that worked.

 

[Deleted member 580309]

I’m sorry to ask this here but I’m new and a smidge desperate for help. I am currently taking Suboxone for pain management. I normally take 2-3 8/2mg strips daily split through the day.

I have taken 7-OH, 160mg chewed and swallowed. Any help with proper dosing would be appreciated because I am here after the ingestion (five mins ago) and it seems I may have overdone it by quite a bit.

Again any feedback is appreciated. Even if it’s anecdotal about your own sub/ 7-OH combo that worked.

a little late here, yes that is a very high dose to start with, luckily 7 doesn't mess with your respetory system too badly. Let me know how it went,