Snorting 7-OH

[notsmokeymcpot42088]

That sounds about right. I think for the vast majority of people regardless of which opiate they are taking, 5 grams should be enough in most cases for a full detox, and with a little bit of SR-17 left over just Incase.

Dose range of 25 mg - 125 mg roughly, taken every 8-12 hours or 2x-3x per day, for a duration of 1.5 weeks-3 weeks.

That's a bit of a range but everyone is different.

was thinking the same thing 3 grams to be done -- sounds too good to be true. I started a thread on this -- ways to get off opioid/area for good and sublocaid and SR - 17018 were my #1 and #2 picks -- followed by Ibogaine, flat tapering and using comfort meds. (Which I did my best to list)

Huzzah for science!

 

[4DQSAR]

I think it a bad idea to presume a novel RC will remain available or affordable. SR-17018 if such it be, does appear to be abusable (although people abuse bupropion and buprenorpine - so go figure) and if nothing else, the DEA is very likely to 'stick it's oar in' if only because there is a POTENTIAL for abuse.

As mentioned, I have read the earlier (60s or 70s patents) in which such compounds are theoretically covered but were not in fact assayed for activity. The thing being... one of the key precursors has no other use I know of and is quite resource intensive to produce. To the point that I can only imagine it being profitable at scale.

If it works for you, great, but don't assume it will be around for long. After all, without addicts, DEA officers would be out of a job...

 

[notsmokeymcpot42088]

Mate - I'm sure it wouldn't take long to find the thread. I posted links, the problem is that I have posted literally THOUSANDS of links to academic papers and I also only have a finite amount of life left to live. If it's is 'LITERALLY lifesaving', find it. I don't think it's my job to act as a oracle. It's on the site, alost certaily in either opioids or other drugs. But I don't keep all of those papers. I just find them when someone asks the first time. From that point, it's up to the seeker.

Sorry, it's been a long day and it isn't like I don't have others who also seek aid.

Again -- Sorry for treating your big arse brain like it is at our disposal sometimes. You bring the accurate information and are so rarely mistaken you have became a bit of an authority on certain things in certain peoples minds.

Horrible idea to presume a novel RC will remain available --- affordable is almost laughable. (First it will get pricier than illegal in most cases). I would say it is safe to presume sr-17018 will be hit with a ban at some point and a price hike before that. When you find a good one that is absolutely legal to order and possess; and the price is cheap. INVEST - if you are insane you can wait and make alot of money. If you are sane you have alot of something noone else does you can sit on quietly and manage yourself.

(Sometimes you can even skirt piss tests with the right RC and lack of talking) --- Look into metabolites and do your own research there.

 

[4DQSAR]

I absolutely WOULD invest in buying the stuff while it's legal to do so. But do demand a certificate of analysis if it's coming from China.

I just know the DEA are experts in inventing problems for them to 'solve' and they must HATE the idea of all drugs being legal since no more career. That's why I suggested allowing licenced sales since it's safer for users but importantly, ensures that someone who is a career DEA officer won't get their rice bowl broken.

 

[VerbalTruist]

thankswish i could go get medical manage/moniterd--if i could afford detox id have went a year ago-tho' thats how i ended up on 7 to avoid an abrupt forced taper by new young doctor pullinh my script of 10 yeras--i al,msost got taken out jumping off 4 mg subs in 2007 dropped to 92 lbsfrom 145 in less then 2 weeks -tachycardia for over a month severe dehydration stec all while passing kidney stones/pain adrenaline insonia-and sub wd-im older now and have signalling autonomid issues and metabolic so im in even worse positon than in 2007-medically- i live alone dont even have a way to hospital-ambulance takes 45 minutes to get to my aprtment -so just trying to not die is all

What state do you live in, what’s your income level, and how old are you? If you want to give me these details privately, I bet we could find you somewhere.

 

[DieTrying]

What state do you live in, what’s your income level, and how old are you? If you want to give me these details privately, I bet we could find you somewhere.

hey just saw this ill message you

 

[DieTrying]

I absolutely WOULD invest in buying the stuff while it's legal to do so. But do demand a certificate of analysis if it's coming from China.

I just know the DEA are experts in inventing problems for them to 'solve' and they must HATE the idea of all drugs being legal since no more career. That's why I suggested allowing licenced sales since it's safer for users but importantly, ensures that someone who is a career DEA officer won't get their rice bowl broken.

there is also****edit sent in dm-so i guess i shld dm this instead dont want to have the 'man' seeing it

 

[VerbalTruist]

hey just saw this ill message you

I’ll do some looking!

 

[4DQSAR]

Back on topic.

In animal models, 7-OH mitragynine has around 20-30% oral bioavailability.

While it's unclear exactly what is being sold, I suggest it is the hydrochloride addition salt. I was unable to find any solubility data on that salt.

But just like tianeptine, early BL reports were saying how great it was which within a few months became more like warnings as the AWS is severe. I don't know how people were consuming that product. But we are starting to see 'trip reports' noting that 7-OH mitragynine also has a severe AWS,

So even if the material is soluable enough to be snorted, I would advise extreme caution. In other classes of compound the nasel route appears not only to increase bioavailability but to change the subjective effects.

I'm old enough to remember the discovery of 7-OHM, the initial excitement and within a decade researchers appeared to decide that the most valuable aspect of the material was in extending our understanding of other opioids. Sadly there is no legal requirement for human trials to be published (which is why I support alltrials.net) but if there were human studies, I would suggest that they weren't positive.

I believe in the fifth freedom but only when a person is able to provide informed consent. I don't think we have enough data to know what to expect from parentheral administration of 7-hydroxy mitragynine i.e. we cannot inform.

 

[rplate81]

I have tried it too snorting, all it did was seem to make my nose blue or whatever color the stuff was haha. I was later on told that that route of administration is not any better than oral. I don't know though.

 

[Deleted member 580309]

ANY sr info--success stories PLEASE let me know?

To start I have a super fast metabolism and im sure this will not be the same for everyone. I got off (then back on) a 600+mg day 7oh habit with sr. 100mg doses to start then 80 3-4 time a day and by day 4 you can start to cut the sr dose to like 20 then ur good to go. If only it helped with the mental aspect the same as the physical. Its truly a miracle how something can work like that. just remember once you done and 25 mg hits you hard again, you'll be back up to the same tolerance as before in a couple days. Good luck! The stuff really is like ia miracle for this.

 

[Kurt Cobain]

Sounds like you answered your own question there! Also, ai highly recommend tapering down. I know a few individuals who have been through high dose 7-OH withdrawals and it sounds worse than my nitazene withdrawals.

Lol your friends are over exaggerating. 7oh wds aren't near as bad as fent or nitazines.

 

[Kurt Cobain]

Yeah tbh SR goes for like 99$ a G, I can't afford that atm. I'm just going to CT when the time comes and if I really need to I'll take the suboxone strip I have. I'm just nervous the Subs will just make it worse... never really been down this road. I know I can't taper because having it on hand makes me compulsively dose. So CT quit with a bunch of comfort meds like Pregabalin, Gabapentin, Soma, Diazepam and MIT extract or leaf

Ah bro you got all that for comfort meds? Wtf are you even worried about???? You won't feel nada fucking thing aside from some depression and fatigue

 

[Helpmeescapethis]

Lol your friends are over exaggerating. 7oh wds aren't near as bad as fent or nitazines.

That really doesn’t seem to be the reality for a great many people. 7-OH is a bastard of a chemical, especially at the 150-300mg doses people are doing. It’s got mechanisms of action far different than other opioids.

 

[4DQSAR]

That really doesn’t seem to be the reality for a great many people. 7-OH is a bastard of a chemical, especially at the 150-300mg doses people are doing. It’s got mechanisms of action far different than other opioids.

It MAY be the case that just like tianeptine, etonitazene and tapentadol , 7-OHM (or MGM-15) is a SUPERagonist. Now don't confuse that term with potency. A compound need not be potent to be classed a superagonist. A superagonist is any compound the acts as a stronger agonist at a receptor that the endogenous ligands (ligands produced by the body).

Certainly we don't have enough data on MGM-15 and it's related compounds. Given that the only difference between 7-OHM and MGM-15 is the reduction of a single double-bond, who is to say that 7-OHM isn't a side-product of a 7-OHM synthesis? It seems quite a likely side-product and the little information we have on the synthesis of 7-OHM from mitragynine suggests a yield of 60-70% and that preparative chromatograpy is required to isolate the 7-OHM, modifying the synthesis so that MGM-15 is the side product would be a very attractive modification.

Never forget that when you have a product, you need customers. If MGM-15 as side-product means more cut, that means less product per dose unit so increased profit.

IF I was in the position to take a closer look at 'kratom extract' based products, I would be looking to see just how much 7-OHM and MGM-15 were in those products. It makes finanicial sense to misrepresent a stronger ligand, someone will do just that.

In fact, as soon as one person does it, Gresham's law more or less drmands that every supplier begins to make the stronger product just to stay in business.

 

[Kurt Cobain]

That really doesn’t seem to be the reality for a great many people. 7-OH is a bastard of a chemical, especially at the 150-300mg doses people are doing. It’s got mechanisms of action far different than other opioids.

Redditors aren't the vast majority my man, they're whiney children, literally. It's a potty party over there they just all want their thumb sucked by a stranger. 7oh is NOWHERE NEAR AS BAD AS FENT OR NITAZINES and if anybody says otherwise they've never done Either to actually compare too, it's not even close, not even in the same realm even at extremely high doses.

 

[cnnka]

7OH isn’t nearly as good or as bad as full agonists. It doesn’t feel THAT good or that deep. As far as WDs, I can’t comment because I’ve never developed a dependency on it. I’m taking it regularly, but if my stash runs out, I don’t take extra steps to acquire it, nor do I have physical symptoms hardly even psychological ones.

7OH is VERY potent and VERY safe, that’s why you see people taking such massive dosages (100–300–600 mg). If I take 15 mg in one dose, I’ll puke my brains out and probably nod. I’ve been taking it for some months now, almost every day, and I’ve never gone over 10 mg in a whole day. Cigarettes are very “safe,” that’s why you see people smoke 3 packs a day. If tobacco, alcohol, and weed are legal, 7OH should be too.

As for the people who take huge dosages, there are always going to be those people. They find a “safe” compound and abuse the hell out of it. I used to do the same with weed. The only difference is that 7OH isn’t so harmless when you suddenly stop it but again, nowhere near harder opiates. I would say the WDs might even be easier than high dose, longterm kratom.

It spins my head seeing people take those massive dosages and spend so much money and time on this compound to the point that it takes over their lives. I think it’s more mental after all. People who take those dosages are going to develop a problem with whatever compound they find safe to abuse and easy to access. Give those people legal oxycodone or cocaine and see what happens.

I’m 190 cm, almost 100 kg, with opiate experience, a lot of drug experience, and past kratom dependency. It just isn’t possible that I take 2.5–10 mg (at most), while people even half my weight are ingesting 10–20x more and “not getting high.” That is abuse at its fullest. And STILL, the compound is very forgiving, because if it wasn’t, people would be dropping like flies, stealing, and causing harm for their dosage instead of just bragging on Reddit about their intense WDs.

 

[4DQSAR]

I just noted a paper which using human liver microsones (i.e. in vitro) appears to demonstrate that the metabolism of mitragynine to be quite complex.

Kratom Alkaloids: Interactions With Enzymes, Receptors, and Cellular Barriers - PMC

Parallel to the growing use of kratom, there is a wealth of evidence from self-report, preclinical, and early clinical studies on therapeutic benefits of its alkaloids in particular for treating pain, managing substance use disorder, and coping with ...

pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Always be careful in attempting to extrapolate from in vitro models as many more factors affect the action and metabolism in vivo. I can only say that one reason a new medicine can fail clinical trials is unreliable pharmokinetics. I'm old enough to remember when mitragynine and 7-OHM were first isolated and that a Japanese (?) team attempted to develop them as medicines. Then the research stopped. Once again, given that there is no legal requirement for any human trials to be published, we have no way of knowing what happened.

Could I just point out the title of the thread. So I'm continuing to respond to that question.

We still know too little about these compounds for my comfort. But if a compound only has 20-30% oral bioavilability, it does seem very likely that snorting a powder of unknown provinence isn't a great plan BUT if someone is intent on doing so, the whole YMMV issue may be even more important than it is for codeine (a pro drug). People classed as 'super metabolizers' can fatally overdose on codeine while those classed as 'poor metabolizers' may not even get any pain relief at that same dose.

We just don't know. But I hope we can agree that anyone presented with the classic 'mystery powder' is playing Russian roulette with their lives.

As others have correctly noted, a person making tea using herbal kratom from a known source likely isn't going to get into trouble while someone snorting something proporting to be 7OHM (which as I pointed out, may not be) probably can. It may not be quite as simple as 'the dose makes the poison' if liver enzymes are responsible for the oxidation of mitragynine into 7-OHM but while I've never even seen the stuff, hundreds of mg does sound like a huge dose. I was given to understand that 7OHM was shown to be MORE potent than morphine (in animal models). But again, while animal models CAN be useful, the above paper does appear to suggest that in this case, those models may have done a poor job.

 

[Helpmeescapethis]

Redditors aren't the vast majority my man, they're whiney children, literally. It's a potty party over there they just all want their thumb sucked by a stranger. 7oh is NOWHERE NEAR AS BAD AS FENT OR NITAZINES and if anybody says otherwise they've never done Either to actually compare too, it's not even close, not even in the same realm even at extremely high doses.

I hate reddit. I definitely wasn’t referring to that.

Obvious the compounds themselves and highs aren’t comparable. But the withdrawals and negative aspects of 7-OH are disproportionately horrible compared to its effects.

These are close friends of mine I’ve known for over a decade, all of them have serious experience with nitazenes and 7-OH. They all assumed it would be better because its effects and potency are so insignificant vs. other options.

Like I said, when you get to excessive doses, all the other aspects of 7-OH become magnified and the withdrawals are debilitating. I never saw them so bad before, and we were among the first users of nitazenes, in a very serious way.

 

[Kurt Cobain]

I hate reddit. I definitely wasn’t referring to that.

Obvious the compounds themselves and highs aren’t comparable. But the withdrawals and negative aspects of 7-OH are disproportionately horrible compared to its effects.

These are close friends of mine I’ve known for over a decade, all of them have serious experience with nitazenes and 7-OH. They all assumed it would be better because its effects and potency are so insignificant vs. other options.

Like I said, when you get to excessive doses, all the other aspects of 7-OH become magnified and the withdrawals are debilitating. I never saw them so bad before, and we were among the first users of nitazenes, in a very serious way.

I'd hard disagree man, the effects align perfectly with eachother, the negatives and the positives.