Does kratom withdrawal feel terrible for anybody else?

[Okiv99]

I am pressed for time and have not fully read all the responses. I am very likely addicted to Kratom...but less so than I am to Coffee. When I was 36 and 100% clean and sober I felt good (was 100% clean and sober for about 18 years). Now at my advanced age (62) being clean and sober I just feel like crap, particularly at night. I still work out incredibly hard and have many injuries.

Kratom makes me feel halfway decent so I suppose there is some very mild addiction there. It gives me enough boost to run my dog at night, 2 hours after my workout. But I never increase my dosage over 5 grams and always take a couple of days off. Sometimes 3 days a week. Now yes, I did some X Saturday night followed by a Xanax to sleep then Sunday I did absolutely nothing.

My main concern is real opioids. I have a bunch (fent, real Oxy, and Tramadol....and a pretty much unlimited access to fent). My BIG worry is not to get hooked on that stuff, and I have been good only getting high once a week, and then a pretty modest high.

This is just me, but as long as I am limiting my use of REAL hard core opioids to once a week, I am OK doing small amounts of kratom.

I think you sound like you have it under control atleast a little bit id just back of if you find doses escalating or gaps between use getting less and less. The conversation about kratom (or minor opiate use in general) gets a little bit more nuanced with age and chronic pain conditions anyway. Aslong as you continue to moderate it like you and the quality of life improvement is outweighing any negative side effects i think its okay.

In my case (and allot of people addicted/not using to manage pain) even if its not damaging your health, family life, personal life in any measurable way ive found it can just make you content to do absolutely nothing and so you waste your life away.

 

[intergalacticBG]

I think you sound like you have it under control atleast a little bit id just back of if you find doses escalating or gaps between use getting less and less. The conversation about kratom (or minor opiate use in general) gets a little bit more nuanced with age and chronic pain conditions anyway. Aslong as you continue to moderate it like you and the quality of life improvement is outweighing any negative side effects i think its okay.

In my case (and allot of people addicted/not using to manage pain) even if its not damaging your health, family life, personal life in any measurable way ive found it can just make you content to do absolutely nothing and so you waste your life away.

It definitely does the same to me. Makes you content to do nothing but dose. Makes you reclusive.

 

[Neuroborean]

I dont mean to sound preachy, but 50 grams a day is WAY too much!!.

I dont take more than 12 grams a day.
3 grams per dose spaced over 4 hours or so is my daily regiment

for me it's about the same, but with different timing, 4-6 in the morning, 3 at lunch and another 3.5-4.5 at night and it works for me,
the constant anxious feeling, restlessness and horrible insomnia is the worst of the withdrawals, if I dose ritalin, a lot of mucuna and/or yohimbe and can be pretty active, but otherwise the lethargy it's also a bad symptom. Diazepam and black seed oil works very good (low dose diazepam it's enough for me 5mg, as I don't have any tolerance). Amanita Muscaria it's also pretty good at night for sleeping, 3-5 grams, it's also pretty good as an antidepressant.

 

[Quasimoto]

I wonder how much 7-OH is in 10 gr of regular leaf? Is kratom a pro drug concept where the body turns mitragynine into 7-OH?

Both, but very little.

Kratom powder contains like 0.001% 7oh by weight. So 10g would only have micrograms.

The majority of 7OH comes from metabolizing mit in the liver. But this doesn't create much either, its not the preferred metabolization route , very negligible amount.

 

[notsmokeymcpot42088]

If 7OH is about to catch a ban as Them Witches suggests and it proves as useful of a tool as touted I may just have to stock up for "worst case situation/doctor fallout". Of course possessing it will become illegal I suppose but as long as it stays with me who would know. I propose a grandfather law and oh yea no legal questions but I wonder if a good lawyer could argue he got it from the gas station when it was legal and forgot. --- I mean not after this incriminating ass post probably lol. This is all hypothetical of course.

Second question I gotta be careful with phrasing umm has anyone ever seen 7oh drugtested for; I suppose the damn labs would catch it if they looked for it but I slipped a few RC's past them for years with no problems. (Redwood toxicology)

 

[Quasimoto]

Second question I gotta be careful with phrasing umm has anyone ever seen 7oh drugtested for; I suppose the damn labs would catch it if they looked for it but I slipped a few RC's past them for years with no problems. (Redwood toxicology)

Yes, in general, if a place tests for kratom (which is becoming more common), they test for both mitragynine and 7oh.

 

[Fresco]

for me it's about the same, but with different timing, 4-6 in the morning, 3 at lunch and another 3.5-4.5 at night and it works for me,
the constant anxious feeling, restlessness and horrible insomnia is the worst of the withdrawals, if I dose ritalin, a lot of mucuna and/or yohimbe and can be pretty active, but otherwise the lethargy it's also a bad symptom. Diazepam and black seed oil works very good (low dose diazepam it's enough for me 5mg, as I don't have any tolerance). Amanita Muscaria it's also pretty good at night for sleeping, 3-5 grams, it's also pretty good as an antidepressant.

Try Phenibut. Its OTC and works well for kratom withdrawals

 

[JackARoe]

Both, but very little.

Kratom powder contains like 0.001% 7oh by weight. So 10g would only have micrograms.

The majority of 7OH comes from metabolizing mit in the liver. But this doesn't create much either, its not the preferred metabolization route , very negligible amount.

Thanks Quasi, I know I an count on info from you. And you have experience with all of these new fangled forms. That regular powder doesn't produce much 7-oh is probably why you had stated tapering off plain powder can be done a little easier.

If this was 10 years ago I may have tried the 7-oh. But since I am trying to get off powder I will just forgo this.

 

[Neuroborean]

Try Phenibut. Its OTC and works well for kratom withdrawals

yeah, never tried yet, I will, there's some european shops that offers it afaik.

 

[Shambles]

I’d avoid phenibut like the plague. Withdrawal is many, many times more severe than kratom. If you’re struggling with kratom then phenibut is your worst nightmare…

 

[Fresco]

I’d avoid phenibut like the plague. Withdrawal is many, many times more severe than kratom. If you’re struggling with kratom then phenibut is your worst nightmare…

Thats weird, cause I never got WD from funnybutt

 

[Fresco]

After taking kratom every day, how long does it take for you to hit tolerance??

For me its about 4 to 6 weeks of daily use before I become tolerant, and I have to take a 2-week break again

 

[SotPoker1012]

I'm a heavy kratom user. The bad withdrawals didn't begin until year three of regular use for me. I could pick it up and drop it with only minimal symptoms for the first three years. Mild restless legs, mild irritability, and fatigue for 2-3 days.

At this point, I get severe anxiety, depression symptoms, restless legs that keep me up at night, weird sinus issues, headaches, can't focus... The kratom WDs got a lot worse after a period of benzo use and withdrawal from that. I suspect it's connected but I don't know if that's a possibility.

I've been slowly lowering my daily dose though and noticed improvement.

 

[JackARoe]

I'm a heavy kratom user. The bad withdrawals didn't begin until year three of regular use for me. I could pick it up and drop it with only minimal symptoms for the first three years. Mild restless legs, mild irritability, and fatigue for 2-3 days

Same here, although the withdrawal still does not get too bad. But it did take months after using to feel a sniffle. And now I get something that amounts to like 1/4th of an opiate withdrawal and it still sucks. It is not easy. I remember thinking that because two days in a row of poppy tea and I am in a worse withdrawal for like a week. Kratom took a bit and hooks don't go as deep. I do think taking like 30 mgs of DXM when I quit helped with the other NMDA area that it may hit. Every kick I was better in 2 weeks.

The kratom WDs got a lot worse after a period of benzo use and withdrawal from that. I suspect it's connected but I don't know if that's a possibility.

I think poly drug use factors in more than we discuss. I see that with gabapentin or pregabalin. Lots say they are ok just putting it down. Others have hard times. And usually other drugs mixed in. I do think poly drug use leads to altered type addictions and to really nail down usage discussing all the drug in a person's body would help. It is not helpful when someone is saying they are having a hard time quitting 900 mgs of gabapentin but leave out the AD, AP, and other drugs they take.

I found stopping kratom with a taper and no other drugs in my system to be doable. I did it about 4 times, I do admit this run it has been a while. But right now handling duties and glad I am still on the 25 gr of powder. But if I used kratom to kick a harder opiate habit the kratom kick was harder.