Tryptamines Dose depended headache

[alexcycling]

Hi all,
it seems that I'm one of those having dose dependent headache after psilocybin (had golden teachers dried and B+ fresh so far; all self grown, should be free of contam).
About 11h after ingestion (I did ingest in the morning) I develop a headache which last over night.
With 2g dried it was so strong that I took some ibuprofen.
With 3g dried it was quite strong.
I took 15g fresh B+ (just for curiosity) and had at the same time a light headache.

This effect seems 'scientifically known': https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/22129843/ , but no counter measure was discussed.

As I intend to go for more / and higher dosed session I'd like to know: does anyone else experience this? Is there some approach to reduce it?

Thanks!
Alex
P.S.: medium to high dose LSD is still to be done, so I can not yet tell if this is different.

 

[daturetard]

If psilocybin gives you headaches you might want to stay away from the lysergic drugs, they're well known to cause vasoconstriction. I'm almost certain that plays a part in headaches, the blood vessels contract, pushing blood through at a higher pace to compensate the lower diameter of the vessel, leading to the feeling of pounding and rushing in your head

 

[alexcycling]

If psilocybin gives you headaches you might want to stay away from the lysergic drugs, they're well known to cause vasoconstriction. I'm almost certain that plays a part in headaches, the blood vessels contract, pushing blood through at a higher pace to compensate the lower diameter of the vessel, leading to the feeling of pounding and rushing in your head

Hi,
the paper suggests that the headache is not due to vasoconstriction (this hypothesis was not approved), but due to NO release, which is know to trigger longer running effects.
Vasoconstriction is a more acute effect. The headaches in my case start after 11 hours after intake of psilocybin, while I'm typically down after 8 hours, so with quite some delay (also found in the study).

 

[daturetard]

Hi,
the paper suggests that the headache is not due to vasoconstriction (this hypothesis was not approved), but due to NO release, which is know to trigger longer running effects.
Vasoconstriction is a more acute effect. The headaches in my case start after 11 hours after intake of psilocybin, while I'm typically down after 8 hours, so with quite some delay (also found in the study).

Sorry for the confusion, I wasn't talking about psilocybin specifically the case of vasoconstriction, just recommending to stay away from lysergic drugs (much more potent vasoconstrictors, iirc) if you're prone to headaches already. Come to think of it, they're used to treat certain headaches because of the vasoconstriction they cause. But I think that's only when the bloodvessles are too dilated already, and vasoconstriction without them being too dilated, it can cause headaches in itself. Not so sure about what'd be causing the psilocybin headaches, though.

 

[Jabberwocky]

I tend to always get mild headaches on most psychedelics. It's actually a peculiar sensation, it does not feel like other types of headaches to me. It sort of feels like mental exhaustion expressed as a physical symptom. I find it only a mild annoyance, it doesn't bother me enough to distract from the trip. The headache usually starts when I'm passed the peak and start coming down, and then goes away several hours later.

On the flip side.... LSD has remarkable ability to heal other types of headaches I get. (tension/stress/low blood sugar/hangover headaches)

 

[iom]

All psychedelics have vasoconstrictive effects to varying degrees. I'm not aware of any systematic studies that indicate which drugs are the worst culprits, and there will always be individual variation anyway. So definitely do try LSD and let us know how it goes. It is possible that vasoconstriction in parts of the brain is a trigger of headaches, but other causes are possible too including muscle tension. Muscle tensions is a very common side-effect of psychedelics and may actually be voluntary, at least to an extent. Muscle tension can arise as a kind of default modal behavior. For example, you might hold yourself in a particular posture when engaging in a particular activity or even experiencing a certain emotional state. Psychedelics can amplify that tendency. This is an opportunity for insight because the psychedelic can assist with connecting awareness of the tension to the underlying state that might produce it. Perhaps you are carrying an emotional burden which is also burdening you physically. Letting it go might lighten both your mind and body.

I personally get headaches often after trips, but they don't usually set in until at least the day after the experience. Sometimes with longer acting stuff it takes two or three days for them to show up. Most of the time, they are not especially bothersome. Often the lift from the after-glow more than compensates for them, and I am able to carry on more productively than normal. I have noted that some psychedelics are more prone to causing me post-trip headaches than others. Like, I almost always get a post-trip headache after taking 2C-I. Possibly the worst post-trip headaches I've gotten were after taking ayahuasca on two separate occasions. Unlike with other trips, the ayahuasca headaches set in shortly after my trips ended.

I should note that I suffer from migraine headaches normally, and my normal headaches are usually much worse than the post-trip headaches. My migraines tend to come with a bunch of other symptoms, which are often more difficult for me to deal with than the head pain. I am prone to getting migraines when I push myself beyond a certain point, like exercising too much, losing too much sleep, getting too much sun (to which I'm effectively allergic), and/or any other major kind of stressor. It's interesting that my post-trip headaches actually feel a lot like my migraines in many ways, and it would make sense that I'm tending to "over do it" a bit during my trips. However as I said, most of the time it's as though the after-glow overcomes these negative effects or otherwise blunts them somehow. Furthermore, my regular psychedelics use seems to greatly reduce the frequency, severity, and duration of my natural migraines, which makes them very helpful to me on net.

Of course, everyone is different, and I wish you luck.

 

[Mr. Krinkle]

when i go off the deep end, i'll sometimes get a bloody nose


that's how i know im having fun

 

[alexcycling]

Hi all,
here is the promised report about LSD. It took me some time for another trip (needed to integrate the last one - I think this is what tripping is for ;-) ) and had a busy summer.
I took 225 µg 1D-LSD which should convert to ~170µg LSD-25. According to conversion calculators, this should be about comparable to 4g dried standard psilocybin mushrooms.
The trip was interesting, the headache also appeared (much later because LSD takes longer to fall off), it was somewhat comparable to 2g mushroom, i.e. same feeling, but not as intense as with 3g. So I guess it's the effect discussed in the paper linked above.

 

[pupnik]

I think it is a sinus allergy taking over as the sympathomimetic (mucous membrane drying) effects of the psychedelic subside.
coming down maybe take an allergy pill, ephedrine, pseudoephedrine or something.

you know about downregulating, or push-pull effects of decongestants, well that is what I think is happening.
eg. when you come off decongestants, you are usually more stuffy than before you started them
I would still take them if you need to fight a headache, but if ibuprophen or panadol work then don't bother with decongestants too.

 

[iom]

Thanks for your report!

Out of curiosity, how much physical activity do you get, and do you do anything at high intensity?

 

[alexcycling]

Hi, sorry for the late response, I was a bit busy.
I do lots of sports (mainly biking) and also high intensity. Never any problems...