Stimulants Why does generic adderall keep getting worse?

[darvocet21]

I've been prescribed four different generics in the past 6 mos. Each one seemingly a little bit worse than the previous one. And always a delay even though my prescription is sent in a week to 10 days before the fill date. The pharmacist explains that they're not allowed to order it until the day before. It's a totally idiotic system that's to be expected.

However what if so-called generic adderall (the branded formula having been discontinued) is purposely being diluted/denuded? Much in the same way that strong opioids have been tampered with in recent years to "deter abuse" by compounding them with agents that reduce absorption limiting bioavailability and perpetuating the suffering of those with acute and or chronic pain?

Nothing would surprise me about the criminality of large pharmaceutical companies at this point. However generic makers used to take pride in providing equipotent & affordable versions of branded drugs, which are cynical monopolies on long-existing drugs such as oxycodone or dextro-/amphetamine salts simply because they claim a novel delivery system or in the case of adderal by mixing as if someone swept the floor of a f****** laboratory one day and said hey these four salts give us a 3 to 1 ratio d-/a- we can make a bazillion dollars. Assholes

Here's a quick list of the tablets I've received w/ratings

LANNETT - 7.5/10 by far the best which I've asked my pharmacy to request but to no avail. The tablets are small, not chalky and have a pleasing sweet taste which I like because my preferred Roa is to dissolve under the tongue

MALLINKRODT - 3/10 easily the worst. Practically Zero Effect and then when one experiences something it's not at all like what one expects. These little white octagonal f****** are also gritty and disgusting. Lucky for me I've only gotten them once and said please please don't get them again I'll even wait if I have to(which I always have to... But that's another gripe for another time)

AUROBINDO - 6/10 the ones I have right now are the 10 mg since the twenties were unavailable (along with juice boxes ) at the beginning of September due to the school year starting ( Definitely more effective however the colloidal silicon dioxide makes them taste chalky and awful, and is a reason why it takes real strength to crush these suckers with a pill crusher--
Insufflate at your own risk trying not to inhale too deeply as any kind of silicone dust has the potential of damaging lung tissue

ALVOGEN - after Lannett this was probably the second most effective at 20mg strength, and the inactive ingredients we're not overly bothersome. Definitely on my "preferred" list; 7/10 which is to say not completely worthless.

I'm even considering switching back to Methylphenidate which really is a drug of abuse for me though.

 

[Fire&Water]

Under the tongue is no way to boof speed

 

[negrogesic]

From what i recall, aurobindo adderall was better than Alvogen, but not 100% sure on this. I know aurobindo makes decent dextroamphetamine.

The real answer is to switch to dextroamphetamine. But even still the real answer within that is to switch to Zenzedi.

 

[darvocet21]

That's a new one on me. Going to research zenzedi

 

[darvocet21]

I've heard of that. Isn't that the one that you take before you go to bed and it starts working when you wake up?

 

[darvocet21]

From what i recall, aurobindo adderall was better than Alvogen, but not 100% sure on this. I know aurobindo makes decent dextroamphetamine.

The real answer is to switch to dextroamphetamine. But even still the real answer within that is to switch to Zenzedi.

That is actually the best advice I have gotten in a while. I know I could get it to because I have a cool prescriber and she knows the difficulty we've had with generic Adderall not being available in a particular strength and having to send in another prescription. I wonder who makes generic dexedrine/stat? Thanks @negrogesic

 

[falsifiedhypothesi]

Are those mallinckrodt ones an off white/very light orange/maybe pink color? Pretty sure those are the ones I always get, and yeah they are fucking disgusting. They dissolve quickly and I highly doubt there are abuse deterrents in them, but when they dissolve in my mouth I gag pretty much every time. On the plus side, they are very easy to dissolve and crush for alternate ROA's

Personally I think it has less to do with the brands and manufacturing of the drug and more to do with the generally unpredictable effects of amphetamine. Sometimes I will get a very clean and clear stimulation off 15mg, but sometimes the same dose will cause brain fog.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

imo there is a world of difference between dextro and racemic Amphetamine.

I have extracted d-Amphetamin but its no where naer as hedonistic as regular Amphetamine. Which is only available as speed/ illegal produced. Which is an equal mixture of the dextro and levo isomer. So not exactly Adderal which is non existent over here. But ime more euphoric as dextro.

 

[darvocet21]

Are those mallinckrodt ones an off white/very light orange/maybe pink color? Pretty sure those are the ones I always get, and yeah they are fucking disgusting. They dissolve quickly and I highly doubt there are abuse deterrents in them, but when they dissolve in my mouth I gag pretty much every time. On the plus side, they are very easy to dissolve and crush for alternate ROA's

Personally I think it has less to do with the brands and manufacturing of the drug and more to do with the generally unpredictable effects of amphetamine. Sometimes I will get a very clean and clear stimulation off 15mg, but sometimes the same dose will cause brain fog.

Off white to white octagonal
They have the M on them. Lower strength come in squares

 

[darvocet21]

I have no idea what's going on

 

[negrogesic]

I got a zenzedi script but no one is willing to fill it. My pharmacist friend retired unfortunately, now i can't convince any of these jack-offs to fill it.

A rite aid/cvs/wallgreens pharmacist is a medical professional and can get anything they want, from any wholesaler, but they are unlikely to expend the time. The pharmacist i knew from a private pharmacy would have filled it, he filled my desoxyn and other weird stuff. But without that personal connection all these chains will make no effort whatsoever. They just say, oh our wholesaler can't get it. Which might be true, but they can get any medicine they want, they'd just have to make a few calls.

 

[darvocet21]

Go to a compounding pharmacy

 

[JestressAnonymous]

It sucks but I actually know and understand the reason!

Generic equivalents are mandatory to dispense unless your doctor writes "no-substitutions" specifically on the order. I'll get into why that is in a min. I was once able to get the brand name Adderall to be covered by health insurance after reporting to my health insurance nurse advice line that the generic version was causing a rare side effect, which was numbness in toes and fingers that was getting pretty persistently worse. Then it was near damn impossible to find it at any pharmacy, but once a pharmacy knew that id need it again next month, they would order it just for me.

So this is how it works. A new drug comes out and is the BRAND name drug. Its usually very expensive and health insurance isnt thrilled to cover it unless you are able to prove that all the other drugs for that health problem have been tried and deemed useless. So this is the company that developed that drug - they are allowed for a limited time to have a monopoly on that drug - and then after I think it maybe two years, this legal thing is lifted, and anyone is allowed to make a generic equivalent, which has the same active ingredient, goes by the same name chemically etc.

The only requirement for something to be a generic equivalent is to be at least 60% effective as the brand name drug at addressing any given health condition.

That's 40% margin to not be effective. Thats a D- right there.

So you'll notice, certain pharmacies may be more inclined to have different generic versions of adderall and when you look at the retail price, even if from the same pharmacy but filled different months, you'll notice the variation in price. They claim this is to help keep the price of healthcare for everybody down. I remeber when abilify first came out, my friend who picked it up at pharmacy showed me that without insurance it was literally $1200 for his prescription.

Its in super tiny letters, but whenever you fill your prescription, take note of the MANUFACTURER which is always listed on the bottle SUPER tiny.
look for the letters Mfr:


No one gets brand name drugs for anything unless 1.) doctor writes no substitutions or 2.) original brand name drug hasnt reached its patent expiration yet.

these generic equivalents dont even need to be created in the same way with the same ingredients. Much like ppl who cook meth know that you can yield the same product, by using extremely different materials and processes in the beginning. It still will make the thing. But I think the devil is in the details.

Most of our shitty generic equivalents come from china. it is far far far more cheaper to have your company, even if based in the us, have its plants be in countries that have no labor working laws, so people get paid less, to work more hours, there are less standards. The true money saver is not so much paying for labor as it is paying for standards. In america it is very expensive to create pharmaceuticals because well first the work enviroment HAS to be safe. Osha standards must be met, as well as fair labor practices. then you need systems in place where everything is confirmed that gets done especially with a controlled drug. Everytime you pick it up and put it down it needs to be logged.

Outsource to china? less likely to have to take the blame when whistleblowers see something going wrong. in fact, i doubt there are whistle blowers at all. I doubt these factories who make these shit equivalents EVER have anyone from the company that sells big pharma and represents the Mfr here ever regularly get to walk through the plant and make sure there arent rats shitting in our adderall. and i even doubt more that there would be any motivation to deliver a superior product to a country of people that have publicly shat on china. I dont think they care if using the product 30 years down the road gives me a stroke.

same active ingredients... not the same ingredients all around

So pay attention. Teva is the best MFR i have universally heard ppl go out of their way for. Sometimes I get shit like from Epic Pharma and that stuff is when i get neck stiffness and need to use more than prescribed. No one actually cares about our conditions. Its all about not solving problems that can be solved by creating a chronic customer.

when suboxone first came out it was not meant to be used for more than 6 months. it was meant to be a way to taper. Now they just have people be on it for life. You need the returning revenue. Renewable energy is a great idea. it renews itself or there is an endless supply of it that does not require money- like the sun- which could literally run the whole planet for free after installation- but then wheres the dependent returning customer? Thats why your new coffee machine broke already.

 

[JestressAnonymous]

I got a zenzedi script but no one is willing to fill it. My pharmacist friend retired unfortunately, now i can't convince any of these jack-offs to fill it.

A rite aid/cvs/wallgreens pharmacist is a medical professional and can get anything they want, from any wholesaler, but they are unlikely to expend the time. The pharmacist i knew from a private pharmacy would have filled it, he filled my desoxyn and other weird stuff. But without that personal connection all these chains will make no effort whatsoever. They just say, oh our wholesaler can't get it. Which might be true, but they can get any medicine they want, they'd just have to make a few calls.

I have found private pharmacies, the little mom and pop shops, to be way better about this. I would imagine it is near impossible to find anyone with desoxyn in stock, let alone anyone who isn't afraid to fill it. I almost want to try my hand at being a pharmacy assistant just to understand this shit. They were saying my med was on backorder for a month, but then when I got my adderall filled finally, i noticed that they had a better quality generic equivalent and that the retail price for said generic equivalent was twice that of the Manufacturerers they usually use. This is why suddenly Walgreens stopped covering my pharmacy benefits for my health plan! So ridiculous. My healthplan is like charity state run plan. I now deserve side effects and 40% less effective drugs that are more inclined to give me a stroke.