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Am researchng for an essay on porn and am wondering how some stuff on pornohub is even legal????

I would also argue that misogyny, abuse and paedophilia were much more prevalent back in the 60s/70s than it is now. It wasn't talked out, it was just brushed under the carpet and everyone turned a blind eye - even being seen as normal in an abnormal kind of way. Porn doesn't cause that behaviour, it simply reflects current tastes. I dread to think what the porn sites would have been like if the internet had existed back then...
 
Atelier3 said:
Anyway, this thread is about pornography and the legality of the material shown. It’s not about prostitution or sweeping statements about morality.
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er, yeah. That was the general idea ... can people be back on the topic a bit more?
 
and one angle that has occurred to me is this: why, on the one hand, is having sex with under-aged persons abhorred in general, yet pornography that eroticises pubescent women above all others seen as normal?
Even the shaven vagina business, which seems universal, seems a little suspect to me...
Although its appeal
could be connected with other whims I guess, such as desire to see everything "uncovered" as much as possible?
 
F.U.B.A.R. said:
I would dispute that TBH. The 70s were very much still in the Twiggy era. I would argue that bigger girls are featured more in porn these days than they ever were in the 70s ( and I should know ;) ).

As for the current fashion for shaved pubes, I dont see it as mimicking prepubescent girls at all. Pubes are just fuckin disgusting wiry piss soaked smelly crab catchers. Who the fuck wants pubes in their teeth..?
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not wanting pubes in your teeth is not the same thing as finding pubes aesthetically intolerable in porn...
as a side note (sorry I am
person going off topic now)
was just reading that medical
personnel have much harder time these days when young women present to hospitals after being raped, because usually there's
little or no pubic hair, which would ordinarily pick up a lot of physical trace from the rapist.
 
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My sister is a certified nurse midwife and she does routine ob/gyn care, as well as delivering babies when the pregnancy is not determined to be high risk.
She says that the shaving of pubes has contributed to an increase in STDs and other infections. She says pubic hair is actually the 1st line of defense against diseases and the pubic hair catches things before they become an issue.
 
F.U.B.A.R. said:
I would also argue that misogyny, abuse and paedophilia were much more prevalent back in the 60s/70s than it is now. It wasn't talked out, it was just brushed under the carpet and everyone turned a blind eye - even being seen as normal in an abnormal kind of way. Porn doesn't cause that behaviour, it simply reflects current tastes. I dread to think what the porn sites would have been like if the internet had existed back then...
Click to expand...
btw of course you are right: in fact a lot of stuff which most people would think inappropriate these days was quite okay in the 70s...thinking specifically of those "artistic"
pictures of semi-naked teen girls by a photographer called David Hamilton (I think) - they were very popular: people had them on show in their houses ....
Also, when tougher laws against child
porn/having sex with minors were introduced in the 70s and 80s, many famous academics such as Michel Foucault spoke out against such laws as repressive and anti-sexual.

These days when any sort of censorship of porn (or anything) is mooted, the anti-censorship people tend to rely on the "freedom of speech"'argument, rather than the 70s "sexual freedom" angle. Possibly because in our era,
nearly everyone will get on board with "freedom of speech".
 
BellaJewel said:
My sister is a certified nurse midwife and she does routine ob/gyn care, as well as delivering babies when the pregnancy is not determined to be high risk.
She says that the shaving of pubes has contributed to an increase in STDs and other infections. She says pubic hair is actually the 1st line of defense against diseases and the pubic hair catches things before they become an issue.
Click to expand...
BellaJewel said:
My sister is a certified nurse midwife and she does routine ob/gyn care, as well as delivering babies when the pregnancy is not determined to be high risk.
She says that the shaving of pubes has contributed to an increase in STDs and other infections. She says pubic hair is actually the 1st line of defense against diseases and the pubic hair catches things before they become an issue.
[/QUOTE
That's very interesting .. ironically I've met women who say they shave mainly for hygiene reasons!
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I should add that I actually reported a man who was making underage pornography to the police. I’m no longer afraid to talk about this because the 2 main people in the situation are now dead.
When I was in 11th grade, this hot new guy started attending my high school. For whatever reason, he asked me out and we started dating. We would go to Blacks Beach, which is a famous nude beach in my town. My mom was always away on business and my dad had moved out with his boyfriend so I did whatever I wanted.
One day I was at his house and while he was in the bathroom, I saw a stack of Polaroids on the bookcase. I looked at them and almost threw up. They were kids I went to school with, naked. There were athletes, there was a cheerleader, a bunch of stoners, some kids I saw really surprised me. My boyfriend came out and caught me looking at the pics. He told me his dad, who sold pot, which was not legal in CA at the time, would give free herb to kids who posed naked.
I made up an excuse to leave and within a week I made up an excuse to break up with him. It took me a few weeks to make the call to the police. When I did, I met with them several times and I ended up testifying not only against the dad, but against some other guy, named Guy actually, I had seen hanging with the dad. They had a child pornography business and were shipping movies they made to Germany. The 2 guys I testified against went to jail for a long ass time, and believe it or not, I had classmates pissed at me because I put their dealer in jail!
 
BellaJewel said:
I should add that I actually reported a man who was making underage pornography to the police. I’m no longer afraid to talk about this because the 2 main people in the situation are now dead.
When I was in 11th grade, this hot new guy started attending my high school. For whatever reason, he asked me out and we started dating. We would go to Blacks Beach, which is a famous nude beach in my town. My mom was always away on business and my dad had moved out with his boyfriend so I did whatever I wanted.
One day I was at his house and while he was in the bathroom, I saw a stack of Polaroids on the bookcase. I looked at them and almost threw up. They were kids I went to school with, naked. There were athletes, there was a cheerleader, a bunch of stoners, some kids I saw really surprised me. My boyfriend came out and caught me looking at the pics. He told me his dad, who sold pot, which was not legal in CA at the time, would give free herb to kids who posed naked.
I made up an excuse to leave and within a week I made up an excuse to break up with him. It took me a few weeks to make the call to the police. When I did, I met with them several times and I ended up testifying not only against the dad, but against some other guy, named Guy actually, I had seen hanging with the dad. They had a child pornography business and were shipping movies they made to Germany. The 2 guys I testified against went to jail for a long ass time, and believe it or not, I had classmates pissed at me because I put their dealer in jail!
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Wow!
RE: "believe it or not, I had classmates pissed at me because I put their dealer in jail!"
I can believe it ... as a side note, it is so exploitative and sucky when people deal drugs but want to be paid "in kind", not cash.
That aside, am assuming this was a pre-internet episode? I am wondering if the kids who posed would've had more pause for thought if the net had been around ... not "victim blaming" btw. But as I read around this subject, one thing that is reiterated again and again by victims of trafficking, "revenge porn", etc, is feeling sentenced to a lifetime of humiliation and anxiety, since permanently taking the videos/images off the net is practically impossible, and of course the images can be viewed and re-veiwed practically ad infinitum ...
 
F.U.B.A.R. said:
I wouldn't know MrsGamp. My searches consist solely of 'Mature', 'BBW' and 'MILF'.

But I'm not familiar with pornhub. My go to visual masturbatory aid is Xhamster and I've not noticed anything particularly dodgy on there. From what little I've seen of the teen section, the women look like adults even if they're wearing pigtails and sucking lollipops - which is a right turn off...
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If you mean illegal in terms of under-age models, that’s less clear. Certainly, there’ll be no child porn there, but it’s likely there’d be models aged 16, 17. Pornhub don’t require proof of age of models like Producers do, so who knows? Paying for porn is not a guarantee the models are of a legal age either, but it’s more likely because a producer has a lot to lose by shooting underage models so they don’t do it.
 
JessFR said:
Warning: OK this is a pretty serious and in depth topic, so this is gonna be a really long post. If you don't wanna read the whole post, I recommend skipping the first 4 paragraphs.

Before I get into this, I'm gonna be a bit pedantic for a moment (although I do think it's an important distinction).

Teenagers are not children. Men being sexually attracted to teenage women is not unnatural. Acting on it is morally wrong because of the power dynamics relating to age, but the attraction itself isn't wrong and certainly isn't pedophilia.

There is ephebophilia, but that is only a primary attraction to teenagers at the exclusion of older women. That's what makes it unusual. Unlike pedophilia which is abnormal no matter if it's a primary attraction or not.

So, unless you're talking about videos where the person depicted is or appears to be prepubescent, it's not pedophilia. It might well still be morally wrong, even sickeningly so, but it's not pedophilia and I think it's a relevant distinction.

OK with that of the way. I don't like the porn industry at all. IF porn was made exclusively with fully consenting adults, I'd say that's absolutely fine. Nothing wrong with that.

But in practice that frequently doesn't seem to be the case. Involving actresses that clearly arent making entirely free choices. And I'd argue just being under the age of 18 in itself usually limits how free your choices are.

Being desperate for money for instance makes it not an entirely free choice. When it's a job like a McDonald's burger flipper then that's an unfree choice that can be classified as just the suckyness of life. But there's a big difference when it's staring in porn.

Sex acts under duress can cause long term emotional harm, especially when it's on video for people to watch for years to come.

So, that's my main problem with pornography. That it frequently seems to involve activities that essentially involve all but victimizing the participants.

There is another problem though. And that's that the content of porn is frequently demeaning to women and encourages misogynistic behaviors. And given how many young men watch porn, I think that's a big problem contributing to misogynistic behaviors in young men.

So, yes, the involvement of or even just depiction of teenagers in porn is problematic, but it's just one aspect of a much larger problem.

Again, if porn were purely made by fully willing participants and wasn't constantly demeaning to women (or maybe at least had more effective age filters) id have no moral objections. But that doesn't seem to be the case.

As for what to do about it? Honestly going after places like pornhub is stupid. Trying to ban it is even worse. What's needed is much better regulation.

Trying to ban it will just drive it underground and make it even seedier. It's just like prostitution. Unfortunate, but banning it is only making things worse.

Not to mention that banning anything from the internet is completely unrealistic. We know there are pedophile networks operating on the dark net. If there's a market it will always be online.

So long as it is possible to run it and regulate it in a way that's not hurting anyone, that's what we should do.
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I agree that trying to ban Pornhub is pretty futile. Plus it's hardly just Pornhub.

However, it does seem like Pornhub in particular has virtually no regulation whatsoever when it comes to verifying things like identifty of uploaders and age of participants.

According to very informative Youtube thing I watched (see below for link), all you have to do to upload a video is provide an email address and confirmation, plus tick some boxes promising that everything is legal.

All Pornhub seems to have by way of keeping it legal is a statement to the effect that they are committed to being non-exploitative, plus a disclaimer to the effect that they are just a publishing platform and not responsible for what people upload.

Ie, fuck all regulation happening with the world's most popular porn website ....
 
Coxenormous said:
If you mean illegal in terms of under-age models, that’s less clear. Certainly, there’ll be no child porn there, but it’s likely there’d be models aged 16, 17. Pornhub don’t require proof of age of models like Producers do, so who knows? Paying for porn is not a guarantee the models are of a legal age either, but it’s more likely because a producer has a lot to lose by shooting underage models so they don’t do it.
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as I just posted (above), Pornhub is practically unregulated.

Professional porn producers might be queasy about under-age performers, but what about amateur/"homemade" efforts? There is no way of knowing. Some of the girls I saw in teasers in the "Exxxtra Tiny Teen" section looked very convincingly like little girls. I didn't watch any actual videos, I admit ... to be honest I feel I wouldn't be able to look any further into this without upsetting myself.
 
MrsGamp said:
as I just posted (above), Pornhub is practically unregulated.

Professional porn producers might be queasy about under-age performers, but what about amateur/"homemade" efforts? There is no way of knowing. Some of the girls I saw in teasers in the "Exxxtra Tiny Teen" section looked very convincingly like little girls. I didn't watch any actual videos, I admit ... to be honest I feel I wouldn't be able to look any further into this without upsetting myself.
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Lmao "Exxxtra Tiny Teen" I can't take porn video titles seriously. I understand that tho. Honestly I never watch porn. I have a strong imagination so I just use that :ROFLMAO: But I guess porn is one way of relieving stress levels believe it or not. Not porn indirectly but what people do watching porn "Yah know" there are worse websites that people go to other than porn websites. Have you heard of Deviant art. That shit is foul some of the shit that is posted on there.
 
Coxenormous said:
Lmao "Exxxtra Tiny Teen" I can't take porn video titles seriously. I understand that tho. Honestly I never watch porn. I have a strong imagination so I just use that :ROFLMAO: But I guess porn is one way of relieving stress levels believe it or not. Not porn indirectly but what people do watching porn "Yah know" there are worse websites that people go to other than porn websites. Have you heard of Deviant art. That shit is foul some of the shit that is posted on there.
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On paper "Exxxtra Tiny Teen" might sound amusing, but even a quick look at titles/promos from this section two days ago has left me feeling really sick at heart.

Even if the actual girls in the "Tiny Teen" videos are really 22 years old, they LOOK like they are under 14, and are obviously MEANT to look under 14. It would seem to follow that a depressingly large number of men are sexually interested in children, and that pornographers are keen to keep this interest going, to the extent of producing fake kiddy porn.

HOPEFULLY fake kiddy porn.
 
MrsGamp said:
On paper "Exxxtra Tiny Teen" might sound amusing, but even a quick look at titles/promos from this section two days ago has left me feeling really sick at heart.

Even if the actual girls in the "Tiny Teen" videos are really 22 years old, they LOOK like they are under 14, and are obviously MEANT to look under 14. It would seem to follow that a depressingly large number of men are sexually interested in children, and that pornographers are keen to keep this interest going, to the extent of producing fake kiddy porn.

HOPEFULLY fake kiddy porn.
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If you saw my face you'd be like damn. I'm 24 almost 25 and I don't even look 18 yet. Some people look young thus is why they got jobs as porn stars or models. People tend to adore a baby face. I hate it, cause when people just go "Awe, you're adorable" I low-key get shitty because that's like talking to a baby yah know
 
MrsGamp said:
On paper "Exxxtra Tiny Teen" might sound amusing, but even a quick look at titles/promos from this section two days ago has left me feeling really sick at heart.

Even if the actual girls in the "Tiny Teen" videos are really 22 years old, they LOOK like they are under 14, and are obviously MEANT to look under 14. It would seem to follow that a depressingly large number of men are sexually interested in children, and that pornographers are keen to keep this interest going, to the extent of producing fake kiddy porn.

HOPEFULLY fake kiddy porn.
Click to expand...
I've never strayed out of curiosity with porn because curiosity killed the cat :ROFLMAO: but anyways child porn and sick stuff is highly disturbing to me. I agree on that aspect
 
MrsGamp said:
Wow!
RE: "believe it or not, I had classmates pissed at me because I put their dealer in jail!"
I can believe it ... as a side note, it is so exploitative and sucky when people deal drugs but want to be paid "in kind", not cash.
That aside, am assuming this was a pre-internet episode? I am wondering if the kids who posed would've had more pause for thought if the net had been around ... not "victim blaming" btw. But as I read around this subject, one thing that is reiterated again and again by victims of trafficking, "revenge porn", etc, is feeling sentenced to a lifetime of humiliation and anxiety, since permanently taking the videos/images off the net is practically impossible, and of course the images can be viewed and re-veiwed practically ad infinitum ...
Click to expand...
Why did u put the dealer in jail?
 
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