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  • Current Events & Politics Moderators: deficiT | tryptakid | Foreigner

The 2018 Trump Presidency thread

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Fucking hell.
It is time we told america to get fucked. Australia has a proud history of fighting againts fascists

I don't recall this history. As I recall it Australia has a proud proud history of sucking America's cock and being thankful for the opportunity.

And hey, I'm not saying that that's a good thing or a bad thing. Just that.. It's generally been my observation that we say jump and you ask how high. To use a more polite metaphor than my last one.
 
You know we fought against germany and japan in the second world war though, right?

Your right though - in the last half century we've been out killing kids with uncle sam at every opportunity
 
You know we fought against germany and japan in the second world war though, right?

Your right though - in the last half century we've been out killing kids with uncle sam at every opportunity

Might be worth considering that prior to that, it was pretty much Australia just jumping at British commands instead. It's always been someone else holding Australia's leash. Well, assuming you don't count indigenous rule.

And perhaps some day not long from now, it'll be china holding Australia's leesh. Although I would put forth that if Australia must have a master, either of the previous ones would be better than China.

As for Australia having no master. Well, apart from the fact that Australia's just not that big a country in terms of population. It doesn't help that republicanism has never exactly held overwhelming support.
 
Australia is a colonial backwater.
Our first "proud" moment of nationhood was the gallipoli landing, in which our men (including some of my family were slaughtered in a bungled landing that we had nothibg to do with. Just doing the bidding of our colonial masters - and it is rarely pointed out that we were an invading force.
Not so heroic :/

First a british outpost, then when that empire ceased to really exist, yup - ee jumped aboard the american imperial project.

Given that the USA has been taken over by a fascist moron with dementia, it'd be a good time for our leaders to start forging a path of out own, but that seems unlikely given the spineless sycophants that govern this blood-soaked, stolen continent.

I've heard that a lot of the liberal party were overjoyed when trump got elected, which isnt terribly surprising; they're scum.
 
Americans have a unique way of using the word "liberal".
Which is why i have a little laugh when people talk about "ultra liberal socialists" or whatever.

Oh america, your butchery of the english language (all the best words! Sad!)
 
No kidding. The very top of that article says this;

This article is about the ideology of liberalism. For local differences in its meaning, see Liberalism by country.
For other uses, see Liberal (disambiguation).
 
Australia's "liberal party" is actually conservative? lol

Its the small government, personal freedom (from unions) ideology that accounts for the name, though they are politically conservative and right wing. The opposition leftist party is the Labor party, or you have the sadly ineffectual Greens Party.

Australians are masters of idiom. ;)
 
Both our major parties are essentially identical.

"Liberal" in the australia tory sense is more about minimal regulation - ie, the 'freedom' of rich folks to fuck working people over.

I like the greens. Hate the "labor" party (which is also interesting - why the fuck do they spell "labour" wrong?)
Useless neoliberal scum.
 
Its the small government, personal freedom (from unions) ideology that accounts for the name, though they are politically conservative and right wing. The opposition leftist party is the Labor party, or you have the sadly ineffectual Greens Party.

Australians are masters of idiom. ;)

LOL at “freedom from unions” :|

Sure that’s an economic freedom but fucking low on the totem pole.

Had no idea economic rights are so desirable by some of the people in Australia.
 
Not the people, just the scumfucks who rule over us.

Australia is a welfare state, which is why we have some of the highest standards of living.
Melbourne has been awarded "world's most livable city" for - what, like the last 4 years?
That's about a lot more than economics - it's town planning, various social services and whatever.

But i find the idea of "economic rights" to be kind of laughable. More power to the few rich to dominate the many poor.
That's how dystopian societies are created, with huge wealth inequality.

I fucking detest australia's liberal party. They are doing all they can to destroy the good things about australia - universal healthcare, free education unemployment benefits, aged pensions etc etc.

Like right wing parties across the world, they use racism and xeniphobic scapegoating to distract the public from the real issues, and con people into voting against their own interests. Sound familiar?

They want to create a country like america with the sort of rampant capitalism that has long been the norm in the states. Awful idea IMO.
The last thing we need is to be more indifferent to the struggles of working people.
Not everyone can be rich - which is why "aspirational voting" is fucking stupid. The wealthy do all they can to keep the riches for themselves, not you or i.
Trump is like taking this sort of stuff to the extreme - it's a get-rich-quick scheme for neo-fascist sickos.
 
It is time we told america to get fucked.

I'd probably feel the same way too. But the American resistance movement needs our Australian brothers and sisters to stand with us right now. Please don't abandon us. We deeply appreciate your solidarity and moral support. All the decent people of planet Earth need to come together right now.

We need to be united and stand up together for what's right. When we stand together, we are strong.
 
Americans have a unique way of using the word "liberal".
Which is why i have a little laugh when people talk about "ultra liberal socialists" or whatever.

Oh america, your butchery of the english language (all the best words! Sad!)

Well, let me ask you this. Would you say that the Australian liberal party stands for liberal values? Going by how you'd define the term liberalism.

I'd probably feel the same way too. But the American resistance movement needs our Australian brothers and sisters to stand with us right now. Please don't abandon us. We deeply appreciate your solidarity and moral support. All the decent people of planet Earth need to come together right now.

We need to be united and stand up together for what's right.

And besides. The Australians are way more like us than either of us are like the Chinese.

So if you gotta pick one of two poor choices, I'd still say you should stick with us.
 
Aussies are probably more similar to Americans than even Canadians are. We have to adhere to each other and cooperate. We are family and if we don't hang together, we'll surely hang separately.
 
We're all part of the big English speaking democracy family. The five eyes countries. New Zealand Australia Canada the UK and the USA. We may all share a certain common bond in being all humans. But as cultures, among those 5 countries, nobody else is more alike than the other 4 members. So, when you think about how different British people are from Americans from Australians. Imagine how much greater the divide must be when there isn't even a common language.

Our language largely defines our culture.
 
I'd probably feel the same way too. But the American resistance movement needs our Australian brothers and sisters to stand with us right now. Please don't abandon us. We deeply appreciate your solidarity and moral support. All the decent people of planet Earth need to come together right now.

We need to be united and stand up together for what's right. When we stand together, we are strong.

Oh absolutely man.
What i'm getting at is not like "fuck america" - just fuck war, and fuck trump.

And we're with you guys - all the way.
I didn't see the point of attending anti-trump protests here when he was elected, but lots of people turned up in a couple of the capital cities.

I'm also not trying to suggest that i see anything better about australia - it's a shithole, for the most part.

But i'm definitely in favour of socialised healthcare, education and the welfare state. Since australian universities have been increasingly privatised, it's been terrible for the sector, which is one of the reasons i don't work at universities any more.

I think there are some pretty fucked up ideologies that have remained largely unchallenged in the US for way too long - but it seems that the madness of the trump administration is forcing people to consider and discuss what they actually want their government to do.
And it seems a lot of people are starting to demand more - rather than less - government programs to help communities.

There is an awful lot of ideology about rugged individualism in american politics or whatever - but the reality of that sort of "economic rights" is that it leaves a lot of people out in the cold when times get tough.

One of the realities of the capitalist model we live under is that not everyone prospers. Even if every single one of us had the skills and determination to work hard to sell our labour - the reality is that things aren't set up for that to work.
Even if there were enough jobs around for everyone to make a livable wage, the reality is that some people are too sick, too mentally ill or too disabled to work.

That means that some people suffer terribly - and die unnecessarily - because of the poverty these systems force upon them.

In wealthy countries, that seems unnecessarily cruel - especially somewhere as prosperous as the USA.

I know some people who think americans that voted for trump deserve whatever they get. Some folks think its good to see america's global power and influenced being flushed down the toilet by trump.

I don't agree with them though - i care about the wellbeing of the american people (like all people on this crazy fucking planet, honestly).
It's not about us aussies and you yanks - it's about all of us fighting to keep the fascists from destroying democracy, the earth, humanity.
We are all in this together, and we need to fight together to stop these fuckers. We outnumber them, and they know this.
That's why "divide and conquer" works so well. We have to find ways to unite people, and transcend the idiotic tribalism that so many of us fall into.

Well, let me ask you this. Would you say that the Australian liberal party stands for liberal values? Going by how you'd define the term liberalism.

I don't think there is any one definition, but yeah - the liberal party likes to go from this ideological base of opposition to economic regulation (when it suits them).

Look at the australian media, for instance. For decades, there were laws about how many media platforms companies were able to own. For instance, there were strict limits on media ownership, and to try to ensure that there was a diversity of journalistic and editorial voices, organisations were limited in how many radio stations, tv and newpapers they could own in each market.
The liberal/national coalition watered the cross media ownership laws over the last 20 years - and they've all but scrapped them now, which has contributed to the lack of diversity in who owns and produces local media content.

Obviously this works for them politically as well, as they are the party that governs for the "big end of town"; corporate interests, not those of people.
It's all a load of bullshit though, really - as they're fucking happy to regulate the shit out of what consumer products are available to be sold to the public - like drugs or weapons or porno or whatever. A lot of it is just superficial right wing moralising.

What the "conservatives" (what a fucking meanjngless tern that has become - there is nothing conservative about radical right wingers like trump) do really is govern for the interests of the privileged.
Whether it's the US, the UK, australia, new zealand, canada or whatever "western democracy" (and whatever words we use to describe it) that's largely what it comes down to.
The last thing these people want to do is provide opportunities - or services - for working people. It's not on their radar.

Incidentally, that's why ocasio-cortes is so refreshing. She's talking about real fucking issues that affect real people - not this big pantomime of political theory.

The US has sorely lacked her kind of perspective for as long as any of us can remember - and look at how many people suffer for it. Obscene homelessness and unaffordable medical treatment - it is why so many parts of the US have third world poverty and social problems; conservative and libertarian philosophy says "fuck em - if they can't afford to see a doctor or to rent a home for their families, they should work harder". Obscene, offensive bullshit, if you ask me.


And besides. The Australians are way more like us than either of us are like the Chinese.

So if you gotta pick one of two poor choices, I'd still say you should stick with us.

True. And it's never been a question of abandoning america - but under trump, it does feel like america (the US government) has abandoned us and all of the other allies that went "all the way with LBJ" and every other misguided US military campaign since then too.
I think we'll always be america's lapdog, but for the love of gawd, america - please don't keep electing fucking fascist presidents! It's really straining the friendship. <3
 
Well, let me ask you this. Would you say that the Australian liberal party stands for liberal values? Going by how you'd define the term liberalism.

We don't have a liberal party; Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Green, and a few more tiny fringe ones

I'm also not trying to suggest that i see anything better about australia - it's a shithole, for the most part.

Needle vending machines, Chinese meth, and all 22,000+ miles of mainland coastline ... yeah I don't know why you'd call it a shit hole. Enlighten me? How is Australia worse than America, according to you?

Don't we have the worse problem with poverty and gun violence?
 
I can see why it would feel like America has abandoned the rest of the world, and why people would be angry at us, and why we might deserve what we got since we elected an incomprehensibly terrible president, but he didn't win the popular vote. Most people do not support Trump and are horrified by the situation we're in. I think most of us just hope everyone else understands that what we want is for the madman to be ousted and that we can hopefully undo the damage he's done.
 
I am fucking LOVING Trump and living in America hasn't been sweeter since I was a teenager. This is really an amazing time to be alive. He is not taking any shit from anyone, especially the corrupt Establishment Propaganda media and the Democrats and Republicans in the Deep State (Let's just be real, Deep State is just a euphemism for the bigger picture, the Military Industrial Complex). He is going to be remembered like JFK, hopefully with a better end result, but man he is on fire and some people in the minority might be upset and offended, but I can tell you it's pretty clear that here in the US that Americans love this man, even in Blue states like New York and New Jersey, Wisconsin, etc....he is winning everyone over. He should most likely win in 2020.
 
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