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Nootropics The Big & Dandy Nootropics Thread (Stack 2)

The opioid is not a 1,4-diacylpiperazine. Its an acyl amide/alkylated derivative, N-1-(n)-butryl-N4-(trans)-cinnamylpiperazine
Was thinking both of making the butyryl analog of sunifiram and testing for activity, as well as preparing the N1-propionyl homolog of the opioid, as well as each of the original compounds.

It'd just be an interesting and handy way to leverage common intermediates, I'm always up for a twoferl so to speak, if some intermediate planned for one project can be leveraged to make two or three more, then why in the hell not. Start out making an AMPAkine, and a one or two-step adaptation to get an opioid and an analog of the opioid out of the intermediate, given the dirt-cheap price for a simple heterocycle like piperazine, then why in the hells not? (already a chronic pain patient, so physical dependence isn't a worry, thats a horse that has already bolted, I have no need to worry whether or not the stable door gets left open. Horse buggered off years ago.)
 
And quite honestly, its a whole 'nother kettle'o'fish to take valerian vs bathe a plated well of cells and leave it to stew in a valerian soup.

(*or rotting toe fungus and stagnant armpit mixed with a tad of the nasty taste that you get in the back of your throat after working with propionyl chloride/propionic anhydride when your packing up and gas mask is not needed any longer, from the traces in the air, that taste like an sweaty old-age-pensioner goat, macerated in distillate of fungal nail infection, and wrapped in a footballer's month-unwashed gym socks before being dipped in a bit of hydrochloric acid...a sort of rotten sweaty goat-with-toe-fungus acidic metallic tang in the back of your mouth...bleergh..I hate working with propionyl chloride, it fucking stinks and makes everything else taste like a hat that had been pulled from a rabbit.)

It does, despite its failing by way of smelling like a football jock's arse crack, have acute effects however. Specifically on dreaming.
But the high doses needed to fly like that, with it being the ultimate in intense when it comes to dreaming (seriously, I could almost compare its effects at a high dose when asleep to a breakthrough smoked DMT trip when conscious, or to a breakthrough on potent Salvia divinorum extract. Its just SO intense its unreal, nay, surreal and unreal both. And having anxiolytic effects typically it means good dreams too, don't think I've ever had a nightmare whilst using it that way, save only for if I've had a breakthrough seizure start in my sleep, which usually is the only time I get nightmares now, so much so that there is specific theme and dream content that I now KNOW means 'WAKE UP LC, WAKE THE FUCK UP DAMN YOU TO COCYTUS-you need to take chlormethiazole and fast'

What I'd love to know, is if anybody on BL has ever tried loreclezole, or even knows of/have tried any other loreclezole site GABAa agonists. Loreclezole and valerian constituent(s) of some kind are the only ones I know of. I've wanted to compare loreclezole for effect on dreaming since forever, to the point I'm seriously considering making myself some, to see if its that which causes those wonderful and intense oneirogenic fireworks.
 
Does anyone here get good results from noopept?
I've been using it on and off for abour six months now, but not sure I get anything from it other than placebo. Only evident effect I consistently get is it helps me start monday mornings in a better way lol. It kinda lifts off the mental fog I sometimes get if I wrecked my sleep schedule too much in the weekend. Other than that I'm not sure it really does something for me. Anyone care to share his experience?
 
I get very noticeable and helpful effects, including a bit of light stimulation and certainly motivation, but only if I snort it. Orally I can't say it's been anything but placebo. I find it one of the most noticeable/strongest nootropics, when snorted. I have noticed that I can only use it daily for 2, 3, maybe 4 weeks tops before it starts giving me a strange brain fog and scattered thoughts. I tend to maybe buy a few grams once a year or less and then do 2 runs with it separated by a little time. I like piracetam better as a general-purpose and pretty sustainable nootropic. Over the years I have learned to really appreciate its effects and its ability to make my brain feel better after abusing it, but it's quite subtle in what it does.

In other nootropic news, I have psoriasis pretty bad, I've had it since I was 18. Recently it started becoming psoriatic arthritis. I'm a musician (I play keys mostly) and the writs pain was becoming intense. I never developed any self-esteem issues from the big patches of psoriasis on my skin because it didn't manifest until I was 18 and in college people are a little past mercilessly picking on kids for stuff. So I've never really done anything about the stuff on my skin,, but when it started to impact my ability to do what I love, I had to make some moves. I cut out gluten and dairy and it's been really helping, it made the joint pain go away and my skin is clearing up too, slowly but surely.

But anyway, I recently started grinding up black pepper every morning for the piperine and take it with curcumin, which is the orange compound in turmeric. It's a potent anti-inflammatory which is made many, many more times bioavailable with piperine. I've noticed a big difference, not only does the psoriasis disappear and stay non-inflamed easier, but it has a notable effect on my energy level and mood. Just recently when I needed to re-up my curcumin, I also bought pure piperine and resveratrol, as I was reading that resveratrol is also a potent anti-inflammatory as well as general health tonic, and its bioavailability is also aided by piperine. Just about 30 minutes ago I took the whole stack for the first time and it's really nice so far. :)

I also ordered some tetrahydropalmatine, which I was reading is quite a potent sedative (though not at all euphoric or recreational), which should be useful sometimes when I can't sleep... for example at the tail end of psychedelics, I keep etizolam around to help me sleep, but it would be better if there was a nonaddictive alternative. So, hopefully there is. :)

I also ordered some cyclazodone which is supposed to be an interesting stimulant, clean, very few side effects and not recreational but very good at the things you want stimulants for if you're using them functionally. It was kind of just an experiment as it was pretty expensive, but in the past months I have been having a hard time staying away from some stims, most notably propylhexedrine (since I walk by it at the grocery store all the time). I came upon some 3-FPM last week and haven't even thought about propylhex, and I've heard that cyclazodone is compared favorably to 3-FPM except even cleaner/more functional, which is great. Also apparently it's pretty closely related to 4-MAR which I have always been pretty fascinated with as a drug (but have never seen).
 
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Hey Xork, take care man.

Psychonaut wiki said:
"Cyclazodone has no documented history of recreational human usage before it appeared on the online research chemical market in 2017. Based on related compounds, it is speculated that it likely possesses hepatotoxic and other not-yet-known toxic properties. It is strongly advised to use harm reduction practices if using this substance."
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Pemoline, which is structuraly similar to cyclazodone, was removed from the market for being hepatotoxic (Source: Marotta, P. J., & Roberts, E. A. (1998 ). Pemoline hepatotoxicity in children. The Journal of Pediatrics, 132(5), 894-897.)


Thread carefully
 
Thanks for the warning, man. I'm gonna proceed with experimenting a bit but I'll make sure not to get any more (I only picked up 250mg total).
 
Xorkoth said:
I get very noticeable and helpful effects, including a bit of light stimulation and certainly motivation, but only if I snort it. Orally I can't say it's been anything but placebo. I find it one of the most noticeable/strongest nootropics, when snorted. I have noticed that I can only use it daily for 2, 3, maybe 4 weeks tops before it starts giving me a strange brain fog and scattered thoughts. I tend to maybe buy a few grams once a year or less and then do 2 runs with it separated by a little time. I like piracetam better as a general-purpose and pretty sustainable nootropic. Over the years I have learned to really appreciate its effects and its ability to make my brain feel better after abusing it, but it's quite subtle in what it does.

In other nootropic news, I have psoriasis pretty bad, I've had it since I was 18. Recently it started becoming psoriatic arthritis. I'm a musician (I play keys mostly) and the writs pain was becoming intense. I never developed any self-esteem issues from the big patches of psoriasis on my skin because it didn't manifest until I was 18 and in college people are a little past mercilessly picking on kids for stuff. So I've never really done anything about the stuff on my skin,, but when it started to impact my ability to do what I love, I had to make some moves. I cut out gluten and dairy and it's been really helping, it made the joint pain go away and my skin is clearing up too, slowly but surely.

But anyway, I recently started grinding up black pepper every morning for the piperine and take it with curcumin, which is the orange compound in turmeric. It's a potent anti-inflammatory which is made many, many more times bioavailable with piperine. I've noticed a big difference, not only does the psoriasis disappear and stay non-inflamed easier, but it has a notable effect on my energy level and mood. Just recently when I needed to re-up my curcumin, I also bought pure piperine and resveratrol, as I was reading that resveratrol is also a potent anti-inflammatory as well as general health tonic, and its bioavailability is also aided by piperine. Just about 30 minutes ago I took the whole stack for the first time and it's really nice so far. :)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the tipp. Did not know, that piperine potentiates the uptake of the curcumin.

I also ordered some cyclazodone which is supposed to be an interesting stimulant, clean, very few side effects and not recreational but very good at the things you want stimulants for if you're using them functionally. It was kind of just an experiment as it was pretty expensive, but in the past months I have been having a hard time staying away from some stims, most notably propylhexedrine (since I walk by it at the grocery store all the time). I came upon some 3-FPM last week and haven't even thought about propylhex, and I've heard that cyclazodone is compared favorably to 3-FPM except even cleaner/more functional, which is great. Also apparently it's pretty closely related to 4-MAR which I have always been pretty fascinated with as a drug (but have never seen).
Click to expand...

Might be an off-topic remark/question, but in the US the analogue law seems to be a lot friendlier than in Europe, so consider yourselves lucky (as in freeer). In western Europe every 2-phenetylamine based compound is scheduled before it was synthesized. Even phenibut is affected by that clusterfuck-phenethylamine ban. And many more US-nootropics that are/will be hyped will be affected.
 
Damn that sucks, it's interesting that America has become one of the freer nations lately with regard to drugs. Lots of stuff is scheduled, but our analogue laws are barely/rarely enforced and it's exceedingly easy to import most anything, and we even have a quickly emerging legal marijuana scene (with most states having medical marijuana - not mine though (yet) :p)
 
Yes, the US is definitely freer in comparison at the moment.

At least the best "nootropic" : L-Theanine is still unscheduled. It would be hard to schedule, I guess. I am wondering if I will be able to witness the day, when Green Tea becomes illegal to possess/consume/buy as a citizen.
 
I seriously doubt L-theanine will ever be scheduled, nor any amino acids, at least in the US. We have a massive supplement industry.

I like L-theanine, I don't find it a nootropic or amazing, but it is relaxing and a decent anxiolytic.

We'll also never illegalize the "non-drugs" - caffeine, tobacco and alcohol. Cuz, drugs are bad, mmkay? But those aren't drugs. After all, why else would they say "drugs and alcohol"?
 
Green tea doesn't really contain serious amounts of theanine.. I like theanine (as supplement) a lot as well but I agree I don't find it nootropic (neither phenibut, it seems to me like nootropic vendors happily classify these as such to sell more and this may be part of our disagreement on labeling them nootropic)..

The best thing about theanine might be how it modulates caffeine effects, they are really complementary.

Honestly mesocarb sounds pretty interesting but it could prove difficult to get..

What are your thoughts / experiences with fasoracetam and coluracetam?
 
I've had fasoracetam, I had read that it can help with phenibut recovery, but I believe through possibly upregulating GABA-B receptors... so while I was withdrawing from it I would notice I'd feel worse. I felt good already by the time I stopped feeling any withdrawal symptoms so I never really thought about it or tried it again. I still have it though. I haven't tried coluracetam, but I've heard good things about it. I found phenylpiracetam to produce some light stimulation and definitely a nootropic effect, but I like noopept better for that sort of thing. I also had pramiracetam once... I remember it sort of similarly to phenylpiracetam but I can't quite remember as it was a long time ago. I've probably used sunifiram the second most next to noopept (besides piracetam which I've used the most) and I liked it quite a bit, but it's basically a stimulant, it's not a strong one but I've actually gotten somewhat uncomfortable from it before, and it doesn't feel totally benign.

But yeah, phenibut is certainly not a nootropic, it's actually one of my very favorite drugs and is both a GABAergic and a gabapentinoid.
 
Solipsis said:
Green tea doesn't really contain serious amounts of theanine.. I like theanine (as supplement) a lot as well but I agree I don't find it nootropic (neither phenibut, it seems to me like nootropic vendors happily classify these as such to sell more and this may be part of our disagreement on labeling them nootropic)..

The best thing about theanine might be how it modulates caffeine effects, they are really complementary.

[...]
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I tend to disagree. L-Theanine is the most effective nootropic I know (purely subjective). It calms the mind in stressful situations, without sedating the body (if you do not fuck up the dose massively). Perhaps I just did not encounter really good non-phenethylamine-based, nootropics. Brahmi (or better the extract of the plant bacopa) is a good one, too.

Phenibut on the contrary I consider also a drug. It is just too strong ... but where is the line between Nootropic vs. Drug scientifically ? In the back of my head nootropic equals "subtle, novel, unconventional stimulant/adaptogen".
 
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L-theanine causes tense muscles around neck if I take it daily for weeks (about 100-200mg).

I've been researching daily (more than a year of consistent daily logs) nootropics and combinations with stimulants and microdosed psychedelics and have been writing almost every day and so far have come up with quite an extensive list of noots and drugs that work for me, dosages, combos, effects, side-effects and much more. I gotta find time, compile it all and post it here! Coming soon!.. 8)
 
It is a matter of definition so yes subjective. I appreciate that various relaxing drugs (actually a lot of non-sedative anxiolytics, though they make up a minor part of anxiolytics) can make you feel more adequate and sometimes they probably are in trials, but calling a lot of anxiolytics and even something like certain opioids nootropic is a step too far for me and it also really dilutes the definition of nootropics. Memory enhancement seems like on of the more definite nootropic effects. The combo with caffeine makes it more of an enabler or primer of letting you realize caffeine's potentials.

For you, being able to relax enough to realize your cognitive potential may count as nootropic, but for me it doesn't.. IMO this is about direct vs. indirect effect.

IIRC bacopa does actually have direct effect. But it happens to have negative cognitive effect on me, at least so far.
 
From all the nootropics I experimented with this year, although underwhelming I would say the best ones which actually did increase my cognitive performance were L-theanine+Caffeine (160mg+200mg) and Modafinil (150mg).

Now, I will try something new: pure Amphetamine powder in low doses and Noopept. I heared good things about Noopept so hopefully it won't let me down.
 
I've heard a few times that taking cholinergic and glutamatergic nootropics can seriously potentiate classical psychedelics. For those of you who have combined classical psychs with nootropics, what nootropics were you using, for how long, and at what dose? And did it potentiate the classical psych experience any, or not significantly affect it, or even diminish it?
 
Question: Matcha tea, can it be extracted with ethanol, similar to making any other extract like I?ve been doing with kratom? I assume it can.
Is it safe? Effective? Stronger than regular tea?
Thanks!
 
Matcha tea is grandioso. But what do you want to extract from it ? I'd guess, that some of the important alkaloids will get lost during the extraction process.

I have a few questions for the nootropics experts :

- Does Gingko Biloba also trigger dysphoria in you ? I will now avoid products with it, because the trade-off is way off for me
- Did anyone realize a positive effect from consuming choline-derivates (CDP-choline for instance) ? I got the feeling, that it is all placebo. I rather eat a lot of eggs rather than buying expensive placebo (?) supplements
- How high do you guys rank Huperzine, I guess it is essential in a stack ?
 
I suppose I would just want to extract the good stuff from it (caffeine, theanine, antioxidants?)
I just had a pouch of about 3 oz in the pantry that my ex had left and since I?ve gotten heavily into making kratom extracts I figured I would just give it a shot. I?m not a tea drinker but I like the idea of putting things in convenient little capsules.
So I did end up trying it. Seemed to work out fine. It dried nice and easy; much more so than kratom. I started with a quarter gram and felt nothing. Tried a half gram next day and maybe felt a little something. Today I?ll try a full gram.
While making it I realized it?s probably just the same as this stuff I used to buy at the vitamin shop. Oh well, it was fun, but it?s so inexpensive to buy in capsule form that if I ever want it again I won?t bother to put all that effort into making it.

I know very little about nootropics, just recently started hearing the word but I?m very curious.
 
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