2017 Trump Presidency Thread

[cduggles]

Mueller Turns Up The Heat With Unusual Search Warrant In Russia Probe

Source

Federal prosecutors have lots of ways to intensify pressure on the people they're investigating, from early morning FBI raids to leaning on relatives of those under government scrutiny.

But even by those measures, the special counsel investigating Russian interference in last year's presidential election is moving with unusual speed and assertiveness, according to half a dozen legal experts following the probe.

Consider disclosures that FBI agents executed a search warrant last month for business and tax records at the suburban Virginia home of former Trump campaign chairman Paul Manafort. That step would have required them to prove to a judge that there's probable cause a crime has been committed.

 

[DoctorMolecule]

Whatever Trump may be it was a strategically stupid mistake to say those things to NK. He lacks statescraft, is bold for its own sake, and unapologetic. He never hid these imperfections, he ran an election on them. I can see why Trump has an appeal to his core voters, he's a supposedly unpolished yet cunning political outsider.

So I ask Trump supporters this: how far from the norm are you willing go before saying enough is enough?

 

[cduggles]

Trump 'absolutely' joking about thanking Putin for expelling diplomats

Source

President Donald Trump said Friday he was "absolutely" being sarcastic when he publicly thanked Russian President Vladimir Putin for expelling U.S. diplomats from Russia.

The president, who reportedly infuriated State Department officials Thursday when he thanked Putin for helping to reduce the U.S. payroll by removing diplomats from the country,
was pressed on whether the comments had been made in earnest or in jest, as White House officials characterized them earlier Friday.

"In order to reduce our payroll? Absolutely," Trump said when asked by reporters in Bedminster, N.J., on Friday whether the comments he'd made to them the day before were sarcastic. "I think you know that."

Trump added that he had recently spoken to Secretary of State Rex Tillerson about devising an answer to Russia's decision to remove numerous diplomats from the country in response to congressional sanctions.

 

[Erikmen]

^ I believe it's all a matter of time. Even Trump can't hide for ever.

Yes, our democratically-elected Congress is starting to work in a bipartisan manner. That's great!

I think that's a great thing too.

And back to China, I was reading today they (China) have always stood by North Korea, in silent ways I assume. Since the Korea's war they had never wanted American Military forces on their back yard, and I think it's pretty naive to believe they will play along with the US when trying to disarm North Korea.

If they do they will do, it would be diplomatically after all, through out the history we learned that 'high level' countries with Intelligence and other capacities should always exhaust their diplomatic means before jumping into a war scenario. Especially in a case where a lot of countries could be involved as it was already mentioned before, countries that are American allies like South Korea and Japan.

 

[Scrofula]

People are looking at his "thank you" as being part of the Trump-Russia connection, but I'm convinced it's his 1980's used car salesman business acumen, where you never admit you're wrong. And always give them the TruCoat™. Broads like compliments. A handshake that knocks people over is a sign of power, so is a full head of hair, never let em see you bald.

It's bad news, that is his responsibility, but in his head he can't call it bad, cause that's what bad business people do. So he spins it and makes shit up--after all they're still employees on payroll, we're not saving anything.

Which means it'll happen again. And again. So when the Chinese bombs start falling, Trump can say we're saving on demolition costs for his infrastucture project. That he'll start right after the Wall's finished.

Fuckin clown. Fuckin joke of an electorate.
Should launch nukes FFS, don't let them breed.

Sorry, deep breaths.
OK erik, sorry for going off China there.

 

[Scrofula]

If they do they will do, it would be diplomatically after all, through out the history we learned that 'high level' countries with Intelligence and other capacities should always exhaust their diplomatic means before jumping into a war scenario.

That's why this isn't a game, Trump supporters. China doesn't like, but supports, NKorea. Two major nuke states facing off, but over US major interests, since SKorea would be wiped out even in a skirmish, and Japan, also a major trading partner we swore to defend after destroying them (so they'd play along and we'd have a base, it's not charity).

Guy in the middle is a child-god-king of the dead wildcard.

So you need someone who is NOT an oil executive over there. You need a president who is actually known for making wise decisions. Under pressure. FFS.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

So Congress goes on a break and just before they do, they unanimously vote that Trump can't do what every other president has done - recess appointments.

All the freedoms that Dubya Bush, Mr Clinton and Barry all had - they acted without congressional approval all over the place and nobody batted an eye, because of course they were playing the Deep State game.

Congress and Senate are both Republican majority; Trump's own party.

If they don't trust him, he's got no one else to blame but himself.

Trump may vary well miscalculate and start a war with China. People laughing off the NK situation need to remember we don't have a rational leader in control for the first time.

Not going to play devil's advocate, but just being honest; I really do believe we need to take out North Korea.

 

[LiquidMethod]

From the NK thread:

Because the US has the biggest nuclear arsenal in the world and Trump, a business man and someone patently unqualified for this role, is the one guy who can use it?

I think we need to rewind a little bit. First make sure that we watched the video I posted earlier of Trump warning us about North Korea in 1999. For a moment forget that this is Trump talking and just listen to what he was saying back then. Was that insane, or even incorrect?

Yes, Trump was warning us at the very same time that Bill Clinton (patently qualified president, or not?) was doing deals with the North Koreans! Trump was telling us then that it was not going to work and that NK were going to attain atomic weapons, and they did. Bill Clinton thought that they would freeze their nuclear program if he gave them nuclear material?? CLINTON WAS WRONG - TRUMP WAS RIGHT, 20 YEARS AGO. And people want to say that he is insane for suggesting that NK is still a problem? Objectively who was more "qualified" to deal with NK back then? How about now?

Someone needs to stop NK. We must protect our allies the South Koreans, so targeted (conventional) strikes on NK's nuclear sites may be necessary. China stated that if NK fires first they won't defend them against strikes from the US, so we have their blessing.

If North Korea does fire at Guam, I get the feeling that some Trump-haters would prefer that he do absolutely nothing at all in retaliaton. Madness..

 

[Erikmen]

And you think Trump is the person in the world who is going to stop NK, at all costs, I presume - so that you feel better?

Whatever ideas he might have had you have to understand that this is not only between two countries. But you don't care about that, do you?

The person who says American comes first is an American. Other countries did not elect him, on the very contrary. Most of the other countries people don't like him. Not because he's childish, irresponsible and liar, but because he's dangerous, toxic.

And now should the world's safety be about what he decides. Not all of us have to agree about that, especially when it affects others. Not only Guam. And remember this could all have been avoided if it wasn't because of Trump's total lack of diplomacy and experience - no to mention intelligence. Trump is the kind of guy who doesn't give a f* about anyone else's interests but his own and what he believes to be right for US, regardless of the fact others think differently including the Congress and both parties.

Therefore, when it comes to international areas, we all have a saying in that. Trump is not at all our world's leader. He's more likely the world's most impatient President who can't hold his breath before talking all of these BS and nonsense. How many times has he contradicted himself? How many times on the following day the tweets sounded like he did not really mean it? Too impulsive? So now we all have to put up with that because he can't control himself and often says the wrong things, except that it will be a time when his nonsense will affect others much more than what's happening now.

Sometimes I honestly think this guy should be monitored 24 hours so someone can tell him, "not now honey". "Time to bed, too much TV makes you say things you don't really like on the following day."

 

[Erikmen]

Not going to play devil's advocate, but just being honest; I really do believe we need to take out North Korea.

Okay, maybe so. However, I strongly believe the "rest" of the world might have a saying in that. UN maybe? Allies?

 

[Soso78]

The rest of the world should have a say in that but America is the one being directly threatened so obviously are going to be the ones who are most pissed off.

 

[Scrofula]

Trump warning us about North Korea in 1999.[/URL] For a moment forget that this is Trump talking and just listen to what he was saying back then. Was that insane, or even incorrect?

Yes, Trump was warning us at the very same time that Bill Clinton (patently qualified president, or not?) was doing deals with the North Koreans!.

Come on. Somebody worried about NK way back in 1999? You know the war went down in the 1950's right? The first big cold war proxy. It's been tense for 70 years, and you'll criticize the statesmen for doing statesman stuff while Captain Obvious lets everyone know he scans headlines sometimes.

Madness. Blow up the bridge anyway.

 

[Scrofula]

Okay, maybe so. However, I strongly believe the "rest" of the world might have a saying in that. UN maybe? Allies?

The Korean war WAS a UN resolution, btw. But somehow, the vote went down when the Soviet delegation was absent.

And don't forget the UN just means USA, Russia, France, UK, and China. They're the ones with permanent veto power.

 

[Captain.Heroin]

The Korean war WAS a UN resolution, btw.

I believe you are referring to this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_Security_Council_Resolution_82

Linked that for anyone else interested.

From the NK thread:


I think we need to rewind a little bit. First make sure that we watched the video I posted earlier of Trump warning us about North Korea in 1999. For a moment forget that this is Trump talking and just listen to what he was saying back then. Was that insane, or even incorrect?

Yes, Trump was warning us at the very same time that Bill Clinton (patently qualified president, or not?) was doing deals with the North Koreans! Trump was telling us then that it was not going to work and that NK were going to attain atomic weapons, and they did. Bill Clinton thought that they would freeze their nuclear program if he gave them nuclear material?? CLINTON WAS WRONG - TRUMP WAS RIGHT, 20 YEARS AGO. And people want to say that he is insane for suggesting that NK is still a problem? Objectively who was more "qualified" to deal with NK back then? How about now?

Someone needs to stop NK. We must protect our allies the South Koreans, so targeted (conventional) strikes on NK's nuclear sites may be necessary. China stated that if NK fires first they won't defend them against strikes from the US, so we have their blessing.

If North Korea does fire at Guam, I get the feeling that some Trump-haters would prefer that he do absolutely nothing at all in retaliaton. Madness..

I'm not saying Bill Clinton was perfect. I don't think this is the "Bill Clinton Appreciation Thread".

 

[Erikmen]

The rest of the world should have a say in that but America is the one being directly threatened so obviously are going to be the ones who are most pissed off.

Yes, I understand, thank you for your comment. I was too focused on Trump's attitude and thinking of other ways to avoid such a comprehensive war, so to speak. A war at this size could involve a lot of us - allies to the US and of course that makes us remind how difficult it was to heal from the past wars. But I definitely get your point and can see that this unbalanced North Korea 'person' should not be allowed to go that far and be a threat to the entire world, making tests as if this would be okay. It's not okay and that has to stop.

Also because we fight together being an ally country to the US. My dad was enlisted for the previous Korean war, and before him his father was also a second war veteran. So I'm that guy who try believe we should always exhaust all other means before actually declaring war. But of course I understand this was directed to you guys and that you should be able to defend yourselves in the best possible ways.

 

[Erikmen]

The Korean war WAS a UN resolution, btw. But somehow, the vote went down when the Soviet delegation was absent.

And don't forget the UN just means USA, Russia, France, UK, and China. They're the ones with permanent veto power.

Yes, you're right thanks Scrof. I kept on reading about that later on last night, and as I mentioned above I feel bad we could soon be in a situation where war could be inevitable. Others will join to help, if it comes to a real war scenario I know that being an ally we would have to work together in ways that we can't predict yet precisely how that would be like. We have signed up for that a long time ago. I guess we need to accept the facts as they are and maybe try to help as much as we can.

As from North Korea I'm wondering how did we all let them grow such a nuclear arsenal and why nobody did anything before to stop them from being a threat to the world or at least to a lot of countries. They must have started developing this sort of technology a long time ago. I assume we could have stopped this earlier. I really don't know. But maybe this has to be done now.

 

[Soso78]

You say "you guys" like I am an American but I'm from the uk.
As far as I'm aware the uk isn't being threatened by North Korea but I still think the uk should back trump, Kim is a danger to everyone and needs dealing with, china should be doing more to calm the situation and should distance itself from Kim as he wouldn't act like such a dick without china backing him.
If he launches missiles near Guam I think North Korea should be strategically bombed. Starting with Kim's house lol

 

[Erikmen]

Sorry I didn't realize you were from UK.
In my opinion, I would think that UK would back the country USA - not necessarily Trump, because even him would have to be advised by his Intelligence. There's a whole lot of people in United States that don't support Trump, including the Congress at times. I believe that a lot of countries would back up the US as a country as Trump alone, although being the president can only go so far as in any democratic country.

In regards to Kim, I'm pretty sure he has his own banker or bankers. Again, IMO, I don't think it would be all that easy to kill him. He's expecting that, and with all the technology to be such a nuclear power he would be far or deep away from his house or place at work if it comes to that.

 

[Soso78]

Yes he is being advised but ultimately the decision will be trumps.
If trump gave the order to bomb North Korea would his orders be carried out?

 

[FLA]

Yes he is being advised but ultimately the decision will be trumps.
If trump gave the order to bomb North Korea would his orders be carried out?

Seeing as how he is the commander in chief couldn't you be court martialed for refusing? In theory, if it's an illegal order military personnel are under no obligation to carry it out but I think the peer pressure and repercussions would be too daunting to overcome. Those of you out there that know much more than me about these nuances should weigh in on this if the spirit moves you. It seems like since about 2001 Presidents have had the right to go to war unilaterally.