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Esoteric DMT & Sprituality

vostochnik

vostochnik

Greenlighter
Joined
Sep 26, 2013
Messages
47
Location
USA
Okay, so I'm in the process of writing a book, to be totally open and honest. A book about DMT spirituality. The book is going to be a mixture of my personal spirituality and philosophies as well as all the experience repots I can gather on the subject. (So, if you would like to contribute any of your experiences that were very spiritual and personal, it would be MUCH appreciated!)

Anyway, I guess this post will pretty much be a synopsis of said “book.” I had absolutely no inherent spiritual alignment before I experienced DMT. None. But ever since the first time, and more so every time I use DMT, I feel a connection with something that I have to believe is in some way divine, the raw driving energy of the universe.

Of course I have experienced meeting a corporeal formulation of this force many times. But every time I go in with a question or ask for guidance, and I receive it.

I was just wondering if anyone else maybe feels the same way or similarly. And, again, if you have any reports that you would like to contribute on the subject of spirituality, please let me know! And thank you.

Safe journeys and happy travels!
Vostochnik
 
On a DMT trip, i believe you are connected to your universe. The one you perceive. DMT is a very spiritual, soul binding high. But on a DMT trip you see what your true beliefs are about life in general. It's the same for death. I believe these trips are sneak peaks of death. I believe when we die we'd have the trip of a lifetime.

So trying to get someone to comprehend your details of your DMT trip is hard for them to fathom. It's such a subjective experience and mind manifesting. Everyone has a different mind.

But there is a general consensus among the psychonauts that these experiences are spiritual and such.

I know a ghetto bad boy fella who took acid once and was freaking out. He wanted to show my friend his guns and how he felt to kill ppl n shit.
Not very spiritual IMO.

It's all how you approach the mountain.
 
I had a somewhat similar experience. In my younger (teenage) years I considered myself an atheist, and became more open to and interested in spirituality when I started taking psychedelics. DMT especially though showed me that there is undeniably a lot going on beyond the physical world that we see. With other psychedelics I understand how people can explain it as just some kind of hallucinatory experience created by your brain on drugs, but I don't really see how anyone who has broken through on DMT could not think of it as tapping into something much larger than yourself (but at the same time deep within yourself).


For me smoking lots of DMT for a while was more of just a jumping off point in getting me interested in spirituality initially. It showed me that there is so much more to this universe, but at the same time I believe we are in human form in the physical world for a reason, and whatever you take from the 'beyond' only really has significance in how it changes your life on earth. I find it's hard to actually take anything away from smoking DMT and it's more like a roller coaster through the cosmos. Ayahuasca, yoga, reiki, and meditation have proved to be much more valuable tools in my quest for spiritual development, in the more grounded lessons that they give me.
 
PotatoMan said:
On a DMT trip, i believe you are connected to your universe. The one you perceive. DMT is a very spiritual, soul binding high. But on a DMT trip you see what your true beliefs are about life in general. It's the same for death. I believe these trips are sneak peaks of death. I believe when we die we'd have the trip of a lifetime.

So trying to get someone to comprehend your details of your DMT trip is hard for them to fathom. It's such a subjective experience and mind manifesting. Everyone has a different mind.

But there is a general consensus among the psychonauts that these experiences are spiritual and such.

I know a ghetto bad boy fella who took acid once and was freaking out. He wanted to show my friend his guns and how he felt to kill ppl n shit.
Not very spiritual IMO.

It's all how you approach the mountain.
Click to expand...


I dont know if I can agree my friend. It seems as though just like astral projection and other extraordinary experiences there is a general universal theme. For example....too many people on high dose DMT meet entities with startling similarities with one another...despite cultural differences...also many people experience glossolalia (speaking in tongues) ...we all seem to experience this universal language of fractals.....I believe that the molecules we consume are pure....its our egos that may make the subjective differences. This is just my opinion though.

The higher the dose the less the persons ego may effect the experience....I think that when we take these molecules at lower doses its our mind melding with the drug......but theres a certain point you reach where your ego takes a back seat and channels the drug through you...and thats when you get a more "pure" experience...
 
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al-laddin said:
I dont know if I can agree my friend. It seems as though just like astral projection and other extraordinary experiences there is a general universal theme. For example....too many people on high dose DMT meet entities with startling similarities with one another...despite cultural differences...also many people experience glossolalia (speaking in tongues) ...we all seem to experience this universal language of fractals.....I believe that the molecules we consume are pure....its our egos that may make the subjective differences. This is just my opinion though.

The higher the dose the less the persons ego may effect the experience....I think that when we take these molecules at lower doses its our mind melding with the drug......but theres a certain point you reach where your ego takes a back seat and channels the drug through you...and thats when you get a more "pure" experience...
Click to expand...
exactly, breakthrough dose is the same for everyone. theres always the same common things happening.
its the bardo that we see. its still your ego that you experience, but we clearly see the different universe possible, the different beings living there, the light, the bliss.
all part of our reality.
the light is the ultimate true though and its quite clear that you see around you, when you breakthrough, what blocks you to the light.
Im sure though that the entities are part of my reality. not a projection, but they exist because I still decide they are there. like a support system.
 
murphythecat said:
exactly, breakthrough dose is the same for everyone. theres always the same common things happening.
its the bardo that we see. its still your ego that you experience, but we clearly see the different universe possible, the different beings living there, the light, the bliss.
all part of our reality.
the light is the ultimate true though and its quite clear that you see around you, when you breakthrough, what blocks you to the light.
Im sure though that the entities are part of my reality. not a projection, but they exist because I still decide they are there. like a support system.
Click to expand...

same theme. But I like I said. We all experience our beliefs. I saw a woman on my trips and I heard it's pretty common. But idk, DMT is very complex. Though one of my friends didnt even see the typical things. The patterns and entities is common but idk. I used to think it was a glimpse of the spirit world. It's just all in your head. Solipsis gave a really good description for these trips. He explained it with science so it kinda ruins the magic of it. I personally like the magical parts of hallucinogens.

Idk i don't even try to figure out the world and its answers anymore. It just depresses me these days. We're here then we die. Where do we go? idk? Massive DMT trip makes the most sense to me
 
Using science to explain an altered state of consciousness ..like using a spoon to eat spaghetti....wrong tool for the job...philosophy comes a bit closer....
 
Nothing can convince me that the worlds and entites are just in my head.
they are there because of me, sure, but the many different material world and dare I say some heavenly realm we have a glimpse on a dmt breakthrough is real in a sense that you really see that theres different sphere of existence and that well, for me at least, I have no doubt that after my death, its far from over.
PotatoMan said:
same theme. But I like I said. We all experience our beliefs. I saw a woman on my trips and I heard it's pretty common. But idk, DMT is very complex. Though one of my friends didnt even see the typical things. The patterns and entities is common but idk. I used to think it was a glimpse of the spirit world. It's just all in your head. Solipsis gave a really good description for these trips. He explained it with science so it kinda ruins the magic of it. I personally like the magical parts of hallucinogens.

Idk i don't even try to figure out the world and its answers anymore. It just depresses me these days. We're here then we die. Where do we go? idk? Massive DMT trip makes the most sense to me
Click to expand...
 
al-laddin said:
Using science to explain an altered state of consciousness ..like using a spoon to eat spaghetti....wrong tool for the job...philosophy comes a bit closer....
Click to expand...

Idk man. Science will explain it far better. It's more exact than the subjective experience from a user.

Hits this receptor, does that and this happens because of X.

Saying well yeah bro, I saw this woman and she was serving me scotch on the rocks. I always see these patterns and come into contact with these entities. What are they? They're actual existing entities. How can we prove that? Well, you just gotta smoke DMT man, you'd see it. Where does DMT even take us? On a mind-trip. What does psychedelic mean? Mind-manifesting.

Conclusion? We smoke this drug and we go on a journey through our minds.

I find with your idea it makes me think that you're saying that this DMT astral plane actually exists. So it leaves me to think that if me n my friend both smoke it at the same time we'd be able to see each other.

But we don't? Do we? We experience something profound. But to label it is just attaching an idea to it. Science or philosophy it doesn't matter. The experience is one we are far from being able to comprehend. I just consider it psychedelic as most hallucinogens and life in general is psychedelic. What you believe is what you see.

Help me out here if i'm not interpreting your idea correctly.
 
science will never be able to explain consciousness. the body is not your mind and consciousness is not limited to your body, but we do limit it to our body. DMT throw our usual way of thinking and experiencing life. you indeed go into a journey into your mind. but your mind is bound to the cycle of existence and thats quite clearly what we see.
there are many different dmt planes. its quite clear for me that theres a truth behind the worlds I see
PotatoMan said:
Idk man. Science will explain it far better. It's more exact than the subjective experience from a user.

Hits this receptor, does that and this happens because of X.

Saying well yeah bro, I saw this woman and she was serving me scotch on the rocks. I always see these patterns and come into contact with these entities. What are they? They're actual existing entities. How can we prove that? Well, you just gotta smoke DMT man, you'd see it. Where does DMT even take us? On a mind-trip. What does psychedelic mean? Mind-manifesting.

Conclusion? We smoke this drug and we go on a journey through our minds.

I find with your idea it makes me think that you're saying that this DMT astral plane actually exists. So it leaves me to think that if me n my friend both smoke it at the same time we'd be able to see each other.

But we don't? Do we? We experience something profound. But to label it is just attaching an idea to it. Science or philosophy it doesn't matter. The experience is one we are far from being able to comprehend. I just consider it psychedelic as most hallucinogens and life in general is psychedelic. What you believe is what you see.

Help me out here if i'm not interpreting your idea correctly.
Click to expand...
 
Never say never, and what is science anyway? Yoga/meditation to me are science. Direct experience, repeatable, proveable results.
 
definitely.
in pali, meditation means science of the mind. why science, because like you said, its explainable, repeatable and if done properly, it will bring the same insight and result for everyone: all you have to do, is follow the method. exactly like science.
problem is, meditation is very had at the beginning and we go back to living in the 5 senses and the pleasure they bring rather they keep at it and learn to still the mind.
but science cannot understand consciousness as its not related to the body.
sure, the 5 senses are related to consciousness, but the way we deal with the 5 senses and react to them is unmaterial.


yepyepwoah said:
Never say never, and what is science anyway? Yoga/meditation to me are science. Direct experience, repeatable, proveable results.
Click to expand...
 
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PotatoMan said:
Idk man. Science will explain it far better. It's more exact than the subjective experience from a user.

Hits this receptor, does that and this happens because of X.

Saying well yeah bro, I saw this woman and she was serving me scotch on the rocks. I always see these patterns and come into contact with these entities. What are they? They're actual existing entities. How can we prove that? Well, you just gotta smoke DMT man, you'd see it. Where does DMT even take us? On a mind-trip. What does psychedelic mean? Mind-manifesting.

Conclusion? We smoke this drug and we go on a journey through our minds.

I find with your idea it makes me think that you're saying that this DMT astral plane actually exists. So it leaves me to think that if me n my friend both smoke it at the same time we'd be able to see each other.

But we don't? Do we? We experience something profound. But to label it is just attaching an idea to it. Science or philosophy it doesn't matter. The experience is one we are far from being able to comprehend. I just consider it psychedelic as most hallucinogens and life in general is psychedelic. What you believe is what you see.

Help me out here if i'm not interpreting your idea correctly.
Click to expand...

I agree with your analysis of your trip and with this response. I just wanted to point out though that though each of our minds and experiences are unique, they still emerge from the same (or at least an extremely similar) template. Charles Darwin was to my knowledge the first to scientifically demonstrate, for instance, that we do not learn facial expressions by observing other people; these things come to us innately, and we can infer then that the corresponding emotions themselves are likely to be similar experiences (your anger is not enormously different from my anger; your joy is not so different from mine). In other words, simply by being human and sharing the experience of it with other humans, I would say we are bound to come across similar archetypes. This is the joining point of the divide between the seemingly disparate viewpoints on DMT; that it must either be of our own individual minds or of the spiritual planes. The hilarious thing is, DMT itself shows us there is no difference between the two to begin with; the borderlines are only ever where WE define them to be. So on that level, my mind is your mind is his mind is her mind is our minds is their minds is every mind and is no mind, because one mind cannot function by itself to begin with. We all NEED our environments and hence each other to be able to define ourselves as separate individuals. DMT takes those barriers of perception away and lets you see a reality where your imagination is not so heavily restricted to what your immediate senses perceive. On that level, you're bound to come across archetypal concepts from your culture and your species - symbols of femininity, angels, aliens - maybe a lot of animal spirits and such if you were born and raised in a more indigenous society - of course it all comes from your mind but don't forget that YOUR MIND COMES FROM THE UNIVERSE.
 
I have a real problem with the notion that a breakthrough dose is "the same for everyone". We're talking about high doses of DMT here (one of the most powerful psychedelic drugs in existence)... not opiates or benzos. Remember: not everybody takes DMT for the same reasons, sees the same shit or interprets the experience in the same way. I have read numerous reports of people who smoke the stuff every day just for the fuck of it. Everybody is different.

I have had a few breakthroughs on high dose DPT. The first word that comes to mind when I think of these experiences is 'mindblowing'. I was seeing planets, orbs, beings (aliens, angels and ghost-like figures)... it was breathtaking.
I can understand why some people might find this kind of experience spiritual - and I totally respect that - but this isn't the case for me.
As beautiful and amazing as they are; I take a very pragmatic approach to these experiences. Pareidolia (rather than being in another dimension) explains why I was seeing beings and faces.
 
Guys 'n gals,

Thank you sincerely for all your responses. I have already included most of these postings in a section in the book. I will keep Bluelight updated on the progress of t
he book. But, just a warning, I'm just starting out.

Peace,
Vostochnik
 
All or most Sciences fail to factor consciousness into the questions that they seek to further our understanding of what they generally refer to as Reality
Was it not Heisenberg who put that into a mathmatical formula that just by observing an experiment we radically alter the results with our excpectations
of the what the outcome will be,with that in mind I would make a very bad scientist and an even worse Guru,still I am fascinated by the fact that Science
has almost proven that GOD or some Divine Entity is behind the scenes making reality up as we go along and that Wizard behind the curtain could be US
Long live Heisenberg's Indeterminacy Principle.
 
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