EADD Heroin discussion v.20 -- You've come a long way baby

[BigG]

Heroin is for the birds.
Guess that makes me a bird.

Hello everyone. A search brought me to the archives of this thread (v. 15?) a while back, and following through up to date has provided me with many hours of reading pleasure. There are only so many heroin threads, and living in an area of the US without any open air markets nor identifiable variations in quality means there is no reason for one for this region. With yours in particular, it seems that your group has less disagreements with one another, and you are more considerate of and supportive of one another in general.

The drought was/is fascinating to me. It's beyond my understanding how that happened, why no one seemed to want to take advantage of filling a hungry void. It's strongly doubtful that would ever happen here, too many people and separate organizations are involved in capitalizing on our insatiable appetite for drugs. It's also interesting how pills are frequently a stepping stone to heroin in this country, while it appears that similar pills only became recently available over there, and not as large of a variety. It's very easy to lead people to believe that "opiates" are just a reference to pills here, and I'm glad to exploit it.

Crawling back in my hole now, may or may not pop back up sometime. Far away in an area that's purely based on a call and delivery system of what blondin would call "not real heroin" (I thought it was a mix of heroin , 3MAM, 6MAM, burnt sugar, human feces, etc lol) I am not sure what I can even contribute. Thanks for the fun reading material that I like to read during walks and bus rides, and when I don't feel like bothering with making money for the day quite yet.

I think its a bit of a misconception that pills have "only just become available over here" and there aren't as many different types... Admittedly there are some we don't have over here but almost everything that's available in the US is also available in the UK. Its just that for whatever reason pill abuse just isn'tquite as big a problem in the UK. In the same way crystal meth use has never taken off here to any appreciable degree (other than in the gay clubbing scene) and other things like prescription dexamphetamine/methylphenidate arnt as big a deal.

While one can only speculate why this is I guess it is just as likely that drug "tastes" would differ on this side of the pond as do things like sports preference (its football not soccer Lol!)...music etc.

 

[kkattastic]

I think its a bit of a misconception that pills have "only just become available over here" and there aren't as many different types... Admittedly there are some we don't have over here but almost everything that's available in the US is also available in the UK. Its just that for whatever reason pill abuse just isn'tquite as big a problem in the UK. In the same way crystal meth use has never taken off here to any appreciable degree (other than in the gay clubbing scene) and other things like prescription dexamphetamine/methylphenidate arnt as big a deal.

While one can only speculate why this is I guess it is just as likely that drug "tastes" would differ on this side of the pond as do things like sports preference (its football not soccer Lol!)...music etc.

I am 42 and have a friend who is 10-15 yrs my senior.
back then,they used to rob pharmacies as street heroin was rare
it was all about pills...tuinal,diconal,barbs,seconal.......
a lotta people rate oxy,but i think it's bullshit

I used to have a dexy script and i sold speed-we would usually use the dexy to give the speed a boost when it was lacking

and if someone thinks a drought could never happen to them.....well,we all know,i think,about the Australian drought and before this drought,we would all have said the same thing.It was just insane.

 

[spudgun]

I think its a bit of a misconception that pills have "only just become available over here" and there aren't as many different types... Admittedly there are some we don't have over here but almost everything that's available in the US is also available in the UK. Its just that for whatever reason pill abuse just isn'tquite as big a problem in the UK. In the same way crystal meth use has never taken off here to any appreciable degree (other than in the gay clubbing scene) and other things like prescription dexamphetamine/methylphenidate arnt as big a deal.

While one can only speculate why this is I guess it is just as likely that drug "tastes" would differ on this side of the pond as do things like sports preference (its football not soccer Lol!)...music etc.

Think it's probably more to do with closer regulation of Doctors' prescribing powers. The fact is that most people get prescriptions through the NHS, which, in conjunction with NICE, tightens the reins on what Drs can get away with prescribing.

Cf America where it's all free-market, and Drs are directly lobbied by drugs companies to encourage them to overprescribe, amongst other things, abusable drugs.

So obviously that means less chance of pills ending up on the street.

 

[BigG]

Think it's probably more to do with closer regulation of Doctors' prescribing powers. The fact is that most people get prescriptions through the NHS, which, in conjunction with NICE, tightens the reins on what Drs can get away with prescribing.

Cf America where it's all free-market, and Drs are directly lobbied by drugs companies to encourage them to overprescribe, amongst other things, abusable drugs.

So obviously that means less chance of pills ending up on the street.

That's a valid point. Doctors in the UK are more directly responsible not only to NICE but the individual practices are responsible to their foundation trusts, CCGs etc. the pphenomenon of the private doctor is still a (relative) rarety in the UK whereas in the US money talks and if you can afford it you can find a doctor who will prescribe it (within limits).
I think things have tightened up in general in the states in the last few years with the pill mill scandals and the like but still prescription pill abuse is still a very big deal but with more and more users turning to heroin as pills become harder to obtain and the development of tamper proof versions of oxycodone, oxymorphone etc.
I thinkas kkattastic alluded to, over here pills are mainly sought when heroin is hard to get whereas over there heroin is sought when pills are hard to get....total opposite. Interesting subject though.

 

[steewith2ees]

hi guys

saw the doc in the end ~ we argued the toss but she was proper safe really and agreed to keep my dose at 60mg ~ any more dirty samples tho and she'll raise it
tolerance issues again - been smoking all weekend so 2nite i ended up having a dig, a behaviour i try to keep to a minimum. Even that didnt knock my sox off, no rush, nothing, took a good minute or 2 to feel it at all but finally im feeling all fuzzy, im chasing the jab with atooter plate and 0.1 of caramalised brown heroin so im getting rather noddy, catch u l8r

 

[steewith2ees]

hi guys

saw the doc in the end ~ we argued the toss but she was proper safe really and agreed to keep my dose at 60mg ~ any more dirty samples tho and she'll raise it
tolerance issues again - been smoking all weekend so 2nite i ended up having a dig, a behaviour i try to keep to a minimum. Even that didnt knock my sox off, no rush, nothing, took a good minute or 2 to feel it at all but finally im feeling all fuzzy, im chasing the jab with atooter plate and 0.1 of caramalised brown heroin so im getting rather noddy, catch u l8r

 

[BigG]

hi guys

saw the doc in the end ~ we argued the toss but she was proper safe really and agreed to keep my dose at 60mg ~ any more dirty samples tho and she'll raise it
tolerance issues again - been smoking all weekend so 2nite i ended up having a dig, a behaviour i try to keep to a minimum. Even that didnt knock my sox off, no rush, nothing, took a good minute or 2 to feel it at all but finally im feeling all fuzzy, im chasing the jab with atooter plate and 0.1 of caramalised brown heroin so im getting rather noddy, catch u l8r

Sorry if you've already explained this but why is it that you don't want to raise your dose again? Would being on a higher dose not help keep you off the heroin? Also if methadone doesn't agree with you have you ever been down the subutex route? Wish there was something I was able to suggest that would help a bit as it sounds like your not really happy with how things are at the moment.

Take care mate and stay safe

 

[steewith2ees]

no need to apologise dude i havnt explained it at all

1:i am looking at doing a reduction, detox and rehab in the new year. For starts thats a 10mg headstart

2k 10mg isnt much in the grand scheme of things when its at the top end and your reducing to 0. Untill i start the reduction i want to continue using illiciate opiates and opioids for recreaction and to self medicate for various reasons (mainly mood and other moderate mental health problems as a pose to chronic physical pain). i can only use a small amount on top of my daily dose before i hit a ceiling from which ican get no higher. People who take alot of ecstasy will recognise this feeling, the first three or four will get you the full range of empthenogenic effects but by the time your on your 5th or 6th all you can feel is an empty, speedy feeling) I can still get high from taking heroin if i time my usage around my daily supervised methadone. If i use on top tho for more than 3 or 4 days then i will hit this ceiling effect regardles, requiring 5-7 days of methadone only before i can use on top again. Im not prepared ro regugitate 60 perfectly fine mls of a class A opioid. An increase to 70mg would put an end to my on top useage


as long as im on methadone im never going to be fit for purpose. when im ready ill stop using heroin and ill start reducing my methadone. i want see if i can get below 20 then ill swap to buprenophrine. The rehab facility im going to has a detox unit so can spend the final 2 weeks of the reduction there before going straight into rehab

thats the plan

 

[da man]

what do u mean by caremalised brown

 

[BecomingJulie]

At a guess, melted and re-solidified?

If it was cut with glucose, it truly would be caramelised: C6H12O6 -> 6C + 6H2O

 

[BigG]

no need to apologise dude i havnt explained it at all

1:i am looking at doing a reduction, detox and rehab in the new year. For starts thats a 10mg headstart

2k 10mg isnt much in the grand scheme of things when its at the top end and your reducing to 0. Untill i start the reduction i want to continue using illiciate opiates and opioids for recreaction and to self medicate for various reasons (mainly mood and other moderate mental health problems as a pose to chronic physical pain). i can only use a small amount on top of my daily dose before i hit a ceiling from which ican get no higher. People who take alot of ecstasy will recognise this feeling, the first three or four will get you the full range of empthenogenic effects but by the time your on your 5th or 6th all you can feel is an empty, speedy feeling) I can still get high from taking heroin if i time my usage around my daily supervised methadone. If i use on top tho for more than 3 or 4 days then i will hit this ceiling effect regardles, requiring 5-7 days of methadone only before i can use on top again. Im not prepared ro regugitate 60 perfectly fine mls of a class A opioid. An increase to 70mg would put an end to my on top useage


as long as im on methadone im never going to be fit for purpose. when im ready ill stop using heroin and ill start reducing my methadone. i want see if i can get below 20 then ill swap to buprenophrine. The rehab facility im going to has a detox unit so can spend the final 2 weeks of the reduction there before going straight into rehab

thats the plan

Ahh right I see. I think much over 70-80mg and you would be unable to feel the heroin at all so I see your point. At 180mg I'm completely unavaible to feel other opiates. I don't take heroin but I had surgery not so long a go they gave me 40mg of IV morphine if which I felt nothing of except a nasty histamine release. That's fine with me as I'm not using opiates for that purpose but I can see how if you were using recreationally (even infrequently) raising your dose would prevent that. Plus as you say if you're trying to reduce going up seems like the wrong direction. Its great that you have a plan for when you're ready to come off. When you do stop using heroin do you think 60mg will be sufficient to hold you for 24 hours? If it is thats great but if it isn't then tapering is a bitch if you're starting from a point of being underdosed.

Anyway good look with it mate and take care...... Stay safe

 

[steewith2ees]

yeah englandz i do have weeks where i use nothing on top and the 60 holds me fine. i have about 300 mls of physeptone spare in there individual dosage bottles, sunday take homes from those days when the session has been enough to hold me. Now ive been smoking most days for the last week, so there really isnt any point in scoring now untill the weekend. Ive also run out of 1 mls so when i do go back into town to score again (i kind of live in the stix you see) i need to make a concious effort to avoid the local chemists. The area i score from is to all intents and purposes an open air drug market and is surrounded by pharmacies doing needle exchange. ill have to go in one at some point tho as i have 2 full sin bins that need getting rid of but it would be difficult to say no to a reload

 

[strungout2010]

Getting some lovely gear, strong as fuck and the bags are getting on for 2 points each, 3 bags for £25 and the first bag has me dribbling , really can't complain other than I can't buy it in weights.
Still,got a couple of days off to get myself nice and stoned.

 

[BecomingJulie]

Talking of melting and resolidifying gear, does it decompose or lose potency in this state? How long can you (theoretically; i.e., barring the urge to smoke the whole lot in one sesh) leave a beetle on foil?

 

[kkattastic]

yeah englandz i do have weeks where i use nothing on top and the 60 holds me fine. i have about 300 mls of physeptone spare in there individual dosage bottles, sunday take homes from those days when the session has been enough to hold me. Now ive been smoking most days for the last week, so there really isnt any point in scoring now untill the weekend. Ive also run out of 1 mls so when i do go back into town to score again (i kind of live in the stix you see) i need to make a concious effort to avoid the local chemists. The area i score from is to all intents and purposes an open air drug market and is surrounded by pharmacies doing needle exchange. ill have to go in one at some point tho as i have 2 full sin bins that need getting rid of but it would be difficult to say no to a reload

IF you do get a new exchange pack and once you get home,you regret it and hope not to use IV again(which would be a good call btw cos IV using is an addiction in itself),just empty out the pins and bend them all so there's no way you can use them.It will only take a few minutes of clarity to do this-you obviously have some strength there so just sabotage yourself

 

[BigG]

I'm well familiar with needle exchanges as I used steroids for years for competitive bodybuilding.. I used to hate going to them though...I read somewhere that's steroid users form a higher percentage of needles exchange users than heroin users. Mind you most of them are 17 year old Geordie Shaw wannabes who don't even compete but don't get me started on that Lol!

 

[BigG]

Sorry for the double post but I was just thinking about this the other day. I've never used heroin but have been on opiates for pain management for 18 years now at very high doses. I'm not trying to brag or anything but just to give you an idea of tolerance, when my pain is bad I can do 1,000mg of methadone pills over 2 days without even feeling it... This tolerance is due to prolonged exposure to morphine, oxy, fent, diconal, methadone, hydromorphone etc.over time. Since all these drugs came curtosy of the NHS they cost hardly anything. If I was to use street gear with this kind of tolerance the cost alone would be astronomical. My point is that this tolerance (which I hate BTW as it makes pain relief almost impossible) would be almost unattainable if one's only source was street gear which you had to buy....to "pay" for this kind of tolerance would I imagine cost hundreds of thousands of pounds over this extended period of time. People who have never been prescribed large amounts of pharmaceutical opiates and have only everbeen exposed to heroin are in a way lucky as if they had been their tolerance would be so high they wouldn't be able to afford to even stay well let alone get high.

I hope this makes sense, its a difficult point to try to get across but I hope you get my drift.

 

[da man]

makes perfect sense id love 2 try some good pharms, only ever had codeine and paracetamol,id like t try iv morphine as i quite like the histamine release from gear

 

[BigG]

The histamine release from a large dose isn't pleasant at all. I think the point I was making is that if u suddenly had access to huge amounts of virtually free 100% pure pbarms over the course of nearly 20 years you would develop tolerance that it would be impossible to maintain with street drugs even of you wanted to.....blessing and a curse really.

 

[kkattastic]

The histamine release from a large dose isn't pleasant at all. I think the point I was making is that if u suddenly had access to huge amounts of virtually free 100% pure pbarms over the course of nearly 20 years you would develop tolerance that it would be impossible to maintain with street drugs even of you wanted to.....blessing and a curse really.

Atm,I am prescribed 400mg of MST a day.
when I was in hospital,it was horrible,cos the only extra pain relief they could give me was a few patient controlled morphine drips(that give you just 5-10mg every 15 mins or so)-which have 0 effect and some paracetamol.
However,when I want to use street gear,I just stop taking my prescribed meds and I usually do get a really good effect at least for the first day.
I dunno if it is me and my tolerance,or the gear,but I also get that terrible morning banging headache that I have heard others mention