Opioids synthetic opiates?

[WILLASS]

You can become addicted to Kratom as well. Search around BL. There are many threads about kratom dependency and addiction. Granted, it's much harder to become addicted to than actual opiates like heroin or oxy, and the withdrawal is much lighter if you do pick up a habit, but it still happens and is unpleasant.

One of the other major downsides to Kratom, is that unless you have a very small habit/tolerance, it's not going to do shit. However, it works great after you've tapered down to a very low dose of methadone or bupe, and then start taking it to treat your withdrawals. I know many people who got clean that way with minimal symptoms.

it isnt anuthing to do with the drug--its biology. if you stimulaye opiatevreceptors lonf enough, your body:s own pain killing properties will essentiallt paxk up, as they are not needed. same way your balls.shrink.when.tou.take steroids. your body gets lazy and stops prodicing its own endorphins, because why shoukd it?
toure supplying.it with all it needs and.when.taken away, they take a long time.to come back (withdrawals)

This would indicate that there is no possibility of a W/D free opiate then? It kind of makes sense to me that would happen. I wonder then if it's possible to take something that kick starts your body's natural production so that the transition is quicker/more efficient? I'm very interested in exploring the world of potentiators, tolerance reducers and W/D eliminators - together we could discover a cocktail of compounds that, when taken together with opioids, increase their effects, slow down the rate of tolerance and speed up recovery - that to me sounds like a very plausible and realistic solution to the problem.

I believe that benzodiazepines increase the effects of opioids (thus requiring less of them reducing harm and cost), DXM reduces and slows tolerance and Kratom can help ease the W/D symptoms. I think that anti-histamines potentiate as well as alleviate itching and chucking a multi-vitamin in couldn't hurt now could it? We could combine this all into one pill and market it as 'Heroin Helper', we'll be millionaires this time next year I tells ya!

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

This would indicate that there is no possibility of a W/D free opiate then?

Who knows? They used to think the Earth was flat.. that is was pure science fiction to go to the moon, etc. So anything is possible.

But as of right now, it's not going to happen.

 

[WILLASS]

Well that's true, who knows what future holds? People will probably be downloading 'IV Morphine Experience 0.7' their organic/synthetic virtual experience dock laughing at us for worrying about withdrawl symptoms - what an archaic concept they seem since all drugs were digitised in 2056........

 

[smackydowners]

i like the concept, but you said yourself, you plan on becoming physicakky dependant on opis. unless youre loaaded, what is your last tenner going to go on? alll this danage control? or another bag to.fix you up immediately?
sorry if im tskking out of turn, but are you experienced in opiates?
to me,it sounds viable, but in the distant future.
opis are sonething you seem to want to do regularly and then when youre forced to take a tokerance break, to minimisevthe pain.
it woukd be better to only use infrequentky and even thats reeeal hard mate.
in my many years of exp you di the crime, you do thevtime.
its a cool idea but unrealistic.

 

[fizzymk]

I agree that bupe was probably viewed as exactley that which you speak of but obviously it comes with the same baggage as methadone. It's definitely not as bad, my first time on and getting off meth was pure hell: absolutely the worst W/D's I've ever had - it lasted 7 weeks until I finally relapsed and that was only after about 9 months of use from 60 mg to 15 mg then one month of residential detox. The 7 weeks was from my last dose of meth (5 mg) to the point I relapsed. In comparison I was on 16 mg of Subutex for 7 months, tapered down to 2 mg and quit cold and experienced almost no W/D's whatsoever! Finally the 'get out of jail' card I had hankered for for so long. Alas it was not to be, after abusing it recreationally for some time I now find it to be equally as addictive with guaranteed W/D's if I use it regularly albeit significantly milder but quite a bit longer.

Back to the drawing board!

Thats pretty good you made it that long coming off methadone! I agree, this drug is absolutely the worst thing I have ever seen as far as w/ds go! I was warned before going on it that it would be a bad choice, but I didnt listen. I can barely make it a few days, there is no way I could do months and months of horrible w/ds. Congrats though on getting off this shit!

btw, Ive had Fent before, It was good, I had the patches and would put 3 at a time on parts of my body with thin skin, the high was good, but I generally like methadone and H better, bad thing about Fent around here anyway, it is hard to get now and when it does come up, it is way overpriced, most former pill heads are now solidly on junk due to state creating tough painkiller laws.

 

[fizzymk]

Tramadol itself isn't synthetic, it's an (awesome) naturally occuring substance. Since you said "analogues", you might know this already, but I thought I'd mention it since it is not a widely known fact and pretty interesting considering tramadol has such a sick pharmacology and 4 isomers which are (ofc) equally distributed in the commercially available synthetic version, but not in the naturally occuring one. The root bark of nauclea latifolia has been used for centuries, maybe even thousands of years to relieve pain. I'd love to extract some to see the difference for myself because I fucking love tramadol, it's always been my favourite opiate. Recreationally I'd prefer oral tramadol over hydromorphone iv, even if that means not getting an awesome rush.
Actually, you wouldn't even have to extract it because the strongest bark contains up to 4% of tramadol!! 5g->200mg...

@fizzymk
It was the Germans man, not the nazis and surely not the Nazis. Come on. You are talking about the generation of my grand parents. I don't call your ancestors the Slavers with a capital S either. Not everyone was a national socialist, you know. You probably don't want to put into the same group of people with that crazy-ass war-mongering fuck George W. Bush Jr. either. I can't force you to stop referring to the entire German populace as "the Nazis", but it might be worth considering. It makes a person look like he's got his education off Discovery Channel imho.

Generally, if you really want to write about the history of the compound, it would would be fair to name those who invented it or would you say it does Thomas Edison justice to say the Americans invented the light bulb?

Im curious how long you have been on tramadol? Back when I was taking it, it was good but not for long, tolerance built up crazy fast and then it seemed the more I took, I didnt get to the high, but only to black out or seize.

I dont know anyone around here that prefers it,and I know for a fact some people have trouble even giving it away.

In Germany, does it come in the same 50mg tabs? Is it the same compound that is in the US?

 

[clubcard]

Grünenthal found tramadol AFAIK. Methadone was discovered by I.G.Farben in 1938 and it was tested and considered too toxic compared to morphine. The US took the patents by Eminent Domain in 1945.

crOOK - I think that there are Neo Nazis everywhere (der Kerl hat backpfeifengesicht), but blaming Germans in general is ignorance. Never blame on hatred that which can be explained by ignorance.

 

[crOOk]

Never blame on hatred that which can be explained by ignorance.

Who said that? That's so very true.

I was a tiny bit offended and just generally tired of people speaking about "the Nazis" when something happened in Germany anytime between 1933 and 1945, but 1 year earlier or later it's the Germans all of a sudden. Really what I was trying to say is that people discover substances (and deserve adequate credit), not a whole country, but even if one wants to generalize like that (e.g. due to lack of knowledge which would be legitimate), then surely the people of that country shouldn't be reduced to the ideology of their leaders over their nationality.

 

[clubcard]

Listen - it's says something about them; nothing about you, crOOk.

 

[crOOk]

Listen - it's says something about them; nothing about you, crOOk.

That's a very good point.

 

[fizzymk]

Who said that? That's so very true.

I was a tiny bit offended and just generally tired of people speaking about "the Nazis" when something happened in Germany anytime between 1933 and 1945, but 1 year earlier or later it's the Germans all of a sudden. Really what I was trying to say is that people discover substances (and deserve adequate credit), not a whole country, but even if one wants to generalize like that (e.g. due to lack of knowledge which would be legitimate), then surely the people of that country shouldn't be reduced to the ideology of their leaders over their nationality.

I have always heard a particular Nazi general was the one to thank for methadone, as he instructed German chemists to come up with something he could use as an alternative to heroin, cuz he was going to be out of germany for some time, and I guess he was worried he wouldnt be able to find any heroin wherever he was going...?? not sure if this is true or not, Do you know?

If its true, wouldnt it be nice to have loads of chemists at your beckon call, ready to create some super drug? LOL

I wonder what the H was like back in WW2? Probably alot stronger than street H today, cuz I bet they didnt cut it to shit back then.

 

[clubcard]

Göring was a morphine addict all through hostilities. When he gave himself up, he was with his doctor who had, it was recorded, the WHOLE of the German stock of dihydrocodeine.

Another interesting fact is that crOOk had nothing to do with the above facts.


Tramadol is a prodrug like codeine. The liver has to metabolise it before it's active. It can be useful for pain, but you can only get a Pepsi habit with it.

 

[crOOk]

Tramadol is a prodrug like codeine. The liver has to metabolise it before it's active. It can be useful for pain, but you can only get a Pepsi habit with it.

Yeah it's not really that useful for most people when it comes to strong pain. The fact that I can nod every damn day for a year straight on it without getting any signs of withdrawal after tapering is pretty amazing. I also thoroughly enjoy the SNRI effect of Tramadol itself and how they slowly transition into the opioid effects of Nortramadol (I think that's the metabolite). I never really needed much more than 400mg per day even towards the end of that year, so tolerance developes only moderately. Used to combine it with grapefruit juice, 60mg DXM, 50mg diphenhydramine and it worked (as in it made me nod) every single time. The duration of the effects was also a huge plus because I could basically be on it non-stop and not worry about redosing all the time. I know it doesn't work this well for some due to their enzyme situation. Believe it or not I prefer the effects over every other opioid I've tried, among them being hydromorphone and oxycodone both of which I've used at dangerously high doses. Morphine is like a bad joke compared to Tramadol, but well, that's just me. Only exception would be IV piritramid and maybe hydromorphone iv too. Can't really compete with that rush.