Opioids new here :) need help with tapering...w/d etc

[sarajenni88]

Kratom actually helped make my w/d very tolerable. I kicked a chemical dependency on opiates and went to semi regular Kratom use with far more ease then I could have cut out the Bupe on its own. I can't explain how or why it worked so well for me but it did. After a week of mild w/d that were easy to ignore because the Kratom made me feel good in ways unrelated to opiates, I was good. And not just on Kratom, I was good sober. Just keep the dose low and use it to ease the sickness, not get rid of it and make you feel amazing because then your not helping yourself lol.

I think I'll give it a try...couldn't hurt...hopefully ; )

 

[sarajenni88]

I used kratom to help with buprenorphine wds and PAWS and it helped but it just delays the wds.. you're gonna feel them no matter what eventually.

How about the PST...same idea right?

 

[HdoubleODeezy]

How about the PST...same idea right?

I would think so, but i dont think PST would even do anything for you at all if you take 32mg of hydromorphone a day lol, not saying to get you high but to even help wds.
Kratom would be more effective but it isn't just an opiate, if you are going to take clonidine as a comfort med, the alpha agonism from the kratom might off set the calming feeling of the clonidine.
Kratom is kinda stimulating.

 

[Kid Amine]

^ so the time release is like OROS?

how long is one exalgo supposed to last? half a day or a whole day?
if it is OROS than yeah just swallow it and let it last how long it's supposed to and see if the dr will just lower the mg of the pill as you drop down on dosage.

I do not know what OROS is, however I know Exalgo is supposed to last 24 hours. I know that due to the construction of Exalgo, it does not dose dump nor have I heard of them passing thru someone's system intact (like OP and TRF Opana). As far as the price, she has Medicare part D that covers it, tho finding a pharmacy that carries the 32mg pills was a huge pita here - took her 9 days to get her script filled, and the pharmacy had to special order it for her alone. Be careful with defeating them, you will get all of that into your system in 2-4 hours vs 24, and be halfway into withdrawals by 24 hours. Personally, I would ask the Dr for 2 16s, for pharmacy availability reasons (a very valid reason here), and take them 12 hours apart. Yes, they're supposed to last 24, and do in most people, however not everyone is the same.

 

[sarajenni88]

...yes I know defeating the time release system is unsafe... not to include incredibly negative to my tapering. Hind sight is 20/20, tho right? I would

 

[kickingOPnK]

I'm using a Kratom taper now myself from an oxy habit and they are most definitely right when they say it only delays the withdrawals. Right now I don't feel good at all, but it's manageable. At the same time my first taper drop was probably way too much, as I was using way too much. Keep the dose low-moderate if you do use it maybe a couple times a day and taper s-l-o-w-l-y. I'm still waiting to even out from my last drop before dropping further. Actually I'm considering splitting my doses since I'm only doing 2 doses of ~5 grams a day and there is this big gap in the middle where I am suffering a little bit (mostly anxiety). So Kratom can work but don't overdo it.

 

[Moondust]

Where do you get kratom? Can it be bought at a vitamin store?

 

[sarajenni88]

Check out head shops...ppl say not too buy from them but I know the owner of the one here in my town so he tells me how long he's had it where he gets it etc.

 

[sarajenni88]

I'm using a Kratom taper now myself from an oxy habit and they are most definitely right when they say it only delays the withdrawals. Right now I don't feel good at all, but it's manageable. At the same time my first taper drop was probably way too much, as I was using way too much. Keep the dose low-moderate if you do use it maybe a couple times a day and taper s-l-o-w-l-y. I'm still waiting to even out from my last drop before dropping further. Actually I'm considering splitting my doses since I'm only doing 2 doses of ~5 grams a day and there is this big gap in the middle where I am suffering a little bit (mostly anxiety). So Kratom can work but don't overdo it.

I'm thinking of using it only when I make my final jump off and using comfort meds while weaning if needed... I dunno how it'll work out but I got some good advice to keep dosing under 10grams to help wth tolerance n w/d from it. Hey good luck!! Its not easy is it??

 

[kickingOPnK]

Where do you get kratom? Can it be bought at a vitamin store?

Some head shops have it but it's usually pretty low quality, it's always better to go with an online vendor. I don't think I'm allowed to post any specific sources on here though.

 

[kickingOPnK]

I'm thinking of using it only when I make my final jump off and using comfort meds while weaning if needed... I dunno how it'll work out but I got some good advice to keep dosing under 10grams to help wth tolerance n w/d from it. Hey good luck!! Its not easy is it??

No it isn't lol. I was using maybe around 8 grams 4x a day for a few weeks before, during and after stopping oxy. Continuing to use it after stopping the oxy seemed to help the oxy withdrawal at the time but it seems I'm seems I'm paying for it now, ha

 

[sarajenni88]

Yeah...that's the way it goes...are u tapering the kratom now?? I'm sure with a good taper schedule ur w/d will be minimum and nothing like cold Turkey from oxys. That's nooo fun. Hell on earth.

Oops sry...just looked back u r on a kratom taper and off the oxy?? Awesome that's an accomplishment in it's self.

 

[sarajenni88]

Flaga...
I can't PM yet...newbie rule I suppose but I did end up trying about 4grams of kratom from my local head shop... and no good: ( first of all it was incredibly yucky. But my hubby brought home orange KOOL AID not OJ. I can't imagine drinking that when I'm in w/d. Do the more quality strains taste so horrible?f so I'm buying the capsules. Secondly...although I only dosed four grams I felt a quick s head rush..a tad more energy than nothing. So I'm def. Going to order caps from the place I was directed to online. Does this sound like an experience with garbage kratom? I know there's a kratom thread but I figured it would be okay to post here??

Anyone's help would be much appreciated.

Ty

 

[kickingOPnK]

I've never had capsules that were worth much in my experience. The strains taste different but they are all kinda similar, though the kratom I've had from the local head shop were much worse really. It's def not as bad mixed with OJ. Kool Aid will NOT do the trick lol. And good kratom is very noticeable when it takes effect. It's easy to down once you get used to it.

And yeah I am tapering the kratom though I jumped off way quicker than I should have. I went from 30-35 grams a day split all throughout the day to just 10 grams split morning and night. It's kinda hell, and it's at the point now where I really don't want to backtrack because it's already been a week and I know soon enough maybe within another 3 or 4 days my brain and body will catch up. I'm staying here and waiting it out at this point, though it really sucks. Mostly the anxiety. At least I know in the next week or so though that I'll have made a huge jump and then tapering should be easy from here on out.

 

[sarajenni88]

TsHey that's awesome. One of my very worst withdrawal symptoms is anxiety. And no sleep...if I could sleep,thru five hrs hell even four hrs I could get thru it better. There would be something to look forward to during the days of hell. But there is no break. I greatly admire anyone who has gone thru it. Its a traumatic horrible experience ppl who aren't in our shoes could never fathom. Sounds like u are doing awesome. Its inspirational.
So buying capsules of a strain sold also in powder form wouldn't be as potent? I just dissolved the powder...well I should say incorporated it into a little warm water. Should I strain?? Yea my hubby didn't know how bad it would be. I laughed when he came in with kool aid. He's so supportive tho...I can't complain.

 

[HdoubleODeezy]

I used to just take regular old bali/premium commercial and i found it is the best bang for your buck.
I'd put it in a coffee mug and add water and stir it (as good as possible, doesn't really dissolve) and drink the muddy liquid it makes, tastes bad until you get used to it.
There would always be some left in the cup after drinking so i would just keep adding a little water and drinking it until it was gone.
I wouldn't get it from headshops, you're probly getting ripped off price and quality wise. We can't tell you vendors but do a google search, there are a few good vendors with great prices out there.

EDIT: it may or may not help your sleep issues, it should help with the wd symptoms and make you more comfortable, but like i said in another post.. it is a little stimulating. A lot more so than the hydromorphone you're used to.
I've found with opiates that hydrocodone and hydromorphone are more of a noddy type buzz than with oxycodone or oxymorphone which i could never even sleep when on.
But than again, kratom isn't in either of those categories so it might be different for different people.

 

[kickingOPnK]

Yeh I use a little water with it which makes almost like a paste, and then fill the rest of the glass with OJ (and/or white grapefruit juice which works as a mild potentiator) and stir it all in and chug. Toss and wash works well but I couldn't do it for a long time because it's gross. And it's not that capsules are less potent in and of themselves, but any company that I've seen selling capsules just doesn't have quality product in general. Yeah Bali is probably the best and most reliable to get. The vendor I get mine from also sells a strain called Red Vein Kali which is like Bali only stronger, I don't know if any other vendors sell it or not.

Yeah the ANXIETY omg... ridiculous. But I've gone through it before so I can do it again. Part of it is the momentum too, once I start withdrawing and proceed for more than a day or 2, I almost CAN'T go back to doing it again, because I have it in my mind that there are only two directions to go in: either keep taking more and more and always be a slave, or take less and less and be free. There's only one way out, and once you start, why go back? That thought alone keeps me going forward even when I feel weak, and it hasn't failed me from detoxing yet. Of course, relapsing months later is a whole other story, but I'm voluntarily starting outpatient soon for the first time so maybe it will help.

 

[sarajenni88]

I used to just take regular old bali/premium commercial and i found it is the best bang for your buck.
I'd put it in a coffee mug and add water and stir it (as good as possible, doesn't really dissolve) and drink the muddy liquid it makes, tastes bad until you get used to it.
There would always be some left in the cup after drinking so i would just keep adding a little water and drinking it until it was gone.
I wouldn't get it from headshops, you're probly getting ripped off price and quality wise. We can't tell you vendors but do a google search, there are a few good vendors with great prices out there.

EDIT: it may or may not help your sleep issues, it should help with the wd symptoms and make you more comfortable, but like i said in another post.. it is a little stimulating. A lot more so than the hydromorphone you're used to.
I've found with opiates that hydrocodone and hydromorphone are more of a noddy type buzz than with oxycodone or oxymorphone which i could never even sleep when on.
But than again, kratom isn't in either of those categories so it might be different for different people.

Ty. I was directed to a good site in which to buy kratom. I wanted to try it to see if my business could stay in my little town... we need it lol...but everyone was correct about the outcome.
No biggie I only bought 7 grams for a low price. So no straining or toss n washing is the consensus so far:D

 

[sarajenni88]

Yeh I use a little water with it which makes almost like a paste, and then fill the rest of the glass with OJ (and/or white grapefruit juice which works as a mild potentiator) and stir it all in and chug. Toss and wash works well but I couldn't do it for a long time because it's gross. And it's not that capsules are less potent in and of themselves, but any company that I've seen selling capsules just doesn't have quality product in general. Yeah Bali is probably the best and most reliable to get. The vendor I get mine from also sells a strain called Red Vein Kali which is like Bali only stronger, I don't know if any other vendors sell it or not.

Yeah the ANXIETY omg... ridiculous. But I've gone through it before so I can do it again. Part of it is the momentum too, once I start withdrawing and proceed for more than a day or 2, I almost CAN'T go back to doing it again, because I have it in my mind that there are only two directions to go in: either keep taking more and more and always be a slave, or take less and less and be free. There's only one way out, and once you start, why go back? That thought alone keeps me going forward even when I feel weak, and it hasn't failed me from detoxing yet. Of course, relapsing months later is a whole other story, but I'm voluntarily starting outpatient soon for the first time so maybe it will help.

That's a good way to think about it. All my other w/D's were not intentional and this time around I am trying to plan and get my head in the right place so this can be a permanent change. I'm young with very young children and while I don't feel as though my meds and dependence has negatively affected my family I don't want them to get older and tell me it has. So I'm looking into ordering a couple different strains...I've gotten some awesome info on strengths and what kinds are stimulating and what types are more relaxing.

 

[Flaga121]

Does sound like the product was less then quality. For the taste I think the Coolaid did not help. OJ makes it almost pleasant for me, but I'm strange and got into herbalism years ago. Anything other then OJ is meh, but with fresh OJ I enjoy my AM glass (which is the only one the taste made touchy while in W/d).

It's not for everyone per say. I hear the caps don't work too well, powdered leaf seems to be the best bet overall. Just gotta find the best way to choke it down. Once your body realizes it helps w/d it becomes SUPER easy to drink.