Opiate and opioid withdrawal: Coping strategies and medication

[Shambles]

Careful with the opies, MDB. I know kratom is a bit of a thing all of its own but it still hits those opi receptors. When you've only recently withdrawn from another opi you're in just about the highest risk group for re-addicting as it's possible to be. You may be physically over the bupe but psychologically and emotionally you'll still have a way to go. Yes opies do feel good. But - as you said yourself - you know they don't stay that way unless you keep upping the dose and you're back to square one. Don't mean to keep pissing on your parade but opioids of any description are the last thing you need to be using so soon after going through all that withdrawal. I've heard kratom w/d are unbelievably brutal too cos it's not just an opioid (of sorts) but hits... can't actually recall but it's not a nice thing to have to w/d from by all accounts.

I know this was addressed to MDB n sorry for interrupting just wondered what is cyclizine? Never heard of that but I'm currently on 12mg suboxone. Evey x

It's an antihistamine - hay fever remedy, basically. Some people like to combine certain antihistamines with opies cos they generally increase the sedative effects. Obviously increasing the sedative effects also increases the risk factor - combining downers is always iffy - but it's a lot cheaper than using higher doses of your opi of choice to achieve a similar effect so it's fairly common practice. More so in the US than here though. They are also good for stopping excessive itching from histamine reactions to large doses of codeine or other itchy opies. You can get non-drowsy anti-histamines if you only need it for practical anti-itchies purposes.

 

[mydrugbuddy]

yeah Im stopping after today Shambles. I know im treading on thin ice, but i have to stay clean, and cannot allow myself to get back into such habits. Damn it feels so nice though. I will probably pay for this for a few days from tomorrow onwards, but so be it.

 

[Shambles]

You should be fine after only a couple days use. Probably get a bit of a rebound but shouldn't get actual w/d. You would if you pushed it much farther though. Just not worth the risk so soon after putting in all that work. There's always another day for opies - just try to make that day not today most days and you'll be fine

 

[brimz]

opiates 2 days n habit again gotta luv the consistency

 

[Kronos]

They've fucked up the rehab funding where im from, overspent, so now everyone who was going to be going to rehab between last week and april cant go, as well as people who were there and wanted to get an extention, resettle post-rehab into sober living etc.. I was gonna go down that path, still am hopefully, it worked for TekkeN. But fuck, their budget fuckups, its caused a lot of relapses and going to cause a lot more when people who had given up their house etc to go to rehab thinking they could resettle and start afresh have to come back to the shit they wanted to leave! Waste of the time in rehavb in the first place. ah i cant articulate well atm one of them nights where i couoldnt sleep lol.

Sorry just thought id rant that cause it pissed me off for a lot of my mates that were trying to go straight, though i dont kow how bad its affected them yet, i've relapsed on gear after a fucking long break lol (unrelated like thats just cause im a daft cunt). Might just do a detox then just fuck off with a backpack na passport before i spend the rest of what id managed to save.

At TTP detox in bradford all the people i know who'v detoxed there say they give to lefexedine (sp?) and that it works amazingly well for nearly all side effects, anyone tried that? cause id never seen it on here only mentioned IRL

 

[mydrugbuddy]

opiates 2 days n habit again gotta luv the consistency

today is no opiates, and has to stay that way for a while. I cannot fall straight back into that trap, as much as a part of me wants to. For me it would probably be one or 2 months of bliss, and then several months of extreme mental torture after id blown my tolerance out. and trying to get off it. I dont want to let that happen, for many obvious reasons.

 

[Shambles]

^ Good call, MDB

It is shitty - especially in the early stages - trying to live without that nice opi-blanket. It really is very cosy and comforting and "real life" tends to be a bit less cosy and is often distinctly uncomfortable one way or another. I know you've heard it a million times but it really does get easier. Doesn't happen quickly but it does happen. It's really only when you look back after a decent length of time and compare how you feel currently to how you felt back when you were addicted. Day to day it feels like nothing is happening and certainly isn't improving. It really is though. You just have to give it a chance and basically accept the fact that you're not gonna be feeling on top of the world all the time - partuicularly when it's so soon after withdrawing.

Also worth bearing in mind the psychological and emotional side of addiction. That stuff takes longer to work itself out than the physical side does. I wouldn't exactly describe it as depressed so much as just feeling kinda blank and empty for a while. Albeit interspersed with periods of acute depression for many. All this is largely down to changes in brain chemistry though - changes for the better. It just takes the brain a while to rebuild all it's lil pathways and receptors and other brainstuffs is all. The fewer lil dabbles - especially with opies of any kind, but also stims cos they fuck about with your motivation, energy and mood so much - the quicker you'll be back on track. It is a slog but you can do it. Don't give up giving up as I am prone to say - it's worth it. Promise

At TTP detox in bradford all the people i know who'v detoxed there say they give to lefexedine (sp?) and that it works amazingly well for nearly all side effects, anyone tried that? cause id never seen it on here only mentioned IRL

Lofexidine is similiar to clonidine - I've often seen them both mentioned (usually the latter but the former is also pretty common) as being helpful for w/d symptoms. They lower blood pressure I think. Have mostly heard good things about 'em but the dose needs to be carefully titrated cos you tend to fall over and faint a lot otherwise. I do believe Brimz mentioned collapsing in the shower when he was on one of the two mentioned. I had some clondine here for my phenibut w/d but in the end I didn't need 'em cos I used a rather non-standard method for tapering. As such, no personal exerience of 'em but they're generally seen as being pretty useful for w/d if used correctly.

And that's shitty about the rehab funding. Happens all the time, unfortunately. It's all very well the government trying to push addicts into rehab (at least they keep making noises about it but doesn't seem to quite be put into practice yet) but there simply aren't the places nor the funding to cover people who desperately want to be in rehab let alone trying to force people who have no intention of quitting at the time. I did a week of inpatient detox but couldn't get funding for actual rehab. It's been mentioned again since as it's not so much detox that I need as... well... some form of rehabitlitation - finding ways to reintegrate into society a bit after being absent for so very long. I was always dead against the idea cos who wants to be in an institution of any sort for months on end? A few years down the line though and I must admit it is something I'd consider if it were available. It's not though and there are people with far greater acute needs than mine and even they can't get in so...

 

[Sammy G]

The fewer lil dabbles - especially with opies of any kind, but also stims cos they fuck about with your motivation, energy and mood so much - the quicker you'll be back on track.

Have to agree with this.

I fucked up my recovery something rotten with stim use, particularly 4-FA. It made the psychological adjustments all the more difficult.

 

[mydrugbuddy]

Im not giving up giving up Shambles. Im was just surprised how much i enjoyed kratom. I know i have to be disciplined with it. This time i can do it, and have to do it, due to the airplane and customs issue that is looming.

 

[Shambles]

Im not giving up giving up Shambles.

I say that to everybody who has gone the taper/withdrawal route - just a stock phrase is all cos I happen to agree with it. I know you're not giving up cos you're keeping us updated and we can all see the progress made. Just chipping in with thoughts from my own assorted withdrawals is all

 

[mydrugbuddy]

thats fine and completely welcomed and appreciated. Sometimes i may need reminding. Thats not trying to take responsibilty for myself away and lay it on other people. I could have just taken the kratom and kept quiet about it. I dont plan to take anymore until a possible night out/ playing pool at the end of the month or until the BL meet up. I HAVE to keep the doses well spread out and allow plenty of time inbetween them. I know how easy it is to take these things every day, and before you know it you're trapped all over again.

 

[brimz]

i luv it n want it mind

 

[brimz]

They lower blood pressure I think. Have mostly heard good things about 'em but the dose needs to be carefully titrated cos you tend to fall over and faint a lot otherwise. I do believe Brimz mentioned collapsing in the shower when he was on one of the two mentioned
i did

yes Britlofex bak when it was non generic £££££

 

[Shambles]

thats fine and completely welcomed and appreciated. Sometimes i may need reminding. Thats not trying to take responsibilty for myself away and lay it on other people. I could have just taken the kratom and kept quiet about it. I dont plan to take anymore until a possible night out/ playing pool at the end of the month or until the BL meet up. I HAVE to keep the doses well spread out and allow plenty of time inbetween them. I know how easy it is to take these things every day, and before you know it you're trapped all over again.

Exactly. It's amazing how quickly the mind seems to fuzz over the memory of what all that tapering and withdrawal bizniz was actually like at the time. I know my proper (hopefully) final major opi detox was brutal beyond belief... but I can't really conjure up how it actually felt. It's like I can picture it but there's nothing really attached to it - no particular feelings or memories of what it was like beyond the basic facts. It is a pretty damn traumatic experience to go through so I guess it's not so strange the mind will try to "protect" you from it but it's not so helpful when one could really do with an acute reminder at times.

I think it definitely helps to post about that kinda stuff on here. I actually did post on here from the detox centre many years back (was amazed it wasn't blocked but it wasn't) but that was under one of my previous incarnations and I can't for the life of me recall what my username was at the time. Wasn't this account anyway. I'm positive that it helps to talk about it and get feedback and support from others even if it is only words on a screen. Going through withdrawal is just plain horrid and you do tend to feel very alone and trapped in your own personal hellhole. It's good to hear from folk who are in similar situation and people who have come out the other end. If ever there was a situation that could do with a lil support and encouragement and regular reminders that there actually is light at the end of the tunnel...

Everything you are doing is totally "normal" behaviour for somebody who has just withdrawn from opies - and probably anything else. The lack of energy and motivation combined with the generally down mood doesn't half make stims look very appealing indeed. They will almost certainly lift your spirits at the time but we all know what happens once you are no longer stimmed but coming down and got a couple days of rebound to look forward to

The ideal is obviously to lay off the furries completely - at least for a while - and do all that stuff we all know is good: get plenty of rest, exercise, good nutrition. In practice it doesn't often work out that way and a few lil wobbles are very far from the end of the world. They are gonna drag it out that bit longer but sometimes I personally find it worth it for the relief... that's not to recommend "wobbles" at all but I totally get it. Just don't wobble too much and you'll be dandy soon enough

 

[mydrugbuddy]

well somehow that kratom that didnt seem to do anything when i first tried it turns out to be absolutely amazing now ive got a lowered tolerance. One evenings dose turned into 4 evenings, and then i was out of it for 2 days because of that embarrasing mirtazapine fiasco. I was craving more kratom like fuck yesterday evening. I eventually caved in and ordered more off the internet. I do have the option today of going into the headshop in town and getting some, but i know that is really admitting defeat and not even trying to exert any control over it, so i hope not to do that.

I have to learn how to control impulses. Step 1: be aware yes i am having these urges, step 2: be aware they will pass. Obviously this is far easier said than done. Last night the cravings did pass after id blotted them out with etizolam 8(, but i didnt have any more kratom in the house, so i had to 'hold out' as far as not taking any went, but i did order some more. I dont think i'll be going to the headshop today. That is just giving up without any fight at all.

 

[Sammy G]

Careful, MDB! Though it sounds like you've thought things through, so well done!

I've never actually taken kratom, you know, so I wouldn't know how tempting it is. If it's breaking through your residual tolerance though, it must be worthwhile.

 

[mydrugbuddy]

The fiend in me won out. I'll live to fight another day. Fight the good fight another day. Fuck it for today.

I need to be putting some more things in place with my support workers, it's not that easy to just stop a roughly 2 and a half year opi habit. Well, i did stop, but it would appear that just as with cigarettes it's the staying stopped thing that is hard. Although there is no comparison as far as the w/ds go.

 

[Sammy G]

So did you go and buy some kratom, MDB?

 

[mydrugbuddy]

yep, bought and ingested. Man do i feel better. I know this is playing with fire now though.

 

[Sammy G]

yep, bought and ingested. Man do i feel better. I know this is playing with fire now though.

Out of interest, how much did you buy and what did it set you back?

Yeah, it's playing with fire alright. As you say, you need to learn to control these impulses. I know it's easier said than done, but you're really setting your recovery back with every dose.